SLB2.0 Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 I can't really continue this convo, seeing as you seem to think Black Caviar and Frankel would even be in the same race. Black Caviar, the champion miler that she was... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 12 hours ago, SLB2.0 said: I can't really continue this convo, seeing as you seem to think Black Caviar and Frankel would even be in the same race. Black Caviar, the champion miler that she was... Don't be a pompous Git! It was mooted that they would meet over 1400m when they were both racing , a distance both horses won a G1 over, you're not the racing aficionado you think yourself to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 20 Author Share Posted April 20 1 hour ago, Huey said: Don't be a pompous Git! It was mooted that they would meet over 1400m when they were both racing , a distance both horses won a G1 over, you're not the racing aficionado you think yourself to be. He's a journalist... 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 I am not a journalist Well Huey, that would favour Black Caviar, who fell in over 1200m at Ascot? She was a sprinter and that's it. Frankel, yes won a G1 over 1400m, but was 1600m+ at its best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 20 Share Posted April 20 And name calling, really? Are you 12? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 5 hours ago, SLB2.0 said: And name calling, really? Are you 12? Coming from someone being pretentious...please!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 5 hours ago, SLB2.0 said: I am not a journalist Well Huey, that would favour Black Caviar, who fell in over 1200m at Ascot? She was a sprinter and that's it. Frankel, yes won a G1 over 1400m, but was 1600m+ at its best. Fell in ...whatever , she traveled half way across the planet to beat them on their own turf. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special Agent Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 A win is a win, isn't it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 Pretentious? I'm just offering my opinion, as you are. It's only pretentious if you believe your opinion is right, and could only be right, but we both have no proof either way. Beware of dogmatism now, Huey. BC's win was good, but the field was distinctly average. Via Sistina cleaned them up a couple of weeks ago before running a massive second behind Pride of Jenni. Via Sistina isn't even close to being near the top over there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 9 hours ago, SLB2.0 said: Pretentious? I'm just offering my opinion, as you are. It's only pretentious if you believe your opinion is right, and could only be right, but we both have no proof either way. Beware of dogmatism now, Huey. BC's win was good, but the field was distinctly average. Via Sistina cleaned them up a couple of weeks ago before running a massive second behind Pride of Jenni. Via Sistina isn't even close to being near the top over there. That's the entire point your making SLB, youre assuming the form these horses show is translated into exactly the same form down under, its not , some improve some don't the same could be said for the form in Europe that you overrate . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 (edited) The third-rate UK imports don't need to improve to win in Australia, that's my point. We have never seen their very best in Australia, and the UK never got to see our very best middle-distance runner (Winx). Black Caviar winning at Royal Ascot is akin to Usain Bolt winning the Auckland 100m championships. I'm talking milers and above, like Frankel, who would have won the 2024 Group 1 Tacred Stakes by 15 lengths. Edited April 21 by SLB2.0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 21 Author Share Posted April 21 23 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: Black Caviar winning at Royal Ascot is akin to Usain Bolt winning the Auckland 100m championships. Bullshit. How do you arrive at that conclusion? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 21 Author Share Posted April 21 23 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: Frankel, who would have won the 2024 Group 1 Tacred Stakes by 15 lengths. Wasn't there light years back to the horses he beat in Europe as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 The best sprinters aren't in Europe. They're not bred to sprint, and name me a single horse Black Caviar defeated at Royal Ascot off the top of your head. Yes, exactly! Frankel destroyed his opposition in Europe, yet, third-rate stayers from Europe come to Australia and destroy their fields. Yet, Huey believes Frankel wouldn't run well in Australia. That is the biggest joke I've ever heard in my life. Horses like Via Sistina make Australia's best look second-rate, let alone one of the best thoroughbreds of all time. Chief, I'm pretty sure you just disagree with everyone on here for the sake of driving traffic to your threads. When was the last time you agreed with someone? Granted, your IQ is much much higher than Scoobysnacks on the other site, who must be teetering around the 40-point mark. But, don't seem so tense all the time. We're talking opinion. There is no fact involved here, because everything between BC vs Frankel etc is hypothetical. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 31 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: The third-rate UK imports don't need to improve to win in Australia, that's my point. We have never seen their very best in Australia, and the UK never got to see our very best middle-distance runner (Winx). Black Caviar winning at Royal Ascot is akin to Usain Bolt winning the Auckland 100m championships. I'm talking milers and above, like Frankel, who would have won the 2024 Group 1 Tacred Stakes by 15 lengths. Black Caviar doesn't deserve a slap in the face mate. She went her whole career undefeated and took the trip to Royal Ascot , starting not fully fit from aches and pains, and even turned off the gas by rider Nolan a bit short of the line , when clear of the field. (huge field of quality International runners it was too) For years now UK horses have been turning up winning some of the features . Not all are successful but some have plucked some of the big prizes. since WINX won her 4 Cox Plates , (the biggest middle distance race we have Southern Hemisphere) 2 Asian horses have turned up and won lately, and we had three lower rated UK horses win the event as well . 