Horace

In respect of the above comment I retract this and unreservedly apologise to TeAkau/D Ellis for the comment. Horace (A Godsalve)

I don't intend to compromise the identity of the people who told me this. I therefore withdraw the allegation Give dave a kiss from me chief. I'm joining the number of people who won't be participating in this site in future.

Ditto. I'm out as well.

Tell you what..and this is my last post on this topic...you front up with a contract from Te akau that says they can demand a 10% fee from the sale of a horse....months, or in fact years if I read you correctly.. after it has been retired and I'll concede.

Consider the facts before you go chucking your weight around Chief. The horse in question-a reasonably well performed mare-had been retired from the TA stable for some time. When TA heard she had been sold they held out ' their' hands for 10%. Quite rightly they were told to fornicate off in a different direction. You are quick to defend TA,OP when he belts horses,morphine in winners etc etc..however if anyone is dumb enough to sign a contract with TA or any other trainer that says that said trainer will get a commission from the sale of a horse months after it has been retired they deserve to be hung,drawn and quartered. And anyway an agreement like that would be almost impossible to enforce if it came to the crunch.

'I'm pretty sure Fortuna and Te Akau will clip the ticket as well'....thats what you said Chief. ' Clipping the ticket' has very clear overtones of 'shady' if not 'illegal' activity so I'd like to hear YOUR justification for saying that before you point the bone at me.

According to NZTR she won $4,220,000 odd. Thats $422,000 to Te Akau at 10%. Plus you can guarantee that the syndicate got charged plenty of expenses etc along the way. If it was me I'm not sure if I'd be interested in paying Te Akau anything from the $2.6m, although I bet they send Fortuna an 'account'. Ellis/TeAkau tried that one on a well known stud in NZ a few years ago after the stud sold a mare Te akau trained. The stud owner told them to get stuffed. Needless to say Ellis hasn't bought any of their yearlings at Karaka since.🤑

Some of these drugs already have a built in ' allowance' i.e. alcohol, cannabis, however I'm hoping you dont think meth. should be allowed in small bits?

Chief I find your view on illegal substances quite disturbing. So you seem to think a little bit of a 'harmful substance' in animals is acceptable? Do you then think that jockeys, drivers, league players etc should be extended the same leniency if tested ' positive' to meth/cocaine/cannabis/morphine/alcohol etc...? Yep, humans have a choice about what they ingest..however methamphetamine is a chemical that does not occur naturally, so a ' minor' positive is still a postive. Love to hear your rationale.

If you don't know, Bob wrote a lovely song/poem many years ago called " Forever Young'. A classic, the version by Joen Baez almost makes me want to cry

'May God bless and keep you always May your wishes all come true May you always do to others And let others do for you May you build a ladder to the stars And climb on every rung And may you stay...forever young ' Not racing related but some of us could do to remember these words... From Bob Dylan, 80 years young today.

Oathum is a lightweight tommo. You know that. Falls to bits when placed under any pressure whatsoever. However, when its a young apprentice is in the firing line, Mr O is dynamite.! Over the years its been clear that senior riders who tend to fight back have been let off the hook in the main. Think ' lethal'...man of many warnings but feck all else! Policy making should be the realm of someone a lot higher up the food chain than' O' and some of his cronies. I see the j.c.a. has employed some Judges to hear raceday charges. A bit over the top-you'd think if these learned ones want to be involved in the industry their expertise would be better suited to promulgating Rules to cover situations you refer to tommo.

I've known Jason for a number of years. He would be the first to acknowledge that he has had ' issues' of various types for a long time. What he didn't need was to get hooked on what some people call a' recreational drug'..🤔.recreational my ass! Just like cocaine, cannabis, alcohol etc etc, 'P' is a damaging influence. Ask some of the victims of crimes/motor collisions/burglaries/robberies/defalcations etc if they think these drugs are merely 'recreational'...ask the parents/families of people killed in crashes when the offending party is affected by one or more of the above..I hope for his sake that Jason can deal with his addictions and come out a better person. I can't see that involving race riding ever again. Unfortunately he won't be the last racing participant to get ' outed' for one or more of these 'recreational' killers.

