BLINKERS ON First time...what took them sooo long???

[Trojan]

2 minutes ago, All The Aces said:

That's why bringing him back to 1600m and chucking the blinkers on was a great move. Worked didn't it. 

So what worked?  Bringing him back to 1600m which is what he has won most of his races at or putting the blinkers on which he has never won with?

[All The Aces]

51 minutes ago, Trojan said:

So what worked?  Bringing him back to 1600m which is what he has won most of his races at or putting the blinkers on which he has never won with?

Well he is unbeaten in blinkers now 

 

[Thomass]

18 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

@Gammalite and @Thomass in my opinion blindfolding a horse is a desperate option.

Mr Brightside didn't need blinkers.  His form showed that.

Now the question is will he wear them next start?

@Thomass what is your recommendation?

Aren't you embarrassed to be telling professional trainers like the Hayes team "it was a desperate action"?

Fair dinkum, too much pullin' the pudding methinks

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Thomass said:

Aren't you embarrassed to be telling professional trainers like the Hayes team "it was a desperate action"?

Not at all because it wasn't the "Hayes Team" apparently it was Daddy Hayes phoning in from Hong Kong.

The point is the horse probably didn't need them.  It's form wasn't anywhere near average.

Do you think they'll run him further than 1600m ever again?  I doubt it.

[Gammalite]

1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said:

Not at all because it wasn't the "Hayes Team" apparently it was Daddy Hayes phoning in from Hong Kong.

The point is the horse probably didn't need them.  It's form wasn't anywhere near average.

Do you think they'll run him further than 1600m ever again?  I doubt it.

Not sure there is anything else they can do with that horse. The Champions Mile . The Crowning glory. A Champion in the champion. 

Won an All stars Mile too.  Mr B . mr brilliant. 

Got beat a nose by Jmac last year in the Cox Plate , only because of JMac's big whip ride on some Asian thing, so maybe he could go for the Cox Plate again Chief ?   Via Sistina too powerful this year . (she won the 2000m race again last Sat too) 

maybe you're right and with him only 4th this year in Cox,  he might just stay back at Mile racing. 

[Thomass]

So Betfair form expert Dan O'Sullivan's rating's for the week are in and he's all over Mr. B's career high ratings

His career peak being in the 2000M Cox which shows he can get further and of course if he'd had BO over the longer distance may have raced too fiercely 

We'll leave that up to the experts like Davo and Pop Col's idea that BO would work this time though

Mr Brightside had the blinkers on for the first time in his 40-start career and that may have proven a master stroke as he improved notably on his recent form to run a 104.5 rating and win the Group 1 Champions Mile, defeating Antino (103.5) by half a length.

He came off previous ratings of 100.6 in the G1 Cox Plate, 100.8 in the G1 Might And Power Stakes and 100.9 in the G2 Feehan Stakes. This improved performance ranks just below his career peak of 104.9 in the 2023 Cox Plate, where he was narrowly beaten by Romantic Warrior, and slightly above his 104.3 rating in his Group 1 Makybe Diva Stakes win the same year.

His next level of top form shows ratings of 103.8 and 103.5 multiple times. While he may not be among the highest-rated horses we've seen, Mr Brightside’s list of achievements, consistency and longevity make him a more than worthy contender for future induction into the Australian Racing Hall of Fame.

Across his 40-start career, he has claimed eight Group 1 wins (nine if the All-Star Mile is included), finished second six times (seven with the All-Star Mile), and run third twice, excelling at distances from 1400m to 2040m. Given his near career-best performance on Saturday, there’s no reason he can’t return in the Autumn with a strong chance to capture further Group 1 wins.

 

[Chief Stipe]

@Thomass it is clear you only have 4 topics at most.  Do you mind dropping a couple and imagining some new ones.  

No one likes a bore.

[Thomass]

What's really funny though...your hero's Te Akau, are MASSIVE users of BO

Stink for you I  guess??

