curious Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said: Why the hell can't they replicate what Australia has done? What do you mean? NZ has a completely different COVID strategy, rightly or wrongly, and only time will tell that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 11 minutes ago, curious said: What do you mean? NZ has a completely different COVID strategy, rightly or wrongly, and only time will tell that. A strategy that is increasingly looking like it is driven by political ideology. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 31 minutes ago, curious said: What do you mean? NZ has a completely different COVID strategy, rightly or wrongly, and only time will tell that. At the moment the stats comparison between NZ and OZ have OZ in front by a nose. Surely if we have an Australia/NZ bubble that means we can follow their lead on racing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: At the moment the stats comparison between NZ and OZ have OZ in front by a nose. Being an Australian and a Kiwi, I know where I'd rather be. And it isn't there. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 (edited) 54 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: At the moment the stats comparison between NZ and OZ have OZ in front by a nose. Really? You are dreaming. Edited April 16, 2020 by curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 8 minutes ago, curious said: Really? You are dreaming. Number infected per million. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 11 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Number infected per million. Fair enough. Similar death rate and testing rate on that basis too. The jury's out still on how things will go over the next few months both health wise and economically. I'm happy with the NZ strategy for now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 I think eventually the world will have to let this thing rip. We are going to have more people die from the cure than the disease. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clarkie Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 I think eventually the world will have to let this thing rip. We are going to have more people die from the cure than the disease. "Christ" as far as Stipes Go I'm not sure where you are placed Chief.?. We have had Cameron George,, Ross Neal. and a trail of Corruption, Gavin Whiterod, Scotty Wallis .. Grimestome to name a few of these corrupt pricks...Cameron George a pure arsehole .. Holden,, Barsi and the weakest of all Hannan is the catalyst for all of this Corruption., 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 10 hours ago, mardigras said: Being an Australian and a Kiwi, I know where I'd rather be. And it isn't there. And I have family in a similar situation booking/planning a return for a 12 month hiatus here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, curious said: And I have family in a similar situation booking/planning a return for a 12 month hiatus here. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 10 hours ago, mardigras said: Being an Australian and a Kiwi, I know where I'd rather be. And it isn't there. Why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said: Why? Covid response, safety and probable economic recovery/opportunity timeline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 16, 2020 Author Share Posted April 16, 2020 12 hours ago, Chief Stipe said: A strategy that is increasingly looking like it is driven by political ideology. It's a broad ideology then. Didn't all parties and all MPs support it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said: Why? Along what curious said. I think the NZ economy will recover a lot quicker than Australia's, even though a lot more business have remained open in Australia. They have lacked clear decision making which will have a longer impact on recovery imo. And because of the clear decision making, I think our response is better in so far as the health and safety aspects. You mentioned you think the cure could be worse than the disease. I definitely disagree. If you didn't try the cure, the disease would have a far greater impact on the economy. That is already evident on what was happening to the economies of those countries that didn't do anything for longer. If you try the cure, and it doesn't work out, you'll just be in the same position as you would be without trying. In NZ, my view is the most important thing to do was ensure our health systems remained able to service the needs of the community. I think we will have done that, and our borders (outside of possibly Australia), won't be opening anytime soon, and unlikely before a vaccination - in order to limit the potential impact to our health system (and we simply don't have the infrastructure/facilities to quarantine the arrivals). I've stated many times, the virus isn't the biggest problem. It is the individual countries ability to continue to provide the level of health service the country requires. If you break your health system, you are going to break your economy. There are plenty of lessons to be learned. But societies will not learn them. Once this is all over and some form of normal life returns, people/business in countries like NZ will still continue to live week to week (even those that could do something to change that). For most, their behaviour will not change. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aquaman Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 https://nopunchespulled.com/2020/04/13/the-coming-economic-crisis-and-its-political-consequences/ Bob Jones. Very good read, right on the button for mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 13 minutes ago, aquaman said: https://nopunchespulled.com/2020/04/13/the-coming-economic-crisis-and-its-political-consequences/ Bob Jones. Very good read, right on the button for mine. Whilst I agree with some of his points - in relation to possibly going too far. However, I doubt going too far will have any variant impact on the economy overall. Shedding parts of an industry that was likely too top heavy anyway is not such a bad thing. Shedding complacency - a great thing if it happens. I disagree with his view on the impact. What does he think the impact will be on Australia - they haven't gone so far, and they are likely to face a longer recovery period - business wise. Perhaps when he talked about the plight of Italy and Spain, he should reflect that Britain is going down a path that surpasses both of those countries. One of my brothers lives there - he reckons it is in the toilet. And for the record, I am not a Jacinda fan. I have never voted labour and it is