curious Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 9 minutes ago, priceless said: HRNZ will not own it.Rangiora Harness Club will. Do they have the funds to buy out the CJC "interest"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
priceless Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Who knows !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 10 minutes ago, priceless said: Who knows !! If they don't or don't want to, who else would buy it? Or, could a sale be forced by the CJC? As Reefton reported the CJC still owes the NCRC 962,000; They also owe Amberley RC, 365,000; Hororata RC, 53,000; Riccarton Turf Club, 66,000 (round figures). So, if the 7/12 interest in Rangiora is sold where does the money go? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
priceless Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 I am sure the RHC will want it.Maybe the money owed should go back to the clubs as they are not disbanded.Going back to this land grab,would NZTR be able to sell up/mortgage the % owned by the freehold clubs ??There appears to be quite a few that are part freehold and this could be another can of worms.Clubs need to be looking at the constution and working out how they can protect themselves or at the very least look after the community.Clubs in various areas need to get together and try to work through this as if NZTR gets their hands on it they will piss it up against the wall and will proberbly give themselves a pay rise !!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 1 hour ago, priceless said: HRNZ will not own it.Rangiora Harness Club will. If Winston gets legislation to nationalise the galloping courses at the same time they will do the same for harness racing you can guarantee. He will only want to do this once and he is implementing what he considers to be the intent of the racing act. Why would he only do it for the galloping code? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 35 minutes ago, priceless said: I am sure the RHC will want it.Maybe the money owed should go back to the clubs as they are not disbanded.Going back to this land grab,would NZTR be able to sell up/mortgage the % owned by the freehold clubs ??There appears to be quite a few that are part freehold and this could be another can of worms.Clubs need to be looking at the constution and working out how they can protect themselves or at the very least look after the community.Clubs in various areas need to get together and try to work through this as if NZTR gets their hands on it they will piss it up against the wall and will proberbly give themselves a pay rise !!! Wanting it is one thing. Having the money to get it or having access to that sort of funding is another. I would be astounded if that Club has that sort of dosh and if they do where did it come from? Anyway as I say it will be HRNZ. And no you can't mortgage a share in a piece of land. You would need agreement from all owners to mortgage it Edited September 1, 2018 by Reefton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 25 minutes ago, Reefton said: Wanting it is one thing. Having the money to get it or having access to that sort of funding is another. I would be astounded if that Club has that sort of dosh and if they do where did it come from? Anyway as I say it will be HRNZ. And no you can't mortgage a share in a piece of land. You would need agreement from all owners to mortgage it According to the Messiah report, that is exactly what they propose... A significant benefit of vesting the ownership of freehold racecourse land in NZTR is that it would place NZTR in a position where it should be able to obtain a loan or loans secured by the freehold land to fund the proposed racing and facilities infrastructure expenditure up until the time the freehold land of closed racecourses is sold and proceeds received. Edited September 1, 2018 by curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justamugpunter Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 3 hours ago, curious said: That's the proposal. To write into the Act that title to all thoroughbred racecourses and training facilities currently owned freehold by Race Clubs and also ownership of all net assets be transferred to NZTR. Scary indeed! Winnies always been a Communist? hasn't he! well he has be seen drinking with a few!! ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 10 hours ago, curious said: According to the Messiah report, that is exactly what they propose... A significant benefit of vesting the ownership of freehold racecourse land in NZTR is that it would place NZTR in a position where it should be able to obtain a loan or loans secured by the freehold land to fund the proposed racing and facilities infrastructure expenditure up until the time the freehold land of closed racecourses is sold and proceeds received. Borrowing against it is different to mortgaging it. You couldn't mortgage it without the agreement of the other owner. The bank might lend to NZTR with a general security over its assets but would not mortgage property unless the other owner agreed. All a general security would mean is a higher interest rate. And the really worrying thing - given its track record do you really want NZTR undertaking large scale borrowing? That would be like putting Winnie in charge of the liquor cabinet. Edited September 1, 2018 by Reefton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Hell, no....given its track record I'd be suss about allowing it to manage anything, not just money matters. But taking this on a bit, if a new body is to be created - i.e.Racing NZ - will the code bodies [ NZTR, HRNZ, GRNZ] remain in their present form, or will they be remodelled as well? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxie Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Any word on how NZTR and Te Rapa are going to fix their sandy track? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 2 minutes ago, Boxie said: Any word on how NZTR and Te Rapa are going to fix their sandy track? They are planning that the Reefton Jockey Club is going to (not voluntarily) fix it for them 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boxie Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 What annoys me most is all the BS about amenities and facilities that need to be upgraded. The focus should be on racing surfaces. That is where the quality punting product starts from. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Boxie said: What annoys me most is all the BS about amenities and facilities that need to be upgraded. The focus should be on racing surfaces. That is where the quality punting product starts from. Yep you're exactly right, in fact I'm of the opinion you only need your premier tracks to have excellent facilities the rest that are mostly running industry race days and are for TV races or summer festival are a different experience altogether, but lets face it this is just BS to get through what they want to. I don't imagine crowd attendances will increase outside of the norm at any of these locations due to track closures, they are alienating a whole bunch of future punters,racegoers , breeders and communities with these closures , I believe racing is going to become even less relevant than it is today(that's hard to believe) in this country if these recommendations take effect. Edited September 1, 2018 by Huey 1 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 13 hours ago, priceless said: I am sure the RHC will want it.Maybe the money owed should go back to the clubs as they are not disbanded.Going back to this land grab,would NZTR be able to sell up/mortgage the % owned by the freehold clubs ??There appears to be quite a few that are part freehold and this could be another can of worms.Clubs need to be looking at the constution and working out how they can protect themselves or at the very least look after the community.Clubs in various areas need to get together and try to work through this as if NZTR gets their hands on it they will piss it up against the wall and will proberbly give themselves a pay rise !!! Don't worry they are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Huey said: Yep you're exactly right, in fact I'm of the opinion you only need your premier tracks to have excellent facilities the rest that are mostly running industry race days and are for TV races or summer festival are a different experience altogether, but lets face it this is just BS to get through what they want to. I don't imagine crowd attendances will increase outside of the norm at any of these locations due to track closures, they are alienating a whole bunch of future punters,racegoers , breeders and communities with these closures , I believe racing is going to become even less relevant than it is today(that's hard to believe) in this country if these recommendations take effect. Of course only the elite tracks need the facilities. The three 'rogue' southern tracks to be retained Kumara Waikouaiti and Cromwell - all rat shit facilities but all run huge days that attract masses of once a year race goers. Ironically improving the facilities might actually bugger the day. The breeding fraternity need to accept that racing has become international and that like every thing international NZ cannot keep up. The sales are massively propped up by Aussie bred horses and we really only have one commercial stallion any more. When he goes that will be the end of that. You only need to look at the metro racing results form Aussie any weekend - 20 years ago there would be three or four NZ winners per meeting now there might be one if that. 20 years ago the Star Kingdom line was the only thing anyone was interested in in Aussie - how often do you hear it mentioned now? Coolmore and Godolphin rule the world and that is that. Sure Coolmore deigns to shuttle one or two here but if say Charm Spirit takes off as a sire how long do you think he will shuttle to Windsor Park? If Winx had been a colt what chance of NZ competing for the stud rights? - they could not even get Dundeel. But say we were the world's elite racing locality. Well let's draw a comparison with he one sporting endeavour in which we are - rugby. The Crusaders are the numero uno 'club' team in the world but do you see packed stands every week - no of course not and even Eden Park only fills for AB's tests. They couldn't even get AMI chocka for the final for God's sake! Rugby is about TV rights and racing is about TV as well. Other than ten times a year forget about on course. And don't think oncourse is the bee all and end all in Aussie either. I was there on QE II day and while the crowd was big with the very best in the world and the stakes to match it was not thronging despite the PR. As I said to a non racing friend who was with us in that Theatre of the Horse as we waited for the horses - without Winx there would be 100 people here not the 2000 that made us feel like the Christians in the Lions den. And as for their venues they have retained - well generally they cannot handle the racing they have now and you can spend what you want - you won't bring him up to standard because it is impossible. Build the cavernous facilities and nine days out of ten they will only produce echos. Clearly the breeders are struggling to accept their new found irrelevance in the world. Santa Claus Peters can do what he wants - he won't change that. And if the truth about the costs of racehorse ownership becomes public knowledge well shut the gate. David Ellis can spin stories about every horse he ever brought being a champion and his owners (usually a retired schoolteacher) who has had three horse shares for three group one winners but the reality is painfully different. What needs to happen is an acceptance of our place in the world. A real strong look a the funding source (ie hack out the deadwood at Parnell and Petone), get some accountability to the stakeholders but unless the government is prepared to stump up (which is a forlorn hope) the status quo is where we are at to stay. Edited September 1, 2018 by Reefton 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 Not sure I agree with you 100% Reefton. Four NZ breds won at Caulfield and one at Randwick yesterday. At least two of those had NZ ownership. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 1, 2018 Share Posted September 1, 2018 4 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Not sure I agree with you 100% Reefton. Four NZ breds won at Caulfield and one at Randwick yesterday. At least two of those had NZ ownership. The exception doesn't prove the rule CS. Without even looking one of those caulfield winners was also by a stallion who didn't stand here wasn't he (Teo filo?) Check it over a period of time and also I might add there is an ominous lessening of NZ breeding influence in Asia as well. At some time in life we all have to accept our place in the scheme of things and those guys need to accept that. It's life - it might be hard to stomach but it is life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reefton Posted September 2, 2018 Share Posted September 2, 2018 20 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Not sure I agree with you 100% Reefton. Four NZ breds won at Caulfield and one at Randwick yesterday. At least two of those had NZ ownership. Just had a look at that - I assume the High Chaparal one in Melbourne was nz bred? If so he proves the what I am saying about Coolmore soon repatriating a winning stallion. But in the two weeks before there were 4 nz bred winners at the two meetings each saturday (being horses by NZ domiciled stallions). It's like living in rural NZ - sooner or later you will get shat on. If you choose to live there your call but accept it as a cost of doing so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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