harness 5000

[the galah]

so hrnz have come up with a series designed to support the people who bred their mares to stallions who cost $5000 or less.

They say the concept is to support people at the grass roots level.

a $720,000 stakes raceday consisting of 12 races run for $60,000.

Now i get what HRNZ are trying to do. They have received significant criticism for prioritising the top end and doing next to nothing for the grassroots level.

So,i give them points for trying with this new concept.

But what i don't get is why they came up with the concept of only people with horses who spent under $5000 on a stallion.

My criticism of HRNZ has always been for 2 main reasons.

1)they haven't been fiscally responsible with their spending on stakes on top end races. put simply,they aren't erning enough to spend as they have been.

so,its apparent how they think,in effect overspend even more to keep more people happy by providing races with good stakes.

i just don't get how that makes any sense.

2)you can't prioritise one group ahead of another, In other words everyone has to get a fair go.

When they have limited the series to stallions $5,000 or under,they have prioritised that group of people. And the strange thing about that is how they seem to think $5000 is the magical figure that grass roots people max out on when breeding their mares.

I just don't get how thats fair to people at the grassroots level who have spent more than $5,000 on a stallion.

I just look out the window and see a couple we have and think,well that would have excluded them had we still been going, as we spent $6,000.  But whether it be $5,000 or $10000 or whatever,isn't the point,the point is the type of races and the level at which they participate.

and also lets not forget,even the elite like the jones /hopes/dalgeties and the like have owners/breeders who race many bred and butter horses,whom are by sires they paid relatively high stud fees for. Why are the owners of those horses not included.

so i don't think prioritising any group is a good thing.

so Hrnz are at least trying,but I just don't think they have come up with a way that gets the greatest impact.

actually is was watching a programme on the catholic church in poland the other night and it was discussing declining numbers that were going to churches over there. 

They highlighted how a couple of churches were doing great numbers wise and bucked the trend. They interviewed the priest at one of thoses busy churches and he said the church should be focussing on connecting with people at the grassroots level more like he was and not focussing as much as what goes on higher up..No matter what it may be,that is always the way things should flow.

Edited 12 hours ago by the galah

[Gammalite]

yes it seems a way to encourage people to use Cheaper stallions for their mare instead of the risk in paying the $30k for Captain Treacherous and that. a large amount to just get a foal. might as well just go and buy a yearling at the sales ?.  a yearling that looks great right in front of you at the sale. 

So a scheme like this you mention gives an owner a chance at Winning a race with out any Big Winning stallions in it ?.  I guess there's a chance of small time stallions getting more Mares? but really ? it's like aiming for the basement instead of the penthouse lol 😁 once you have a ' cheap 'horse you're generally stuck with it lol. bloodlines are reasonably important to increase your chances of winning races. (as proven through history really)

The quality of race horse in it (the new races) will  seem low then ? , thus would be not creating an event good for publicity and encouragement in the Sport.

Unlike a Slot race , or a Sires Stakes Series or similar, that draws the best horses and gets good publicity and long range aspirations for the big players to stay in the sport. You NEED the Big players . And BIG PRIZE races. the Sport will be DECEASED with out their support.  If you rely on tiny bit players (you call them grass root)  the sport would end up like Tasmania with cheap syndicate horses , running in cheap races, that no one has heard of, and no-one bets on. 

Perhaps a better idea is to have a $10k + bonus for Any horse upon it's first Race win.? gives the owner/breeder something to aim for . at all levels. 

  

[Brodie]

39 minutes ago, the galah said:

so hrnz have come up with a series designed to support the people who bred their mares to stallions who cost $5000 or less.

They say the concept is to support people at the grass roots level.

a $720,000 stakes raceday consisting of 12 races run for $60,000.

Now i get what HRNZ are trying to do. They have received significant criticism for prioritising the top end and doing next to nothing for the grassroots level.

So,i give them points for trying with this new concept.

