Horseboy

Do we need 50 something race tracks?

Racing NZ is a forum that all three codes sit on. NZTR will still exist as will the other two code bodies, they will take over all functions from the NZRB that are not considered directly related to wagering/broadcasting. Racing NZ will likely be where the codes come together and work on issues of shared importance (calendar, Wagering NZ oversight etc etc). NZTR however will still have full autonomy over the Thoroughbred Code and under the new setup will have a significantly greatly independence over the codes administration. well that's how i read it anyway...

i think you have misunderstood the purpose of Rita if you believe it will make NZTR defunct.

Didn't they bet through the tote? Why would the tab restrict that if they did and how was that different from any other on course betting syndicate like punter of the year?

Question to ask. While NZRB increases amount of account holders, what is the change in the average profit per account? I would almost guarantee that all these new accounts are just people having a go with their free $5 bet the TAB pump out or $20 sign up bonus.

While everyone harps on about tracks they are missing the biggest win out of the Messara Report. Restructuring. Right now when something goes wrong who is to blame? Well half was done by NZRB that was a function historically delegated to them by NZTR, but NZTR was still involved in the process of consultation and as the major stakeholder should have carried alot of weight, but the reality was that NZRB didn't actually have to listen to them because the only person they are accountable to was a board of suits appointed by polly from wellington who doesn't give a rats arse about racing. This has been the structure for 15 years. Restructuring won't fix everything right away, but the closer to the coal face and accountable that bodies actually running racing are the more racing PEOPLE can actually push for change without layers of bureaucratic government monopoly insulating them. Ask yourself why haven't the trainers gone on strike when the situation and stakes are so dire? Because there is no point, the organisation that has ultimate say and holds the purse strings will just play dogs out of Australia on trackside if an NZ meeting gets canned to strike action.

jesus.. how old are you guys. I've seen less bitching on the Kardashians - not that i watch it...

Saying there is no connection from an industry sense is flawed. How many kiwi trainers, jockeys and horses will line up this saturday in Australia? There is a direct effect, a good horse wins in NZ then jumps on the first flight to Aus. This diminishes the quality of NZ fields due to our close connection with Aus racing. There is no official connection sure. But you can hardly blame a sporting code that is so closely connected from not lobbying in their own self interests.

All that matters is the make up of RITA. Will it be independent, industry experts or same-old, vested interests. Seriously, is anyone surprised NZTR put this out? The report says their stakes will double - why the hell would they not support it...

Supermarkets aren't the core business of a gambling operator. Hence why they got a Gaming license and started operating pokies to generate additional revenue. They are already doing it. I disagree it's that clear cut. Racing is the prime benefactor of the legislation, if government wants to come in and pull the rug out now then we should challenge that since it was betting on horse racing that built the initial infrastructure for sports and other betting. What assets? Last i looked successive government ministers have watched the NZRB deplete all it's cash and sell off its asset base.

How is Australian racing different from Fonterra investing in Chinese Milk Powder? If racing (historically clubs) has some form of ownership of the TAB and that organisation finds revenue sources outside local product, why does that revenue suddenly become disconnected from NZ racing?

I would argue once you remove competition or strangle it the results we have seen over the past decades are just a simple by-product. Also note that it was the Govt that essentially appointed the management of the TAB through the Minister appointing the NZRB chair. In my book that means they have to take their fair share of responsibility for the situation we are in.

And where would the industry be if the Govt didnt impose a monopoly? Air New Zealand seems to be doing better... If you reduce competition by controlling an industry as a govt then you either have to support it, or get out and let the market operate.

Of course you ask for more, you never stop stop asking. Because you want the sport to be the most successful version of itself. Do you think Rugby or Yatching roll over? No. At every opportunity they push their case and they grow from it. The alternative is the kind of self deprecating, defeatist attitude that is present in this topic. Where those who have already have had the so called 'Golden Days' are happy to roll over and give up. You should be angry, because what you are handing down to your sons, daughters and grandchildren is a shadow of what you were given.

At the time advertised TAB went live with a domestic basketball game.

If this is about the Facebook live date I'm pretty sure this is them going live at a domestic basketball game. Amazing that Facebook live has now been well and truly picked up by media across the world and our RACING board uses it showcase domestic basketball. Not live on course on a big Gr1 day to maybe talk to jockeys and trainers. No that's all behind a $80/month paywall on Sky they will say - why would we want to engage younger people anyway when we have all this great sports content they can sink their teeth into. This is the New Zealand Sports betting board after all. To the credit of long term Sports people like Glenda Hughes (just check what other directorships she has) the cunning and political manoeuvre to make this happen isn't anything short of genius, helped in large part by the fact the New Zealand racing industry lacks any real political nous to stand up and defend it's own court (basketball reference). After all Racing is just another 'sport' in their eyes, why should it get preferential treatment in any of this. However maybe at the 11th hour we will save our own skins and the DIA sports takeover that John Allen, Hughes and the National Party slipped into the Race Fields legislation will be stopped by Messara and the govt. I wonder how many racing folk realise just how close we came to this..

