holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 If Imperatriz wins the Moir it should be off to the Everest imo. My theory is that 'Aunty Alice' is playing games to get a better deal from slot holders. The prize is just too big to sidestep. Not sure who the owners are but the owners manager is meant to be Karen Fenton-Ellis. Te Akau Invincible Empress Racing Partnership (Mgr: Karyn Fenton-Ellis MNZM) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 45 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: Not sure who the owners are but the owners manager is meant to be Karen Fenton-Ellis. Te Akau Invincible Empress Racing Partnership (Mgr: Karyn Fenton-Ellis MNZM) You've obviously never had the chance to see one of their contracts. David Ellis is the Racing Manager and Karyn is the Syndicate Manager. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 46 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: If Imperatriz wins the Moir it should be off to the Everest imo. Surely that's a moot point for you as you don't believe she will win it. Feel free to post your massive lay bet. No doubt you are laying that off on the $6 quote for the Everest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 I would say that they have already been offered the maximum possible which would be $7m less $700k entry fee I.e. $6.3m. From that they slot holder would probably subtract their slot purchase fee. So maybe $5.5m? Perhaps Coolmore will throw in some free services to one or more of their expensive stallions as a sweetner. I don't believe she is better than I Wish I Win. So the prize money drops off really quickly if you place. Who really cares in the future if a mare was an also ran in The Everest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 19 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: You've obviously never had the chance to see one of their contracts. David Ellis is the Racing Manager and Karyn is the Syndicate Manager. I would hope to never see one of their contracts!😀 Te Akau Invincible Empress Racing Partnership (Mgr: Karyn Fenton-Ellis MNZM)=that was off their website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: I would say that they have already been offered the maximum possible which would be $7m less $700k entry fee I.e. $6.3m. From that they slot holder would probably subtract their slot purchase fee. So maybe $5.5m? Perhaps Coolmore will throw in some free services to one or more of their expensive stallions as a sweetner. I don't believe she is better than I Wish I Win. So the prize money drops off really quickly if you place. Who really cares in the future if a mare was an also ran in The Everest. How is that the maximum possible?Slot holders could offer more than that...surely...as she beat last years winner ,she is hot property.Running unplaced would have little effect on her value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 1 minute ago, holy ravioli said: How is that the maximum possible?Slot holders could offer more than that...surely...as she beat last years winner ,she is hot property.Running unplaced would have little effect on her value. Why would they offer more than that when they are already in the hole for a $1m? The winning prize is $7m which quickly drops to $2.9m for second. It isn't the normal stakes split. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 50 minutes ago, curious said: 1.82 lay price on Betfair. Still steady $6 for the Everest. If she bolts in the Moir they'll have a fair bit of leverage for an Everest slot I'd say. Yes.She shouldn't be in the market if Ellis is serious.Gamesmanship imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 1 minute ago, holy ravioli said: She shouldn't be in the market if Ellis is serious. David Ellis doesn't frame the markets although I'm sure he'd like to. On the TABCORP market she is marked as doubtful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Why would they offer more than that when they are already in the hole for a $1m? The winning prize is $7m which quickly drops to $2.9m for second. It isn't the normal stakes split. They would offer more because of her form=her chances of winning.! The Moir has a total stake of $815,000 ....how many times would she have to win that to equal even the 2nd prize in the Everest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: David Ellis doesn't frame the markets although I'm sure he'd like to. On the TABCORP market she is marked as doubtful. Clearly Ellis has not categorically stated that she will definitely not start. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 13 hours ago, holy ravioli said: I would hope to never see one of their contracts!😀 Not very aspirational. I was sent a contract some time ago to peruse. I must say it was very professional and comprehensive. I thought at the time I wish I'd had a contract like that with some of the syndicates I've been involved in. 13 hours ago, holy ravioli said: Te Akau Invincible Empress Racing Partnership (Mgr: Karyn Fenton-Ellis MNZM)=that was off their website. Karyn is the Syndicate Manager - she is a licensed syndicator and manages the owner side of the business. David Ellis in association with the trainer is the Racing Manager. If I recall correctly in his absence the decision making is the Trainers responsibility. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 28, 2023 Share Posted September 28, 2023 4 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: Clearly Ellis has not categorically stated that she will definitely not start. Well hammer that $6 then because she won't be paying that if they do accept a slot. The only way I see them accepting a slot is if Coolmore offer a future stallion deal which would add considerable value to her residual value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 28, 2023 Author Share Posted September 28, 2023 1 minute ago, Gammalite said: no worries mate . I'll roll with 'potential champion' then. I always call someone who performs at the very top level of any sport ( that is Group 1's in racing) and then WINS a champion of their sport. If the All Blacks Win . they'll be 'World Champions' . A huge honour...something they've already been in the past . YEah I think they (AB's) can Win 🏆. Give it a jolly good shake anyway ........🏆 I'm laying them...as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 55 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: Good exotics around her for the keen.💲 Yep double up on your losses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 13 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Yep double up on your losses. Comprehension ,Chief...yes you picked a winner but it was too short for you to back.... Quinella 7:8 4.00 Trifecta 7:8:3 29.70 First4 7:8:3:2 233.30 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 9 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: Comprehension ,Chief...yes you picked a winner but it was too short for you to back.... Quinella 7:8 4.00 Trifecta 7:8:3 29.70 First4 7:8:3:2 233.30 Well you just go put all your alleged winnings now on Imperatriz to win The Everest. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said: Well you just go put all your alleged winnings now on Imperatriz to win The Everest. What alleged' winnings would they be ,then Chief? I layed her and lost. I will spell it out ,so that a 2.y.o can understand it.People who fancied Imperatriz but couldn't back her outright because she was so short ,could have taken quinellas,trfectas,first4's,trebles,quaddies and made money....the divvys were very good. Get it?🙄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 14 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: What alleged' winnings would they be ,then Chief? I layed her and lost. Oh so you didn’t take any of the exotic bets on her? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 15 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: I will spell it out ,so that a 2.y.o can understand it.People who fancied Imperatriz but couldn't back her outright because she was so short ,could have taken quinellas,trfectas,first4's,trebles,quaddies and made money....the divvys were very good. The majority of top punters look for value. They don't play exotics especially on the Tote. I'm glad you can relate to two year olds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 5 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Oh so you didn’t take any of the exotic bets on her? NO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 3 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: The majority of top punters look for value. They don't play exotics especially on the Tote. I'm glad you can relate to two year olds. When were you appointed spokesperson for the majority of punters? I am loathe to cast aspersions on the mental dexterity that some commentators display,but have come to the conclusion that some are just a ...wee bit...thick!👈 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 29, 2023 Share Posted September 29, 2023 7 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: When were you appointed spokesperson for the majority of punters? FFS who said I was spokesperson?! It's a well known fact. Successful punters look for value. Hard to do that with exotics. 10 minutes ago, holy ravioli said: I am loathe to cast aspersions on the mental dexterity that some commentators display,but have come to the conclusion that some are just a ...wee bit...thick!👈 No need to cast aspersions in your case. Your posts suffice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 ' It's a well known fact. Successful punters look for value. Hard to do that with exotics.' A good deal easier in an 8 horse field. Quinella $4-Asfoora Tri-$29.70-Asfoora,Uncommon James F4-$233.30 QUAD-$176.70 Treble-$23.10 Not forgetting Amelia's Jewel another $1.50 shot was a leg of the treble/quaddie. Looks like value to me.👈 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
holy ravioli Posted September 29, 2023 Author Share Posted September 29, 2023 20 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: It comes with Grp 1 black type which adds permanently to her residual value. Black Type is how the industry measures the quality of the horses. Arguably top of the tree in this industry=Coolmore...what would..they know!🤪 ' The Everest has put a 3-year-old on top of the sprinting world, sending his potential stud value into the stratosphere." TDN AusNZ, 20th October 2019 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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