But what i don't get is why they came up with the concept of only people with horses who spent under $5000 on a stallion.

My criticism of HRNZ has always been for 2 main reasons.

1)they haven't been fiscally responsible with their spending on stakes on top end races. put simply,they aren't erning enough to spend as they have been.

so,its apparent how they think,in effect overspend even more to keep more people happy by providing races with good stakes.

i just don't get how that makes any sense.

2)you can't prioritise one group ahead of another, In other words everyone has to get a fair go.

When they have limited the series to stallions $5,000 or under,they have prioritised that group of people. And the strange thing about that is how they seem to think $5000 is the magical figure that grass roots people max out on when breeding their mares.

I just don't get how thats fair to people at the grassroots level who have spent more than $5,000 on a stallion.

I just look out the window and see a couple we have and think,well that would have excluded them had we still been going, as we spent $6,000.  But whether it be $5,000 or $10000 or whatever,isn't the point,the point is the type of races and the level at which they participate.

and also lets not forget,even the elite like the jones /hopes/dalgeties and the like have owners/breeders who race many bred and butter horses,whom are by sires they paid relatively high stud fees for. Why are the owners of those horses not included.

so i don't think prioritising any group is a good thing.

so Hrnz are at least trying,but I just don't think they have come up with a way that gets the greatest impact.

actually is was watching a programme on the catholic church in poland the other night and it was discussing declining numbers that were going to churches over there. 

They highlighted how a couple of churches were doing great numbers wise and bucked the trend. They interviewed the priest at one of thoses busy churches and he said the church should be focussing on connecting with people at the grassroots level more like he was and not focussing as much as what goes on higher up..No matter what it may be,that is always the way things should flow.

Pleased you started the post Galah!

Great that HRNZ are trying things and easy to pick faults in anything!

Firstly this initiative is only possible due to the funds being gifted from Entain as it would not be possible from racing profits!

The elephant in the room is just not being addressed and this is the problem.

How many stallions are eligible for being under the $5k?

Personally think it is going to be hard to fill these 12 races with horses that qualify in several of the categories?

Seems a helluva big stake to be racing for and just seems like get rid of the Entain cash splash without any future forward gains?

Spend it while we are getting it appears to be the attitude doesnt it?

 

Edited 11 hours ago by Brodie

[TAB For Ever]

 Out spoken Industry participants are highly critical of this new '.raceday ' involving progeny of 'low cost ' stallions.

Firstly cos it on the same time as Invercargill Cup day ,the big day down South and close to the rich Golden  Gait day in Auckland.

So these clashes seen as spreading the supply of horses too slim and questioning whether there are even enough numbers of this category of horse to fill the fields.

HRNZ claim to have tweaked the Calendar to give a better 'flow' so time will tell.

The "Aces' series which was run late November for 2 yr olds at Addington in 2024 has been scrapped.

[Gammalite]

30 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

Out spoken Industry participants are highly critical of this new '.raceday ' involving progeny of 'low cost ' stallions.

yes it is hard to imagine someone sitting there thinking , I'll go to that stallion with my mare next year to get a foal that can race in a -$5k service fee race. Sires Stakes racing much better.

On breeding , 3 of my All time favourites for Ability ( Tiger Tara, Lazarus and Leap To Fame ) all by Bettors D, looked a chance of being the 'next Generation' Stallions . BUT....

the Tiger Tara's are doing nothing , so he stands for just $3,500 now . Lazarus showing at $5000 fee I think , might change this year. Opinion is devided  ? some say ok , some say underperforming ?'.

so doubt I would rush off to 'Leap To Fame' when he retires without considering other options for my mare.  It's a fickle game the breeding.😁

anyone said to you anything TABman ? about the Lazarus stock ?  

[Brodie]

Great that Chief runs BOAY to enable people to discuss things racing!

Firstly, no one is going to be breeding next year to $5k stallions so they can race in these $60k races!

