Less horse numbers - less supply more demand - is it driving export prices up

[Jones]

Was thinking, with each season getting lower & lower numbers breeding wise. Will this ultimately result in higher prices, as overseas demand one would think would stay the same. Aus and USA both have big populations. So demand stays the same, but with less NZ supply, is this driving up or going to drive up export prices?

Therefore is this actually a positive for the industry? Owners make money in sales should they strike an above average horse. Less or no wastage in time as some call it. With more horses getting a home after racing or being sold on overseas. 

Less racing overall, but a more improved product as racing gets streamlined? Is the future? Don't hold the answer or answers was just thinking about supply & demand.

Would be interesting to see all those exported to Aus and USA in the past 5 years. Sale price figures. If it is the same or if the average/median has gone up in the past year or 2.

[Gammalite]

12 minutes ago, Jones said:

Was thinking, with each season getting lower & lower numbers breeding wise. Will this ultimately result in higher prices, as overseas demand one would think would stay the same. Aus and USA both have big populations. So demand stays the same, but with less NZ supply, is this driving up or going to drive up export prices?

Therefore is this actually a positive for the industry? Owners make money in sales should they strike an above average horse. Less or no wastage in time as some call it. With more horses getting a home after racing or being sold on overseas. 

Less racing overall, but a more improved product as racing gets streamlined? Is the future? Don't hold the answer or answers was just thinking about supply & demand.

Would be interesting to see all those exported to Aus and USA in the past 5 years. Sale price figures. If it is the same or if the average/median has gone up in the past year or 2.

Reckon Mr Dickie at Clevedon, will be pleased picking up TWIST LIKE THIS at the sales for $90,000.

Absolute bargain out of the great racemare Twist and Twirl ,so is  a halfie to magnificent horse's King of Swing and Bettor Twist.

Can it get any 'bettor' than that ?   I'd be twisting and twirling waiting for him to race next year. wow.

[Gospel of Judas]

More when will demand and supply meet? that be point when prices remain stable or decrease. Untill then, might opportunity to breed, race sell.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Gospel of Judas

[Jones]

9 minutes ago, Gospel of Judas said:

More when will demand and supply meet? that be point when prices remain stable or decrease. Untill then, might opportunity to breed, race sell.

Nice to see you post Gospel. You, me Gamms & Taupiri our new lil clan hehe. 

Yes Gamms wasn't thinking of high priced yearling sales when posted thread. More like if one gets a cheaper horse from Gavel or say weanling sales say between 5k-10k and then if its ok and sells for anywhere between 50-500k. Not losing anyway.

Think when Bettors stock all sold for high price at yearling sales, again supply-demand. As there were so few. But of course he is a stallion in demand. 

Agree Gospel when will supply and demand meet. Good question. 

Just thought for thought. 

Welcome to ideas and thoughts BOAY posters 😄

[Taupiri Wonder]

Jonesy,I think a factor to consider on the demand for Kiwi Standardbreds to Markets in USA & Australia is the cost of freight.

Back when Brian Meale,Charlie Hunter & others were sending planeloads of horses Stateside during the 1970's & thereafter,they formed a significent percentage of total exports.Plus others took the more economical sea route!

These days,you can usually count on one hand the number exported to the USA.

[Gammalite]

10 minutes ago, Jones said:

Yes Gamms wasn't thinking of high priced yearling sales when posted thread

I was saying that was in fact a Very Low price for quality stock.

The West Australians (NZ best buyers ) still swoop on 'Up and running' stock. esp. after 1 southland win, they wisk off to the big smoke. Hall still buys 10 per year and sure Team Bond the same.

A Jonesy special at Albion tomorrow. The Sweet Lou gelding SPIRIT OF ST LOUIS is in at $1.35 , !!!!  as is with McCarthy now and appears to have half of New Zealand and Australia as the owners !! lol..............

He won his Australian debut in 1.55.2 at the Goulbourn backwater early in month. pretty slick ? should give the Brissy locals some curry , and increase the value of Sweet Lou's ?? lol.....

[Jones]

Thanks guys for your input.

