Box Seat- Dexter Dunn’s thoughts?

[Brodie]

Box Seat this week had the second part of the interview with Dexter Dunn.

Very interesting listening to his thoughts.

He suggested that we might be overdoing the Standing Starts and should be more mobiles, which I agree with nowadays as the starts are just not

good enough.

There has been no improvement with them and just turns the punters off, not that it seems to concern HRNZ though as they allow the crap to continue.

How come the Stipes dont mention the poor starts in their report, cos they are all mates!

The second very interest thing Dexter said was that he thought people in the industry seemed to enjoy the short track racing???????

Personally think that serious punters hate the mile racing  that the Clubs have brought in in recent years.

He is used to the boring racing that he drives in, in the United States so will not be aware of what is going on here.

Would be good to know whether this mile racing does actually attract punters to the races and is there more wagering on them?

I would be extremely sure that it does not encourage wagering at all and is a turnoff for most serious punters and enthusiasts.

Edited Wednesday at 08:32 AM by Brodie

[Nowornever]

Need standing starts but just need to make them stand still and not get a running start like most of them try to do. 

[Tonkatime!]

On 5/02/2025 at 9:31 PM, Brodie said:

 

He suggested that we might be overdoing the Standing Starts and should be more mobiles, which I agree with nowadays as the starts are just not good enough.

 

Finally Brodie. It has taken many many years but you are  on the money.
 

I totally agree with you that the standing starts are just not good enough since Peter Lamb retired. 

[Brodie]

8 hours ago, Tonkatime! said:

Finally Brodie. It has taken many many years but you are  on the money.
 

I totally agree with you that the standing starts are just not good enough since Peter Lamb retired. 

Always on the money Tonka!

It is not be that hard to have horses standing behind the tape as the trainers surely all spend plenty of time on this?

The fact that certain starters do not give a stuff about standing starts paints a very poor picture of professionalism for the industry.

All starts should be fair for all horses, but almost every standing start in Canterbury is just a raffle and unfair.

Drivers know how lax the starter is and that they can get away with almost anything including full blown run up.

HRNZ if they have any concern for the industry progressing should be coming down on the starter and not allowing AMATEUR HOUR STARTS!
Are they standing starts or not??

If not then change the name to NON MOBILE START, ANYTHING IS ACCEPTABLE!

Edited 17 hours ago by Brodie

[Gammalite]

2 hours ago, Brodie said:

All starts should be fair for all horses, but almost every standing start in Canterbury is just a raffle and unfair.

Drivers know how lax the starter is and that they can get away with almost anything including full blown run up.

HRNZ if they have any concern for the industry progressing should be coming down on the starter and not allowing AMATEUR HOUR STARTS

Not just Canterbury either Brodster.

You should of seen the Hawera meeting last weekend. The Stratford Cup on day 1 ( for supposed experienced horses) was a Dog's Dinner. A false start caused by Dennis Dunuto and at 'Take 2' he was just about sideways as they let them go the second time round.  Interfered with others. Also  The Abernathy brothers were both tipped out from handicap marks. Handicapped alright !! 🤣  It was ridiculous. 2 races later > in the Stratford Trot for the mid class trotters it was like Ellerslie with more galloping than trotting at /just after the start. 

The Hawera Cup on the 2nd day was a bit better I spose but still 3 runners lost their chance at the start. They didn't use the run-up technique at all that the Southerners use. They were actually standing.

BUT Just use the mobile like the other races on the card is the answer ?. It's right there - ready to use. 

[goldilocks]

I agree that it is time to give standing starts away, use the PBD for all races except  maidens to provide some handicapped.

Dexter has been home for a good while now, and to me it is unfortunate  that the Box Seat is the only place he has been interviewed,  surely a world champion should be seen on main stream media to help gain exposure  to the general public not already aware of his talent and record

[Withadream2]

On 2/5/2025 at 9:31 PM, Brodie said:

Would be good to know whether this mile racing does actually attract punters to the races and is there more wagering on them?

As an enthusiast I love mile racing.  Not at Addington of course or on grass tracks but love it on tracks like Nelson, Ashburton & Winton.   I wouldn’t want it to be like the USA but a couple of mile races on suitable tracks per meeting adds to the variety of distances we compete over.  Particularly valuable for mares & fillies races. 

[Gammalite]

7 minutes ago, Withadream2 said:

As an enthusiast I love mile racing.  Not at Addington of course or on grass tracks but love it on tracks like Nelson, Ashburton & Winton.   I wouldn’t want it to be like the USA but a couple of mile races on suitable tracks per meeting adds to the variety of distances we compete over.  Particularly valuable for mares & fillies races. 

The thing with mile racing (or mile and a quarter) that nearly all the races are run over day in and day out in Aus and USA is that it's easier on the horses (and therefore the trainer and driver)  Horses recover better and can race again the following week no trouble at all. 