This will be a one off just to get rid of the Entain promised money, and HRNZ are doing this very well going by the many poor decisions bring made.

Not sorry to state that we can have absolutely no confidence in the future of harness racing in this country if we believe that  those making the decisions currently, have its best interests at heart!!

No media beef up is going to help things, and there is no way on earth any successful business would be operating like this.

Anyway, nothing anyone on BOAY can do or say that will stop this wasteful spending that will end poorly for harness racing in NZ!

We need this committee formed ASAP and potentially take control of what is happening.

[the galah]

3 hours ago, Brodie said:

Pleased you started the post Galah!

Great that HRNZ are trying things and easy to pick faults in anything!

Firstly this initiative is only possible due to the funds being gifted from Entain as it would not be possible from racing profits!

The elephant in the room is just not being addressed and this is the problem.

How many stallions are eligible for being under the $5k?

Personally think it is going to be hard to fill these 12 races with horses that qualify in several of the categories?

Seems a helluva big stake to be racing for and just seems like get rid of the Entain cash splash without any future forward gains?

Spend it while we are getting it appears to be the attitude doesnt it?

 

i agree that at least they seemed to have recognised the need to attempt to support other sectors ,other than the elite.

Personally i think the horse has bolted in that respect.But at least they are trying.

In the nz standardbred stallion book for 2024-25,half the pacing stallions are $5000 or under and 2/3 of the trotting stallions are.

Whats relevant is not todays %,but the historical % for the years,which the grouip of horses eligible for the newly announced races came from.I assume it wouldn't be that much different.

but i agree with you,how can they sustain such spending in years to come?

Edited 8 hours ago by the galah

[the galah]

2 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

 Out spoken Industry participants are highly critical of this new '.raceday ' involving progeny of 'low cost ' stallions.

Firstly cos it on the same time as Invercargill Cup day ,the big day down South and close to the rich Golden  Gait day in Auckland.

So these clashes seen as spreading the supply of horses too slim and questioning whether there are even enough numbers of this category of horse to fill the fields.

HRNZ claim to have tweaked the Calendar to give a better 'flow' so time will tell.

The "Aces' series which was run late November for 2 yr olds at Addington in 2024 has been scrapped.

I hope the same people who are outspoken about "involving progeny of low cost stallions", are being consistent when they criticise prioritising one sector over another.

In other words,if they are going to criticise the latest scheme,,then they should also have criticised the 2 year old bonuses which did exactly the same thing.

thats what i'm doing,being consistent.

i'm not sure who you are referring to,but if people aren't consistent then i think it would be easy enough to see their hypocritical thinking and self interest motives.

you mention the golden gait.

is that going to be run again.

can you explain to us how a club that is so financially rooted,can still run such an expensive/loss making meeting. Hang on,the answer is in that sentence isn't it.

[the galah]

4 hours ago, Gammalite said:

 

Unlike a Slot race , or a Sires Stakes Series or similar, that draws the best horses and gets good publicity and long range aspirations for the big players to stay in the sport. You NEED the Big players . And BIG PRIZE races. the Sport will be DECEASED with out their support.  If you rely on tiny bit players (you call them grass root)  the sport would end up like Tasmania with cheap syndicate horses , running in cheap races, that no one has heard of, and no-one bets on. 

Perhaps a better idea is to have a $10k + bonus for Any horse upon it's first Race win.? gives the owner/breeder something to aim for . at all levels. 

  

If you look at nz.

where is the profit making province for nz harness racing and what type of racing provides the profits in that province. A.canterbury,low grade racing,especially on grass tracks. 

Where is the very large loss making province and what type of racing rpovides those losses. A. auckland and their premier meetings.

why is that. Its obvious,auckland is just big players,no grass roots. 

