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Police Raid Stables?? Oh Dear

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47 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said:

213 C

So stipes saying the horses may have been administered a prohibited substance by it's trainer.

 

Exactly this mate. 

Either "has had, or may have had"...  

 

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2 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said:

What now?!

They can do this to his stable but can't do it to those trainers who transform horses like those mentioned in the Star articles. 

 

Happy,would you rather them not do it at all?   

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3 minutes ago, the galah said:

Happy,would you rather them not do it at all?   

I am all for keeping people to the rules and the stipes doing their job but it just seems to be the same McGrath is in the firing line a lot. Maybe that it is his own fault and I should reserve judgement until it is explained but asI said in a previous post about the Star article, how come these trainer(s) seem to be under less scrutiny?

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4 hours ago, hunterthepunter said:

corona virus???????

I'm pretty sure it was rule 213 (1)(c), not 213 (1)(b)... but who knows with the current state of events around the world. 

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On 12/03/2020 at 5:47 PM, the galah said:

You seem to believe that the telephone recordings were not an important part of providing sufficient evidence to prove a charge of improper driving.    I can't see where the published decision says that.   

 

If you read the section in the decision labelled - THE FACTS UPON WHICH PENALTY WAS IMPOSED - you can quite clearly see that the telephone conversations had little if not no bearing on the decision.  Of the five lengthy paragraphs (17-21) in this section only one references the recordings.

The part that does refer to the recordings is as follows:

(20) We do not need to dwell at any length on the intercepted conversations between Mr McGrath and Mr “A” given how the matter has been resolved, but we make some brief observations. Of course, as is common practice, it is very usual for a trainer to discuss with an owner how his horse may be driven and race tactics and chances before a race. But this does not permit a driver trainer to advise or discuss how his other horse in the race, which he will be driving, will likely to be driven or its tactics.

The telling paragraph on how the basis of the decision is as follows:

(21) We can attribute the actions of improper driving on this occasion to complete stupidity and very unwise actions as the admitted charge does not involve deliberate dishonesty. 

To sum up emphasis was placed on HOW the horse was driven not the peripheral matters.  If you draw the obvious conclusion from this you could say the RIU could have and SHOULD have laid a charge on the 31st March 2018.  That would have sent a clear message to all participants.  But no they didn't.  Why?  Were the Stipes/RIU aware of the Police investigation?  It is stated in the decision that they weren't which I very much doubt.

On 12/03/2020 at 5:47 PM, the galah said:

If the conversations were of no significance in proving the case then why did mcgrath spend so much money trying to exclude them from the hearing?

 

If you have been following the case(s) involved that have INCA connections you will understand that these arguments focussed on a point of law, the rules of racing, precedents and the differences between two legal jurisdictions.  Bear in mind there are or may be other cases that may be affected by this point of law.  That being, is evidence used to charge someone in the Criminal Court but not formally filed able to be used in another jurisdiction e.g. the JCA.  

McGrath in his deal with the Crown Prosecutor agreed to hand this evidence over to the RIU/JCA (moot point with the RIU as I bet my bottom dollar that they had seen it anyway). Note the Crown Prosecutor cannot have been confident of success in their criminal prosecution.  Indeed comments by a Judge indicated that the evidence did not reach a criminal conviction threshold by a long measure.  McGrath's lawyer then attempted to renege on what was agreed by arguing that as the evidence had not been formally filed in Court then it couldn't be used in the JCA hearing.  Part of their argument I assume was based on the fact that it wasn't RIU gathered evidence.  But that aside the moot point was....

McGrath HAD that evidence in his possession therefore the JCA contended that under the rules of racing anything in McGrath's possession could be used in the hearing AND if not provided a summons could be issued.  That seems a pretty far reaching rule in my opinion and potentially at odds with natural justice.  Hence the lengthy arguments.

However as seen from the final decision that evidence had no bearing on the result.  To reiterate - (21) We can attribute the actions of improper driving on this occasion to complete stupidity and very unwise actions as the admitted charge does not involve deliberate dishonesty. 

