Taku Umanga

1 minute ago, Nowornever said:

Will all trainers now start nominating their horses for Friday, Sunday in the hope of winning Friday and putting a junior on for a free go in the same field. Why wouldn't you.

Sunday fields might be decimated by scratchings if the horse doesn't win Friday or is a there a stand down rule for scratchings?

Exactly, if you had a horse that you thought would back up, why wouldn't you?

24 minutes ago, the galah said:

Well its you who is saying they changed the conditons of the race after the horse won..

You said there was no such condition originally.( I've referenced what you said below) 

To change means alter/modify,so using your words,there was never a provision for a let up

So why are you now saying its ok to change the race conditions after the fields come out?

where's that in the rule youv'e quoted?

And i quoted the definition of

corruption  "the process by which a word or process is changed from its original state to one regarded as erroneous or debased.".

so thats why i said it falls within the definition of the word corruption,based on what your saying.

And this whole non win/1 win isn't the crux of the argument.

As if we go by what your saying,then whats to stop them altering any race conditions after the race when the fields are out. For example what to stop some horse in a mobile 1 win race winning,then them changing the conditions of another 1 win race that its accepted in 2 days later to allow the junior driver concession penalty. ,and so on.

really,lets cut to the chase,your seem to be implying that its within the rules to have many future examples of preferential treatment happening, irrespective of what type a race is being run. 

so why do they have a rule that can be manipultaed by someone,i.e. the handicapper,to give preferential treatment. And its very obviously preferential treatment. As pointed out by you,not me,they specifically altered the conditions of sundays race to exclude the other 1 win horses from getting a let up if driven by a concession driver.

You need to get up to date with the new regulations before accusing anyone of corruption .....

29 minutes ago, Blackie said:

I very much doubt you can change conditions after fields are published, they can after nominations to get the maximum field but surely not after a field is published. They should have not changed anything and just allowed the new rule to work (ie concession driver on so they can still start) if they knew about it, obviously not. That rule should be void for a maiden winner being able to start again against maidens, seems wrong. Own goal there.

Changing the original conditions to fit the final fields has been happening for years.

4 hours ago, the galah said:

well,i'm now consideing there is the possibilty that they put that condition in when the fields came out,that is prior to origin winninng on friday.

now i not saying that happened. i don't know.Others on here are saying,defintely not that.

But it does seem the only likely available escape route for those who handicapped that race,otherwise it seems corruption and favoritism,if whats alleged is true..

I just find it hard,even with my sometimes lack of confidence in how they run hrnz,,that  they couldn't possibly be that dumb as to score  an own goal of that magnitude. Could they really be that stupid?

Especially when they have people like mark jones already criticising the handicapping system and people.

But even on best case scenario for hrnz,the other  1 win horses were still excluded from being able to take advantage of starting off the front, if driven by a concession junior,like origin was

Does the owner or trainer of origin have some connection to the handicappers. 

or maybe someone at hrnz has deliberately sabotaged the handicappers ,so as to look corrupt.

corruption-i just goggled its meaning to confirm its the appropriate word"the process by which a word or expression is changed from its original state to one regareded as erroneous or debased"

seems thats the right word if what everyone is saying is true.

what more can you say.

As Brodie said, after the horse won on Friday it was initially shown in the fields as being re-handicapped off 20m.

Someone has obviously pointed out the rule (posted above) to the handicapper and the conditions of the race were changed to align with that rule.

How can it be "corruption" when the rules allow it?

On what planet would the original conditions of the race have this part "Also horses with 1 win since 25/07/2025 if driven by a concession junior driver."

The original conditions (and fields) were out before Origin won on 25/7/2025.

The conditions were changed to align with the rules that allowed the horse to remain entered in its original position off the front.

2 hours ago, the galah said:

i get what hes saying. i.e. Its unusual for a 1 win horse to get to start off the front in a non win race.

But i disagree with what hes saying about the new handicapping .

i just had a look at the conditions of todays race and it states any 1 win horse could have started off the front if driven by a concession driver.

Now its obvious why they have done that.

They have been trying to give 1 win horses who are struggling to be competitive in the 1 win grade,a chance to run in a race where they may have a chance. In other words,don't retire ,sell or get rid of that horse, because we are going to try and keep the numbers up that are racing, by providing all horses that have enough ability to win a race opportunities to race in races where they aren't outclassed.For example theres 1 win horses around who won non win trots at addington tuesday meetings with winning stakes of $4400. Doesn't mr jones want to see those horses and their connections stay in the game?Its not all about the bigger stables who have owners who pay the bills..

