Thomass Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 Waller looks to have worked the oracle with this gear change...why wouldn't you trust Trainers to know what's best..and then adding 10% to your investment? Champion trainer Chris Waller is hopeful a gear change trialled prior to Verry Elleegant’s last win can extract an “extra five to 10 percent” more ability from the exciting filly in Saturday’s Group I Vinery Stud Stakes (2000m) at Rosehill. Verry Elleegant is widely regarded as one of the most naturally-gifted fillies’ in a strong three-year-old crop but during her nine-start career, her racing manners have let the daughter of Zed (NZ) down on occasions. Verry Elleegant joined the Waller team prior to resuming in The Vanity and made her Sydney debut for the stable in the Group II Phar Lap Stakes at Rosehill a fortnight ago and couldn’t have been any more impressive recording an easy 3-1/2 length victory but again, she wanted to overdo it during the early and middle stages of the race. “She needs to relax better,” jockey James McDonald said post-race. “It’s hard to explain, she’s awkward rather than being fierce. She just doesn’t give herself a rest.” Stepping up from 1500m to 2000m on Saturday, Waller has made a significant change to Verry Elleegant’s racing attire, a process that started before the Phar Lap Stakes which the stable hopes will help the filly to relax this weekend. “Nose roll off and ear muffs (during the race) on,” Waller’s racing manager Charlie Duckworth said. “She’s obviously a very good horse but there’s four Group I winners in the race on Saturday and she’s yet to get hers and needs to be doing everything right. “Group Is are so hard to win, she can’t afford to be doing 90 to 95 percent of things right out there and beating horses like she’s up against. “I think we’ve got the right jockey (McDonald) to achieve it, I think we’ve made the right gear changes to achieve it. “The gear chances are a little bit of trial and error but mostly based on experience and feedback. “James galloped her in ear muffs on the Tuesday before her last start and he said she was so much more relaxed than when he’d galloped her previously. “She was a different horse when we put them on and she actually cantered down to the start in them prior to the Phar Lap and James said she was very passive. “We are quietly confident it will help her to relax during the race on Saturday and give us the extra five to 10 percent we’re looking for.” Verry Elleegant is the clear $2.70 favourite to win the Vinery Stud Stakes and Duckworth said “she’s flying” at home and “she’s drawn well so hopefully she can get some cover”. Meanwhile, the stable is also expecting the stablemate Zalatte to bounce back after she ran well below expectations when beaten 9-3/4 lengths in the Phar Lap Stakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted March 28, 2019 Share Posted March 28, 2019 She just wins on Saturday. Beautiful filly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 28, 2019 Author Share Posted March 28, 2019 Very interesting aspects to all of this for sure though.... ...maybe she's just a miler?? Who can't settle? The Roll didn't make a jot of difference really...it's her natural galloping style by the looks... ...and Weir's modus operandi of jiggery pokkery probably wasn't activated on her..being a natural So you have to believe the Jock and Waller when they make a change such as this.. If Mak says she was settled on race day... galloping to the start with them on... ...where they came off...you'd think having them on the entire time ..will definitely help her settle better over a longer distance Id be upping the stake investment to 20% in that case Walle's not a beginner... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted March 30, 2019 Share Posted March 30, 2019 And just wins she did. It was never in doubt beforehand or during the running. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 30, 2019 Author Share Posted March 30, 2019 And she settled so much better ATA! When a doyen trainer and smart Jock tell the public of how much better she was in training and on race day with them... ...only a stupid punter wouldn't listen After the race Waller made special mention about giving this type of info to PUNTERS ...he knows he'd be running for ribbons without them 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 31, 2019 Author Share Posted March 31, 2019 Who doesn't like the look of a good set of Muffs?? Maybe Matty Camo...but hey they sure did the trick Wiley Waller Still...you didn't need to be Iron Stain to work it out... ...when the Jocks says f yes...and the trainer watches, listens then learns... you just get on f in board don't you?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 In my opinion she didn't race much different to how she always races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 31, 2019 Author Share Posted March 31, 2019 16 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: In my opinion she didn't race much different to how she always races. Oh please not another one... Wait...I'm thinking as well as needing the muffs...she'd be even better...and go faster from point a-b ...with Blinkers... what say you expert? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Thomass said: Oh please not another one... Wait...I'm thinking as well as needing the muffs...she'd be even better...and go faster from point a-b ...with Blinkers... what say you expert? Who cares. Now you must know what she needs better than Weir and Waller. How stupid are they not to have put them on her for the Oaks or even last start to make the win even easier on her. Don't they know anything. Send them an email and tell them how they've both got it so wrong. Edited March 31, 2019 by mardigras 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 27 minutes ago, Thomass said: Oh please not another one... Wait...I'm thinking as well as needing the muffs...she'd be even better...and go faster from point a-b ...with Blinkers... what say you expert? You would have had $20k on her being so confident T. Shame it wasn’t before the race. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 31, 2019 Author Share Posted March 31, 2019 1 hour ago, mardigras said: Who cares. Now you must know what she needs better than Weir and Waller. How stupid are they not to have put them on her for the Oaks or even last start to make the win even easier on her. Don't they know anything. Send them an email and tell them how they've both got it so wrong. Oh gee..how did I know you'd poke your 'expert' opinion up on gear to wear... J Mak seems sure they'll help her... Maybe after you've emailed Snowden...do the same for J Mak...he's only her Jock after all The rst leg of a winning Group 1 double for jockey James McDonald, who also rode Avilius (Pivotal) to win the HE Tancred Stakes (Gr 1, 2400m) later on in the card, said the gear changes had made a big diference to the Filly’s racing manners. “It was a masterstroke putting the ear muffs on, incredible,” McDonald said. “I could have had her anywhere, she relaxed so well. But she might need blinkers now. She hits the front and goes left, right – she thinks the job is done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 (edited) 7 hours ago, Thomass said: Oh gee..how did I know you'd poke your 'expert' opinion up on gear to wear... J Mak seems sure they'll help her... Maybe after you've emailed Snowden...do the same for J Mak...he's only her Jock after all The rst leg of a winning Group 1 double for jockey James McDonald, who also rode Avilius (Pivotal) to win the HE Tancred Stakes (Gr 1, 2400m) later on in the card, said the gear changes had made a big diference to the Filly’s racing manners. “It was a masterstroke putting the ear muffs on, incredible,” McDonald said. “I could have had her anywhere, she relaxed so well. But she might need blinkers now. She hits the front and goes left, right – she thinks the job is done. So the trainers don't know this. I thought they knew stuff like this being horsemen. Go on, tell them how stupid they are and how wrong they've been for every start the horse has had. You put these people on a pedestal. But as of right now according to you, Waller couldn't work that out and McDonald could. Is Waller thick? And even in your own stupid post - sharing more opinion - which supposedly you don't listen to. He says might. She might also go worse with blinkers on. You're so gullible. These people try this stuff all the time. And Waller's record with Ear Muffs and Blinkers on is atrocious compared to his record without. Does he only put them on useless horses? I'm definitely not an expert on gear. neither are you. Since you don't know when they might assist and when they don't. You just listen to trainers and jockeys - of which more often than not, they get it wrong. Edited March 31, 2019 by mardigras 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 Bang on Mardi, I would imagine with all this expert knowledge, Jockey’s & Trainer’s would make the greatest tipsters, right?. Oh wait, hang on, they are experts on gear change improvements like Thomass’s Punting, after the race. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 (edited) Maybe Waller should give up training. Just punt. Same with McDonald. He shouldn't have bothered coming back to ride. Just do a bit of farming and punt with all those skills. Edited March 31, 2019 by mardigras 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 (edited) I've just had a message from a mate in Perth who likes to keep up with the goss.....she's had a gutsful of Thommo too, has taken BOAY off her favourites. Why do you two - and others - give him air? deprive him of the attention he craves and he might just go away painlessly...! I must admit to being OK with his constant critique of the feds....someone needs to hold the police to account....if he could leave it at that instead of launching off into meaningless tirades about ....nothing.... Edited March 31, 2019 by Freda 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, Freda said: I've just had a message from a mate in Perth who likes to keep up with the goss.....she's had a gutsful of Thommo too, has taken BOAY off her favourites. Why do you two - and others - give him air? deprive him of the attention he craves and he might just go away painlessly...! I must admit to being OK with his constant critique of the feds....someone needs to hold the police to account....if he could leave it at that instead of launching off into meaningless tirades about ....nothing.... I tried that Freda. The entire gallops site filled up with his threads. He wrote to himself. There was no point visiting the site. Even now, he started 17 of the last 25 threads. 4 of the last 25 threads have had 20+ replies. Only one of his. Most of his are just him responding to himself. He won't go away. Gallops now has about 5 posters on it - rarely. Thomass and the chief in the main. But I will stop on this topic. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hesi Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 1 hour ago, mardigras said: I tried that Freda. The entire gallops site filled up with his threads. He wrote to himself. There was no point visiting the site. Even now, he started 17 of the last 25 threads. 4 of the last 25 threads have had 20+ replies. Only one of his. Most of his are just him responding to himself. He won't go away. Gallops now has about 5 posters on it - rarely. Thomass and the chief in the main. But I will stop on this topic. For a moment, one could be forgiven for thinking you were describing Racechat. I find the situation very sad, considering the amount of work I put in, helping to build up BOAY. I'm afraid it is not going to change though. the view is, that it is a reflection on the posters, not on the site 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 3 minutes ago, hesi said: For a moment, one could be forgiven for thinking you were describing Racechat. I find the situation very sad, considering the amount of work I put in, helping to build up BOAY. I'm afraid it is not going to change though. the view is, that it is a reflection on the posters, not on the site Keep chipping away Hesi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 I would have thought that most times blinkers have been applied to a horse it is on the recommendation of the jockey. After all they are in the best position to judge whether they would suit the horse. ie Knowing what the horse is doing and how it is reacting during the race. From my experience this seems quite common. If Jimmy Mac told me that he felt my horse would benefit from blinkers being applied I would certainly give it the utmost consideration. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 Just now, All The Aces said: I would have thought that most times blinkers have been applied to a horse it is on the recommendation of the jockey. After all they are in the best position to judge whether they would suit the horse. ie Knowing what the horse is doing and how it is reacting during the race. From my experience this seems quite common. If Jimmy Mac told me that he felt my horse would benefit from blinkers being applied I would certainly give it the utmost consideration. But only if it works in a track gallop. I would say the majority of horses that I've had involvement with that have had blinkers applied haven't responded that well. Veery Ellegant's racing style has been somewhat idiosyncratic since it first graced the race track. MacDonald reckoned blinkers would stop it from switching off and veering to one side at the end of a race and putting in to the end. Well in my opinion that could conflict with the need for it to settle for the rest of the Oaks journey. The horse is a bit of a goon with loads and loads of natural ability. Sometimes when you start messing with the head gear of those types of horses you have a negative reaction. They're the type that likes to see what they are racing and with their ability have the time to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 1 minute ago, Chief Stipe said: But only if it works in a track gallop. I would say the majority of horses that I've had involvement with that have had blinkers applied haven't responded that well. Correct in that they would be tried in a track gallop. Perfect example Sentimental Miss. Trainer Lisa Latta was far from disappointed. “We were happy with the Lowland Stakes as an Oaks trial and feel we are very much on target for her grand final on Saturday. She is looking for the step up to 2400 metres. She has been working in blinkers to give her more confidence – she’s a pretty laid back horse and blinkers will help her push through gaps. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 13 minutes ago, All The Aces said: Correct in that they would be tried in a track gallop. Perfect example Sentimental Miss. Trainer Lisa Latta was far from disappointed. “We were happy with the Lowland Stakes as an Oaks trial and feel we are very much on target for her grand final on Saturday. She is looking for the step up to 2400 metres. She has been working in blinkers to give her more confidence – she’s a pretty laid back horse and blinkers will help her push through gaps. I'm not sure in Verry Ellegant's case she lacks confidence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
All The Aces Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 32 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: I'm not sure in Verry Ellegant's case she lacks confidence. Indeed, I showed one example. In her case J Mac gives another reason. She has won her last two easily without them just the same. I am not saying that blinkers is a panacea, they are also applied as a last resort on a poorly performing horse in hope of a better result, however most times making little difference to those lacking in ability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted March 31, 2019 Share Posted March 31, 2019 21 minutes ago, All The Aces said: Indeed, I showed one example. In her case J Mac gives another reason. She has won her last two easily without them just the same. I am not saying that blinkers is a panacea, they are also applied as a last resort on a poorly performing horse in hope of a better result, however most times making little difference to those lacking in ability. Yes I agree. I wouldn't be putting them on her. Funny I had a horse with similar issues. A real goon in his antics and galloping style but very very fast and a good galloper. A nose roll was put on him to change his style - it made it worse. Sometimes you just need to go with the flow and tinkering too much to make a talented galloper like some perceived optimum can screw things up. In my opinion the less gear on their head the better. As for her settling better she missed the start in the Vinery and then got a trail on the rail. Maybe that had a part in her settling as she hasn't trailed often in her short career. Still learning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted March 31, 2019 Author Share Posted March 31, 2019 42 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Yes I agree. I wouldn't be putting them on her. Funny I had a horse with similar issues. A real goon in his antics and galloping style but very very fast and a good galloper. A nose roll was put on him to change his style - it made it worse. Sometimes you just need to go with the flow and tinkering too much to make a talented galloper like some perceived optimum can screw things up. In my opinion the less gear on their head the better. As for her settling better she missed the start in the Vinery and then got a trail on the rail. Maybe that had a part in her settling as she hasn't trailed often in her short career. Still learning. I know it's April 1...but I'm reading some really hilarious stuff on this thread... ...and unbelievably...You're serious!! If you call settling 8th as the "Trail" then you're beyond help Some even think all gear WILL result in EVERY neddy winning... This is all you need... If after winning...a top class trainer and Jockey want to change gear... You simply know the new gear will WORK...these are HORSEMEN... Not ignorant STATSMEN... ffs Heres Mak again...read it, ingest it, and please don't think you know more than the EXPERTS...ever again McDonald described Waller’s decision to remove the nose-roll and add ears muffs to Verry Elleegant was a “masterstroke”. “She was a different ride today, I’ve never seen a horse transformed so much,’’ McDonald said. “I could have had her anywhere in the race, she relaxed so well. Amazing, it was a masterstroke putting the ear muffs on, incredible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.