Seriously though, drop the Trumpeske b/s and look at the SCIENCE I  provided 

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Thomass said:

What's really funny though...your hero's Te Akau, are MASSIVE users of BO

How often did Imperatriz wear them?

Te Akau don't often try them as a last resort.  For example Melody Belle raced most of her career in them.  

So your Blinkers First Time On or Off isn't a Te Akau metric to follow.

BTW the First Time Blinkers in your Super Maiden at Rosehill yesterday only ran second.  Didn't improve much.

1 hour ago, Thomass said:

Stink for you I  guess??

Seriously though, drop the Trumpeske b/s and look at the SCIENCE I  provided 

What science?  Nothing you write has any scientific evidence based research that conforms to scientific standards.  Largely it is finger in the air BS.

[Thomass]

37 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

How often did Imperatriz wear them?

Te Akau don't often try them as a last resort.  For example Melody Belle raced most of her career in them.  

So your Blinkers First Time On or Off isn't a Te Akau metric to follow.

BTW the First Time Blinkers in your Super Maiden at Rosehill yesterday only ran second.  Didn't improve much.

What science?  Nothing you write has any scientific evidence based research that conforms to scientific standards.  Largely it is finger in the air BS.

This is "finger in the air stuff"

"Perhaps but did it really make a difference?  His last 200m might have been quick but they ran 1:36 for a Grp 1 on a Good 4 track.

The maidens at Riccarton ran 0.8 of a second slower on a Soft 6!!!'

The science of professional rating's, PROFESSOR Dan is very well respected and uses algorithms you wouldn't know existed

Comparing Riccarton maiden times to Mr. B's is the stuff of lunacy and you'd be laughed out of Dan's  'cop the f on' classes 

[Chief Stipe]

15 minutes ago, Thomass said:

This is "finger in the air stuff"

"Perhaps but did it really make a difference?  His last 200m might have been quick but they ran 1:36 for a Grp 1 on a Good 4 track.

The maidens at Riccarton ran 0.8 of a second slower on a Soft 6!!!'

The science of professional rating's, PROFESSOR Dan is very well respected and uses algorithms you wouldn't know existed

Comparing Riccarton maiden times to Mr. B's is the stuff of lunacy and you'd be laughed out of Dan's  'cop the f on' classes 

Really?  I do recall you rubbishing him at one time online.  I guess things change when it suits.

Anyway you have done this topic to death for years to the point it is becoming boring regardless of any veracity to your supposition.

BTW O'Sullivan uses a rating system that I doubt takes into consideration whether blinkers are used or not.  He rates a horse on its relative performance pure and simple regardless of if it is wearing blinkers.

[Murray Fish]

groundhog day...

 

[Chief Stipe]

[Thomass]

7 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Really?  I do recall you rubbishing him at one time online.  I guess things change when it suits.

Anyway you have done this topic to death for years to the point it is becoming boring regardless of any veracity to your supposition.

BTW O'Sullivan uses a rating system that I doubt takes into consideration whether blinkers are used or not.  He rates a horse on its relative performance pure and simple regardless of if it is wearing blinkers.

#yeana

" had the blinkers on for the first time in his 40-start career and that may have proven a master stroke as he improved notably"

That's right, he observed and like horseman WILLO came to the obvious conclusion

Fair suck of the sav, let it go and admit you're way out of your depth

 

[Chief Stipe]

So answer this question:

Why didn't Daddy Hayes suggest the Blinkers before the Cox Plate?

[Murray Fish]

Is There Any Scientific Proof That Blinkers Work?

There is some scientific evidence to suggest that blinkers can be effective in helping horses maintain their focus and perform better during races or other equestrian activities.

Several studies have been conducted to investigate the effects of blinkers on horse behavior and performance, with varying results.

One study published in the Journal of Equine Veterinary Science in 2010 found that horses wearing blinkers had a reduced heart rate and were less likely to become distracted than horses without blinkers.

