A different viewpoint on Vaccination.

[Chief Stipe]

[aquaman]

This goes beyond crimes against humanity, horrifying. What i cannot understand is, why are people so gullible, it tells me IQ level has dropped probably since the 1960s where i would argue it was at its highest.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, aquaman said:

This goes beyond crimes against humanity, horrifying. What i cannot understand is, why are people so gullible, it tells me IQ level has dropped probably since the 1960s where i would argue it was at its highest.

Fear inspired group think.  

[aquaman]

Yes, the leeming syndrome. I understand that, but to witness madness on a grand scale is something to behold, and as you say, weaponising fear as a weapon. This is all part of globalisation amonst the elete. The masses are the guinea pigs.

[Chief Stipe]

The crap science being spouted day in day out in the media is driving me insane.  

I read today that over 60 million children didn't receive their Polio vaccinations last year due to Covid-19.  Polio being a disease that they ARE vulnerable to AND for which there is a proven vaccine!  

[aquaman]

I know how you feel, it is so blindingly obvious to a few people, but they are a small minority. I too feel like throwing a brick at the TV everytime I here the lie's and misinformation that is spewing forth. Everytime you put the radio on no matter the station, more unadulterated garbage, all designed to brainwash the masses.

They lie about the origin. They lie about how China sent it out to the world deliberately by stopping all internal flights whilst at the same time letting all international flights go unchecked. They lie about China corrupting W.H.O. so as to deflect the origin. They lie about the severity of the virus. They lie about whom is at risk. They lie about successful treatments for the virus, in fact the whole f#cken thing is one big whopper.

[curious]

This is a worry:

Drugmaker Pfizer said Thursday it is seeing waning immunity from its coronavirus vaccine and says it is picking up its efforts to develop a booster dose that will protect people from variants.

[Freda]

4 hours ago, curious said:

This is a worry:

Drugmaker Pfizer said Thursday it is seeing waning immunity from its coronavirus vaccine and says it is picking up its efforts to develop a booster dose that will protect people from variants.

Would it be surprising, though?    We know that viruses can mutate very quickly - the changing makeup of the influenza virus being one we are all familiar with.

[curious]

Having just been offered the vaccination I am trying to decide but will at least wait till the FDA makes a decision on approval. There is no doubt a personal and public health benefit of having it because it appears to reduce the risk of hospitilisation and death if you contract it though the quantum of that remains quite debateable. There are also signs in the data and research that it may reduce the risk of contracting it and of transmitting it, though that remains unclear.

It's a risk/benefit thing given available information for me I guess. A major stumbling block is that while the short term adverse effects are mostly relatively minor, longer term adverse effects are entirely unknown. The idea that now booster injections are likely necessary (and they are talking 6-12 month intervals) while the adverse effects of the initial jab/s are completely unknown just adds to that concern. Boosters to modify effectiveness against new strains also seem highly likely as you say.

 

[Chief Stipe]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

Would it be surprising, though?    We know that viruses can mutate very quickly - the changing makeup of the influenza virus being one we are all familiar with.

Actually this virus ISN'T mutating very quickly at least not to variants of concern.  In nearly 20 months there have only been FOUR variants of concern.

Influenza is a different beast entirely.  I won't debate the efficacy of flu vaccines except to say there is some doubt about how effective they actually are.  Influenza is different because there are different STRAINS and variants therein - it isn't easy to predict from one year to the next which Strain will be the dominant one.

In my mind the fact that the supposedly best of the vaccines doesn't have the same efficacy against the Delta variant NOR as Pzifer announced in the last few days have lasting immunity isn't a factor of Covid-19 but a factor of the vaccine technology.

It is interesting to note that as yet Sweden does not have a third wave driven by the Delta variant.  I postulated this on another forum and was immediately banned for misinformation.  My hypothesis is that Sweden allowed the initial virus to circulate and although late to do so has protected the vulnerable and sick first.  Primary schools have not closed down at any stage during the pandemic.

I read a research paper recently that theorised that Sweden had a level of pre-immunity and that coupled with immunity gained through infection and now vaccination (Sweden has vaccinated about 45%) has reached a level of herd immunity that will only alter if a more infectious variant emerges.  

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, curious said:

Having just been offered the vaccination I am trying to decide but will at least wait till the FDA makes a decision on approval. There is no doubt a personal and public health benefit of having it because it appears to reduce the risk of hospitilisation and death if you contract it though the quantum of that remains quite debateable. There are also signs in the data and research that it may reduce the risk of contracting it and of transmitting it, though that remains unclear.

It's a risk/benefit thing given available information for me I guess. A major stumbling block is that while the short term adverse effects are mostly relatively minor, longer term adverse effects are entirely unknown. The idea that now booster injections are likely necessary (and they are talking 6-12 month intervals) while the adverse effects of the initial jab/s are completely unknown just adds to that concern. Boosters to modify effectiveness against new strains also seem highly likely as you say.