The same generation that loves knock outs and bloodsport in the UFC? but then i guess racing doesn't have the same marketing does it..

I think all the codes and the TAB are getting so thoroughly pantsed by other sports/entertainment options/offshore bookies , especially in the market for new/younger entrants that it's amazing a full scale review wasn't done 5 years ago. That's my point, it doesn't indicate any ulterior motives. But Peters has on multiple occasions indicated the outcome of the review would look to ensure all codes have a good outcome. This just seems like typical fear mongering and division stoking. Let's wait for the report.

Can someone point out how the words 'particular emphasis' clearly show intent to create a model that benefits TB at the expense of others codes? Maybe if TB is performing as poorly as you state that is the reason the Minister is asking for particular emphasis is given to finding a solution to these problems?

Then the codes are trustees, call it what you like but the govt has obligations to the racing codes. The TAB isn't a monopoly provider, they just have the only right to operate stores and advertise in NZ. It would still make sense to have all betting handled through a single provider, this may mean that in the future the NZ TAB would be given the ability to issue licences to off shore bookies to promote and advertise within NZ under certain guidelines, but it is still better for NZ to maintain a centralised control and authority.

Not maintaining a betting monopoly would be a bad financial move for a country of our size and scope. Hong Kong controls everything that comes in and out because that is the best way. The best model is code independence (with multiple functions currently handled by NZRB handed back to the codes) with the codes still owning the TAB but outsourcing the betting infrastructure. Surely if you were a business and were given the opportunity to 1. monopolise your income streams 2. have complete oversight over the product 3. outsource infrastructure where possible.. you would grab it with both hands?

not that the whole argument about who is subsidising who really matters, it's just the in-fighting promoted by politicians and the status quo as they prefer to wrap the three codes into a neat bundle so their jobs are easier. The fact is all codes would be better off under a model where the NZRB is stripped back to its essential services and the codes have greater control. The amount of money that has been wasted within the NZRB walls over the past decade would be eye watering - and what have we got to show for it? fuck all infrastructure investment, barebones stakes, an out of date betting platform, basic APP and a broadcast platform that is light years behind international standards. Where has all the money gone? But just wait we keep getting told by accountant , followed by banker followed by bureaucrat, I can fix it, just give me 50 million and another 2 years.

Wouldn't the broadcast of Australian TB racing fall under the umbrella of NZTR under this separate model? Similar to how the rugby codes would negotiate with other jurisdictions for tri-nations etc. NZTR would handle the broadcast of International TB racing into NZ. It makes sense since the amount of NZ trainers and horses that operate or raid across the tasman. If this is the case your claim that dogs are subsidising NZ gallops would be way out, Australian TB racing would be one of the biggest racing products in NZ and if owned by TB would be subsidising the other codes?

I notice no one in this thread has indicated any policy or detail that they were expecting in this budget, just that 'something' should have been given to racing? The 10 points i can find here: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/sport/news/article.cfm?c_id=4&objectid=11922050 1. Return a greater proportion of industry taxation to the racing codes. 2. Introduce a new (below Premier Meeting) category of meeting where every race will be for $15,000 minimum, with relativity across the codes. 3. Enhance employment and export opportunities by working with the industry to improve the international status of New Zealand Group One races to attract greater international interest. 4. Restore marque racing plans and prize money initiatives in line with New Zealand First policy implementation 2005-08. 5. Introduce means policies assisting importation of quality mares and properly using the sire cost writedown. 6. Urgently review the operations and costs of the New Zealand Racing Board. (Messara) 7. Continue to support projects and initiatives, e.g. the Racing Safety Development Fund (a contestable fund of $1.5 million per annum, matching dollar for dollar contributions from racing clubs) that enhances safety and improves the quality of facilities, in the racing industry, including the safety of riders, handlers, spectators, officials and others involved in racing codes, as well as the health and safety of animals. 8. Direct IRD and Treasury to respect the spirit of the laws passed to assist racing so we do not have specious departmental interpretations of laws that are clear to the industry. (budget) 9. Further improve the appeal of the racing industry to a wider audience by encouraging the promotion of "family-friendly" activities in conjunction with race meetings in all codes. 10 .Defend the historic, modest share of the racing industry, to lawful gambling proceeds, against unreasonable attacks.