likely I never will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 18 minutes ago, aquaman said: https://nopunchespulled.com/2020/04/13/the-coming-economic-crisis-and-its-political-consequences/ Bob Jones. Very good read, right on the button for mine. And more importantly, most of the things that will happen to the economy, were going to happen anyway, even if there had been no lockdown. Tourism etc (including restaurants/bars). The jobs haven't gone needlessly - they were going with or without the lockdown. And he talks of the fear factor and reinvestment. If he thinks the fear would be lessened by not having had the level of lockdown, then I'm not sure why he would think that. The fear is likely heightened if the virus spread to a greater degree, yet that is what would be likely under his suggestions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 58 minutes ago, mardigras said: Perhaps when he talked about the plight of Italy and Spain, he should reflect that Britain is going down a path that surpasses both of those countries. One of my brothers lives there - he reckons it is in the toilet. The statistics don't confirm that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 59 minutes ago, mardigras said: I disagree with his view on the impact. What does he think the impact will be on Australia - they haven't gone so far, and they are likely to face a longer recovery period - business wise. Based on what evidence? One industry that concerns us all on this forum will do a lot better than our equivalent e.g. the racing industry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aquaman Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 Leave the virus alone, get on with life, its not that deadly, no more than a cold to most people. Gullible people have swallowed this sham hook line and sinker. The cure will be far more deadly than this mild virus. This government failed badly, and now the entire population is paying the price. They failed on the borders, failed with the cruise ships, failed protecting rest homes, and worst of all, failed with the economy. If they had interned all arrivals at the border in the beginning, ring fenced rest homes, then this home detention would of been avoided. This is a virus that predominately affects the very old and infirmed. It will never be eradicated like stupid Cindy believes. We should open up immediately, build some xtra hospital capacity in spare buildings and parks, ring fence the elderly, and observe strict border controls until a vaccine is found, or we reach herd immunity. A vaccine will probably not be available until June 2021 at the earliest if at all. All NZ deaths attributed to this virus would of died even if they got a cold or flu. Its rapidly becoming becoming so bad now, that you are not allowed to die no matter how poorly you are. Humans have become very weak in this new age of control. Forces are at work out there using this virus for other reasons. If we do not stand up, then we will rapidly descend to the level of China and its control of its people. Thats my opinion, and I am certainly not afraid of catching this very mild virus even though I'm in my 70's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 1 minute ago, Chief Stipe said: The statistics don't confirm that. You must be reading different statistics. Have you seen the statistics of all three countries based on the days since they each had 100 cases? Which of the three has the highest gradient curve in relation to cases. And did you know that the UK has had only 55% of the number of reported cases of Spain? And had 70% of the number of deaths of Spain? So their case rate growth at the same time is higher than both Italy's and Spain's And their death rate is also far higher than Spain's. And did you also know, the deaths in the UK only count hospital deaths? No deaths in rest homes or anywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 3 hours ago, curious said: It's a broad ideology then. Didn't all parties and all MPs support it? How can we be sure? Our Parliament was shut down and decisions have been made by executive decree. In a broad sense I don't think anyone opposed restrictions being implemented however how they were implemented and the degree to which they have been implemented there has been disagreement. With the contagion of mediocrity and lame leadership that has swept the western world it isn't surprising that everyone followed everyone else like lemmings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 4 minutes ago, aquaman said: Leave the virus alone, get on with life, its not that deadly, no more than a cold to most people. Gullible people have swallowed this sham hook line and sinker. The cure will be far more deadly than this mild virus. So it's just a cold. And you think Bob Jones is on the money. Can you give us a comparison maybe between NZ and Sweden. Can you tell us how many die in Sweden each year from what is just a cold to most people? Sweden seem to have followed Bob's advice. How's their economy. What sort of job losses did they have in the last week? It makes no difference whether the virus is no more than a cold to most people. Doing nothing or doing something was always going to have the same impact on a countries economy. Only the gullible couldn't see that. Clearly you couldn't see that. Nor could Bob. Shed some light on the impact of this cold to countries that have followed such advice. Compare with Sweden remoteness/accessibility population density population age profile city densities virus cases virus deaths virus serious/critical cases virus economic impact Feel free to compare anything else you feel relevant. And maybe you can tell us how much different what Sweden has done to what Bob suggests in dealing with this cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 16, 2020 Share Posted April 16, 2020 3 minutes ago, mardigras said: You must be reading different statistics. Have you seen the statistics of all three countries based on the days since they each had 100 cases? Which of the three has the highest gradient curve in relation to cases. Not the UK. The UK went from 100 to 100,000 cases in 46 days. Spain 31. Italy 35. 10 minutes ago, mardigras said: And did you know that the UK has had only 55% of the number of reported cases of Spain? And had 70% of the number of deaths of Spain? So their case rate growth at the same time is higher than both Italy's and Spain's And their death rate is also far higher than Spain's. The death rate for those that have caught Covid-19 in Spain is 10%, Italy 13%, UK 13%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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