 

My views are aligned to yours.  I've been offered it as well - been given a booking number by text.  I have considerable doubts about the long term effects of the vaccine but mainly for young adolescents and children.  They have a substantially different physiology to adults with many of their internal systems still developing e.g. endocrine, reproductive, brain and nervous system etc.  Given that the risk of Covid-19 is very low to this cohort in the absence of long term data I don't think it is a good approach to open up vaccination to them.

At times it feels I living in a lunatic asylum when reading the alarmist NON-scientific pretending to be scientific information and anecdotal evidence being promoted.

The latest was this 5 year old that died in Alabama (some reports had him in Florida!).  The child also had a staph and strep infection.  Tragic though it may be these things happen.  Last year a 14 year old athlete of quite some ability dropped dead while running the 800m at the local interschool sports!  Is the 5 year old death any more tragic or common than that?  Or for that matter the 44 year old man that died from blood clotting from the Astra-Zeneca vaccine.  The media then reports that the odds of dying from the AZ vaccine with blood clots is less than taking oral contraceptives......since when have men been taking those?

[aquaman]

These China virus vaccines are not the same as Flue shots. Different science, and uncharted waters. I will be working on my own immune system, ie vitamin D, Zinc, vitamin C, keeping my gut healthy, I consume Kimchi most days, eat well and exercise daily. Plus manage weight. I will take my chances when it sweeps through NZ, and it will, burying your head in the sand will cost NZ in the long term. I do not fear this virus, and once I have had it, I shall have natural immunity and will not require constant jabs. I shall be visiting my doctor soon and hopefully discussing the possibility of getting a home kit such as the Indians are using, ie Ivermectin, or the HydroC anti maleria drug, both costing less than a dollar although I suppose here they will inflate it. That is my strategy.

[curious]

1 hour ago, aquaman said:

These China virus vaccines are not the same as Flue shots. Different science, and uncharted waters. I will be working on my own immune system, ie vitamin D, Zinc, vitamin C, keeping my gut healthy, I consume Kimchi most days, eat well and exercise daily. Plus manage weight. I will take my chances when it sweeps through NZ, and it will, burying your head in the sand will cost NZ in the long term. I do not fear this virus, and once I have had it, I shall have natural immunity and will not require constant jabs. I shall be visiting my doctor soon and hopefully discussing the possibility of getting a home kit such as the Indians are using, ie Ivermectin, or the HydroC anti maleria drug, both costing less than a dollar although I suppose here they will inflate it. That is my strategy.

Exactly. We do not know if the vaccinated populations are more likely to be engaged with other protective factors such as you mention as well as the basics such as distancing, sanitisation, PPE use etc. No research has partialed eout these things yet.

In the worst case there are tubes of Ivermectin in the tack room.

[Chief Stipe]

I'm not sure I'd use the Ivermectin dose gun from the local cow cockie.

But I see no harm in taking the recommended dose of tablets.

I did some research trying to work out why Ivermectin has an antiviral property.  I might be way off beam BUT Ivermectin is supposedly anti-parasitic yet the parasites that cause River Blindness carry viruses themselves.  Maybe it is the viruses that the parasites carry that cause the diseases and not the parasites.

We should have taken the Sweden approach which was EXACLTY what every country and WHO had agreed to as a pandemic strategy after decades of research.

[aquaman]

I think the classic misinformation that is pedaled is by the untrustworthy media. Take for example India. Two months ago they claimed armageddon had come to India with bodies being cremated all over the show due to the virus, and people running out of oxygen and choking to death, an then if by magic everything went away and no more reporting on India, what happened to change things. Well what happened is it is sweeping the country uncontrolled, but the death rate and hospitalisation has dropped right away through the use of effective cheap therapeutic drugs costing less than a dollar. They have a home kit that the population has easy access too to take home and self administer if and when they display symptoms of the virus. Their population will have herd immunity very quickly. They will not wreak their economy with endless lockdowns as we are witnessing in Aust. NZ and Aus will be left behind as the rest of the world learn to live with it. We are in danger here of being like natives were in the 1700's when first meeting explorers and being decimated by the common cold.

[Chief Stipe]

Apparently 4 million more people have died in India than reported by the "corrupt Government"!

Where are the bodies?

27,000 people die a day in India in an average year.

[Yankiwi]

Personally, I reckon it's more dangerous to my long term health driving somewhere to get the vaccine than it would be to contract Covid.

I will not even consider rolling up my sleeve until the time I believe I am being told the truths about the virus and the prescribed vaccine for the virus. I'm not going to be tricked into being a Guinee Pig for Cindy or any of her chosen drug companies.

Since China is so tight lipped & not open to inquiry of the Wuhan lab, to me that screams there is something for them to try to hide. It's been made obvious that China has the WHO in their back pocket as well. Remember when Covid wasn't airborne & we only needed to wash our hands & not touch our face? It's too bad Trump isn't around anymore. I never did find out the safest way to get the bleach into my body.

As a side note, I'm still waiting for my refund from the Cindy & Co for the 7 weeks of level 3 & 4 lock-down they imposed on me, which I couldn't drive my car anywhere, yet had pre-paid my rego & warrant in order to do so...