Focusing on looking after the big players is clearly not the answer in my opinion.

it just makes no sense whatsoever to see  HRNZ continue to artificially prop up auckland with cross subsidisation.They need to  deal with the auckland issue and get it operating somewhere such huge losses aren't genereated and where better stakes are more sustainable.  

the massive irony about what HRNZ is doing,is auckland and the big players you mention,will be the biggest impacted by current fiscally irresponsible policies.

Instead of looking to tasmania,isn't victoria more appropriate.

maybe you r right about a bonus for a first win.i don't know. over the years i've posted suggestions,but my honest opinion is its too late. The people the industry has lost in recent time sare still interested .but only as bystanders,not as participants or breeders. Once those breeders have made the very difficult decision to say goodbye to their mares,they ain't coming back. 

Edited 7 hours ago by the galah

[Gammalite]

2 minutes ago, the galah said:

I hope the same people who are outspoken about "involving progeny of low cost stallions", are being consistent when they criticise prioritising one sector over another.

you are making this up really . Supporting one sector over another ?. the elite and all this sort of stuff.

HRNZ spreads the funding as they traditionally see fit. 

Your leading stables aren't elite at all . House, Dunns, Hopes and Mark Jones all hack around on the grass Sundays as much as anyone else . Don't even have a Cup class pacer amongst them ? how is that elite ? just a good trotter or 2.

Dalgety's are best now?  that Allstars are all but washed up as an elite force with Mark and Nat all but retired.  but I have a mate here who has 2 horses at Dalgety's . they are only moderately elite lol 🤣 could of been Elite if Carter pursued the Interdominion with the Republican Party instead of just a Invercargill - Auckland Cup double 😅😎  chickened out in the end . Good luck to the kiwi's having a go though  . The Elite . Mr and Mrs White 👍🏆

The Prizemoney allocation for your midweek and Sunday country horses is very generous . Probably too much really per race. Fields should be cut to 10 maximum and run more races . That way YOU GET MORE WINNERS . which is Critical to keeping the participants in the Sport (as costs of running one go up and up each year) 

Best thing you could do is Race every SATURDAY night to capture some of the galloping dollars when they go out after, and keep some public exposure (and somewhere to go for the public that like to go out at the weekend)  

all the exclusions going in place to help Share the wins/money really. sometimes they work . The EUREKA (Australia's richest race at $2 million is open Only to 3 and 4 year olds and NO NZ trained horses lol😁) this stops the same horse winning it year after year (like 'Larry' who got beat in it in his attempt actually)  , and keeps the money in the country .

The BETCHA million dollar race there should consider the same thing to stop the Aussies , or Larry will be back to mug you again. 😉💰💰🎉    and put a handicap back on the NZ Cup and Dominion Trot too . 

[the galah]

5 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

 

Best thing you could do is Race every SATURDAY night to capture some of the galloping dollars when they go out after, and keep some public exposure (and somewhere to go for the public that like to go out at the weekend)  

 

that is long gone as being viable. They would get no sky australia racing coverage and without that the pools would be pathetic.

Just look at the pools they had for those couple of auckland meetings run on a saturday night.

Like i've said before. Once people change their habits,you hardly ever get them to change back. When racing gave up the saturday nights many years ago,they effectively killed any fututre saturday night harness racing.

[Gammalite]

6 minutes ago, the galah said:

that is long gone as being viable. They would get no sky australia racing coverage and without that the pools would be pathetic.

Just look at the pools they had for those couple of auckland meetings run on a saturday night.

Like i've said before. Once people change their habits,you hardly ever get them to change back. When racing gave up the saturday nights many years ago,they effectively killed any fututre saturday night harness racing.

Had one recently at Alexandra Park after the rain delay. So can be done. Don't give up mate.

19 minutes ago, the galah said:

where is the profit making province for nz harness racing and what type of racing provides the profits in that province. A.canterbury,low grade racing,especially on grass tracks. 

so just cut out Bernie ,Michelle and Crystal (Hackett's) with their unbelievable skill at getting trotters winning ?

and Tony Herlihy and Barry Purdon and Butchers and etc ...with records that must be near WORLD records . Barry was near best on the planet years ago when training with dad Roy. A lifetime of Quality DESERVING reward. 