As i've said before,those type of horses are the ones who aren't being catered for in the previous handicapping system. I don't quite get why mr jones can't see that..

possibly they could have placed a condition on the stakemoney won when providing that concession,but why bother when any 1 win horses around who have not won in a long time who deserve an opportunity like todays race .

as to the driver,well if a driver has to be declared by 1.00pm on thursday,then that  hould be it. Just because a trainer realises he could start a horse off the front after the closing time for declaring drivers,if he puts a concession driver on,well that should be his hard cheese. he should have read the conditions of the race.

so if they changed the driver when they shouldn't have well mr jones is right about that,but i don't know whats that got to do with the the handicapping system like mr jones infers.

They changed the conditions of the race after the fields had been published to cater for the horse that had won on Friday night.

"Front: 4 yrs & older trotters with no wins for lifetime. Also horses with 1 win since 25/07/2025 if driven by a concession junior driver. 20m: R35 to R40 4 yrs & older horses with 1 win for lifetime."

So, they're "close to signing a deal" and planning to commit funds to setting up a training centre prior to the unconditional date of the Franklin sale (November)?

Risky methinks.

Very sad - RIP fella

15 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

We've discussed this at length but you have a conspiracy theory and like most consipiracists will not waver from it even in the face of facts. 

Speaking of conspiracy theories, does anybody know the reason for Beside Me's disqualification at Nelson in January not being publicised anywhere?

Wasn't Nathan previously based in the North?

On 7/02/2025 at 2:51 PM, Blackie said:

"admitted the charge", case closed.

Mr Orange did not wish to comment. Asked by the Adjudicative Committee, he acknowledged that Miss Harrison was entitled to shift him down and he had failed to concede his position.

3 minutes ago, Taku Umanga said:

 

Not sure of the impact, but this is another change that has been slipped in:

 

“If the breeding entity does not exist at the time of the win no breeder bonus will paid.”

(previously) “A Breeder or Breeding Entity ceases to exist if they have had no service attempts in the previous 5 years on the HRNZ Infohorse system.”

(now) “A breeding entity ceases to exist for the purposes of TYOBS if they have had not bred or attempted to breed a mare since the 2021/22 breeding season as recorded on the HRNZ Infohorse system.”

Given that current 2yo's were born in 2022, does that mean a breeder that only breeds every second year misses out on the bonus?

Not sure of the impact, but this is another change that has been slipped in:

“If the breeding entity does not exist at the time of the win no breeder bonus will paid.”

(previously) “A Breeder or Breeding Entity ceases to exist if they have had no service attempts in the previous 5 years on the HRNZ Infohorse system.”

(now) “A breeding entity ceases to exist for the purposes of TYOBS if they have had not bred or attempted to breed a mare since the 2021/22 breeding season as recorded on the HRNZ Infohorse system.”

SASSY STAR - Driver Z Meredith was replaced by M McKendry after a phone call to Stewards from Mr Meredith advising that he was unable to attend the meeting due to transport difficulties. Subsequent to this call Mr Meredith was located on course and served with drug testing paperwork but refused to provide a sample. An investigation has been opened and adjourned into this matter with Mr Meredith's driver's licence being suspended effective immediately in accordance with Rule 514(1).

Driver D Balle (DREAMS PAT - Race 6) was served with drug testing paperwork but failed to supply a sample with an investigation being opened and adjourned into this matter.

1 hour ago, Gammalite said:

Kumeu used to have a training/trials  track? .  spose that's all covered with houses now? 

Kumeu's still there .... but only occasionally utilised by a few local trainers 

It's all about balance in the early stages of a standing start trot.  Different story at the end of a race.  Nothing to see here in my opinion.

6 minutes ago, Brodie said:

Yes Just Holla won.

Who is the starter up there today, is it Donnelly?

Seriously needs to learn what a standing start actually is!

If harness racing wants to have credibility they need to be employing people who actually  give a damn!

Very poor, standing starts should not be moving starts and all horses need to be in a line not all over the place!

Very amateur performance these stands and should be abolished if that is the best they can do.

 

Wil be Donnelly

This is Nelli's post from the other channel - some good points made.

"The launch of NextGen today demonstrates yet again more half-baked ideas even though the intentions are admirable.  

1) I can see the rationale of restricting the scheme to sale horses, since NZB Standardbreds are major sponsors, but why restrict it to progeny of stallions in their 1st 3 seasons in NZ? For example, if you are after a trotter, this restricts you to a choice of just 22 horses with half by expensive stallions (a big windfall for the sellers). 

