Chief Stipe

Part of the problem with all the critics is they don't understand that one particular race turnover doeen't need to fund that race's stake. That's a @TAB For Ever cost accountant approach.

How much more? What are HRNZ contributing to the Slot races? Aka the Sweepstake races. For those of us that are really old that's what we all race for 100 years ago. My horse vs your horse and what would you punt to beat it.

Are they putting in more or less?

I see on the other channel run by @Pete Lane and @Comic Dog that there is a Topic critiquing the David Ellis yearling purchases being sold as broodmares yesterday at the Gold Coast National Broodmare Sale 2025. I will write an opinion piece on this in due course. But as some of you know I have an indirect connection to The Victress - I actually recommended to a friend that they purchase a share in the Te Akau syndicate that she was a part of. A bit of a long story but due to coincidence I was somewhat goaded into promoting the horse by @Reefton - more on that later. I said to the friend the purchase was in a filly that at the end of the day would have some residual value so everything was not lost if she didn't perform. The Victress still won two races and showed a lot of promise on the training track but unfortunately couldn't or wouldn't transfer that talent to the race track. So in terms of money invested a loss but... All was not lost however as The Victress came as a package (MM Fillys Breeding Syndicate) and my friend has been very fortunate to have won 4 group races including a Group 1 with the other filly. With their first horse I might add. One of many highlights for them was watching The Victress win her first start at a beautiful and friendly racecourse named Te Aroha. More to come...racing is all about mitigating your investment risk. Good luck to Zorrah in the breeding barn.

You are the one with the beef about racehorses masquerading as ponies in Pony Scurry's. Name the racehorse and its height.

@Huey according to the rules it is 14.2h or less. Name the racehorse and its breeding and its height that is in the Pony Scurry as a pony?

Just a minor point. Slot onwers are not necessarily the owners of the horses that race in the slots. Some slots are owned by Trainers, some by Studs and in rare cases speculating investors. Although the horses may appear to race for large amounts in some cases they only get a percentage of those winnings because the majority goes to the slot owner. Yes a winning horse slot holder might very well be the same person who owns a horse.

ATC members vote against sale of Rosehill Gardens www.racenet.com.au Rosehill Gardens racecourse will not be sold after the 11,500 members of the Australian Turf Club (ATC) today voted against the $5 billion deal. The final vote count was 56.1 per cent ‘No' while 43.9 per cent of the membership voted ‘Yes' with the motion therefore being defeated Of the 11,500 strong membership, 7864 voted on the sale proposal. The decision has been immediately condemned by Western Sydney leaders as a huge loss for Sydney which will miss out on a new 25,000 home suburb that would have eased the housing crisis. ATC chairman Peter McGauran's last ditch appeal to members to vote for the "once in a lifetime opportunity" to secure the future of racing in NSW for the next century failed to persuade the ATC members. ATC members arriving at Randwick to vote on the Rosehill sale proposal Picture: Jeremy Piper NSW Premier Chris Minns had warned there was "only one opportunity" to sell the land while there was still time to build a Metro station to service the new community. "The train line and a station can only be built once," he warned. "Without the Metro station the value of the racecourse is a fraction of the $5 billion on offer with some estimates as low as $300 million." Before the result was announced, Premier Chris Minns told ABC Radio: "I would be disappointed … if the vote went down. "I thought this would be a good step forward for Sydney … thousands of homes for young Australians. But I'd have to accept the decision of ATC members. NSW Premier Chris Minns Picture: Christian Gilles / NewsWire "We're going to have to take chances, even controversial decisions when it comes to housing in Sydney. We've got the second most expensive city in the world, yet by most measures we're the 800th densest city in the world." Ahead of the vote, Mr McGauran had argued the sale should go ahead to secure the future of the industry for the next century in the face of falling ATC membership and attendances at Rosehill. "We cannot bury our heads in the sand, we have lost 20 per cent of our membership over the last five years and crowds at Rosehill have fallen by 50 per cent in the last 10 years," he said before the vote. Australian Turf Club chairman Peter McGauran Picture: Bradley Photos Had the sale gone ahead the ATC would have spent $800 million upgrading Warwick Farm racecourse to Group One status with a new grandstand, training tracks, stables and barns for 1,000 horses. Instead members have sided with a vocal Save Rosehill campaign that was backed by prominent trainers including Gai Waterhouse and Peter Snowden, who incorrectly said no firm figure had been put on the deal. David Borger, Executive Director of Business Western Sydney and Chair of the Housing Now! Alliance, said "the broader community interest has not prevailed in this decision". "We've lost the gift of building a new city in the middle of Sydney and that's disappointing," he said. "It breaks your heart to think that such a massive opportunity to get kids into the housing market, to create new supply to deal with the crisis we're facing … could just sail by. Executive Director of Business Western Sydney David Borger has condemned the decision not to proceed with the sale of Rosehill Gardens Picture: Jonathan Ng "Young people already feel locked out. They don't feel like they've got a stake in this city anymore when they can't even afford to rent or buy a house." Borger also warned how the $5 billion price tag for Rosehill would vanish along with the proposed Metro station if a sale was revisited down the track. "Because of traffic nightmares (caused by the lack of a Metro) you would never get approval to do more than something very modest there," he said.

