Terrible news for connections of Amore Vita

[Nowornever]

https://harnesslink.com/new-zealand/star-mare-amore-vita-dies-tragically-in-training/

Feel for connections as the foals out of this mare would have been worth a fortune in the coming years.

[Walt]

2 hours ago, Nowornever said:

https://harnesslink.com/new-zealand/star-mare-amore-vita-dies-tragically-in-training/

Feel for connections as the foals out of this mare would have been worth a fortune in the coming years.

Awful news for the mare and her connections. She would have been in demand as a broodmare when her racing days were finished.

Her only NZ victory highlighted a mare with a big future.

 

https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=82E29F3F-68C2-4BFE-B0FE-0239471B00B9&Arg=hrnzg-rSite&Arg=TRUE

[the galah]

I guess i will say what most are thinking,but don't bother saying except to their mates and that is, that can happen when you pump things into them.

The article goes on about how much they care about their horses, well yes i'm sure they do care a great deal,but they care more about the $.

You know,harness racing is strange in how it worries about how the public percieives the sport.They focus on the whip rule but that is so insignificant when you compare it to stuff like horses dropping dead on the track.We all knows its what a very small % of trainers do to enhance performance that is the most obvious thing that is detrimental to their horses long term health.

It happened on the same week emma stewart was disqualified for 6 months.Her partner was the blue magic guy. These people are great trainers but often the long term health of horses they train is comprimised.

Some may say that p williamson had a young horse die recently,but you have to look at how they die. His horse got sick and died after receiving veteriarian treatment. Its the horses that drop dead on the training track that are possibly the dodgy ones,like amore vita.

Edited December 7, 2023 by the galah

[Chief Stipe]

23 hours ago, the galah said:

I guess i will say what most are thinking,but don't bother saying except to their mates and that is, that can happen when you pump things into them.

What "things"?  Try not use innuendo, inference or supposition.  Details please.

23 hours ago, the galah said:

.We all knows its what a very small % of trainers do to enhance performance that is the most obvious thing that is detrimental to their horses long term health.

We ALL don't know nor do we ALL suspect like you do that illegal undectable performance drugs are being used.

You are doing a disservice go the harness racing industry.

23 hours ago, the galah said:

These people are great trainers but often the long term health of horses they train is comprimised.

Proof?  Aren't those who don't use every legal therapeutic available compromising the health of THEIR horses?

On 8/12/2023 at 9:08 AM, the galah said:

Some may say that p williamson had a young horse die recently,but you have to look at how they die. His horse got sick and died after receiving veteriarian treatment. Its the horses that drop dead on the training track that are possibly the dodgy ones,like amore vita.

So Williamson doesn't deserve any scrutiny from you?  Aren't you being inconsistent and a hypocrite?

Horses dropping dead on the training or on the race track is not a null event.  It happens at a fairly consistent rate.  The corollary is with high performance human athletes where it also happens.  The difference with humans is medical services are quick to attend to any event whereas the options with a 500kg animal lying on a track is limited.

Shall we wait for the autopsy results for Amore Vite before speculating?  I'm sure there will be an autopsy as you would expect such a valuable mare would have been insured.

[Chief Stipe]

@the galah and @Archie Butterfly while your at it - tell is all how Hartmann’s Solution is a PED rather than a electrolyte replacement solution.

Also explain what you understand osmolality is? 

[the galah]

3 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

What "things"?  Try not use innuendo, inference or supposition.  Details please.

We ALL don't know nor do we ALL suspect like you do that illegal undectable performance drugs are being used.

You are doing a disservice go the harness racing industry.

Proof?  Aren't those who don't use every legal therapeutic available compromising the health of THEIR horses?

So Williamson doesn't deserve any scrutiny from you?  Aren't you being inconsistent and a hypocrite?

Horses dropping dead on the training or on the race track is not a null event.  It happens at a fairly consistent rate.  The corollary is with high performance human athletes where it also happens.  The difference with humans is medical services are quick to attend to any event whereas the options with a 500kg animal lying on a track is limited.

Shall we wait for the autopsy results for Amore Vite before speculating?  I'm sure there will be an autopsy as you would expect such a valuable mare would have been insured.

Well speculate is what we both do on bit of a yarn. 

I add 2 plus 2 and get what i think is 4.

I'm just not a fan of the dolan or stewart stables.I started threads on why in the past. But many are. I've seen what i have seen,you can't erase history.  I have formed my opinions not on one off occurences but what i believe are patterns. You don't agree. Fair enough.

[Gammalite]

21 minutes ago, the galah said:

I'm just not a fan of the dolan or stewart stables.I started threads on why in the past.

and throw in Telfer's as well. You weren't happy with 3 horse deaths there at one stage.

I think Allstars, Mc Carthy, EmmaStewart/Tonkin and even Hall's in West Australia have a bit of attrition as their stables are Full of the very best horses racing and they bend and strain to the absolute MAX limits these great horses  , ... The horses are 'That Good' in these stables , they can be just set for races year after year , and are looked after like 'Kings' and 'Queens' all through the year (Like the King of Swing himself for example  by some of the BEst Horsepeople on the Planet . Not just the trainers But their important excellent support Staff too ...... 

Amore Vita just a sad tragedy to of passed away like that 😪. very sad for everyone connected. She was going like a train too. (having defeated stablemate Encipher (the 2 $mill Eureka Winner ) a couple of times in feature races. I commented on her great runs here several times. Very sad won't see her go again 😢.

