curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 And Wilcox's 3000 tons of sand has now become 300? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 3 minutes ago, curious said: Well, it sounds like Guerin doesn't understand what a matted root structure is and no-one he can think to ring knows either or can explain what's wrong with the track. Emily thinks it's a matter of trial and error. Why not get someone from Strathayr that does know, on the show to explain? So they will continue to race on it to see whether or not they have it sorted. And the stakeholders will be left hanging in the dark? Really? That's what's not good enough I think. Far from not good enough - rank incompetence. I see a common theme in the approach so I'd love to know who is advising them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 14 minutes ago, curious said: And Wilcox's 3000 tons of sand has now become 300? Interesting that you should point that out. I did a calculation the other night but wasn't brave enough to post it in case my math was off. One cubic meter of sand covers 10 square meters to a depth of 10cm. If the top layer is 30cm then 3 cubic meters is needed per 10 meter squared. So roughly (1800 length/10) *20 width)) x 3 = 10,800 cubic meters. A cubic meter of sand weighs 1682kg. So 10,800 cubic meters x 1682 kg = 18,165,600 kg or 18,165 tonnes. I'm sure @barryb will correct me if I'm wrong. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 Guerin has also decided to trust senior jockeys opinions that it will come right in time, yet I personally can't think of a senior jockey that I would ring if I were having trouble with the root structure in my new lawn, let alone a racetrack In my experience growing pasture grasses (such as ryes and fescues) in sandy soils, from core sampling, the roots will be down 100-150mm 2 weeks after seeding in the right conditions. At that point, there is just a tinge of green across the field visible at the surface. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 4 minutes ago, curious said: Guerin has also decided to trust senior jockeys opinions that it will come right in time, yet I personally can't think of a senior jockey that I would ring if I were having trouble with the root structure in my new lawn, let alone a racetrack You're kidding me? It may come right in the sense that it will be a broken rough surface and horses can get a grip but still won't be a nice consistent surface to gallop on. As for the Jockeys did Guerin ask them what was the difference between Karaka Millions night and the two abandoned meetings? Other than stakes. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 3 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: You're kidding me? It may come right in the sense that it will be a broken rough surface and horses can get a grip but still won't be a nice consistent surface to gallop on. As for the Jockeys did Guerin ask them what was the difference between Karaka Millions night and the two abandoned meetings? Other than stakes. Only that Matt Cameron, after consultation with other senior jockeys, decided to bring it to the attention of the RIB and that only after inspection, the jockeys agreed the meeting should not continue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 2 minutes ago, curious said: Only that Matt Cameron, after consultation with other senior jockeys, decided to bring it to the attention of the RIB and that only after inspection, the jockeys agreed the meeting should not continue. Hasn't Matt Cameron done that before? I'm not pointing the finger but I've have this nagging memory that there is a commonality somewhere. As for Senior Jockey's - who exactly? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 Don't think he said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 39 minutes ago, curious said: Don't think he said. Well they quoted Warren Kennedy after the post-renovation trial. I've being trying to work out who should be laying down the law on the problem. You can't rely on the Jockeys nor Trainers as they have too much skin in the game. After Karaka Millions there was a fair amount of disquiet amongst that group. So it sits with the Club, the RIB and NZTR. In my opinion the RIB should be the organisation that without fear or favour is banging heads to get a safe and fair surface to race on. Afterall isn't that what integrity and horse welfare depends on? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark D Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 Haven't see anything on Love Racing website about the track issues since Saturday which is not in line with previous incidents which is interesting and may also indicate that they don't know what the fuck to do which is spot on. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 10 minutes ago, Mark D said: Haven't see anything on Love Racing website about the track issues since Saturday which is not in line with previous incidents which is interesting and may also indicate that they don't know what the fuck to do which is spot on. They're flying in the StrathAyr people to work on the track that the ATR customised to NOT be a StrathAyr. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said: Interesting that you should point that out. I did a calculation the other night but wasn't brave enough to post it in case my math was off. One cubic meter of sand covers 10 square meters to a depth of 10cm. If the top layer is 30cm then 3 cubic meters is needed per 10 meter squared. So roughly (1800 length/10) *20 width)) x 3 = 10,800 cubic meters. A cubic meter of sand weighs 1682kg. So 10,800 cubic meters x 1682 kg = 18,165,600 kg or 18,165 tonnes. I'm sure @barryb will correct me if I'm wrong. Forgot to add that 10,800 cubic meters cost about $648,000 at $60 a cubic meter. So that leaves another $54.3m that was spent in not changing the iconic shape and rocks and gravel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 8 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: They're flying in the StrathAyr people to work on the track that the ATR customised to NOT be a StrathAyr. What I don't understand is why they would do that let alone a Strathayr expert from Tasmania who presided over one of worst early failure Strathayr installs. There is an abundance of experts in NZ on growing grass including large university departments. FFS we are renowned for it and our economy is founded on it. Why doesn't the likes of Guerin buy some gumboots, get the likes of one of them and a core sampler and go out there and get them to explain the problem and show us all and then get their opinion on the best way to fix it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 There is more to this than is publicly been told. Gary Grylls statement that the track didn't allow horses to get their hooves into it as much as when they trialed last Monday poses the question WHY? Wilcox says they will aim for 25 May meeting "So we can keep working on it (the track)and learning how best to prepare it" Does that fill one with confidence? Finally CEO Sharrock has been MIA this month as this debacle unfolds. He is scheduled to appear on the last edition of this seasons Weigh In next Monday. Will we be enlightened? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 3 minutes ago, curious said: What I don't understand is why they would do that let alone a Strathayr expert from Tasmania who presided over one of worst early failure Strathayr installs. There is an abundance of experts in NZ on growing grass including large university departments. FFS we are renowned for it and our economy is founded on it. Why doesn't the likes of Guerin buy some gumboots, get the likes of one of them and a core sampler and go out there and get them to explain the problem and show us all and then get their opinion on the best way to fix it. I know what you mean. I was lectured to by some of the best turf and sports field experts in the world. None of what I've seen at Ellerslie resonates. I'll ask the question again who is the Sandman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 2 minutes ago, Wingman said: There is more to this than is publicly been told. Gary Grylls statement that the track didn't allow horses to get their hooves into it as much as when they trialed last Monday poses the question WHY? Wilcox says they will aim for 25 May meeting "So we can keep working on it (the track)and learning how best to prepare it" Does that fill one with confidence? Finally CEO Sharrock has been MIA this month as this debacle unfolds. He is scheduled to appear on the last edition of this seasons Weigh In next Monday. Will we be enlightened? Well the latest is the 25 May meeting has been moved to Pukekohe!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 3 minutes ago, Wingman said: There is more to this than is publicly been told. Gary Grylls statement that the track didn't allow horses to get their hooves into it as much as when they trialed last Monday poses the question WHY? Wilcox says they will aim for 25 May meeting "So we can keep working on it (the track)and learning how best to prepare it" Does that fill one with confidence? Finally CEO Sharrock has been MIA this month as this debacle unfolds. He is scheduled to appear on the last edition of this seasons Weigh In next Monday. Will we be enlightened? FFS Sharrock and Clement should turn up. Both are responsible for providing fair and safe tracks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 1 minute ago, Chief Stipe said: Well the latest is the 25 May meeting has been moved to Pukekohe!! Guerin can get nothing right. Cited Wilcox this morning as saying it would definitely be at Ellerslie. At least that stops the crash test dummy approach for now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 6 minutes ago, Wingman said: Finally CEO Sharrock has been MIA this month as this debacle unfolds. He is scheduled to appear on the last edition of this seasons Weigh In next Monday. Will we be enlightened? Not unless they get some informed person on there to ask him the hard questions and follow up the evasion and shite. Anyone happen to know where he might have been during this saga? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 This is so disappointing. Everytime that I've had a horse racing at Ellerslie since 2004 I've walked the track early race day. When I heard they were spending big dollars and taking 18 months to build a new StrathAyr track I thought the worm had turned. I have walked Ellerslie three times since Karaka Millions night and have been very very disappointed. So where are all the scheduled stakes races for Ellerslie going to be next season? I hope Riccarton has sorted their shit out ...I'm not confident. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 The new Ellerslie track has not been right no matter what the weather conditions. That wasn't the deal we were 'sold'. Are we steering down at yet another white elephant. Perhaps it really is time to sell the rest of the course and develop a new track in the Waikato. Whatever is done , before anything, please, please, clean out the current executive 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 May 25th ATR Race Meeting Transferred to Pukekohe Park Following Ellerslie’s Abandonment on Saturday Sent on behalf of Auckland Thoroughbred Racing and New Zealand Thoroughbred Racing Following the partial abandonments of race meetings at Ellerslie on 10 and 20 April, New Zealand Thoroughbred Racing (NZTR), in conjunction with Auckland Thoroughbred Racing (ATR), advises that the planned winter renovation of the track will commence immediately with the race meeting scheduled to be held at Ellerslie on May 25th moving to Pukekohe Park. This decision comes as a proactive response to recent track issues and concerns raised by stakeholders with officials confident the planned renovation will greatly assist in removing the root mat which has compromised traction. Saturday’s abandonment follows a mid-week meeting abandonment on 10 April that required the Club to undergo immediate remedial works and conduct a trial meeting, per NZTR’s Return To Racing protocols, following which after thorough assessment and constructive dialogue with stakeholders saw collective agreement that racing activities could proceed at Ellerslie on Saturday. Despite these concerted efforts to ensure optimal track conditions, unfortunate circumstances arose during the course of Saturday’s meeting after a horse slipped during race 6, resulting in the cancellation of the remaining two races for the safety and well-being of all participants. In commenting on the events of Saturday, ATR Chief Executive Paul Wilcox says, “We find ourselves at a loss for words. Our team shares a sense of disappointment and frustration, not only for ourselves but also for the broader industry. With unwavering faith in our new direction, we regret any disappointment experienced by those affected in recent weeks. “We have had every confidence in the new surface and, while we still strongly believe this is the right track for us, are sorry to those for whom have been let down over the past couple of weeks. “Despite setbacks, we recognise the importance of embracing this experience as a lesson and, as we embark on our scheduled renovation, remain committed to positive progress. “We express our sincere appreciation to our stakeholders and the racing community for their understanding and continued support during this time.” NZTR COO Darin Balcombe echoed ATR's sentiment and was supportive of Ellerslie's pre-emptive move to Pukekohe. "After all efforts were made to improve the surface following the 10 April abandonment, NZTR was disappointed in the outcome of the partial abandonment Saturday at Ellerslie." "We fully support ATR's proactive approach to move the meeting on May 25th to Pukekohe and will work alongside Ellerslie over the winter as we work toward ensuring the surface is at its best for the 2024/25 season." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 13 minutes ago, curious said: In commenting on the events of Saturday, ATR Chief Executive Paul Wilcox says, “We find ourselves at a loss for words. Our team shares a sense of disappointment and frustration, not only for ourselves but also for the broader industry. With unwavering faith in our new direction, we regret any disappointment experienced by those affected in recent weeks. Lose your PR/Communications person Paul. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 36 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: I hope Riccarton has sorted their shit out ...I'm not confident. To be fair, the track was nice on Saturday and raced fairly. It's the only major track left in the country despite its problems. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 33 minutes ago, curious said: To be fair, the track was nice on Saturday and raced fairly. It's the only major track left in the country despite its problems. Yep. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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