Chief Stipe

What's your point? Wouldn't a better question be - how many people from Hokitika used the venue outside of yesterday or how many painted the fences or how many cleaned the bird shit off the stand seats? I do know that the Westland Racing Club sponsored a race. Kumara is a one use venue that is detached from any significant community. I don't know if things have changed at Reefton but even Reefton has uses outside of its race days - school athletic track in the summer and a rugby field in the winter.

Which according to the Messara blueprint, which all the legislative changes underpin, then that is the agenda. At the moment we are only seeing a stay of execution. Ironically the WRC's action may have been a wake up call for those administrators and helped to achieve that stay of execution.

But that ignores the fundamentals which are the basis of your argument against the likes of Ellerslie? If the pinnacle is not attained on the basis of fundamentals but exaggerated fluff and hype then how is that sustainable in the long run? You said it yourself when you referred to Kumara's financial status cf with the Westland Racing Club. Isn't there a fundamental lesson in there somewhere?

But try telling that to people who are only looking through city real estate value eyes! So assuming they found a purchaser for the property which I imagine would take some time and they have $500k in the kitty. How long is that going to last especially when they would be "investing" in something that they have no control over and is a basket case anyway i.e. Kumara?

Morally and probably legally it wasn't the Club's land to sell. Not that you would have got much for it anyway. As I said earlier probably wouldn't cover the annual deficit of the AWT's!

You are entitled to your view Tesio but you don't appear to have any understanding of country racing nor West Coast racing in particular. If my father was alive today he would respond to your opinion with an educated (albeit West Coast secondary schooled) articulate discourse that would be delivered with such passion and strength that would make Reefton look like a meek school girl. I'll spell it out for you WESTLAND DID NOT GIVE THE FINGER TO THE INDUSTRY. No one really knows why but Kumara became the favoured venue by the racing bureaucrats and gained the title iconic or historical or whatever the hell they gave it. Now Kumara is a shit hole and a veritable dump. The track is built on the poorest piece of dirt on the entire West Coast. It always has been. It gained notoriety as a venue because of an advantageous race day gifted to it and the fact that it played on its hicksville attraction and enticed Cantabrians to venture "over the hill" for a day out with the hill billy's. It gained further notoriety when under threat from the NZRB to force its closure in the early 80's they invited Muldoon to the party - watered and fed him and the day was saved. The same approach was taken with Winston Peters (a brown Muldoon) in later years and again Kumara has been saved. Kumara has a population of 300 but even the locals would admit that that is a bit of an exaggeration and probably includes a few dogs in the total. Westland Racing Club (WRC) was formed in 1865. Both horse codes have raced there over the years. They even had a Hokitika Trotting Cup in the late 19th Century and I was fortunate enough as a child to see the cup in the home of the late Ted Lowe in Hinds. It towered over the NZ Trotting Cups that Ted had alongside it. The WRC like a lot of country clubs was always a community asset from the beginning. Indeed it was the home of the Westland AMP show right from the very beginning and its assets grew because of that. Some may forget that the Metropolitan Trotting Club in Christchurch also grew on the back of the Royal Show as did the Auckland Trotting Club. So rather than bore you with a detailed history of the club I'll make the point that it started as a community asset and has always remained a community asset. Its facilities over the years have had more than one purpose - I recall once seeing the Moscow Circus there (a real circus with real Lions and Elephants!). Hokitika a town of 3,500 - a tidy clean modern town and a relatively forward thinking town when you compare it to its larger cousin up the road Greymouth. My father was a committee member and donated a lot of his time and his business staff time to helping keep things ship shape. I remember helping him at working bees when I was a lad. He sponsored races and along with the local Parish priest (Father Bill Middleton) helped build a trotting training track on the inside of the course proper during the 70's. Now the towns on the West Coast are all very parochial - there are actually provinces within provinces e.g. Buller, Inangahua, Grey, Grey Valley, Westland, South Westland. It is understandable that they are because each of them has their own challenges for survival and have eked out an existence in a difficult region to do that. Sadly you can't live on scenic views and fresh air alone. So when the administrators once again wielded their big stick and once again made Kumara the protected species what outcome would you expect from the Hokitika community? Why would they sell their asset which morally (arguably legally) is a community asset and spend their cash on moving to Kumara? Kumara might only be 17 miles away but there is nothing there! No businesses like my father's to sponsor races nor more importantly to help maintain assets. No youth groups like my Harrier club to use the venue every week as part of their Sunday run. Nothing! Zip! Nada! Not even a venue or facility good enough to securely stable and train horses on! The assumption is falsely made by the administrators that because it has Racing in its club title the assets are Industry assets. I'm afraid they are having a rude awakening. So Tesio when you say WRC gave the finger to the industry I suggest you think again. What WRC didn't do was give in and give the finger to THEIR COMMUNITY!

Reefton that makes too much sense!

That's a daft proposal but reflective of a CEO who believes you gallop a horse everyday! The cynic in me says there is an alternative reason for it as it benefits only one club not the three. "Squeeze" is the appropriate term for it. I imagine there will be a "take it or leave it" caveat to the "proposal"!

