Damn Reefton and Foxton missed out on Club of the Year!

[curious]

The award is for the club, not the track separately so ATR is the club. It's not an assessment of the Ellerslie course alone, though that effort presumably won't help.

[Special Agent]

4 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

A certificate and a bit of cash and maybe an extra date or two if thats what they after.

 

The amount of cash would only shout the staff to lunch in that city category.  I'd like to think winning such an award in a limited line up would not qualify for extra race days.

[Huey]

3 hours ago, curious said:

The award is for the club, not the track separately so ATR is the club. It's not an assessment of the Ellerslie course alone, though that effort presumably won't help.

Good point new market:

ATR $1.01

WRC $2.10

CRC $101

[Bloke]

Is Waikato classed as a Metro Club? You would think so given the population and that they are the main Centre for horses being trained and bred. If so it's a real embarrassment for The Fat Butcher finishing last in a four-horse field.

Especially losing out to Trentham. I went to their "Christmas At The Races" last December and they did not have the public stand tote and bar open. The place is so run down, it's like a ghetto. I met up with a WRC Committee Member while there and he boasted that it was a very successful day.

[Chief Stipe]

Why didn't Matamata make it to the top 3 in any category?

[TAB For Ever]

8 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

Some read part of it and made up or inferred the rest!  

Or in your case Chief , you read part of it and made up your mind !

Have you found and read P51 yet  ?

Do try and read it completely....get up to speed .

These awards ,are merely something to reward those that make an effort to assist Entain obtain at least some of their goals . Feel free to name your 3 x Finalists in each 'tier.

Reefton and Foxton clearly ain't going to feature but Matamata could  !

I'm starting to think that the naysayers and quicksand crowd who are against everything are not getting out and about and experiencing  the good stuff that is happening in racing currently. Many posts start....I went to XYZ course decades ago and this happened , or I was there a while back. The past is gone, concentrate on the future !

[Doomed]

10 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

 

Not to mention of course that Riccarton was classified as Provincial when they got their PGF donation from Winnie.

 

Very good point. Surely Riccarton should be in the provincial category?

[Doomed]

There must have been something like this previously. I can remember someone on here once commenting that a certain track, I can't remember which one, was voted the second best track in the country. I have no idea what the best track was.

[Wingman]

I will try and be very polite. This is directed at you TAB For Ever. A lot of us are not negative we are however tired of the continuous appalling lack of direction and professionalism displayed by the so called executive of this industry. Back to the tracks, and back to the past, as in this January 2024, Ellerslie was on the cusp of being abandoned and would have been if it was a lesser meeting and Trentham being a lesser meeting was abandoned half way through their programme.  These are are our two most important tracks historically and between them they still hold the bulk of NZ Group one races. So now with gloves off, I suggest you take your rose tinted glasses off and look at the reality. 

[TAB For Ever]

11 hours ago, Wingman said:

I will try and be very polite. This is directed at you TAB For Ever. A lot of us are not negative we are however tired of the continuous appalling lack of direction and professionalism displayed by the so called executive of this industry. Back to the tracks, and back to the past, as in this January 2024, Ellerslie was on the cusp of being abandoned and would have been if it was a lesser meeting and Trentham being a lesser meeting was abandoned half way through their programme.  These are are our two most important tracks historically and between them they still hold the bulk of NZ Group one races. So now with gloves off, I suggest you take your rose tinted glasses off and look at the reality. 

Spare me Wingman....

Spread your wings and fly away......

Bullies and anonymous keyboard insults don't worry me !

Start by reading the Optimist's latest piece on his site.

You like many folk spend too much time and energy talking ,thinking and worrying about things they not responsible for and don't control . Try concentrating on things you are responsible for a can do something about .

The past has gone ,concentrate on the future.

Karaka day was fantastic with Aussie based jockeys and horses including superstar James Mac....and it was a miracle that the work had been included under shocking conditions to get the facility reopen. But you trying to reopen something that couldve ,wouldve , shouldve.

What you got planned for this week ?...I'm heading to a couple of meetings...some good racing looks likely.

 

[Wingman]

Touchy, touchy. Lots of tough talk but you have thin skin as I am not sure how my asking you to remove rose tinted glasses makes me a bully. I did read the optimist article prior to posting and the bottom line is no tracks, no racing, now flutter away for ever

 

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Start by reading the Optimist's latest piece on his site.

As usual it is an error ridden piece.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

You like many folk spend too much time and energy talking ,thinking and worrying about things they not responsible for and don't control . Try concentrating on things you are responsible for a can do something about .

