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Bit Of A Yarn

Japan Cup Weights...


Thomass

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So it appears the time was a running start...the real time once the gates opened is different....

Translated from a French site

It was 2'20''60 ... or 2'21''36. With the help of Franco Raimondi and Bruno Barbereau, who released their times, we rechronomed the Japan Cup Almond Eye (Lord Kanaloa) to check if it was a running start and know which could be in this case the distance of the run up. By translating: does the chronometer work when the stalls are opened, or does it begin at the beginning of the official distance, with the stalls (running start and run up) moving backwards and, in this case, a more flattering time. At trot, it would be the principle of the departure volte, slower than a departure launched to the autostart ...

 
The clock of Franco Raimondi indicates, by starting it at the opening of the stalls, a time of 2'21''36. Bruno Barbereau, for his part, counted a run up of about 10 meters before the start of the chrono, or 0.7 seconds: this is consistent. But whether it's 2'20''60 or a time closer to our 2'21''36, it's a world record.
 
Stronger than Asidero. It is not easy to navigate the different records on 2,400m grass. The previous record we found is the one won by Asidero (Fadeyev), in 2'21''98. The name of Asidero does not necessarily speak to everyone: he is the winner of Gran Premio Carlos Pellegrini (Gr1) in 1999, in San Isidro. Almond Eye, whether with or without running start, beats it widely and it makes more sense to compare the chronos of Almond Eye and Asidero based on that of running start. In South America, the run-up is about fifty meters.
 
Compared to the other records of great races ... The time achieved by Almond Eye is extra. We wanted to compare it to some of the biggest Grs1 in the world for 3 years and over 2,400m, from Europe to South America via Australia and the United States. Almond Eye is clearly in the lead, followed by Asidero, the previous distance recorder. In the races we have selected, it is the Qatar Prize of the Arc de Triomphe which gets the best ranking for a European race: a particular Arc, since won by Found (Galileo) and ran to Chantilly.
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THE FASTEST HORSES ON 2.400M
 
Racecourse Race Record Winner
Japan Cup Tokyo 2'20''60 Almond Eye
Gran Premio Pellegrini San Isidro 2'21''98 Asidero
Breeders' Turf Cup Santa Anita 2'22''83 Little Mike
Price of the Arc de Triomphe Chantilly 2'23''61 Found
Great Premio Brasil The Gavea 2'23''93 The Amico Steve
Prize of the Arc de Triomphe ParisLongchamp 2'24''49 Danedream
King George VI & Q.E. II Stakes Ascot 2'24''60 Novellist
Gran Premio Latin Americano Vina del Mar 2'24''88 Song Sixties
Hong Kong Sha Tin Vase 2'25''10 Red Bishop
Yorkshire Oaks York 2'25''11 Lush Lashes
Grosser Preis from Berlin Berlin 2'25''38 Sternkönig
The BMW Rosehill 2'25''78 Grand Zulu
Vermeille ParisLongchamp Prize 2'26''00 Zarkava & Pearly Shells
Preis von Europa Cologne 2'26''37 Girolamo
Saint-Cloud Grand Prix Saint-Cloud 2'26''50 Moon Madness
Grosser Preis from Baden Baden-Baden 2'26''74 Pilsudski
Grosser Preis from Bayern Bayern 2'26''76 Kamsin
Dubai Sheema Classic Meydan 2'26''97 Postponed
British Champion Fillies & Mares Ascot 2'27''29 Dancing Rain
Coronation Cup Epsom 2'33''31 Bustino
 
Obviously, incomparable. The game of times and records is fun but it has its limits ... The layout of Tokyo has nothing to do with that of Epsom. Moreover, there is a world between the time of Almond Eye in the Japan Cup and the record of the Coronation Cup, held by Bustino: 12''71 if we compare with the chrono "Almond Eye running start" and 11 ''65 compared with the chrono "Almond Eye Franco Raimondi". Obviously, comparing a track like Tokyo's and the roller coaster Epsom makes no sense. We can push the cap a little further reminding that the Coronation Cup is not a race of 2.400m or rather is not a race of 1 miles and 4 furlongs. Indeed, the Coronation Cup runs on 1 mile, 4 furlongs and 6 yards ... Or about 2.420m!
 