Not prepared to yet but given the sleuth that you are I would have thought by putting the responses from two forums together you would have joined the dots.

Fails the age and height test. Actually fails the sniff test as well.

How many racehorses are shorter than 14.2h? As an aside can you name one that won a decent race?

This one is interesting. https://raptors.co.nz/product/lot-992-karaka-yearling-sales-2024/ Bought for $20k but the lease shares are being sold based on an $80k price. 15% commission on prize money. $39.90 (half price) per 1%/monthly fee. https://www.nzb.co.nz/sales/24kbb/992 No trainer registered at NZTR. Supposedly a rising 3yr old colt. Perhaps their website is put of date.

Rosehill sale vote: Australian Turf Club meeting reveals result www.racenet.com.au To sell or not to sell, that is the question. The Australian Turf Club's proposal to sell Rosehill Gardens racecourse for a reported $5 billion to make way for 25,000 new homes will be determined by the club's 11,000-plus members on Tuesday. This is a defining moment for Sydney and NSW racing. It is up to the members to decide the fate of Rosehill, the home of the Golden Slipper. Rosehill is a historic venue and all the greats of Australian racing like Phar Lap, Tulloch, Bernborough, Todman, Vain, Luskin Star, Manikato, Kingston Town, Octagonal, Lonhro, Makybe Diva and Winx won major races there. But only 12,111 attended the Golden Slipper earlier this year and less than 100,000 people came to Rosehill meetings during the 2023-24 season. This is a disturbing decline in race day crowds given 191,671 came through the turnstiles in 2012-13. So, if this issue is not burdensome enough already for members, they also have to work out what is fact or fiction from what has been a very robust and often heated debate from proponents of the Yes and No votes. There have been so many claims and counterclaims from both sides of the argument that it has become increasingly difficult to work out what is right or wrong. ATC chairman Peter McGauran has said if members vote to sell Rosehill it will secure the future of Sydney racing. "We believe it is the biggest and most important decision in the history of the club,'' McGauran said. "It will make us the most financially secure race club in the world.'' Marhoona (green and white silks) wins the 2025 Golden Slipper at Rosehill. Picture: Bradley Photos • ATC tees off on Penrith golf course plan for new track in Sydney's west But Hall of Fame trainer Gai Waterhouse has led the charge against the sale, urging members to vote "No". "Members still have no definitive proposal of any sort to justify a sale,'' Waterhouse wrote on social media earlier this month. "Warwick Farm is unsuitable, there is no supporting evidence to say a track can be built, and if ‘yes' wins then voting members lose all control of Rosehill. We may as well throw our betting tickets away.'' ATC expects at least half of the club's membership base of nearly 11,500 to vote on the issue. The "no" vote is favourite with the Save Rosehill group having the support of many leading industry participants. But if members vote in favour of selling Rosehill, the land will be used to build 25,000 new homes while ATC has unveiled plans to redevelop Warwick Farm and build a new training facility near Penrith which has the potential to also to be a Group 1 racetrack. The $5 billion sale price is a one-off and is dependent on a decision being made in time for the NSW Government to build a new Metro station to service the homes that would be built on the racecourse land. In an endeavour to provide some clarity for those members still trying to decide how they will vote on Tuesday, this is a snapshot of the most pressing issues concerning the Rosehill sale proposal. 1: What does selling Rosehill mean for Sydney racing? If Rosehill is sold, ATC has stipulated racing will continue at the track until at least 2031. During this period, $800 million will be spent on transforming Warwick Farm, $520 million on upgrading stabling facilities and other infrastructure at Royal Randwick, and another $520 million allocated to building the training centre at Penrith. In total, $1.9 million will be spent on various infrastructure projects with the remaining $3 billion invested into a Future Fund. 2: Is the $5 billion guaranteed if Rosehill is sold? The resolution to sell Rosehill ensures that the deal will only proceed if the State Government agrees to pay ATC a net of $5 billion. Payment will be secured through a legally binding contract with the NSW Government, which will provide a mechanism to safeguard payment. 3: Who will have control of the funds? The ATC owns Rosehill Gardens and has stipulated it will retain complete legal and financial control over every dollar if the sale goes ahead. Racing NSW has provided written confirmation to the ATC that it will not seek to recover any of the net $5 billion in sale proceeds. 4: Is Warwick Farm a suitable and viable alternative to Rosehill? Under the ATC masterplan, Warwick Farm will undergo an $800 million transformation, including flood proofing, and a completely new racetrack and grandstand. At 87 hectares, it is vastly larger than Rosehill Gardens (60 hectares). 5: Is there a transition plan for trainers if Rosehill is sold? This is one of the most difficult aspects of the sale proposal as any potential sale of Rosehill and rebuild of Warwick Farm will directly impact trainers and their stable staff. ATC has vowed to work individually with all trainers on transition plans with the consultation period to last at least 12 months. No trainers at either Warwick Farm or Rosehill Gardens will be relocated for at least two years and the new Racing Advisory Board is there to provide advice and input on transition plans. 6: ATC's loyalty program for members The ATC is planning to introduce a loyalty program for members funded by proceeds from the proposed sale. Critics have described as a "gimmick or bribe" while the club is hoping to use the program to increase club membership and what have been poor race-day attendances. The Loyalty program will provide free annual membership fees for five years, free annual membership for life for those members who already have been at the club for 20 or more years, and $1000 per annum food and beverage credits for five years.