Cut Auckland funding to these people you say ??? because people won't bet on them . Goodness me they're still winning Group 1's with Merlin, Meant To Be , Bolt (ret) , even won the new Slot race at Addington they won too in Nov.

They are near BEST on THE PLANET , and you want to cut their funding for a Sunday sessions battlers . you are a Cruel man . (just kidding) but really these people Put HARNESS on the PLANET MAP . should be paid just to turn up.

would be like saying pay the the first round players at the Tennis much more , and stop giving joker, Nadal ,and Feds the millions. lol. 

[the galah]

28 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

. 

Your leading stables aren't elite at all . House, Dunns, Hopes and Mark Jones all hack around on the grass Sundays as much as anyone else . Don't even have a Cup class pacer amongst them ? how is that elite ? just a good trotter or 2.

 

If you want people who mix and mingle with people from the top to the bottom,those people you mention above would be your best answers.

So who would you turn to for advise on what is good for the overall industry,those people.

I'm not sure about robert dunn though,i can't work him ou. i don't understand why he can't see that his canterbury owners will one day pay a price for the way the industry is handling the auckland issue.Maybe hes is one of those people who believes in something that should be,instead of something that is real,like the population being aso called  factor.. Theres lots of people who think like that,especially amogst those in charge.

Edited 7 hours ago by the galah

[the galah]

14 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Had one recently at Alexandra Park after the rain delay. So can be done. Don't give up mate.

so just cut out Bernie ,Michelle and Crystal (Hackett's) with their unbelievable skill at getting trotters winning ?

and Tony Herlihy and Barry Purdon and Butchers and etc ...with records that must be near WORLD records . Barry was near best on the planet years ago when training with dad Roy. A lifetime of Quality DESERVING reward. 

Cut Auckland funding to these people you say ??? because people won't bet on them . Goodness me they're still winning Group 1's with Merlin, Meant To Be , Bolt (ret) , even won the new Slot race at Addington they won too in Nov.

They are near BEST on THE PLANET , and you want to cut their funding for a Sunday sessions battlers . you are a Cruel man . (just kidding) but really these people Put HARNESS on the PLANET MAP . should be paid just to turn up.

would be like saying pay the the first round players at the Tennis much more , and stop giving joker, Nadal ,and Feds the millions. lol. 

yes that auckland meeting had no sky racing ayustralia coverage and like i said,no one bet on those meetings. Racingn does need people to bet to survive.

Cut people out. Where have i ever said that.

I'm consistently saying the opposite.

i'll quote what i said earlier.

42 minutes ago, the galah said:

  

the massive irony about what HRNZ is doing,is auckland and the big players you mention,will be the biggest impacted by current fiscally irresponsible policies.

 

if you want to create an environment where current stakemoney in auckland is no longer sustainable,do as they are currently doing.

If you want to create an environemnt where the people you love gammalite, still have good races to race their horses in,albeit most likely at a different venue,make change before its too late and the equity is diminished too much..

you can't just think of tommorow or next year if you an administrator,you have to think of 10 years time.

Edited 6 hours ago by the galah

[Gammalite]

17 minutes ago, the galah said:

If you want people who mix and mingle with people from the top to the bottom,those people you mention above would be your best answers.

So who would you turn to for advise on what is good for the overall industry,those people.

no no no no.... they are horse trainers and drivers. they don't know.  they are the participants. 

I wouldn't even get advice from them on training horses  🤣, let alone what is good for the industry 😎.

would however take 'Training advice' from BarryP and Scott and  Probably Cullen and RTodd from the South. outstanding results from outstanding trainers.  and they SET Horses for Races. this is important. or you're just a Sunday hack going through the motions . just surviving and that's all.  like those non-elites you mentioned earlier. without a Cup class runner even. 

you need advice from the rich and famous mate.