'ADELAIDE and SIR DRAGONET and STATE OF REST all winning the Cox Plate in very recent years . they only won 4 or 5 races each in their Entire Racing careers as UK middle distance imports. and yet were Hammering out Cox Plate victories.😂 so we were lucky the best ranked horses didn't turn up as you say🤣. (footnote. The old Shiekh mohammed's BENBATL did turn up , bred at his Darley stud, and try and knock off Winx. His highest ranking was about 10th in the world , so pretty good. and ran a gallant 2nd in the 2018 Cox plate, but it's a win for the locals in the WFA feature for a change 🏆👍) long may she reign !! or not . 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 I take nothing away from what BC achieved. Granted, the Ascot sprint is a much harder track than what she faced in Australia in terms of elevation. I'm happy someone saw my point about lesser-rated UK horses coming over and winning Australia's biggest G1 races. I can't imagine what would happen if their best came over. Australian racing would be made to look embarrassing, and it's really only the sprinting ranks that saves face. Ortensia won at Goodwood and York (for a whopping 200,000 pounds). She had only one G1 win in Australia (in Perth) prior to winning in Meydan and Europe. That's another prime example of the sprinting ranks around the world, outside of Australia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted April 21 Share Posted April 21 1 hour ago, SLB2.0 said: The best sprinters aren't in Europe. They're not bred to sprint, and name me a single horse Black Caviar defeated at Royal Ascot off the top of your head. Yes, exactly! Frankel destroyed his opposition in Europe, yet, third-rate stayers from Europe come to Australia and destroy their Granted, your IQ is much much higher than Scoobysnacks on the other site, who must be teetering around the 40-point mark. But, don't seem so tense all the time. We're talking opinion. There is no fact involved here, because everything between BC vs Frankel etc is hypothetical. We are talking opinion here ,but Frankel would win the Tancred by 15L ... you can't make it up! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 In my opinion, Frankel would win the Tancred (taken out by Kalapour in 2024) by 15 lengths. That is my opinion of what would happen. Your opinion is that Frankel wouldn't perform well in Australia, and you're allowed your opinion without being called a pompous git and other such names like journalist (much worse). Can't you engage in debate without thinking your opinion is right and only right? If so, seek help, or are you related to LM? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 4 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: In my opinion, Frankel would win the Tancred (taken out by Kalapour in 2024) by 15 lengths. So you base your opinion on one race? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 I base my opinion on countless examples of former UK runners winning in Australia, over varying distances. There are also countless examples of former Hong Kong runners, who had form lines of 00000, winning in New Zealand upon their return. Australian racing is centered around sprinting, and it has been a massive detriment to their middle-distance ranks, and the proof is in the pudding. In MY opinion, Frankel would destroy any middle-distance (1600-2000) race in Australia at the moment. However, I believe Winx would have beaten Frankel in Australia. Unsure why Black Caviar was even mentioned in the same sentence as Frankel, as my point was only about the clear class difference between UK and Aus middle-distance runners. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 10 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: I base my opinion on countless examples of former UK runners winning in Australia, over varying distances. But you've only given one example. 45 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: There are also countless examples of former Hong Kong runners, who had form lines of 00000, winning in New Zealand upon their return. Yes but as you would surely know quite a few horses don't adapt to the environmental and training conditions in Hong Kong. I'll use one example for Hong Kong - Werther. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 49 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: Unsure why Black Caviar was even mentioned in the same sentence as Frankel, as my point was only about the clear class difference between UK and Aus middle-distance runners. I think part of that is to do with the different training and racing approaches. Both struggle to adapt to the other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 28 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: But you've only given one example. Yes but as you would surely know quite a few horses don't adapt to the environmental and training conditions in Hong Kong. I'll use one example for Hong Kong - Werther. Can you clarify what you're saying about Werther? Who was a star in both Australia and Hong Kong... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 22 Author Share Posted April 22 8 minutes ago, SLB2.0 said: Can you clarify what you're saying about Werther? Who was a star in both Australia and Hong Kong... Oh so you now have three separate arguments. Werther kicked off in NZ. Trained out of Otaki if I recall correctly. Certainly measured up in OZ and Hong Kong. You chose one example I chose one. Werther won a Group 1 over a middle distance in HK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SLB2.0 Posted April 22 Share Posted April 22 Right, I see your point now A two-time Group 1 age-group placegetter in Aus is certainly good enough to win Group 1s in Hong Kong. I don't see how that relates to me saying European middle distance form is better than Australian middle distance form, and European sprinting form is worse than Australian sprinting form, but whatever boat you're floating on, the tide must be high. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.