The industry gave them the finger. Before you all get starry eyed with sanctimony it might pay to remember what the Messara report wants to happen to the West Coast. Also don't forget that Reefton has had a stay of execution only. You also may wish to look at the "extra" day on the Coast as a day for THE COAST not for Hokitika. All very easy to apply revisionist history but don't forget what the Agenda is. The didn't "give the money away" to some dodgy cause nor piss it up against the wall which we see happening repeatedly at so called Premier Clubs they gave it back to their community. Yes 150 years of voluntary work and stuff all support from the Ivory Towers. Any civic minded non-self interested person would applaud them giving back to the community that had created the asset. Let's face it we are only talking about a quarter of the annual deficit that the new sand dune track will create at Riccarton!

But not Greymouth?

The same way this happens on a D4 at Riccarton. When maidens run 1:07.

In my opinion the Democrats had a chance to create a clean slate by not re-selecting Pelosi as Speaker of the House. That bitter and twisted old cat makes Trump look sane!

But that isn't the point. It just seems a lot of pot kettle to me. How did his Tweets incite violence? Where did he say I want all American Patriots to storm the Capitol? For me it isn't about Trump it is about very large tech companies and their influence. Who are they to decide what is right or wrong? Theoretically if I was sympathetic to Twitter and Facebooks approach I would immediately ban Brodie for what he just posted above. Democracy is about conversation and negotiation. Twitter has just pissed off tens of millions of Americans. That isn't going to end well! Who knows Shu but when the Hate Speech laws are passed in NZ what you just posted might be classifed as such!

Oh and isn't Pelosi calling for impeachment 12 days out from the handover inciting violence? Given impeachement isn't going to happen in the time frame remaining and Trump has already packed his bags!

You may be fine SLB but I just did those tests and it doesn't work for me. Others have complained as well. Perhaps I'm a restricted punter and I don't even know it.

All you "Woke" types out there can you explain how using the term "American Patriots" would incite violence? Is it a code word or something for "I want you to pitch up, protest and then partake in wanton vandalism"? Bizarre. However doesn't the very fact that Twitter has done this actually incite a backlash? What ever happened to making up our own minds about whether or not someone is an idiot or not based on their utterances?

Twitter deletes new Trump tweets after ban Tali Arbel16:24, Jan 09 2021 @REALDONALDTRUMP/TWITTER US President Donald Trump speaks in a video posted to his Twitter account on Friday (NZT) after a short ban. His account has now been suspended “due to the risk of further incitement of violence”. A defiant Donald Trump has had more tweets deleted and accused Twitter in a statement of having "coordinated with the Democrats and the Radical Left" to remove his account. Twitter earlier banned Trump's personal account citing “the risk of further incitement of violence.'' The president of the US threatened regulation, promised a "big announcement" to come and said he is looking "at the possibilities of building out our own platform in the near future!", The Washington Post reported. The official account for the presidency, @POTUS, also tweeted that message, although the posts were quickly taken down by Twitter. Trump tweeted, "We will not be SILENCED!" The @POTUS government account has 33.4 million followers. The Team Trump account has also been suspended for tweeting out the same message as the president after the ban. The social platform has been under growing pressure to take further action against Trump following Wednesday's deadly insurrection at the US Capitol. Twitter initially suspended Trump's account for 12 hours after he posted a video that repeated false claims about election fraud and praised the rioters who stormed the Capitol. TWITTER Twitter deleted Donald Trump's tweet from the @POTUS account while the @TeamTrump account has been suspended along with Trump’s personal Twitter account. Twitter's move deprives Trump of a potent tool he has used to communicate directly with the American people for more than a decade. He has used Twitter to announce policy changes, challenge opponents, insult enemies, praise his allies (and himself), and to spread misinformation. Twitter has long given Trump and other world leaders broad exemptions from its rules against personal attacks, hate speech and other behaviours. But in a lengthy explanation posted on its blog Friday, the company said recent Trump tweets amounted to glorification of violence when read in the context of the Capitol riot and plans circulating online for future armed protests around the inauguration of US President-elect Joe Biden. Outgoing US President Donald Trump makes his strongest condemnation yet of the Capitol Hill riots in a prepared speech, released in a pre-recorded video the day after the disturbance. In those tweets, Trump stated that he will not be attending the inauguration and referred to his supporters as “American Patriots,'' saying they will have “a GIANT VOICE long into the future.'' Twitter said these statements” are likely to inspire others to replicate the violent acts that took place on January 6, 2021, and that there are multiple indicators that they are being received and understood as encouragement to do so.” The company said “plans for future armed protests have already begun proliferating on and off-Twitter, including a proposed secondary attack on the US Capitol and state capitol buildings on January 17, 2021.” Twitter said its policy enables world leaders to speak to the public, but that these accounts “are not above our rules entirely'' and can't use Twitter to incite violence. Trump had roughly 89 million followers. Facebook and Instagram, which is owned by Facebook, on Thursday suspended Trump's account for at least two weeks, and possibly indefinitely. At that time, Twitter, however, merely revoked Trump's posting privileges for 12 hours after he posted a video that repeated false claims about election fraud and praised the rioters who stormed the Capitol. LAUREN VICTORIA BURKE/AP In this 2014 photo, then-US Defence Intelligence Agency Director Lt. Gen. Michael Flynn testifies on Capitol Hill in Washington. President Donald Trump has pardoned Flynn, taking direct aim in the final days of his administration at a Russia investigation that he has long insisted was motivated by political bias. Trump announced the pardon on November 25. Twitter has banned Flynn. On Friday, the company permanently banned two Trump loyalists - former national security adviser Michael Flynn and attorney Sidney Powell - as part of a broader purge of accounts promoting the QAnon conspiracy theory. Twitter said it will take action on behaviour that has the potential to lead to offline harm. “Given the renewed potential for violence surrounding this type of behaviour in the coming days, we will permanently suspend accounts that are solely dedicated to sharing QAnon content,'' Twitter said in an emailed statement. The company also said Trump attorney Lin Wood was permanently suspended Tuesday for violating its rules, but provided no additional details. The company says that when it determines a group or campaign is engaged in “coordinated harmful activity,'' it may suspend accounts that it finds primarily encourages that behaviour. Social media companies have been under intensified pressure to crack down on hate speech since a violent mob egged on by Trump stormed the US Capitol. Dozens of QAnon social media accounts were hyping up Trump's January 6 rally in the heart of Washington, expressing hope that it could lead to the overturn of the US election results. AP