Get Benefactors in there . Chris Garrard and Seymour. Dean Shannon knows the sport better than anyone as as well as being a big-time owner for decades , he knows the whole betting aspect. Pay him as consultant? they'll even clean up the ATC mess. I have wonderful ideas for that . woo John Green or someone local like that if you like . he knows too . and is a multi millionaire.    

Edited 6 hours ago by Gammalite

[Brodie]

Has anyone read the letter from Greyhound Racing NZ?

They state that the Government is actually paying Entain tens of millions of dollars every year so that Entains losses for the money they are donating to racing for the 5 years is not as great!

You couldn't make this shit up!

And yet they will get 50% of all the sports and online gambling profits ?

Yeah great deal TAB, you have been ripped off!

RIP racing in NZ 

Edited 6 hours ago by Brodie

[Brodie]

New analysis details Government annual gift of $119m to multinational gambling company

Greyhound Racing New Zealand has released new analysis detailing the extent to which the Government is financially supporting a multinational gambling giant.

It comes as the Government is expected this week to pass the Racing Industry Amendment Bill into law, creating a digital monopoly on gambling for Entain.

The analysis, prepared by an independent consultant, details the financial help required for Entain to meet its funding guarantee of $150m per year to the racing industry.

The funding guarantee, combined with a guarantee to retain approximately 450 TAB staff until June 2025, were set under the terms of the agreement when the TAB’s betting business was outsourced to Entain in 2023.

The analysis estimates in dollar terms the value of the Government’s support to bail out Entain so it can limit its losses in meeting the terms of its deal until 2029.

The passage of legislation to block New Zealanders from gambling offshore will boost Entain annual revenues by at least $75m per year.

The retention of gambling on Australian greyhounds after the ban comes into effect, will preserve Entain gross betting revenues of approximately $44m per year.

Without these actions by the Government, Entain would be faced with an estimated revenue deficit of $26m per year.
Greyhound Racing New Zealand CEO Edward Renell said:

“The Government has chosen to bail out a multinational gambling company at the expense of ordinary Kiwis.

“It will shamelessly pass laws and create digital monopolies so Entain can meet its funding guarantees and obligations to private shareholders.

“Entain won’t need to compete to win new revenue as it was brought in to do. It will be gifted it by banning Kiwis from using non-Entain betting providers and retaining gambling on Australian greyhound racing.

“The decision to keep taking money from Australian greyhound races, but strip thousands of regional Kiwis of their livelihoods and passion, is depressingly cynical and hypocritical.

“Gross income of $44 million dollars each year will now be sliced up between the Government, Entain and the equine codes and not go to the thousands of trainers, owners, and breeders involved in greyhound racing.

“It’s a reverse Robin Hood. The Government is taking money from the provinces to save face on a bad deal and keep the money flowing into Entain, thoroughbred and harness racing.”

/Ends
For further information contact:
Liam Constable – 029 200 9842
EDITORS NOTES

Timeline of Entain – TAB deal:

March 2023: TAB and Entain agreed to enter a strategic partnership agreement where TAB has delegated its betting and wagering functions to Entain.

May 2023: The partnership was approved by then Racing Minister Labour’s Kieran McAnulty, outsourcing TAB’s monopoly betting operation to Entain for 25 years, a UK-listed multinational. 50% revenue share between Entain and the TAB.

May 2023: TAB sought a variation to its authorisation of its arrangements with Tabcorp to reflect strategic partnership with Entain.

June 2023: The partnership officially started on June 1, 2023.
Entain Guarantees under the terms of sale:
Entain provided TAB $150 million upfront a with a guaranteed $150 million for the first five years.
$10 million sponsorship for racing carnivals.
On passage of the Racing Amendment bill into law: $100 million payment from Entain, $80 million to be shared between thoroughbred and harness racing
Entain committed to no forced redundancies for first 24 months of the agreement, due to expire this month (June 2025).