Well said Yank... And, quite frankly, who the fuck are these people promulgating these industry restrictions? Should we be reaching for our copy of 1984 to see who the piggy is?

Just speaking generally Brodie....as far as I'm aware the protest/interference rules in tb and harness are the same? You have to prove you were interfered with AND that you'd have beaten the one causing it.

It's called society...any civilised society has to have Rules. A proportion of people will always want to rebel or transgress Rules, however they are coached. It seems to be human nature. Look at the narcicistic twat who thought he would ignore the Law on name suppression..thought he was the centre of attention until his penalty was delivered and now he's crying for mummy and saying ' it aint fair'. If I followed your reasoning I guess it would lead me to 'no rules'..hit horses whenever/wherever/as hard as you like...is that what you'd prefer? Is that how you would really like it to be in NZ? Anything goes? Aww shucks, may as well do away with the interference rules too eh, who cares if a few horses and riders hit the deck...🤔

Leopards don't change their spots Gamma... race 5 at rotorua gallops yesterday. Good old 'trudes' true to form, won the race and fined $300 for beating the horse. AND kept the race? Reece jones, first race ride for months, warned for excessive use of the whip, horse finished 3rd in a black type race. Rasmussen, Williams, etc etc win major harness races and get charged with excessive use/improper use etc..keep the races. Just more ammunition for the anti-racing brigade. Ask yourself.

Thats a step too far Bas....what is required is this: There needs to be a Rule change to allow for a protest to be instigated where the whip guidelines have been breached. Same in galloping races. I cannot for the life of me understand why this is not put in place, right now. Irrespective of what ' chief stipe' thinks, this would be a major disincentive to cheating in the last few hundred metres, which is where most of the offenders lose the plot and belt shit out of their horses. Lets see races being taken off offenders when they win, especially major races....owners won't give the thickheads a second chance!

Compare that to what goes on at Cambridge....not unusual to have 4 drivers with the same surname in one race.

Obviously many trainers also drive. Maybe someone will post here as to how the present guidelines especially were arrived at. Someone who knows what theyr'e talking about that is, i.e. an industry participant. They most certainly had plenty of input and 'signed off' the present situation.

Interesting then that the' law'...in reality the Rule and relevant Guidelines, were in fact 'created' with the full involvement of harness industry participants. Particuarly drivers and trainers. So the problem is not the 'system' in this case, but more the drivers who keep getting stung by the feds for improper whip use. Some of these so called 'senior' drivers seem to think it doesn't apply to them and cry 'foul' when they get hauled up before the judge. Tough shit.

In reality I'd like to punch him in the chops for hurting the horse but that's not productive😄

Needs help. Symptons of underlying problems imho.

Because he pooped himself after getting 13 day suspension after the first at Ruakaka yesterday. Great stuff! After leaning all over apprentices and young riders for years he gets charged for severely interfering with 2 riders..finally. Someone must have told Williamson that he couldn't keep warning innes...and it looks like whoever was the j.c.a at Ruakaka played a blinder giving innes nearly 3 weeks. May seem a tad excessive and no doubt lethal will get a mouthpiece to appeal but at least the writing is on the wall?

Yes there are agendas at work. Just watch racing in the North as soon as it starts to rain. Tracks like Te Aroha, Matamata, rotovegas get 'heavy' and you'll find that programmed races on those tracks will be transferred to the Cambridge highway track....after all the money spent at Cambridge-and it aint finished yet-nztr especially will want to justify all of the money and so they'll be quick to ' can' racing on real winter tracks. Pity about any true winter track horses....not going to liking the synthetic crap. p.s. I walked on the 'synthetic' surface during construction. The base is identical to the highway that passes the course. Tar sealed. They better make sure the surface is deep and protecting horses legs or else there will be carnage.