The study also found that horses wearing blinkers were more likely to maintain a straight line during a race and were less likely to veer off course.

Another study published in the same journal in 2016 found that horses wearing blinkers had improved performance in races and were less likely to become stressed or agitated during the race.

The study also found that blinkers had no negative effect on the horse’s vision or ability to navigate the course.

However, other studies have produced mixed results, with some finding no significant effect of blinkers on horse performance, while others have found that blinkers may have a negative effect on peripheral vision or cause discomfort or stress for some horses.

Overall, while there is some scientific evidence to support the use of blinkers for certain horses, their effectiveness can vary depending on individual horse characteristics and performance, and they should be used with caution and careful consideration by trainers and jockeys.

 

https://grandnational.horseracing.guide/416/whyhorseswearblinkers/

[Murray Fish]

If one asks Prof ChatGPT

"statistics on race horses wearing blinkers in a race?"

ChatGPT said:

ChatGPT

Blinkers are a common piece of equipment used in horse racing to help a horse focus and reduce distractions. They are a type of hood or cup that limits the horse's peripheral vision, preventing it from seeing other horses or distractions to the sides, which can sometimes cause anxiety or loss of focus.

While detailed statistics on the exact impact of blinkers on a horse's performance in races may vary by location, trainer, and horse, here are some key insights and trends from the racing industry:

1. Blinkers and Performance

• Positive Impact: For many horses, blinkers help improve focus and can prevent them from shying away from other horses or becoming distracted by their surroundings. This is especially true for horses that tend to "wander" or lose their focus during a race.
• Negative Impact: On the other hand, some horses can become overly aggressive or excitable when blinkers are applied, which might hinder their performance. Additionally, horses that are naturally calm or focused may not benefit as much from blinkers.

2. Statistical Studies

• Win Rates: Various studies and analyses suggest that horses wearing blinkers sometimes show a slight improvement in their win rate, but the effect is not always significant across all horses. Some research has found that the percentage of horses wearing blinkers that win races can be slightly higher compared to those not wearing them. However, this depends largely on the horse's temperament and history with blinkers.
• Trainer Influence: The use of blinkers often depends on the trainer's judgment. Trainers may apply blinkers to horses that have shown signs of losing focus or becoming distracted during races. The results may vary based on the skill and timing of the trainer’s decision.
• Racing Data: Some specific studies (especially in jurisdictions like the UK and US) have analyzed horses' performance data before and after blinkers are applied. Generally, horses that are first-time blinkered have a mixed performance, with some improving significantly while others performing worse.

3. Types of Blinkers and Adjustments

• Full Blinkers vs. Noseband Blinkers: There are variations in blinkers, such as "full blinkers" (which block vision to the sides) or "noseband blinkers" (which just limit vision to the sides of the nose). The type of blinker used can influence the effectiveness on a horse's performance.
• First-Time Blinkers: A first-time application of blinkers is often viewed as a "last-resort" move by trainers when a horse is showing signs of losing focus. Horses wearing blinkers for the first time can sometimes see a jump in performance, particularly if they were previously distracted or undisciplined.

4. Statistical Considerations

• According to racing statistics, horses wearing blinkers can have a higher probability of finishing in the money (top 3) compared to those not wearing them, but the difference is generally modest. For example, in some racing data sets, horses with blinkers might have a winning rate around 10–15%, compared to 8–12% for those without blinkers. The exact numbers vary significantly based on the horse's previous form, track conditions, and distance.
• Post-Blinker Stats: When horses race with blinkers for the first time, they can show a higher improvement rate in their performance stats, especially in sprint races where focus is crucial.

5. Racing Jurisdictions

• US vs. UK: The impact of blinkers on a horse's performance can vary based on the racing jurisdiction. In the UK, for example, horses wearing blinkers may have slightly different win rates than in the US, depending on the type of racing culture and training methods.

