Chief Stipe

Not only is that incorrect but you seem very adept at doing what you describe except you seem to spray tags at random and in volume whenever the facts are put in front of you.

So I gather you had the operations so you could go unnoticed in the North?

Are you well? It's a good thing you left the South Island as going by your current mental state you'd probably be joing that list. Of course you now live in Auckland where there is a murder at least once a week.

No because it is a track that horses get their hooves into it. Most of our tracks are like that. It is in the early spring and early autumn where issues with slipping occur. Where the weather goes from dry to wet and back again. There'd be no slipping at Waverley today - just tired horses.

Which is exactly what I've been saying. If you listen to the Jockeys after a race in those conditions you hear that the horses look after themselves and hold back.

This was the profile before they raced on it.

Really? Who would have thought.

They put 90 tonnes after the first abandoned meeting then when the next meeting was abandoned they put on another 900 tonnes. That of course doesn't count the original 12,000 tonnes.

Yes I've been arguing that for months now much to the derision of some. Why aren't they using a Going Stick at Ellerslie and publishing the results? As for the AWT's I've never understood why they take the lazy option and don't measure the firmness and shear of the synthetics and publish those. At the very least it would give track managers some data to show what works and what doesn't. Ellerslie behaves like a AWT NOT a traditional turf track or for that matter a standard Strathayr. Wilcox has as good as admitted that in press releases.

Logic would say so. Looking at @JMO 's photos the kickback must be really high. I liken it to being on the beach and someone kicks sand in your face. It isn't a very enjoyable experience and given the sensitivity of horses eyes I imagine they don't enjoy it either.

Yes I've heard that as well. Which when you think of the mechanics of an equine gallop - the slide helps dissipate a lot of forces with the front legs and the scoop gives them a purchase to push forward. Mind you I might have that all wrong. But I have heard the shear part of the stride is important. Excuse any misuse of terminology.

I know exactly what you mean. I have a friend who I talked into buying their first horse. As luck would have it the horse has turned out very good - multiple Group winner already. However she has a very long stride and with a surprisingly high frequency. She won't go on that bend because its shifting under her. Yes the only way to ride Ellerslie now is to push forward early - hold your horse together round the bend and hope you are within 4 lengths on balancing in the straight. Or stick to the fence and hope you can get a run.

Just my opinion @jess based on actual observation and my horticultural training. I get a bit of kickback (or worse) for my opinion on this subject. One recollection that sticks in my mind was when I was on the track between jumpouts which were being held to test it following the abandonment. I was standing within earshot of the CEO Wilcox explaining to those around him what had been wrong and how now it was a lot better because the horses hooves were getting 10mm into the surface. I saw some puzzled faces and I had a closer look. The hooves were going in a bit deeper but there didn't seem to be any shear i.e. the front part of the hoof was penetrating the surface but there was zero forward movement. It didn't look right. I don't know much about the mechanics of a horse galloping but I've read somewhere that the optimum safe surface is when a horses hoof can pierce the surface slide forward (shear?) and scoop out. Perhaps you, @JMO, @Freda and @curious can comment.

Thanks for posting your pictures and I agree with your assessment. Did you hear any comments from Jockeys regarding it being shifty and horses not wanting to go on it especially around the bend?

As for Ellerslie "playing fair" on Saturday I'm not so sure it did. The fact is if you are not within 4 lengths of the leader turning for home then you don't win. You also can't improve your position on the final bend and stay balanced - you can't really get moving until your horse has regained its balance on straightening. There are three factors involved - one the shifty nature of the track (sliced and diced turf on a hard sand base), the horses can't get their hooves into the turf and the lack of camber of the last part of the turn. The smart way home is tracking along the rail and praying for luck e.g. Damask Rose in the KiwiB. Doctor Askar was ridden positively and forward from its draw, nursed around the bend and wasn't let go until the straight. Yes the second horse flew home from back wide out but it couldn't win - it needed to start moving before straightening to get closer but you can't do it on the track. The big question is it may "play fair" for punters and it may offer a Soft 6 (Is it ever anything other than a Soft 5 or 6 regardless of the rainfall?) on a day that you would expect a softer track but is it "fair" to the horses? In my opinion it isn't. I don't believe it was designed to provide the best racing surface for a horse to gallop on safely. It was designed to always be a Soft 5/6 (not sure we should be using those ratings) regardless of the amount of rainfall. The design was totally focussed on that. Hence the extremely customised Strathayr. Now I've never walked a Strathayr so a key reference point for me is missing. But when I walked the new Ellerslie track I was very surprised. The growing medium is pure sand - there is no other soil components e.g. loam in that that substrate. So you have a substrate that compacts readily and is high draining with little water and negligible nutrient retention. The initial problem that occurred in the first few meetings (the first Karaka Million meeting should have been abandoned like the next was) was the grass roots grew across the surface and to a shallow depth (10-15mm) in a dense mat. They didn't grow to any real depth - why would they? The roots didn't need to search for water and there was any retained at depth anyway! Not surprising when you are watering and fertilising frequently. Hence the slipping and the inability of the horses to get there hooves in to the top layer. I'm sure many of you have seen over the years a dense root matt that you can barely pierce a knife through! That was how Ellerslie presented in the first few moths. So what was the solution? The solution was to core the track in the first instance. Well that worked to a degree but if you think about it you still have a continuum of root mat but just with evenly spaced holes that are then refilled with sand! So the next method was to slice and dice the turf with tynes and verti-drain (suprising on a state of the art Strathayr). Once they started doing this extensive mechanical work in the week leading up to raceday we no longer got a Good 4 track but a Soft 5. The downside to the mechanical work to get a Soft 5 is the top layer becomes shifty and loose and there is still a hard compact layer below. Although I haven't seen the track after this work I have heard many reports from jockeys that the surface was shifty and their horses didn't feel comfortable on it. So what @JMO has posted resonates with what I would guess is happening. At the end of the day the Ellerslie track is an expensive near hydroponic turf growing system that is more akin to a synthetic track except it has grass growing on it. But many will be slapping themselves on the back for being able to hold a meeting after 40mm of rain during the week and the surface "playing fair" to punters.

There were at least two senior jockeys interviewed after the Awapuni trials and their comments were very complimentary. As for jockeys being in the best position to comment. They may well be but very few ever walk a track before riding it and often there assessment is not as accurate as you may think. At best they may have an accurate opinion on how the trqcks feels while riding an individual horse but I cant see how they can have any accuarcy in opinions on how the track got to the condtition it may be in. For example Kate Hercocks comments about the cause of the Hawkes Bay Guineas Day abandonment last September were well off the mark. Her observations didn't align with what I saw having walked the track both early in the morning and after the abandonement. BTW I'm still trying to find out if horses galloped on the track proper in the morning as per the protocol.

They pay their way without enormous subsidisation?

No need for that language @mikeynz

Were they given the 3 days off between Easter and ANZAC day?

Fair to whom?

What does that tell you about the track?

Your home-bred is eligible for all the big stakes race except the KM sweepstake races. Assuming you didn't put your home-bred through the sales.

Are they competing against themselves or the SEVEN Australian Harness meetings on the same night? Yes it isn't an exact overlap but doesn't it give the NZ meetings first crack at the punters dollar?

Forecast is for 40mm today is it not?

They'll race. It'll be a S5 or a S6. Doesn't seem to be anything else. They'll still need to slice and dice it which if they haven't already done will be interesting today. It is a Synthetic hydroponic track that grows grass. At least they haven't needed to irrigate this week and the pond will be filling up.