I assume you mean JJ Flash not sure who 027 is. For a brief period recently I did care a bit too much however some reassurance from some quality people PM'img me on BOAY got me back on track. As long as those who can't defend themselves (e.g. our families) are not dragged into our spats, as long as people don't get fixated on ad hominem attacks and we stay within the laws of the land then who cares if we sometimes rant on like idiots!

Back to the Topic of the thread. Just did some tests. Yep if I Trackside streaming via the Loveracing website a). I dont have to prove I have money in my TAB account; b). There is zero buffering in small or full screen. Test from the same location using the TAB App and I get appalling buffering. So not my phone and not the connection. Further checked against TV - 7 second delay between Loveracing stream, 3 seconds TAB App. For the sake of 4 seconds and having full screen streaming on my phone without buffering then I'll happily be 7 seconds late. Given there is a delay between when they stop taking bets, 15 second delay after the start to update the final prices and when the race is run.

Again I agree Nomates. But shouldn't the industry stakeholders be involved in determining the strategy whatever it is? It is a statutory organisation that only exists through an Act of Parliament. Given it supposedly has a monopoly in NZ shouldn't any pending strategic decisions be put up for public discussion? For example they pushed the marketing of racing out to the codes. I dont believe that was explicit in the Messara report. Now we have NZTR spending North of $2m+ on a new computer system from OZ. Where was the industry discussion on that? Back to my old chestnut - why the secret squirrels around the AWT track business cases? Where is the transparency? I note there doesn't seem to be much happening at Awapuni yet with regard to their AWT!

Again I don't disagree. However TAB NZ as an entity is still trading essentially insolvent. The majority of revenue they earn doesn't come from NZ Racing - that was clearly evident during Covid-19 lockdown! They have already started pushing costs to the codes. For example no on-course presenters instead they are now based in a mini-studio at Te Rapa!

Don't get me wrong. I don't disagree with your sentiment. I'm just pointing out the duplicity of it all including the lack of customer service! The sleight of hand with the pushing of costs off the TAB NZ accounts out to the Codes is a dangerous trend and I fear more of it will occur. That will be supported by the Thoroughbred code as they have a sense of entitlement "we funded the setup of the TAB not Harness and Greyhounds" and they have the resources to squeeze out the other codes. Notice how the marketing broadcasts of Weigh In and the Box Seat have been pushed out to the codes and even further out to the industry paying. It won't be long before the only marketing and promotion you see from TAB NZ is purely wagering related - actually in writing that I'm thinking that they've got there already! Again the rationale and corporate speak will be "we are a wagering company" and the promotion and marketing of individual sports is not our core competency. Shoot it won't be long before they will be charging Sports and Racing Codes the privilege of using their monopoly! I'm picking there is going to be a big scrap for Race Broadcasting soon. TAB NZ obviously don't want a bar of it.

Why waste your time reading their crap when you can read our crap? Let alone worry about what is said! Don't you find it amusing that a few hours after an interesting topic appears on BOAY it gets duplicated elsewhere?

But they don't have any involvement with broadcasting those Sports that they provide books on. For example the Polish Women's Volleyball League.

Yep and between those two "premier tracks" they have about 140 staff - many full time. They even have Racing Manager's! How many at Reefton - Reefton? Let me guess one part time who is racing manager, track supervisor, seat cleaner, number cloth cleaner, function organiser, hospitality co-ordinator, ....probably even hammers the odd nail into a yard plank or a stable door occasionally! Oh and how many "practice" race meetings a year do the big tracks have compared to say Reefton? Yet in 20+ years of a golf course in the middle of the Ellerslie race track no one thought about a raceday protocol and risk management plan?