The problem is those things that really affect key stakeholders are beyond their control.  Very very frustrating to pitch up to a racetrack that is unsafe to gallop a horse on or is in such poor condition that its performance will be adversely affected.  

If you are as connected as you suggest you are then you would know that many of the top stables had hurt horses after Karaka Millions night but in the "interests of the industry" bit their tongues from making comment.

[Cyril]

15 hours ago, Doomed said:

Very good point. Surely Riccarton should be in the provincial category?

And judging by that overcrowded housing mess they have developed,  it may well end up in the urban slum very soon.

[TAB For Ever]

1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said:

The problem is those things that really affect key stakeholders are beyond their control.  Very very frustrating to pitch up to a racetrack that is unsafe to gallop a horse on or is in such poor condition that its performance will be adversely affected.  

If you are as connected as you suggest you are then you would know that many of the top stables had hurt horses after Karaka Millions night but in the "interests of the industry" bit their tongues from making comment.

Not like you to sound so wishy washy Chief.

Talking gossip or fake news etc....

I heard some of the 'aftermath' etc and was only connected enough to know of one big stable who actually rocked up to the 'big dance' with a few scratchy horses etc. I knew that before hand and of how keen they were to get a balloted horse to run and so it proved.

And I actually posted on here about the possibility  of the track being a little hard  ! Actually attended the trials and workouts to see for my self. Fake stories emerged...apparently the top Racing website named  one very unhappy trainer ,funny she lined up her horse the following week.And Chad's unsound horse mentioned too, he was soon at trials then back racing in Australia. ! And Velocious seems to love the place. Most trainers been lining up to get back there racing again.

But the naysayers have latched on to it  and not letting it go.

Has any NZ track always provided 100% perfect footing...many never had any form of irrigation or if they did it lacked consistent coverage.

Move on ....or better....build a bridge !

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Talking gossip or fake news etc....

Not fake news nor gossip.  There were injuries to horses at the Karaka Millions and if it had been a low key provincial meeting it would have been abandoned.

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

And I actually posted on here about the possibility  of the track being a little hard  !

You see that's where despite your appare t years of experience in the industry you are still ignorant of what harms horses.  It wasn't the hardness of the track (was the penetrometer reading bullshit?) it was the slippery shifty surface.  Sheer causes most problems to horses not the hardness.

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Has any NZ track always provided 100% perfect footing...many never had any form of irrigation or if they did it lacked consistent coverage.

Yes many have and still do.  Many have been mothballed.

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Move on ....or better....build a bridge !

Never as long as poor tracks are produced.  

[curious]

On 14/03/2024 at 9:20 AM, Chief Stipe said:

Not that I can recall.

What will also be interesting is how they measure the financials - return on stakemoney?

Here's the 20/23FY data on that. Two standouts with Kumara leading the field by a narrow margin from Wairarapa. Given that the Entain prize is aimed to encourage them to engage in activities that promote oncourse wagering, you'd think that would be a useful metric in considering the winner.

On a turnover:stakes basis for the metro clubs Huey, you may want to adjust your market.

Edited March 15 by curious

[Bloke]

5 hours ago, curious said:

Here's the 20/23FY data on that. Two standouts with Kumara leading the field by a narrow margin from Wairarapa. Given that the Entain prize is aimed to encourage them to engage in activities that promote oncourse wagering, you'd think that would be a useful metric in considering the winner.

On a turnover:stakes basis for the metro clubs Huey, you may want to adjust your market.

The criterion relating to turnover I believe is a good one. I recall Chris Weaver banging on about Auckland Cup Day being about making money out of hospitality not betting. Only problem was that the crowd got so small that even their hospitality income was drying up.

At the time I was surprised that the RIB as it was called at the time did not challenge Weaver and Co.

[TAB For Ever]

On 3/16/2024 at 3:10 AM, curious said:

Here's the 20/23FY data on that. Two standouts with Kumara leading the field by a narrow margin from Wairarapa. Given that the Entain prize is aimed to encourage them to engage in activities that promote oncourse wagering, you'd think that would be a useful metric in considering the winner.

On a turnover:stakes basis for the metro clubs Huey, you may want to adjust your market.

I assume the narrative has a typo.....these numbers for the one season 22/23 not 20/23 over covid etc.

Interesting the % of the the NZTR total club meeting funding that each club puts into stakes .