Does anyone know what say the price is for a say 3 or 4 win NZ horse in form, sales to Oz for these days? And then compare that to say 5 years ago or even 3 years ago? Just curious.

Or even a horse that wins first up and is well breed. Id love to know the sale prices for ALL exports. Be GREAT if HNRZ could make it a rule to make public. 

[paleface adios]

6 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

I was saying that was in fact a Very Low price for quality stock.

The West Australians (NZ best buyers ) still swoop on 'Up and running' stock. esp. after 1 southland win, they wisk off to the big smoke. Hall still buys 10 per year and sure Team Bond the same.

A Jonesy special at Albion tomorrow. The Sweet Lou gelding SPIRIT OF ST LOUIS is in at $1.35 , !!!!  as is with McCarthy now and appears to have half of New Zealand and Australia as the owners !! lol..............

He won his Australian debut in 1.55.2 at the Goulbourn backwater early in month. pretty slick ? should give the Brissy locals some curry , and increase the value of Sweet Lou's ?? lol.....

louie the horse gammalite in Perth is the best sweet Lou around with team bond the running camel lol top driver Ryan Warwick son of Colin Warwick who was top driver and trainer

[Taupiri Wonder]

19 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

 

The West Australians (NZ best buyers ) still swoop on 'Up and running' stock. esp. after 1 southland win, they wisk off to the big smoke. Hall still buys 10 per year and sure Team Bond the same.

A Jonesy special at Albion tomorrow. The Sweet Lou gelding SPIRIT OF ST LOUIS is in at $1.35 , !!!!  as is with McCarthy now and appears to have half of New Zealand and Australia as the owners !! lol..............

He won his Australian debut in 1.55.2 at the Goulbourn backwater early in month. pretty slick ? should give the Brissy locals some curry , and increase the value of Sweet Lou's ?? lol.....

Gamms:I note that Spirit Of St Louis is another successful winner Flying The Banner for Summit Bloodstock.

In watching their interview with Unhinged earlier today,I also watched an interview with West Aust Legend Garry Hall Snr.He stated that in buying 10 racehorses per year from NZ,he expected 2 to be extra good (if not as good as The Mighty Quinn): 4 to pay their way: and 2 to be losers.

[Jones]

Iv just got the racing channel on, & they have a shot of the war torn Bosnia lol. (the Alex apartments).

Oh my, just doing a stir, when I read (past tense) on other channel that some on there were saying it was war torn.

Edited June 18, 2021 by Jones

[Unhinged]

I reckon big syndicates will be the savior of our good racing stock. We recently sent Spellbound to race in Australia and have had alot of success, now a big offer has come in from the states. When I put it to the syndicate,  mostly 1- 10% shares the money really didn't come in to the discussion,  the most important factor was they may never get a horse as good again and the average age of the owners would be over fifty hence 2000 dollars won't change there life.

[Jones]

18 minutes ago, Unhinged said:

I reckon big syndicates will be the savior of our good racing stock. We recently sent Spellbound to race in Australia and have had alot of success, now a big offer has come in from the states. When I put it to the syndicate,  mostly 1- 10% shares the money really didn't come in to the discussion,  the most important factor was they may never get a horse as good again and the average age of the owners would be over fifty hence 2000 dollars won't change there life.

Who is this Gamms? You are not going to be next week, don’t know who Unhinged is lol.

Agree for me as an owner its about the fun & experience never about the money. And how exciting if any of my Lou fillies make it to be as good as Spellbound.

Im rolling out guys/gals for the nite with the big North win haha love it.

Nite all.

 

 

[Gammalite]

23 minutes ago, Unhinged said:

I reckon big syndicates will be the savior of our good racing stock. We recently sent Spellbound to race in Australia and have had alot of success, now a big offer has come in from the states. When I put it to the syndicate,  mostly 1- 10% shares the money really didn't come in to the discussion,  the most important factor was they may never get a horse as good again and the average age of the owners would be over fifty hence 2000 dollars won't change there life.