[the galah]

1 hour ago, Gammalite said:

and throw in Telfer's as well. You weren't happy with 3 horse deaths there at one stage.

I think Allstars, Mc Carthy, EmmaStewart/Tonkin and even Hall's in West Australia have a bit of attrition as their stables are Full of the very best horses racing and they bend and strain to the absolute MAX limits these great horses  , ... The horses are 'That Good' in these stables , they can be just set for races year after year , and are looked after like 'Kings' and 'Queens' all through the year (Like the King of Swing himself for example  by some of the BEst Horsepeople on the Planet . Not just the trainers But their important excellent support Staff too ...... 

Amore Vita just a sad tragedy to of passed away like that 😪. very sad for everyone connected. She was going like a train too. (having defeated stablemate Encipher (the 2 $mill Eureka Winner ) a couple of times in feature races. I commented on her great runs here several times. Very sad won't see her go again 😢.

I would have thought everyone would have a problem with a cluster of horse deaths in similar fashion from any stable,should it occur.I have no problem with the telfer stable. I think the telfer stable have changed things so they now place the welfare of there horses as top priority. Its a fine line and some put the $ first.

You seem to be suggesting a top horse that tries 100% is somehow straining its heart more than a poor one that tries 100%,I certainly don't agree with that.

Your right that certain stables have the occasional problem  with horses dropping dead. I remember talking to an owner 30 years ago who owned a very promising horse that dropped dead. Apparently the stable had 3 that week. He believed it was a result of some sort of treatment. He never used that trainer again.

Then once i was told that a certain product was a good product to use on horses with a virus. At the time it was perfectly legal.But a couple of weeks later it got a lot of publicity ,being trainers were being warned not to use in to close to a race as it would return a positive. Well i was only interested in treating my horse. Not racing. And guess what. the vet i contacted said they had stopped selling it because,in an attempt to improve performance,trainers had been overdosing their horses and killing them. He said many horses had died.

Did you not read the new york cases.

There was clear evidence that the multiple horse deaths were related to the perfomance enhancers being used.Remember the wire tap when a supplier was recorded as talking about the rene allard death camp.

I really can't understand why people prioritise peoples feelings over animal welfare.and turn a blind eye to the obvious

 

Edited December 9, 2023 by the galah

[the galah]

 

29 minutes ago, the galah said:

I would have thought everyone would have a problem with a cluster of horse deaths in similar fashion from any stable,should it occur.I have no problem with the telfer stable. I think the telfer stable have changed things so they now place the welfare of there horses as top priority. Its a fine line and some put the $ first.

You seem to be suggesting a top horse that tries 100% is somehow straining its heart more than a poor one that tries 100%,I certainly don't agree with that.

Your right that certain stables have the occasional problem  with horses dropping dead. I remember talking to an owner 30 years ago who owned a very promising horse that dropped dead. Apparently the stable had 3 that week. He believed it was a result of some sort of treatment. He never used that trainer again.

Then once i was told that a certain product was a good product to use on horses with a virus. At the time it was perfectly legal.But a couple of weeks later it got a lot of publicity ,being trainers were being warned not to use in to close to a race as it would return a positive. Well i was only interested in treating my horse. Not racing. And guess what. the vet i contacted said they had stopped selling it because,in an attempt to improve performance,trainers had been overdosing their horses and killing them. He said many horses had died.

Did you not read the new york cases.

There was clear evidence that the multiple horse deaths were related to the perfomance enhancers being used.Remember the wire tap when a supplier was recorded as talking about the rene allard death camp.

I really can't understand why people prioritise peoples feelings over animal welfare.and turn a blind eye to the obvious

 

P.s.. I'm not saying you don't care about animal welfare gammalite. I'm sure from what you have written many times, you consider it the top priority.

I think the difference between you and me is you also place high priority on peoples feelings,whether they be doing things legal or not.

Personally i  think people who give horses illegal things to improve performance,knowing there's even a small possiblity of serious major adverse effects ,don't deserve to be treated with the same level of respect.

Edited December 9, 2023 by the galah

[Gammalite]

1 hour ago, the galah said:

Your right that certain stables have the occasional problem  with horses dropping dead. I remember talking to an owner 30 years ago who owned a very promising horse that dropped dead. Apparently the stable had 3 that week. He believed it was a result of some sort of treatment. He never used that trainer again

well that would definitely make you have the opinion you have . Past experiences are always at the fore-front of opinion. In the end you are possibly right. A treatment schedule could be spread around more than one runner and place them under duress , if too strong, in correct dosage , etc. We have seen in recent times Alford there using very strong injection so his 'welfare' concerns must of been zero and thankfully he was outed. 

I am lucky have never seen a horse damaged from treatments personally in NZ and/or Australia. Many horses have issues that you need to treat aggressively on occasion (e.g Tendons) and you have a lot of USA info that shows PED's are in fact causing deaths. fair enough. Alford / Jones does show that there are dubious goings -on occurring still 

I'm still gunna go with Bad Luck ... with Amore Vita . as Heart attack can happen anytime . I worked with a millionaire at Samford once. He dropped clean dead off his bicycle one weekend . age 60. just regular bloke , reasonable fitness. makes me nervous actually 🤔. Stewart Barn performance we were already discussing. I think their record over many years is 'proven' and same with Allstars in NZ. they look after their horses well and get great results year after year.