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The reality of 'Sir' M Cullen and his Capital Gains Tax


Kopia

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And yes this post does directly apply to racing, or more particuarly, ownership of horses. So, you've got a young horse that you bought cheap, maybe a few grand..then..Great News!! Your trainer calls with the news that the horse ..a filly,,looks promising. She goes through jump-outs, gallops up well.  Now a trial...jumps ok, settles midfield,into the straight she lengthens beautifully and wins by 3 lengths..?   Move along to her first race, maiden 1200m..slow to begin, storms home beaten a lip. Comes through race great, trainer says..' have had a couple of calls, is she for sale?'. You say, sheeet no! 3 weeks later, maiden 1400m, slow again, swoops wide around turn, pisses in by 4 lengths..jeeze!!

Now..all of this time you've been paying training fees, etc etc, not claiming a cent. So far she's cost you about $30k all up...roll the dice again, 1600m..wahoo wins again with strong run!  Now the phones are definitely ringing. Cut to the chase....you get offered huge $$$ from across the ditch ( is this sounding familiar?)  anyway, this is 12 months from today. In the preceding time Taxi and her cronies have-against their promises-gone along with Cullen on his crusade to tax the shit out of anyone remotely being successful and making a quid and installed a 'Capital Gains Tax. So you,as owner of this filly, have to factor in that if you sell her, be ready to pay anything up to 33% of your 'profit' to Taxi and Robertson.  Is that fair? I'd say only Tommo will say that it is.

And guess what? In the finer details of cullens scheming he's slipped in that KIWISAVER yearly 'profit' will attract Capital Gains Tax. How feckin stupid is that..I'd have to say that Kiwisaver is about the only good idea labour has ever come up with. But wait...your money is already taxed when its earned anything by investment by your 'provider'..so these pricks want to tax it again...every year! Should have left cullen to spend his huge govt pension in retirement I say..surely someone independent shoulod have done this 'enquiry' into CGT ?

 

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44 minutes ago, Kopia said:

And yes this post does directly apply to racing, or more particuarly, ownership of horses. So, you've got a young horse that you bought cheap, maybe a few grand..then..Great News!! Your trainer calls with the news that the horse ..a filly,,looks promising. She goes through jump-outs, gallops up well.  Now a trial...jumps ok, settles midfield,into the straight she lengthens beautifully and wins by 3 lengths..?   Move along to her first race, maiden 1200m..slow to begin, storms home beaten a lip. Comes through race great, trainer says..' have had a couple of calls, is she for sale?'. You say, sheeet no! 3 weeks later, maiden 1400m, slow again, swoops wide around turn, pisses in by 4 lengths..jeeze!!

Now..all of this time you've been paying training fees, etc etc, not claiming a cent. So far she's cost you about $30k all up...roll the dice again, 1600m..wahoo wins again with strong run!  Now the phones are definitely ringing. Cut to the chase....you get offered huge $$$ from across the ditch ( is this sounding familiar?)  anyway, this is 12 months from today. In the preceding time Taxi and her cronies have-against their promises-gone along with Cullen on his crusade to tax the shit out of anyone remotely being successful and making a quid and installed a 'Capital Gains Tax. So you,as owner of this filly, have to factor in that if you sell her, be ready to pay anything up to 33% of your 'profit' to Taxi and Robertson.  Is that fair? I'd say only Tommo will say that it is.

And guess what? In the finer details of cullens scheming he's slipped in that KIWISAVER yearly 'profit' will attract Capital Gains Tax. How feckin stupid is that..I'd have to say that Kiwisaver is about the only good idea labour has ever come up with. But wait...your money is already taxed when its earned anything by investment by your 'provider'..so these pricks want to tax it again...every year! Should have left cullen to spend his huge govt pension in retirement I say..surely someone independent shoulod have done this 'enquiry' into CGT ?

 

Presumably there would be a private exemption in the horse example you are talking about as you are not carrying on a business or taxable activity?

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23 minutes ago, Tonkatime! said:

Presumably there would be a private exemption in the horse example you are talking about as you are not carrying on a business or taxable activity?

No there isn't. Cullens Capital Gains Tax will hit anything sold at a profit. Including your holiday home that you inherited from your parents and will be taxed each year assuming it appreciates, even if you don't sell it!!   And that painting you bought at an auction and suddenly is worth more because the artist died and his work has appreciated in value...you will have to 'value' it somehow and pay CGT without selling it...the only 'exemption' as it stands will be the house you own and are currently living in as your family home. Anything else is 'fair game' according to the rich-prick hater...who, by the way accepted the Knighthood from the Queen, even though he stated that he thought NZ should be a Republic..another labour hypocrite.