It's a tough one. I was often in 4 person ownership groups and often small issues would arise whether to sell, race ,and in the end , whether to breed from the fillies. (one bloke was a breeder) . Ultimately the better ones get sold as the Aus money , esp WA is pretty good.

Spellbound soon to arrive in Brissy for 100k race where a strong chance, so that beats racing for 3rds and 4ths in NZ like HAVTIME is and ultimately PLUTONIUM LADY as well  barely paying their way , when both are such talented mares for example. Katrina left HAVTIME at Menangle most of last year for a few wins and 70k earnings, but owners want to SEE their horse race, and no doubt hubby BARRY has cheaper training fees for her (and co-owners) too. !! Lol... Great to see all the Southern mares at Auckland though for the Un-cut gems . was a very good race. 

[Jones]

Just thinking, if harness becomes more syndicate driven which looks potentially on the cards & if many don't want to sell due to wanting to race enjoying experience & being split by so many people therefore they don't individually receive substantial sum, so keep horse to race in NZ. If that becomes a trend ... would that not then potentially proceed to drive export prices up? 

Again demand is there, but less stock available to buy. (Meaning the stock that is wanted). 

 

[Gammalite]

2 hours ago, Jones said:

Just thinking, if harness becomes more syndicate driven which looks potentially on the cards & if many don't want to sell due to wanting to race enjoying experience & being split by so many people therefore they don't individually receive substantial sum, so keep horse to race in NZ. If that becomes a trend ... would that not then potentially proceed to drive export prices up? 

Again demand is there, but less stock available to buy. (Meaning the stock that is wanted). 

 

They have a great System with thoroughbred mares now . absolutely smashing it.

The big Syndicates of owners sign up and race the fillies and mares for their 'Racing Days' but as a clause of ownership, the horse must be sold at end of career to the big studs , at the Big Broodmare sale once per year.

A windfall for all !! the breeders (studs) pick up most of the best mares around. Arcadia Queen and Melody Belle were 2 examples sold this year's sale recently. Breeders are delighted to put them to their star stallions.

And the 'Racing' Syndicate members are 'settled' with a handsome Sale price share, as their final fling , even though some might of liked a foal out of their pride of the track themselves, just too many issues in that area, so are paid out. 

Possibly a way Standardbred colts and mares could have the syndicates 'dissolved' at end of racing career.? A once a year BIG sale where all the studs turn up to buy the stock for their shareholders and profits. That's If they have many syndicate horses in the future years racing. (prob is we do have a lot of geldings in harness though lol.......) 

[Gammalite]

On 6/18/2021 at 6:05 PM, Taupiri Wonder said:

Spirit Of St Louis is another successful winner Flying The Banner for Summit Bloodstock

 

On 6/18/2021 at 7:16 PM, Jones said:

exciting if any of my Lou fillies make it to be as good as Spellbound.

It's a McCarthy massacre at Brisbane with KING of SWING in easily by 3 lengths jogging, from fellow ex-pat kiwis 'Turn It Up' and 'Spankem' at $1.10

SPIRIT of ST LOUIS also easily by 3 lengths at $1.10 , increasing the value of Sweet Lou's for Jones !!

EXPENSIVE EGO (could still be the best) a real beauty !! home by 3 lengths easily at $1.40. 

Brisbane locals no hope with the McCarthy slaughter. He left ALTA ORLANDO (owned by Dunn's) at menangle for a Group3 , but he got pipped at the post ?? surprise result for me , by another ex=pat Kiwi named BUNDORAN roared home from last place, turning for home!!, wow wee! , to arrive at the line in 1.52 with a devastating sprint for Amanda Turnbull. he now has 8 wins , 4 x 2nds  from 15 runs this year , after near nothing in NZ last year ?. 

so that can only INCREASE Aus demand for even moderate performing NZ horses. so still a good market Jonsey!!

[Jones]

Who is username Irish. Smart purchaser it seems. On it. This person. Just brought Lot 3 - 5 - 7 - 8 on Gavel House. Stonewall Stud/Telfer adding to their already massive brod in getting Lot 1. 

Nice article on HRNZ recently about Statfords eye for a weanling.