 

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Now that i don't have much to do i was doing some reading and was interested in the meadowlands boss,Mr gural,comments on the recent indictments relating to the big doping scandel over in new york. The meadowlands and the jockey club had worked with a surveillance  company then  the FBI to gather evidence.

When asked why the FBI was doing what the racing industry had been unable to do he said.   

"I think its simple. No one cared." All the racetrack owners in the country who said they cared about this didn't care".... "All it was,was lip service and industry participants knew,in order to clean it up would cost a lot of money. And that drug testing wasn't the answer. Racetrack owners had to know you had to do surveillance work,wire taps,all that stuff to catch these guys. Without them you were just giving lip service that you cared..as these guys were ahead of the testing."

 

 

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15 hours ago, the galah said:

Now that i don't have much to do i was doing some reading and was interested in the meadowlands boss,Mr gural,comments on the recent indictments relating to the big doping scandel over in new york. The meadowlands and the jockey club had worked with a surveillance  company then  the FBI to gather evidence.

When asked why the FBI was doing what the racing industry had been unable to do he said.   

"I think its simple. No one cared." All the racetrack owners in the country who said they cared about this didn't care".... "All it was,was lip service and industry participants knew,in order to clean it up would cost a lot of money. And that drug testing wasn't the answer. Racetrack owners had to know you had to do surveillance work,wire taps,all that stuff to catch these guys. Without them you were just giving lip service that you cared..as these guys were ahead of the testing."

 

 

galah riu will have a bit spear time now with no racing so they will have time to investigate the two p smoking stable hands at the jewels or was that a made up story to get clear blood test 48 hours before a race meeting?????

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1 hour ago, hunterthepunter said:

was that a made up story to get clear blood test 48 hours before a race meeting?????

how would 2 p smoking stable hands get a clear blood test for horses?

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, hunterthepunter said:

galah riu will have a bit spear time now with no racing so they will have time to investigate the two p smoking stable hands at the jewels or was that a made up story to get clear blood test 48 hours before a race meeting?????

excellent thinking outside the square / cospiracy theory

making good use of your isolation

riu would struggle to see this in a month

Edited by Rangatira

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1 hour ago, hunterthepunter said:

galah riu will have a bit spear time now with no racing so they will have time to investigate the two p smoking stable hands at the jewels or was that a made up story to get clear blood test 48 hours before a race meeting?????

You have made reference to that when replying to me previously. The person who you think i may be might know what you are inferring,but unfortunately i don't.   

Reminds me of the bloke who saw two men in identical outfits. He asked one of them if they were gay. One of them then arrested him.

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1 hour ago, Happy Sunrise said:

how would 2 p smoking stable hands get a clear blood test for horses?

happy was made up story to pre race blood test horses 48 before they raced and be clear before getting .......... up  there was no p smokers in horse truck 

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46 minutes ago, Brodie said:

RIU hardly an essential industry, at the best of times!

 

 

not currently essential 

but they do have an important role in times of racing

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2 hours ago, Rangatira said:

not currently essential 

but they do have an important role in times of racing

You reckon?

Integrity not shown All of the time!,
We would be better off having a common sense unit

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3 hours ago, Rangatira said:

not currently essential 

but they do have an important role in times of racing

how is your new horse going ranga in stable changes lol

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16 hours ago, hunterthepunter said:

how is your new horse going ranga in stable changes lol

i can't wait to look

bbs

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17 hours ago, Brodie said:

You reckon?

Integrity not shown All of the time!,
We would be better off having a common sense unit

you can't have nothing

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1 hour ago, Rangatira said:

you can't have nothing

 

1 hour ago, Rangatira said:

you can't have nothing

Thru to the keeper on that one?

What you mean u can’t have nothing?

Only second day Ranga, you might be losing it already?.

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2 hours ago, Brodie said:

 

Thru to the keeper on that one?

What you mean u can’t have nothing?

Only second day Ranga, you might be losing it already?.

is ranga still allowed to hide in hedges?????

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42 minutes ago, hunterthepunter said:

is ranga still allowed to hide in hedges?????

bunkered down until cinders advises otherwise

Hedge Bubble.jpg

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