Chief Stipe

Godsen seems to prefer Turf to AWT going by the statistics of where he starts his horses. Also Godsen has a wide variety of surfaces to train on that would be the envy of any Australasian stable. Enable had 19 starts only three on AWT. She was beaten only 4 times with two of those losses the next race after running on an AWT. The surfaces were reported as "Standard to Slow" so obviously rain affected. She raced twice at Kempton Park (AWT) which is interesting. It is a Polytrack that cost $19 million pounds to build and recently has been costing $250k pounds a year to maintain. They also invested in an irrigation system to keep the track temperature down and to not allow it to get too hard and to prevent kick back. Apparently we have the new state of the art versions which are cheaper and don't need watering! The track was built by the same firm that is building NZ's. They stated in 2011: Large volumes of water needed to produce the ideal all-weather going necessitated investment in a state of the art irrigation system, which uses a high capacity ring main fed from a borehole with a 86 cu.m licence via powerful pumps to Briggs reels and booms. The irrigation system can put 25mm of water on the entire track in forty-eight hours, which also benefits the turf course. The surface itself was commissioned from Martin Collins Enterprises and is a new generation Polytrack mix of sixty-three percent silica sand, recycled materials and binding waxes. "Water is added to give 'life' to the surface - in direct contrast to turf, the warmer and dryer it gets, the slower the going - and to prevent 'kickback' which is uncomfortable for horses and riders. Our maintenance programme is dictated by the air temperature and moisture - the material also generates heat and, with an air temperature of 22OC, the ground temperature can be 48OC, so the aim is to get water on and keep it to a temperature of around 20OC," explains Barney. https://www.amenity.co.uk/news-media/all-weather-racing-a-success-story-at-kempton-park.html The Kempton AWT was "refurbished" only 5 years after installation: https://www.thejockeyclub.co.uk/kempton/media/press-releases/2016/07/kempton-park-completes-latest-all-weather-refurbishment1/

"Tar And Cement" probably describes the AWT!

I can corroborate that Brodie has been a very successful punter and is restricted because of it. As for spending time on BOAY well the same question could be asked of anyone who follows social media.

You've contradicted yourself. On the one hand you admit bias then proclaim it to be scientific evidence. It is neither scientific nor evidence.

Rule Number(s): 642(1)Folllowing the running of Race 3, "The Bidding Ends at 3pm on Gavelhouse Plus 3yo" an Information was filed by Mr Marsh instigating a protest pursuant to Rule 642(1). The Informant alleged that the horse CAPTAIN TOM provisionally placed 1st by the Judge interfered with the chances of DARCI DIVA placed ... (Feed generated with FetchRSS)View the full article

Lead tends to slow you down.

What the hell are you on about Forbury?

For a start the second study was an analysis of Stewards reports which are subjective in themselves. They also compared the non-whip races ridden by Apprentices vs whip races ridden by some Apprentices and fully fledged Jockey's.

Spot the flaws in the research methodology.

We were talking about banning whips completely. However the rules vary between jurisdictions. These are the rules in the UK: https://www.thepja.co.uk/service/whip-use/#:~:text=Whip Rules,whip in some other way. UK Whip Rules The permitted number of uses of the whip with hands off the reins is 7 times for Flat races and 8 times for Jumps race. Stewards will consider whether to hold an enquiry if a rider has used his whip 8 times or more in a Flat race or 9 times or more in a Jump race or misused the whip in some other way. When deciding whether or not to hold an enquiry, Stewards will consider how the rider has used the whip during the course of the entire race, with particular attention to its use in the closing stages, and relevant factors such as: The manner in which the whip was used, including the degree of force The purpose for which the whip was used The distance over which the whip was used and whether the number of times it was used was reasonable and necessary Whether the horse was continuing to respond. Provided that the manner in which the whip had been used was measured, Stewards may choose to disregard occasions when the whip has been used in the following circumstances: All Races To keep a horse in contention or to maintain a challenging position prior to what would be considered the closing stages of a race To maintain a horse’s focus and concentration To correct a horse that is noticeably hanging Where there is only light contact with the horse Jump Races Following a mistake at an obstacle To correct a horse that is running down an obstacle. Stewards may be less tolerant about should a rider use the whip 8 times or more in a Flat race or 9 times or more in a Jump race: When the horse is young or inexperienced When a rider continues to use the whip when not being directly challenged for a finishing position When a rider fails to recognise that his use of the whip is not having the intended effect.

Did you get Black Balled from the BGP Thomarse?

Geez you are the master of obfuscation! I asked for links to the science that show horses experience pain. Once you have done that can you then provide us with some evidence that there is a causative link between the whip, pain and horses going faster. With regard to your "Dan the Punting Expert" - can you provide us with links to his data that provides evidence to support his assertion that whipping makes horses go faster.

I mean "scientific research" not some punter's musings!

I said Matamata but you asked for a race meeting not a trial meeting. As mentioned in another thread most of the Cambridge trainers pitched up at Matamata instead of the their own AWT.

What's your point? At least Hart tendered for the purchase of Government Print which like a lot of Government "assets" at the time was underperforming in terms of return on capital. Hart paid the Government $12m for it. Compare that to the steal by NZ Racing of $100m in handouts from the Government in the last 12 months alone! I don't see NZ Racing multiplying that "investment" by a comparable amount to what Hart has done! More than likely they'll be back within a year asking for more!

What's the point when the main racing surface is stuffed? If Riccarton trainers are taking their horses elsewhere at the moment to gallop them what does that tell you about the main turf track? Where is the funding coming from to fix that? Is there a strategic plan to do that? Or will Riccarton become solely an AWT racing venue?

Nor is the PGF the complete funder of any of the three. Up to $6m needs to be found from the each club. That $6m would have gone a long way to fix the Riccarton Turf track which as you know is a complete disaster zone at the moment. We have traversed the Cambridge Jockey Club AWT funding at length before. The Cambridge Jockey Club is not the majority funder of their AWT the PGF is. NZTR underwrote them initially by $400k so they could secure funding. If the cost exceeded $12.7m then NZTR promised to pitch up with $700k. Will be interesting to see in the accounts what the transactions ended up being unless of course if they are hidden within a particular account. If anyone could have funded their own AWT it was the Cambridge Jockey Club with the number of horses that are trained there - 1,200. Not only did they not completely fund it they ended up turning their "training facility" into a new racing venue!

You still haven't posted any links to any reputable research.

Rule Number(s): Rule 638(3)(b)(ii)Following the running of the DUNSTAN HORSEFEEDS 1600 an Information was lodged by Senior Stipendiary Steward Mr M Williamson against Rider Mr S Weatherley alleging that Mr Weatherley (the Rider of WATCH THIS SPACE) used his whip excessively prior to the 100 metres mark. Rule 638(3)(b)(ii) provides : ... (Feed generated with FetchRSS)View the full article

Hardly a gift. It wasn't exactly a profitable business at the time. He borrowed $12m to buy it - sold it. Invested elsewhere and is now worth $12 Billion. I guess he didn't invest in racehorses or All Weather Tracks.

Ash Vegas?

From my personal perspective it isnt about supporting a particular party it is about supporting what works. At the moment NZ'S political party's are just playing the polls.

Well this Government is coming for it.

Well it is going to get a whole lot worse. So how bad was your "life" under National?

NO! Under a Labour Government?!