Chief Stipe

The crowd numbers at Trentham on a great day of racing looks absolutely pitiful. I remember when a filly I had a share in ran in the Oaks there was a big crowd.

Aren't we still waiting for some BIG result from INCA? When is it coming Galah/Newmarket you seem to have the inside info?

But what did they catch? Any evidence of race fixing? How many performance enhancing drugs uncovered? SFA! About the worst they have got is recreational drug use and dealing. No more or less than if you put any industry under surveillance. As for the "booze bus" effect aka deterrent - really? Doesn't the fact that they have caught SFA send the opposite message? That is it appears to be relatively easy to get away with race fixing and performance enhancing drugs. Of course that assumes that there is a "systemic and endemic problem going right to the core" of harness racing. I would say that that assumption is in fact not correct.

If they know there is "more to come" then they are being fed by someone at the RIU. Quite frankly that stinks. Will be interesting to see what comes out of the RV Integrity Commission Inquiry into the actions of the Feds over there. Maybe there is more to come. In my opinion there should be an Inquiry into the actions of the Police and RIU regarding INCA. A lot of public and industry money was squandered on nothing.

But there is no evidence of the use of performance enhancing drugs. If the RIU have evidence from testing then they should have laid charges immediately. I've written about this on the Thoroughbred forum.

Excuse me but you may view my question as shyte but you set the standard with some hypothetical questions. Although how hypothetical they are is questionable when you infer there is something more with comments like "all in good time"! Based on the tenor of the majority of your posts this would appear to be another axe grinding exercise on your part based solely on inference, supposition and innuendo. When asked to elucidate or be more definitive you evade answering. Why don't you just spell it out? At the moment you are casting aspersions on both the RIU and industry participants. Now if we go back to your opening and second statement which we can only assume are hypothetical because you haven't provided any real evidence. So distilling from your questions in your first statement we have the hypothetical scenario that: That there are traces of prohibited substances being found in post race swabs; Those traces do not meet the threshold for a positive; Following on from 2. the RIU are not informed therefore the trainers are not informed. Well that hypothetical situation as described is a nonsense unless the Lab the RIU are using is incompetent. If the Lab is doing its job and even traces of prohibited substances are found then the RIU will be informed. Now that being the case and the Trainers are not being notified then the RIU is either incompetent, corrupt or acting in a duplicitous manner for some other reason. We have seen in the past where the latter has occurred. Your second statement questions, again use a hypothetical situation i.e. that traces of prohibited substances have been found in a swab. Should the RIU be told? Yes and as per above must be told. I doubt that they are not told; Should the affected Trainer(s) be told? Yes, absolutely. To not do so undermines the very reason for being of the RIU i.e. to maintain the integrity of the sport (more on this later); What if the Trainer(s) are already on the "radar" what then? Same answer as 2. - they should be informed otherwise the integrity of the sport is undermined; Positives have been returned but not charged for some reason; There are a number of issues in the "pipeline". That infers that you know something is in the "pipeline". Pray tell WHAT is in the "pipeline"? As I said above to cast aspersions via inference, supposition and innuendo is to undermine the integrity of the RIU and ALL industry participants. Now lets recap on the above and look at another hypothetical situation. We all know that some of the RIU "Investigators" are ex-cops or close associates. Their modus operandi is to assume that there IS drug cheating within the industry and that they just need to find it. Acting as a model of integrity, a monitoring agency and as a deterrent is subjugated to that goal of finding the guilty. That is ingrained in their investigative DNA and there is plenty of evidence to support that. Their goal is to nail "perp's" to the score board using whatever means they can. Afterall the ends justify the means don't they? Well I don't need to rehash where that approach has got to both in the real world and in racing. So back to the hypothetical. The RIU have seen positives but have chosen not to prosecute. Why not? Presumably because they are chasing a much bigger target. At this point all the Police/Crime TV programmes come to mind - binoculars behind hedges, dark coats, surreptitious surveillance, wire taps, informants.....all a bit surreal sounding isn't it? Let's just call the operation something like Aztec Gold or maybe INCA? Now there are a number of problems with this approach and I don't need to elucidate the real world and recent racing examples to highlight that. But the bigger issue is the subjugation of the prime role of the RIU and the diminishing of their Integrity. If positives have been returned regardless of what level then the RIU, the Trainers and the public should be informed. Transparency equals integrity. Failing to do that will result in more innocent victims, more carnage to the racing industry through negative publicity and most importantly disaffected punters and owners. It isn't fair, equitable or justice. Racing Victoria is being forced to address the issues caused by the taking the hypothetical situation I described and making it reality. If it is those issues that you say are in the "pipeline" then you have my full support to uncover them. Perhaps a question should be directed to Mr Godber - Is he aware of any positives to prohibited substances that have not had an information or charge laid? If not, why not?