The implications of this are immense. when people take a bit of time to read about what Cullen proposes they will be staggered.

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7 hours ago, Kopia said:

No there isn't. Cullens Capital Gains Tax will hit anything sold at a profit. Including your holiday home that you inherited from your parents and will be taxed each year assuming it appreciates, even if you don't sell it!!   And that painting you bought at an auction and suddenly is worth more because the artist died and his work has appreciated in value...you will have to 'value' it somehow and pay CGT without selling it...the only 'exemption' as it stands will be the house you own and are currently living in as your family home. Anything else is 'fair game' according to the rich-prick hater...who, by the way accepted the Knighthood from the Queen, even though he stated that he thought NZ should be a Republic..another labour hypocrite.

The implications of this are immense. when people take a bit of time to read about what Cullen proposes they will be staggered.

Let's join the rest of the World Kops...

Next you'll be saying a worker shouldn't have to pay tax after receiving a wage

...after all he's worked hard for it hasn't he...

...just as an owner has worked hard to improve their holiday home

...they too should have to pay tax...to help build schools...to educate the ignorami

 

 

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48 minutes ago, Thomass said:

Let's join the rest of the World Kops...

Next you'll be saying a worker shouldn't have to pay tax after receiving a wage

...after all he's worked hard for it hasn't he...

...just as an owner has worked hard to improve their holiday home

...they too should have to pay tax...to help build schools...to educate the ignorami

 

 

Spoken like a true ignoramus.

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i suggest we are among the most heavily taxed nations in the world..and we are too apathetic to fight the red-led dingbats who want to tax us even more

It's not just Income Tax.. its pervasive  from ACC to EQC levies to GST to regional fuel taxes....

and as if all that ain't enough District and Regional Councils smack us all again with rates based on Land Value and Capital plus plus so-called targeted rates for everything from Pest Management to Stadiums and Rescue Helicopters.

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9 hours ago, Kopia said:

No there isn't. Cullens Capital Gains Tax will hit anything sold at a profit. Including your holiday home that you inherited from your parents and will be taxed each year assuming it appreciates, even if you don't sell it!!   And that painting you bought at an auction and suddenly is worth more because the artist died and his work has appreciated in value...you will have to 'value' it somehow and pay CGT without selling it...the only 'exemption' as it stands will be the house you own and are currently living in as your family home. Anything else is 'fair game' according to the rich-prick hater...who, by the way accepted the Knighthood from the Queen, even though he stated that he thought NZ should be a Republic..another labour hypocrite.

The implications of this are immense. when people take a bit of time to read about what Cullen proposes they will be staggered.

False news and fair mongering, I believe  

If it’s not a taxable activity with the appropriate claims why would you have to pay a capital gains tax?

 

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35 minutes ago, Dark Beau said:

False news and fair mongering, I believe  

If it’s not a taxable activity with the appropriate claims why would you have to pay a capital gains tax?

 

Ask Cullen. Don't forget, in the lead up to the last election Taxinda was espousing a capital gains tax, amongst other new taxes, which she dropped due to the public outcry. they don't learn, do they?

And furthermore..the reason labour wants to introduce new taxes, including a CGT, is that they never,ever learn that you have to encourage businesses to generate income. You saw what ardern did to New Plymouth. Destroy growth. Thats her motto, so that she could 'impress' the UN nazis...The dairy industry is NZ's biggest ever income earner...so labour and the greens want to reduce the dairy herd=reduce income=don't worry, we'll just tax more.

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20 minutes ago, Kopia said:

Ask Cullen. Don't forget, in the lead up to the last election Taxinda was espousing a capital gains tax, amongst other new taxes, which she dropped due to the public outcry. they don't learn, do they?

And furthermore..the reason labour wants to introduce new taxes, including a CGT, is that they never,ever learn that you have to encourage businesses to generate income. You saw what ardern did to New Plymouth. Destroy growth. Thats her motto, so that she could 'impress' the UN nazis...The dairy industry is NZ's biggest ever income earner...so labour and the greens want to reduce the dairy herd=reduce income=don't worry, we'll just tax more.

She was espousing a capital gains tax on residential rental properties rather than across the board. I struggle to see how if someone is not engaged in a taxable activity a capital gains tax would apply. 

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4 minutes ago, Tonkatime! said:

She was espousing a capital gains tax on residential rental properties rather than across the board. I struggle to see how if someone is not engaged in a taxable activity a capital gains tax would apply. 