Book value of Entain’s TAB licence assets, if the Racing Amendment legislation goes through:
According to Entain’s March 2025 annual report, the estimated value of the New Zealand TAB licence assets was $2.7 billion NZD, including the potential introduction of the legislation.

[Nowornever]

So Entain guarantee on retaining staff until June 2025 is almost up. 

What other goodies are about to hit in June 2025 via the same arrangement?

[Brodie]

15 minutes ago, Nowornever said:

So Entain guarantee on retaining staff until June 2025 is almost up. 

What other goodies are about to hit in June 2025 via the same arrangement?

They didnt honour this!

Sent heaps away early from what I have heard, no need cir them when work is bring done from OZ! 

Not sure how many are actually still on the payroll but would not think there be many at all  left?

Edited 6 hours ago by Brodie

[the galah]

4 hours ago, Gammalite said:

no no no no.... they are horse trainers and drivers. they don't know.  they are the participants. 

I wouldn't even get advice from them on training horses  🤣, let alone what is good for the industry 😎.

would however take 'Training advice' from BarryP and Scott and  Probably Cullen and RTodd from the South. outstanding results from outstanding trainers.  and they SET Horses for Races. this is important. or you're just a Sunday hack going through the motions . just surviving and that's all.  like those non-elites you mentioned earlier. without a Cup class runner even. 

you need advice from the rich and famous mate.

Get Benefactors in there . Chris Garrard and Seymour. Dean Shannon knows the sport better than anyone as as well as being a big-time owner for decades , he knows the whole betting aspect. Pay him as consultant? they'll even clean up the ATC mess. I have wonderful ideas for that . woo John Green or someone local like that if you like . he knows too . and is a multi millionaire.    

you have a lot of fairth in the rich and famous gammalite.

More than i would ever have. success in one field doesn't always translate into success in other fields,especially when not playing with their own money.

E.g. Look who ran the auckland trotting club when they did the developments.

Give me an accountant with common sense and an abilty to recognise what is both good and bad advice, when they get it.

 

 

john green...

gammalite,Look i'm sure hes a clever man who intended well,but he was one of the many who pushed the original development,that is the cause of all aucklands problems.He was appointed to help oversee the development right from the start..

gammalite... 

heres a quote from an atc press release in 2018 about 2 new board directors

"the appointments follow the recent retirement of john green from the board,,who was specifically appointed in 2014 for his skills in property development and was a member of the auckland trotting clubs project control group.

the property control group is currently overseeing the current construction of the clubs significant urban village development on green lane west due to open later this year". 

so ,well intentioned like everyone involved in pushing the apartments,but boy oh boy did he and the others involved get it wrong..

wasn't the likes of barry purdon and derek balle also atc diirectors at the start of the developments.

actually i've posted this before. It was about a year in from when the apartments  thing started,about 2015.

I had a conversation with someone from auckland who went around the country advising councils about big developments like the atc's.. I asked himabout  the auckland trotting club developmemts expecting him to just say the same as what you read in the papers and from the atc press releases.

To my surprise he said the opposite,listing all the pitfalls and how other such developments had failed due to numerous factors, often outside the control of those involved. He expressed surprise about the atc getting involved to the extent they did,given what he said were very obvious risks.

I distinctly remember saying to him,from what you just said,you don't think the ATC have made good decisions,to which he smiled and replied...."well, we will just have to wait and see how it all turns turns out.

I often think about that conversation when i think of the atc. 

Edited 2 hours ago by the galah

[the galah]

4 hours ago, Brodie said:

Has anyone read the letter from Greyhound Racing NZ?

They state that the Government is actually paying Entain tens of millions of dollars every year so that Entains losses for the money they are donating to racing for the 5 years is not as great!

You couldn't make this shit up!

And yet they will get 50% of all the sports and online gambling profits ?

Yeah great deal TAB, you have been ripped off!