So what's missing? After 53 starts there is no difference in the UDR between Cullen and the All Stars. Which isn't too bad considering that Cullen has lost some good horses.

Why isn't The Press across this?

Yeah what WAS the point of this article? Horses involved in alleged doping scandal back racing again Martin Van Beynen19:55, Mar 19 2021 ALDEN WILLIAMS/STUFF The Motukarara Races this Sunday will feature a horse at the centre of an alleged doping scandal. (File photo) All eyes will be on race three at the Banks Peninsula Trotting Club meet at Motukarara on Sunday, where a horse involved in alleged doping is expected to run. The race features a five-year-old gelding called Johnny Nevits, which was allegedly injected and tubed only three weeks ago by Canterbury trainer Jesse Alford. The horse will be driven by Tim Williams in the 2000m Probuild Rolleston ITM for non-winners older than four years. The race at the track on the outskirts on Christchurch carries a prize of $8000. Johnny Nevits was transferred to the Woodend training facility of trainer Cam Jones after Harness New Zealand suspended Alford’s licence. Alford has been charged with administering a prohibited substance and attempting to administer a prohibited substance on race day.Racing Integrity Unit investigators raided Alford’s stables at Woodend Beach in February, finding syringes and other equipment used for tubing horses. It is understood Alford was seen injecting a substance into Johnny Nevits and also inserting a tube into its nose. Alford will be dealt with at a Judicial Control Authority hearing, the date of which has yet to be set. Cam Jones, who did not respond to calls from Stuff, has had a stellar start to his training career. In 21 starts, he has posted five wins, four seconds and two thirds, ensuring he is a trainer to watch. Motor Mouth, another horse involved in the incident at Alford’s stables and which is now also trained by Cam Jones, is racing at Forbury Park in Dunedin on Monday. The gelding, which will be driven by Sheree Tomlinson, is entered in the Living Corporation Ltd Mobile Pacer – a race for pacers three years and older who have never won a race. Prize money of $7000 is on offer. Racing Integrity Unit general manager Mike Godber said the horses were entitled to start in the races as they had met pre-race conditions. The normal testing regime would apply to the races, he said.

Geez Forbury how many identities and email addresses do you have?

There is a testing threshold but that isn't published as far as I know. As with any test there is a margin of error however that is quite small now given the accuracy of modern testing. The key is what level has a therapeutic or performance enhancing effect given that very small amounts can be detected. That is where in my opinion zero tolerance doesn't work when environmental contamination is an issue.

Horace are you insinuating that the RIU are incompetent or corrupt?