So here we are with chronometers to try to have fun comparing our horses, but ultimately unusable. Everything varies so much: flat track, hilly track, uphill start, announced distances of 2.400m but distances in reality of more or less 2.400m ... To this must be added the state of the field of course, but also the composition of the field. What to lose his Latin. As such, the gross chrono is an indication of a performance but, as we well know, there is no sign of a horse clearly superior to others. In this sense, the performance of Almond Eye will be analyzed by the partial times with much more precision by Bruno Barbereau.
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1 minute ago, FeelTheFear said:

Anyone come up with the answer to the timing of the race? Suspect it wasn't when the gates opened looking at the time. 

Ffs ftf...block moi and you'll remain Igor rint 

Unblock moi and you have the key to knowledge and enlightenment 

f me

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1 hour ago, FeelTheFear said:

Anyone come up with the answer to the timing of the race? Suspect it wasn't when the gates opened looking at the time. 

Courtesy of Thomass

 

It was 2'20''60 ... or 2'21''36. With the help of Franco Raimondi and Bruno Barbereau, who released their times, we rechronomed the Japan Cup Almond Eye (Lord Kanaloa) to check if it was a running start and know which could be in this case the distance of the run up. By translating: does the chronometer work when the stalls are opened, or does it begin at the beginning of the official distance, with the stalls (running start and run up) moving backwards and, in this case, a more flattering time. At trot, it would be the principle of the departure volte, slower than a departure launched to the autostart ...

 
The clock of Franco Raimondi indicates, by starting it at the opening of the stalls, a time of 2'21''36. Bruno Barbereau, for his part, counted a run up of about 10 meters before the start of the chrono, or 0.7 seconds: this is consistent. But whether it's 2'20''60 or a time closer to our 2'21''36, it's a world record.
 
Stronger than Asidero. It is not easy to navigate the different records on 2,400m grass. The previous record we found is the one won by Asidero (Fadeyev), in 2'21''98. The name of Asidero does not necessarily speak to everyone: he is the winner of Gran Premio Carlos Pellegrini (Gr1) in 1999, in San Isidro. Almond Eye, whether with or without running start, beats it widely and it makes more sense to compare the chronos of Almond Eye and Asidero based on that of running start. In South America, the run-up is about fifty meters.
 
Compared to the other records of great races ... The time achieved by Almond Eye is extra. We wanted to compare it to some of the biggest Grs1 in the world for 3 years and over 2,400m, from Europe to South America via Australia and the United States. Almond Eye is clearly in the lead, followed by Asidero, the previous distance recorder. In the races we have selected, it is the Qatar Prize of the Arc de Triomphe which gets the best ranking for a European race: a particular Arc, since won by Found (Galileo) and ran to Chantilly.
 
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1 hour ago, SLB2.0 said:

Courtesy of Thomass

 

It was 2'20''60 ... or 2'21''36. With the help of Franco Raimondi and Bruno Barbereau, who released their times, we rechronomed the Japan Cup Almond Eye (Lord Kanaloa) to check if it was a running start and know which could be in this case the distance of the run up. By translating: does the chronometer work when the stalls are opened, or does it begin at the beginning of the official distance, with the stalls (running start and run up) moving backwards and, in this case, a more flattering time. At trot, it would be the principle of the departure volte, slower than a departure launched to the autostart ...

 
The clock of Franco Raimondi indicates, by starting it at the opening of the stalls, a time of 2'21''36. Bruno Barbereau, for his part, counted a run up of about 10 meters before the start of the chrono, or 0.7 seconds: this is consistent. But whether it's 2'20''60 or a time closer to our 2'21''36, it's a world record.
 