Conclusion

While blinkers can provide an advantage for some horses, they do not guarantee success. The impact largely depends on the horse’s temperament, prior experience, and the specific circumstances of each race. As such, the general consensus is that blinkers are a useful tool, but their effectiveness is far from universal.

For specific statistics, you may need to refer to data sets from a specific racing track or database like Equibase (US) or Racing Post (UK), where performance metrics for blinkered horses can be analyzed in more detail.

[Chief Stipe]

17 minutes ago, Murray Fish said:

Racing Data: Some specific studies (especially in jurisdictions like the UK and US) have analyzed horses' performance data before and after blinkers are applied. Generally, horses that are first-time blinkered have a mixed performance, with some improving significantly while others performing worse.

Who would've thought!

[Chief Stipe]

18 minutes ago, Murray Fish said:

First-Time Blinkers: A first-time application of blinkers is often viewed as a "last-resort" move by trainers when a horse is showing signs of losing focus. Horses wearing blinkers for the first time can sometimes see a jump in performance, particularly if they were previously distracted or undisciplined.

Now that's interesting.  A "last-resort"!  "Undisciplined".  

[Pete Lane]

4 hours ago, Murray Fish said:

If one asks Prof ChatGPT

"statistics on race horses wearing blinkers in a race?"

ChatGPT said:

ChatGPT

Blinkers are a common piece of equipment used in horse racing to help a horse focus and reduce distractions. They are a type of hood or cup that limits the horse's peripheral vision, preventing it from seeing other horses or distractions to the sides, which can sometimes cause anxiety or loss of focus.

While detailed statistics on the exact impact of blinkers on a horse's performance in races may vary by location, trainer, and horse, here are some key insights and trends from the racing industry:

1. Blinkers and Performance

• Positive Impact: For many horses, blinkers help improve focus and can prevent them from shying away from other horses or becoming distracted by their surroundings. This is especially true for horses that tend to "wander" or lose their focus during a race.
• Negative Impact: On the other hand, some horses can become overly aggressive or excitable when blinkers are applied, which might hinder their performance. Additionally, horses that are naturally calm or focused may not benefit as much from blinkers.

2. Statistical Studies

• Win Rates: Various studies and analyses suggest that horses wearing blinkers sometimes show a slight improvement in their win rate, but the effect is not always significant across all horses. Some research has found that the percentage of horses wearing blinkers that win races can be slightly higher compared to those not wearing them. However, this depends largely on the horse's temperament and history with blinkers.
• Trainer Influence: The use of blinkers often depends on the trainer's judgment. Trainers may apply blinkers to horses that have shown signs of losing focus or becoming distracted during races. The results may vary based on the skill and timing of the trainer’s decision.
• Racing Data: Some specific studies (especially in jurisdictions like the UK and US) have analyzed horses' performance data before and after blinkers are applied. Generally, horses that are first-time blinkered have a mixed performance, with some improving significantly while others performing worse.

3. Types of Blinkers and Adjustments

• Full Blinkers vs. Noseband Blinkers: There are variations in blinkers, such as "full blinkers" (which block vision to the sides) or "noseband blinkers" (which just limit vision to the sides of the nose). The type of blinker used can influence the effectiveness on a horse's performance.
• First-Time Blinkers: A first-time application of blinkers is often viewed as a "last-resort" move by trainers when a horse is showing signs of losing focus. Horses wearing blinkers for the first time can sometimes see a jump in performance, particularly if they were previously distracted or undisciplined.

4. Statistical Considerations

• According to racing statistics, horses wearing blinkers can have a higher probability of finishing in the money (top 3) compared to those not wearing them, but the difference is generally modest. For example, in some racing data sets, horses with blinkers might have a winning rate around 10–15%, compared to 8–12% for those without blinkers. The exact numbers vary significantly based on the horse's previous form, track conditions, and distance.
• Post-Blinker Stats: When horses race with blinkers for the first time, they can show a higher improvement rate in their performance stats, especially in sprint races where focus is crucial.