Horace maybe the NZ Feds should do well to remember what has happened in OZ. Integrity board wants full disclosure in Laming case bungle Charges against Richard Laming were abruptly dropped by Racing Victoria. Picture: AAP Gilbert Gardiner7:51PM17 March 2021 The Victorian Racing Integrity Board wants Racing Victoria to provide a “full and public explanation” about the failed Richard Laming hearing. The independent body has completed the first part of its review into the bungled case. Racing Integrity Commissioner Sean Carroll has requested a separate briefing from Racing Victoria. It comes after a respected trainer last week accused Racing Victoria of “shutting up shop” about its embarrassing blunder. The VRIB has forwarded its determination to proposed disciplinary action against a senior steward. The action relates to the steward’s conduct while giving evidence to the Victorian Racing Tribunal last month. In a statement issued late on Wednesday, the VRIB ordered Racing Victoria make public its decision, once it has considered the determination. On March 9 the VRIB requested additional documents surrounding the withdrawal of alleged stomach-tubing charges against Laming and two stablehands. Racing Victoria supplied the information on Wednesday. Commissioner Carroll will conduct his own examination of the matter “expeditiously”. “The matter has received significant media attention questioning the conduct of Racing Victoria stewards and the integrity of the evidence given by them before the Tribunal,” Carroll said. “Clearly, there is potential for damage to public and industry confidence in the integrity of the Victorian Racing Industry which demands independent assessment.” Racing Victoria’s prosecution and enforcement processes will come under the microscope as part of the Commissioner’s own review. Racing Victoria was forced to abruptly drop charges against Laming after identifying an undisclosed “issue” that made progressing the case untenable. A full and public explanation about the circumstances of the withdrawal of charges will be delivered “as soon as is practicable”. Victorian Racing Integrity Board chairman Jack Forrest QC said: “Accountability, transparency, and public confidence in the integrity of racing mean that there must be full public disclosure of the stewards’ conduct, including publication of details about relevant actions and the disciplinary action taken.” Racing Victoria on Wednesday night confirmed receipt of the VRIB determination. “RV has been and remains committed to making a detailed public statement at the conclusion of the review, including any action taken,” the statement read. “The timing of this will be following the conclusion of (Commissioner’s) additional assessment of the matter.” RV also confirmed the senior steward at the centre of the probe is on “restricted duties” pending the completion of the review. “So as not to prejudice the review and the related assessment by RIC, Racing Victoria will refrain from making any further comment on the matter at this time.”

Here we go again another cloak and dagger story without any substance. Afterall has a someone who as done the following I would have thought that you would be all for transparency and accountability.

You can imagine the Stipes report if Opie hadn't moved forward from the 800m and given her a couple of flicks at the 500m. "Mr Bosson why didn't you improve your position with more vigour?" "Sir because I'm not allowed to use the whip until the last 100m!"

You seem to be confusing two different things. Prohibited substances generally have a zero threshold. If they are present then it is classed as a positive. The RIU does the testing (sure they hire a third party lab to do the actual work) so will be informed. They are alerted. They must be as it is a positive! What it seems they are not told is the level that was detected. I believe that is wrong. For example? What do you mean by "near misses"? There is ZERO tolerance for prohibited substances. It is either positive or negative - it isn't a maybe. If you are talking about thresholds for something like TCO2 then those figures are published. Stop beating around the bush - what is your point?

Using morphine as an example is a poor one. There is zero tolerance for morphine so one would have to say yes they would be informed. Substances such as Cobalt that do have a threshhold will provide a measure. If you had zero cobalt present in a blood sample you would have a seriously ill race horse.

You said there was a "deep and systemic problem" in harness racing. The inference being that corruption is endemic. Yet there is no evidence to support that and you have provided none. Repeat after me: "Just because the same news about a handful of individuals is rehashed every week doesn't mean there is endemic corruption"! "I will not believe in conspiracies where there is no evidence"! I would have thought you of all people Basil would understand evidence based research.

Whiplash the information copied by Rangatira is from the Australian TAB not NZ's. The cut and paste muddled the format so I asked Rangatira a question which he kindly answered in a civil manner. You might try that some time.

Just shows that displaying that information isn't as hard as some suggest it is.

So 4%?

Shame that it lost its format when copying Rangatira but I'm assuming that it is showing the scratching time and price?

Really? So you are a Bookie and an IT specialist. Tell me why it would be so hard to display the following (15%, $3.50, 4:35pm)?

Ring and ask what? Publish what? FFS is your first language Greek or something? You have shown no comprehension whatsoever regarding this Topic.

Just like most of what you have written on this topic the post was irrelevant.