Stronger than Asidero. It is not easy to navigate the different records on 2,400m grass. The previous record we found is the one won by Asidero (Fadeyev), in 2'21''98. The name of Asidero does not necessarily speak to everyone: he is the winner of Gran Premio Carlos Pellegrini (Gr1) in 1999, in San Isidro. Almond Eye, whether with or without running start, beats it widely and it makes more sense to compare the chronos of Almond Eye and Asidero based on that of running start. In South America, the run-up is about fifty meters.
 
Compared to the other records of great races ... The time achieved by Almond Eye is extra. We wanted to compare it to some of the biggest Grs1 in the world for 3 years and over 2,400m, from Europe to South America via Australia and the United States. Almond Eye is clearly in the lead, followed by Asidero, the previous distance recorder. In the races we have selected, it is the Qatar Prize of the Arc de Triomphe which gets the best ranking for a European race: a particular Arc, since won by Found (Galileo) and ran to Chantilly.
 

The whole topic of times is interesting - but they are only comparable imo, if you understand the tracks and conditions. If you look at straight times and compare a race run a Te Teko for example with a race run at Woodville, then your comparison will be flawed. It's an area I believe most punters don't consider when assessing performance. And of course there are the many that don't even consider time at all. That's their call.

I prefer the ability too compare a performance at one track with a performance at another by understanding the track factors and associated track based performance.

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2 hours ago, mardigras said:

The whole topic of times is interesting - but they are only comparable imo, if you understand the tracks and conditions. If you look at straight times and compare a race run a Te Teko for example with a race run at Woodville, then your comparison will be flawed. It's an area I believe most punters don't consider when assessing performance. And of course there are the many that don't even consider time at all. That's their call.

I prefer the ability too compare a performance at one track with a performance at another by understanding the track factors and associated track based performance.

Yes I agree. It's an area I am still coming to terms with

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The pressure on her to compete in the Arc will be immense back home...

Almond Eye, who smashed the track record when winning the Japan Cup last Sunday, will run in the Dubai Turf or Sheema Classic on World Cup night on March 30.

The star filly completed the Japanese fillies' triple crown before her Japan Cup success and is as short as $9 to break her nation's hoodoo in the Prix de l'Arc de Triomphe (2400m) at Longchamp next October.

Confirming that Dubai is the next target, trainer Sakae Kunieda said: "She ran well in both the Shuka Sho and the Japan Cup but there aren't any suitable races for her in Japan in the spring.

"She came out of the race (Japan Cup) fine but she is a little tired and she'll now have a break."

Almond Eye is the $2.90 favourite for the Sheema Classic (2400m) at Meydan but is not quoted for the Dubai Turf (1800m).

No horse trained in Japan has won the Arc but El Condor Pasa (1999), Nakayama Festa (2010) and Orfevre (2012) have all finished runner-up.

The Arc market is headed by dual winner Enable at $5.

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On 28/11/2018 at 5:57 PM, mardigras said:

The whole topic of times is interesting - but they are only comparable imo, if you understand the tracks and conditions. If you look at straight times and compare a race run a Te Teko for example with a race run at Woodville, then your comparison will be flawed. It's an area I believe most punters don't consider when assessing performance. And of course there are the many that don't even consider time at all. That's their call.

I prefer the ability too compare a performance at one track with a performance at another by understanding the track factors and associated track based performance.

Haha this is hilarious Magoo...

Of course one could obtain 20 years of stats...find the benchmark for each distance/ class....extrapolate that out to find 'fastest az'

...then having to go back to the drawing board when you forgot to compensate horses for 'wide without cover' 'slow out, unlucky' et el

...when those runs could have been its best performance EVER...

Magoo you is and Magoo you shall remain....

Until you do what moi does

If the experts knew the Thoroughbred Mile rate was the benchmark for performance they'd include that in a sales catalogue...

....Instead they include what I use as the benchmark...BLACK TYPE

next

 

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