RIP racing in NZ 

i think what that press release is saying is entains original agreement with the government meant they expected to be receiving money from turnover generated on nz greyhounds.

so ,when the governments ban on nz greyhound racing comes into effect,it means part of entains income will have been impacted,so they have said,hey we will sort that out with adjustments to  your share of the revenues generated from the australian greyhounds, through the nz tab.(maybe entain may have sued them about that bit?)

but other parts of that press seem misleading a little,becuase the governmant already had an agreement with entain to do the geo blocking in return for an extra payment from entain of $100m to be split up amongst sports and racing and the government. That was already there before the greyhounds decision to close down.

Is edward reneell and the greyhound people doing themselves any favours by attacking the government with statements that can be construed as a bit misleading.Interesting tactic.

Edited 2 hours ago by the galah

[PeterLambFan]

I don't understand how you can say Greyhound racing is bad so lets ban it on animal welfare grounds, but it's ok for animal welfare to be abused off shore.

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, the galah said:

i think what that press release is saying is entains original agreement with the government meant they expected to be receiving money from turnover generated on nz greyhounds.

so ,when the governments ban on nz greyhound racing comes into effect,it means part of entains income will have been impacted,so they have said,hey we will sort that out with adjustments to  your share of the revenues generated from the australian greyhounds, through the nz tab.(maybe entain may have sued them about that bit?)

but other parts of that press seem misleading a little,becuase the governmant already had an agreement with entain to do the geo blocking in return for an extra payment from entain of $100m to be split up amongst sports and racing and the government. That was already there before the greyhounds decision to close down.

Is edward reneell and the greyhound people doing themselves any favours by attacking the government with statements that can be construed as a bit misleading.Interesting tactic.

It reads that the taxpayer is going to be paying Entain money to enable them to fulfil the 900m obligation!

They are hypocrites if they think it needs to ban greyhounds in NZ as they think it is cruel and yet they are endorsing the cruelty of greyhound racing in Australia, by accepting wagering on them!!

NZ greyhound people are being totally shafted!

How can anyone with any common sense be able to justify the anomalies?

 

Edited 49 minutes ago by Brodie

[Gammalite]

2 hours ago, the galah said:

To my surprise he said the opposite,listing all the pitfalls and how other such developments had failed due to numerous factors, often outside the control of those involved. He expressed surprise about the atc getting involved to the extent they did,given what he said were very obvious risks.

No doubt it's a tragedy. The original man Kerry Hoggard (president of the ATC then)  died right at that point as construction was about to start . It was his brainchild the Apartments. Guess John Green and his company couldn't save the day afterall then . was just an idea. thank you very much for that info. John  along with his wife and old friend of mine. I went to their wedding at Alexandra Park actually lol. They still races horses with Tony Herlihy and Hughes as well. they raced The Orange Agent. she was a beauty , won near a million?  but broke bones in the end 😪.

I think the Original contractor doing the apartment job for ATC went Belly-up which snowballed the problems dramatically.  what a bloody nightmare the whole thing has turned into. 

re: greyhounds

They shut the greyhounds down once 2016 in NSW for a time, but then the government shortly after overturned the decision as 2000 people would of lost their livelihood. so they made welfare changes in the industry  and away they went again. NZ should do that. 😊

as for Entain. I'm grateful they put up money for 5 years . Everyone racing for a quid a bit longer. I'm sure when the five years approaches some plan will be in place for harness to continue. Even if they race for half the money they do now, so be it. Have slot races and put money up ourselves 😁 or pay just acceptance Fees like we DID for Years. 

Vic Frost (now 80 years old the famous millionaire Westburn Grant man ) won with his horse tonight and picked up $2,369 for his trouble . Just like last week. horse has won 3 races from 15 starts and about 10k this year. It's not about the money for some just doing their sport/hobby. People are happy to be winning . even if prizemoney greatly reduced.  You might have to do that in New Zealand.  on ya Vic ! you old marvel you