Brodie rightly is always against it (short course racing)  as a Punter. As rightly as he notices , it is TOO Hard to come from the back and win these races. They are hard to bet on. They are harder to win . The barrier draw is really determining your chances greatly. They can be very 'pedestrian' because of this too. and at our local course in Brisbane every race starts to look the same . same old same old. I wouldn't bet on it and love the sport , and the NZ harness racing is way better to watch . and with the 2600m Addington or 2700m Alex Park horses can come from the Back of the field and Win , so much better for the Punter, and exciting to watch too. 

[Brodie]

3 hours ago, Withadream2 said:

As an enthusiast I love mile racing.  Not at Addington of course or on grass tracks but love it on tracks like Nelson, Ashburton & Winton.   I wouldn’t want it to be like the USA but a couple of mile races on suitable tracks per meeting adds to the variety of distances we compete over.  Particularly valuable for mares & fillies races. 

Fair enough, but do you actually wager on them?

Black print is overrated nowadays as anything that wins can get black print on all weather tracks.

All the punters and enthusiasts I speak to  do not like this short trsck racing.

The U.S. mile racing is just a yawn fest in my humble opinion.

Edited 10 hours ago by Brodie

[Withadream2]

1 hour ago, Brodie said:

Fair enough, but do you actually wager on them?

As much as I would on any race. 

 

1 hour ago, Brodie said:

The U.S. mile racing is just a yawn fest in my humble opinion.

Fair enough but in the USA it’s virtually all mile racing.  In NZ we are talking about a couple of races a week at the most on suitable tracks as part of a variety of distances. 

[Gammalite]

5 hours ago, goldilocks said:

I agree that it is time to give standing starts away, use the PBD for all races except  maidens to provide some handicapped.

Good to see that the NZ Metropolitan TC are running all 3 of the trots races as mobile starts this afternoon.

That seems a very progressive move to stop all the shambles at the starts. 

And Auckland are running 2 mobiles and just the one stand in the last race with just 6 in it.

The 2 yearold race has just 6 starters as well and Lincoln Farms have 5 of them !!. wow-wee they might have a good 2 year old year if can get that many going early on in season. Telfers with the other runner.  

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, Withadream2 said:

As much as I would on any race. 

 

Fair enough but in the USA it’s virtually all mile racing.  In NZ we are talking about a couple of races a week at the most on suitable tracks as part of a variety of distances. 

Addington races most weeks so great that they do not race over the mile thank goodness for that.

The harness industry really need to pull together and start programming races that encourages punters as they certainly need more.

Yes stake money is better now than it was a couple of years ago and owners are going to get bonuses, not that I believe $4k is going to entice new owners in large numbers, but it is something.

At the end of the day, if HRNZ and the Clubs think that programming these races are going to attract people to the races and wager, then that is their choice.

Our horses are trained to be running these middle distances and if you asked the horses whether they preferred to sprint  hard all the way over a mile or race at a good speed and sprint home over 2600m, I reckon they would go for the 2600m!

Most punters would be the same, 2600m rather than the mile but I am not on the payroll 

[Gammalite]

18 minutes ago, Brodie said:

Our horses are trained to be running these middle distances and if you asked the horses whether they preferred to sprint  hard all the way over a mile or race at a good speed and sprint home over 2600m, I reckon they would go for the 2600m!

wrong . not the case. the horses are pretty knackered at the end of 2400 to 2700m races. 

A mile is a Easy distance for them to get there timing right. 

Most Gallopers in a free flowing natural action are racing 1200m to 1400m . very few go 2400m plus . it's very taxing on them. even in their natural movement.

Pacers and trotters expend a tremendous amount of energy trying to hold down 30 second quarter miles in a row. It's almost cruel the Nz Cup and Rowe Cups (and Melbourne Cups galloping) over 2 miles, as knocks the horses around terribly. Only the Very best can do it. 

A bit like a human athletes can goes ok and can back up (even later that day) after a 100m or 200m dash , but put him over a mile and recovery is much slower and he'd be still feeling it the next day. or even later that week.  

[Withadream2]

9 hours ago, goldilocks said:

agree that it is time to give standing starts away, use the PBD for all races except  maidens to provide some handicapped.

I have to say we’ve had our fair share of false starts from the mobile tonight 

[Brodie]

3 hours ago, Gammalite said:

wrong . not the case. the horses are pretty knackered at the end of 2400 to 2700m races. 

A mile is a Easy distance for them to get there timing right. 

Most Gallopers in a free flowing natural action are racing 1200m to 1400m . very few go 2400m plus . it's very taxing on them. even in their natural movement.

Pacers and trotters expend a tremendous amount of energy trying to hold down 30 second quarter miles in a row. It's almost cruel the Nz Cup and Rowe Cups (and Melbourne Cups galloping) over 2 miles, as knocks the horses around terribly. Only the Very best can do it. 

A bit like a human athletes can goes ok and can back up (even later that day) after a 100m or 200m dash , but put him over a mile and recovery is much slower and he'd be still feeling it the next day. or even later that week.  

They work hard over more distance on their home tracks.

You would know better than I Gamma, but is a turn off these miles.

Its all good though if the powers that be believe that these miles are good for the industry and is profitable.

Maybe the less serious punters do not mind the sprints but I would be pretty sure the turnover suffers majorly from running them.