Kumara with its one iconic raceday on a Saturday in early January put 60% into of its funding into Stakes. Got $230k after betting commission etc .Stakes $140k

Riverton had 4 days....New Years , Easter Saturday and Monday plus one day in May. They go hard in increasing stakes and received $$830k and paid out $701 Stakes { 83% } I note them and Wairio are offering travel subsidies for their May meeting. They earn money from Farming ,livestock etc. and work hard to justify their racedays

Wairarapa  pushes their Family picnic outing on their days which was 3 x last year .They also race on Public Holidays Jan 2 ,Waitangi Day and a Sunday in Canterbury Cup week. They got nearly $600k from NZTR paying out $387k in Stakes [ 63%]

They also do Farming,livestock for extra income and do various other things for Income.Venue rental, Camping ground/accomm, music festival ,pony club eventsetc.They also host Masterton raceday.As a result they have more paid staff and much bigger Cash flow and own their course freehold. They also include Harness races on their January 2 day so do a lot to  enhance their standing .

 

 

[curious]

Yes. That was a typo. Should have been 22/23FY as you say.

[Murray Fish]

On 15/03/2024 at 1:36 PM, TAB For Ever said:

 

But the naysayers have latched on to it  and not letting it go.

 

 

speaking as a punter who prides themselves at being a winning punter!    that track was a instance NO BET MEETNG, sadly quite a few Group race meetings seem to fall into that cat agree...

[Bloke]

19 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

I assume the narrative has a typo.....these numbers for the one season 22/23 not 20/23 over covid etc.

Interesting the % of the the NZTR total club meeting funding that each club puts into stakes .

Kumara with its one iconic raceday on a Saturday in early January put 60% into of its funding into Stakes. Got $230k after betting commission etc .Stakes $140k

Riverton had 4 days....New Years , Easter Saturday and Monday plus one day in May. They go hard in increasing stakes and received $$830k and paid out $701 Stakes { 83% } I note them and Wairio are offering travel subsidies for their May meeting. They earn money from Farming ,livestock etc. and work hard to justify their racedays

Wairarapa  pushes their Family picnic outing on their days which was 3 x last year .They also race on Public Holidays Jan 2 ,Waitangi Day and a Sunday in Canterbury Cup week. They got nearly $600k from NZTR paying out $387k in Stakes [ 63%]

They also do Farming,livestock for extra income and do various other things for Income.Venue rental, Camping ground/accomm, music festival ,pony club eventsetc.They also host Masterton raceday.As a result they have more paid staff and much bigger Cash flow and own their course freehold. They also include Harness races on their January 2 day so do a lot to  enhance their standing .

 

 

That is a good Analysis TAB, well done.

[curious]

19 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

Interesting the % of the the NZTR total club meeting funding that each club puts into stakes .

Kumara with its one iconic raceday on a Saturday in early January put 60% into of its funding into Stakes. Got $230k after betting commission etc .Stakes $140k

I think it's worth pointing out that the total funding is stakes funding + contribution to costs of running the meeting. Obviously with many times the stakes funding, the latter will be a smaller percentage. Kumara put 100% of NZTR stakes funding to stakes.

[TAB For Ever]

38 minutes ago, curious said:

I think it's worth pointing out that the total funding is stakes funding + contribution to costs of running the meeting. Obviously with many times the stakes funding, the latter will be a smaller percentage. Kumara put 100% of NZTR stakes funding to stakes.

I try not to get too 'provocative' with the Coast Clubs cos I don't want to incite a riot on here.

The Coast has a special circuit and Coasters generally fine people who enjoy racing.. Interesting tho that Kumara is the standout but Harness actually performs well overdue and there ain't a lot of horses trained there now . 

Apart from when the pigs attacked the track Kumara has proved very resilient ,possibly carries the other two along with it.

Kumara has a good date , and prior to this year the TAB staff/workers used to travel in a bus from Christchurch to do 3 x meetings including Friday and Sunday at busy Nelson trots. more costs I suspect. Then Kumara ran into some trouble with Liquor licensing etc.

Cos its only one day a year ,I'd rate it behind Wairarapa and Riverton but what would I know. Awards are very subjective and we all have our biases. Not so long ago I was on a panel judging Sports People of the Year award. To me it was really clear cut...Two sports people who were NZ champs in Sports with high participation ,one world wide one Commonwealth.

My choices were slated in local paper who thought their Athletes nominated were far superior because they were part of a NZ team playing [not too successfully] at the Olympics.To them being at Olympics was number 1.I never got asked again !

[Bloke]

Have they announced the winner(s)?