Oh dear the Pony Conspiracy continues.

Why isn't it a pony race?

Media Release - Greyhounds starts judicial review proceedings 26 May 2025 MEDIA RELEASE Greyhounds starts judicial review proceedings Greyhound Racing New Zealand (GRNZ) has today applied, through its Counsel to the High Court, for a Judicial Review of the Government’s decision to ban greyhound racing from 31 July 2026. The statement of claim made to the Court says the decision broke fundamental rules of law, being inadequately informed, prepared and consulted on. There were only a few short steps from the Minister for Racing seeking a report in June 2024 on banning the sport, to the Cabinet deciding to do so in December 2024. The Cabinet paper produced by the Department of Internal Affairs (DIA) focused on animal welfare but was selective in its use of reports from the Racing Integrity Board (RIB) and included no information from the National Animal Welfare Advisory Committee (NAWAC). For example, an RIB November 2024 report stated that GRNZ met welfare standards, often better than other animal sports or greyhound racing worldwide, but this information was left out of the DIA report and Cabinet paper. GRNZ’s application says there was a duty, promise and expectation to consult with GRNZ on the decision which never happened, despite a history of constructive engagement on animal welfare. GRNZ CEO Edward Rennell said “the organisation had decided on a judicial review to expose the Government’s cavalier attitude to policymaking adversely impacting the livelihoods of thousands. “This was a Cabinet paper from public officials who had made up their minds, for a Prime Minister who had made up his mind and stated it publicly. “The Government took its decision too lightly and too quickly, without due care and due diligence. It was a rushed and inadequate Cabinet paper. “This is an injustice to greyhound breeders, owners, trainers and all other industry participants, as well as a dereliction of duty to New Zealanders. “Decisions that impact the lives and livelihoods of people must be extremely well articulated and evidenced. This decision was not, highlighting an emerging pattern of short-cutting in policymaking. New Zealand deserves better.” Edward Rennell said. Case explainer The GRNZ statement of claim under the Judicial Review Procedure Act 2016: • The essence of the GRNZ case is that the way the Cabinet decision to ban Greyhound racing was reached and the decision itself broke many fundamental rules of administrative law. • It is rare to challenge a Cabinet decision, but the decision-making process was so inadequate and erroneous that it warrants judicial intervention. • It clarifies that the Cabinet decision was a ‘reviewable decision’ under the Judicial Review Procedure Act 2016. • The first cause of action was the failure to consult. GRNZ says consultation is a legal duty that arose from being promised to Greyhound Racing, and because of the hugely significant implications to the detriment of many hundreds of hardworking New Zealanders. The Department of Internal Affairs officials said no decision would be made without Greyhound Racing being consulted – but it did not happen. • The second cause of action is legitimate expectation. A legitimate expectation about a certain process can be established by what has been said or done by a decision maker. GRNZ says DIA’s course of conduct since 2021 created a legitimate expectation that the industry would be able to make submissions on any proposed ban. • The third point is that the process broke all the rules about procedural fairness. Decisionmakers must act reasonably to ensure the process undertaken is fair and not a foregone conclusion. That has not happened here. • The fourth and fifth causes of action deal with the failure to make relevant considerations. Either the Minister was unaware of the development of the Cabinet paper and the background circumstances, or the Minister knew exactly what was going on and was instrumental in its sign-off and presentation. The fourth cause of action says that if the Minister was unaware, then the officials failed by not bringing to the Minister’s attention certain key relevant considerations The fifth cause of action proceeds on the basis that the Minister did know what was going on. • Interim Relief. GRNZ is applying for ‘interim relief’ – a Court order to stop the Crown working on the ban (via the Ministerial Advisory Committee) while the judicial review is undertaken. No further steps to give effect to the ban should be taken unless and until the Court has had an opportunity of scrutinising the claim. /Ends