Do you seriously think Cullen(who is well known for his contempt of wealthy people - only matched by their contempt for him) would miss the Queenstown or Coromandel  bach/holiday home when it comes to the CGT?  On principle he would attack it.  And racing is perceived to be a rich man's sport so fair game in his eyes(note I said 'perceived' so please do bombard me with argument that it is not a rich man's game(I know it is not))

And it is clear you share gains are going to be subject to it and you might not necessarily be carrying on a taxable activity there(if you are not a share trader in the IRD's eyes)

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3 minutes ago, Reefton said:

Do you seriously think Cullen(who is well known for his contempt of wealthy people - only matched by their contempt for him) would miss the Queenstown or Coromandel  bach/holiday home when it comes to the CGT?  On principle he would attack it.  And racing is perceived to be a rich man's sport so fair game in his eyes(note I said 'perceived' so please do bombard me with argument that it is not a rich man's game(I know it is not))

And it is clear you share gains are going to be subject to it and you might not necessarily be carrying on a taxable activity there(if you are not a share trader in the IRD's eyes)

Sorry I haven’t made my point very clearly, yes I do expect holiday homes would be liable to a cgt as they are already subject to the bright line test at this point in time. 

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7 hours ago, Tonkatime! said:

Sorry I haven’t made my point very clearly, yes I do expect holiday homes would be liable to a cgt as they are already subject to the bright line test at this point in time. 

Classic example of how they pick the desirable(and easy) fruit when introducing these taxes. If they applied the brightline test only to houses held with the intention of rental or business they would be missing millions in tax.  Shares not held on trading account are another example. You are an Accountant I know Tonkatime - this us going to be fun to administer and to deal with the clients over.  Only thing for me coming from the Coast there is not a lot of capital gain apart from farmers(and the way the banks are treating them there will be f all  capital gain there either.

Teethcinda needs to be careful actually - there is a lot of benefits going to the rural areas (like the $140m 'given' to the Coast last week though that is a bit of a media myth) or in a case like this CGT a tax not so likely to affect the rural areas.  There is not much appearing to be helping the cities and that is where the votes are.  You can't win elections making a big fuss in Hari Hari or Keri Keri. 

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On 4/12/2018 at 1:42 AM, Reefton said:

Do you seriously think Cullen(who is well known for his contempt of wealthy people - only matched by their contempt for him) would miss the Queenstown or Coromandel  bach/holiday home when it comes to the CGT?  On principle he would attack it.  And racing is perceived to be a rich man's sport so fair game in his eyes(note I said 'perceived' so please do bombard me with argument that it is not a rich man's game(I know it is not))

And it is clear you share gains are going to be subject to it and you might not necessarily be carrying on a taxable activity there(if you are not a share trader in the IRD's eyes)

Racing is a rich man's sport-----look at the big salaries the trainers and stablehands get !

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1 minute ago, Poisoned Dwarf said:

Racing is a rich man's sport-----look at the big salaries the trainers and stablehands get !

I did say 'perceived' as a rich man's sport. And Messara and Winnie are pretty clear they are seeking to protect the rich men in the sport and their investments.

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3 hours ago, Reefton said:

Classic example of how they pick the desirable(and easy) fruit when introducing these taxes. If they applied the brightline test only to houses held with the intention of rental or business they would be missing millions in tax.  Shares not held on trading account are another example. You are an Accountant I know Tonkatime - this us going to be fun to administer and to deal with the clients over.  Only thing for me coming from the Coast there is not a lot of capital gain apart from farmers(and the way the banks are treating them there will be f all  capital gain there either.

Teethcinda needs to be careful actually - there is a lot of benefits going to the rural areas (like the $140m 'given' to the Coast last week though that is a bit of a media myth) or in a case like this CGT a tax not so likely to affect the rural areas.  There is not much appearing to be helping the cities and that is where the votes are.  You can't win elections making a big fuss in Hari Hari or Keri Keri. 

F me...just as well the whole country's not hooked up to NRTH Sea gas...

What a depressing load of hogwash..

But you know it...Its way over time we had an overhaul of the Tax system

Successive Governments have been too shit scared to join the rest of the World into doing what's normal...

Our 3 year term has a hell of a lot to answer for...Governing by fear has got NZ into the pickle it's now in...

Luckily Cullen's an expert in steering ships...that's why the Knats appointed him

And Labour has its own Tax Lectuerer in Parliament to help Mick as well

You weren't happy when the Knats were sitting on their hands letting the Market rule ...and you're still not happy

wtf will you be?

When a Supreme Leader takes over?

Actually that's not a bad idea

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You have to speculate to accumulate Fred...and the taxman will be waiting

Its called providing for a society...schools roads et el

But Oligarchs like Graeme Hart...his home should be Nationalised...so he can pay back the full payment that should have been forthcoming...

when the Government Print Office was gifted to him....

...then forced to sell his ridiculous Luxery Liner McBoat...to invest in the Thoroughbred Industry

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