2) Why the G1 restriction on the trainers when I think what they intend is to promote young trainers. This means 21 year old Zev Meredith in his first year of training is ruled out (Tom Bamford also) but very successful 80+ year old Luk Chin is eligible (not that he ever needs to buy a yearling with his great breed).

3) The alternative option is having a partnership of at least 4 owners with 30+% of the people under 40 years old and who have never owned a horse before. This of course is easily achieved by adding a couple of grandchildren on the ownership papers. A nice thing to do but will it mean more owners racing more horses in the future?"

On 22/11/2024 at 8:39 AM, the galah said:

But i can understand nz people selling, as many of the horses going there are unlikely to be bred from and some of their owners saw no future in breeding from them here given how they perceived the future of the industry here as relates to how perceived they were considered of little relevance.

5 hours ago, the galah said:

 

You know i was talking to someone nopt that long ago. He was telling me he was talking to someone in power and the topic of the handicapping rating system came up. He was told by this person that if he wasn't happy with it,to sell his horse to australia. Basically give the game away. I was also told about another part of this persons conversation,which i laughed at because i thought he wasn't being serious,as it seemed such a dumb thing to say. But when i laughed the bloke i was talking to me said,i'm telling you,this is what was said.

 

Or China - huge number of mares exported 15/11 ..... anyone know what sort of $$ they pay for these horses?

On 17/11/2024 at 5:35 PM, Westview said:

We absolutely need Michael House to continue racing at Manawatu as you say without him meetings could be abandoned.  I see the Telfers are headed down for this meeting where are the rest of the North Island trainers or is there to much racing at Cambridge or as Brodie has stated are there enough horses up there

 

All Telfer horses scratched at Manawatu

Sharing a barn at the Rakero Racing property in Fernside, North Canterbury.

On 3/10/2024 at 5:31 PM, Gammalite said:

Well there goes the First Slot Horse. will be snapped up for sure. 

FATHER TIME for Kevin Townley and driver Tim Williams , has donkey licked them in the 2nd race tonight at Addington by lengths. has 3 wins on the bounce and going well.

Anyone wanting to see the BEST 2 Aussie 3 year-old trotters Who both likely to get a Slot, would have to stay up late to see the last 2 races at Melton on Saturday night when they are in 2 $50k Finals. 

(actually it would be after midnight your time so just put the replays on off the AHR website Sunday morning might be best lol.  )

KEAYANG ZAHARA is at $1.03 against the Fillies and DEREK THE JET at $1.10 against the boys. Both undefeated thus far. and going gangbusters. 

 

Hasn't KEAYANG ZAHARA already got a slot with Breckon racing?

17 hours ago, the galah said:

the analogy of the airline i think is a good one.

the thing is though,by airlines providing a service to some regional centre's that run at losses,it means the quality and cost of services on the profitable routes are compromised and tickets often expensive.  

Actually if you look up australian regional airports,in the latest budget the australian government just put in an additional $40 million funding over the next 3 years, on top of what they already fund them. Then of course most regional airports are already funded by the councils who provide all the infastructure and many councils are always calling for more governmant funding.Same as in nz.

So,theres no local coucil or federal government to help subsidise harness racing,its all got to be done by the industry as a whole,so therefore it goes without saying that providing funding,whether it be for infastructure or stakes,needs to be done in a responsibly fiscal way.

So its responsible fiscal management that the likes of brodie and myself support and its not accurate to say that we don't want northern harness to prosper.

personally i think the answer lies somewhere in between what gammalite and brodie say.

To me there is a place for late afternoon/early evening harness racing at both northern and canterbury on tuesdays. They have to be mini meetings with races programmed at stakes levels that are susainable and not a drain on the industry overall. And of course the handicapping penalties have to reflect the stakes.I believe that $8000 for cambridge is too high.Turnovers at cambrdge haven't been that bad,they just haven't warranted the $8000 stakes currently being paid..

of course also you have to have handicappers and programmers understanding that they should be running races with conditions which encourages everyone to start,with things like $ won the last 5 starts or whatever as part of the conditions.There should be races at cambridge for all horses who have run 4 or 5 starts at auckland for no placings and its just a matter of programming.

canterbury has more participants in need of these races,so surely the leadership of hrnz should be able to see that by providing a smilar choice with extra tuesday meetings would create a more unified indutrsy. 

Only problem is there has been nothing to come out of hrnz,apart from the horse utiilisation group,that meakes any sense. So you  end up with no confidence in hrnz leadership and what your seeing is people pointing out the obvious flaws in what hrnz are currently doing.

doesn't all that seem obvious?

Twilight $8k Wednesday meetings start at Addington on 9 October .....