You need to be on the inside @Brodie https://simplywall.st/stocks/gb/consumer-services/lse-ent/entain-shares/news/insider-stock-buying-reaches-uk297m-on-entain

I researched a couple of these horse at Raptors. The actual purchase price is nearly double the actual price from the yearling or R2R sales. The % available is also described as a Lease not actually a ownership share. In most cases the current syndicates are full ownership shares not leases. Raptors charges $39.90 (half price) per 1% lease share per month and takes 25% of any stakes won. Presumably that is over and above trainer and jockey %.

Perhaps but we don't have all the information for the decision. As many have said on BOAY the programming in the South Island especially Riccarton isn't much chop. I wouldn't have backed for similar reasons you did however one of the factors was the experience of a 4kg claimer on a horse drawn very akwardly for the conditions. Observing the video a couple times I felt the horse was never travelling well to make up the extra ground that it would have had to.

Right you didn't back it yet you felt motivated to bag a young 4kg claimer aprentice Jockey? What you actually ARE a betting analyst? Then you would have realised that the horse wasn't a value bet. You obviously give three shits. You win. Yep one from the @Pete Lane playbook. But keep it personal - I'm not. Other than upsetting your feelings by inferring you were a "betting analyst"! Touchy. She rode it exactly the same way as she did the previous start when it rang second at Riccarton. The difference being it drew wider and the track was better than the notified Rating of a Heavy 10 at Riccarton. She didn't sit on the horse as a dead weight (hyperbole). I gather you wanted her to flog the shyte out of the horse or ride it with heaps more vigour but given no one but her was riding the horse we have to accept that the horse wasn't actually travelling that well. I also gather you wanted her to lose ground and move wider on the course when able and then presumably make up that ground and...win? Oh Ok you are crusading for the punters by bagging the ride on a horse you didn't back. Makes sense... So do you know the disgruntled owners you quoted?

LOL. You have a short memory. It was only a few weeks ago you were complaining to me that @Comic Dog was calling you all the names that Leo used to call you like Sunloon Boy etc. I laughed and told you that he wasn't original enough to come up with his own insults which you laughed at!

LOL really? You don't feel sorry for anyone as evident from the toxicity in your posts.

You never were "bothered" you just used to drive by occasionally and lob the odd grenade or more like a smart arse comment. Clear what your motive was. I actually told a few members months and months ago what you were up to. You tell your new mate @Comic Dog what I told you and @hesi when you wanted to use personal messenger on RaceCafe to attract members here. I'll remind you - I said "do what you want but I neither condone nor want any part of it". LOL didn't think you'd do it again when you both set up the third channel!

The horse issue is a big one. In the past abandonments have helped. It does look like they might be trying to scavenge Harness racing do you think?

There we go ladies and gentlemen - that post is what you call a "toxic post". You can imagine how things will be run elsewhere! BTW Wightman and @Thomass are still welcome here but you have publicaly announced they are "not welcome on any forum I manage".