5. Racing Jurisdictions

• US vs. UK: The impact of blinkers on a horse's performance can vary based on the racing jurisdiction. In the UK, for example, horses wearing blinkers may have slightly different win rates than in the US, depending on the type of racing culture and training methods.

Conclusion

While blinkers can provide an advantage for some horses, they do not guarantee success. The impact largely depends on the horse’s temperament, prior experience, and the specific circumstances of each race. As such, the general consensus is that blinkers are a useful tool, but their effectiveness is far from universal.

For specific statistics, you may need to refer to data sets from a specific racing track or database like Equibase (US) or Racing Post (UK), where performance metrics for blinkered horses can be analyzed in more detail.

That certainly raises the question that many have posed on here in the past.

As a punter how can you quantify the improvement that might occur on the application of blinkers?

Answer seems to be that you can't. Therefore it's pretty useless as a factor to consider when assessing a horse's chance.

Edited 14 hours ago by Pete Lane

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Pete Lane said:

That certainly raises the question that many have posed on here in the past.

As a punter how can you quantify the improvement that might occur on the application of blinkers?

Answer seems to be that you can't. Therefore it's pretty useless as a factor to consider when assessing a horse's chance.

Spot on.

[Wingman]

Two trains of thought. Blinkers on first time, get on, fill ya boots. OR.. gear change, gear added , avoid like the plague. So do you believe in God or are you an atheist..take your pick, but no one wins these type of discussions.

[Gammalite]

11 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Spot on.

what is ?  There's heaps of factor's dismissed by grandstand experts who think they know reasons why a horse's chances are greater or lesser in a race.  Nothing is Useless ??? the bloody trainers know what they're doing. Not the punters lol.  

The application of gear (deafeners used on a lot of harness horses) blinkers /blinds are ALL applied to give you just a small 'Help' in the closing stages of a race. difference of a metre or 2 sometimes like Mr B got.   

Every little thing you do / administer/ shoe/ feed / designed to give you the slight EDGE over the opponent you face on the day. Having a jockey like Jmac is a case where you gain a little edge as well. A bit less weight than some rivals. sometimes a good draw 'Helps ' keep you handy. a tongue tie, a slap on the bum 😂 . all bits that might help? 

 No good dismissing Any of the Criteria involving your horse as unnecessary/useless  , that is applied by Trainers . 

Every little bit designed/applied to help for That moment in Time.  The Trainers are Mostly Experts in their field.

(I have a great example that i'll put in a photo on the harness thread of added gear) and a Hot Tip for tomorrow along with it )

 

 

 

 

 

[Pete Lane]

3 hours ago, Gammalite said:

what is ?  There's heaps of factor's dismissed by grandstand experts who think they know reasons why a horse's chances are greater or lesser in a race.  Nothing is Useless ??? the bloody trainers know what they're doing. Not the punters lol.  

The application of gear (deafeners used on a lot of harness horses) blinkers /blinds are ALL applied to give you just a small 'Help' in the closing stages of a race. difference of a metre or 2 sometimes like Mr B got.   

Every little thing you do / administer/ shoe/ feed / designed to give you the slight EDGE over the opponent you face on the day. Having a jockey like Jmac is a case where you gain a little edge as well. A bit less weight than some rivals. sometimes a good draw 'Helps ' keep you handy. a tongue tie, a slap on the bum 😂 . all bits that might help? 

 No good dismissing Any of the Criteria involving your horse as unnecessary/useless  , that is applied by Trainers . 

Every little bit designed/applied to help for That moment in Time.  The Trainers are Mostly Experts in their field.

(I have a great example that i'll put in a photo on the harness thread of added gear) and a Hot Tip for tomorrow along with it )

 

 

 

 

 

I think you missed my point. I'm not denying all those factors can and do make a difference to a horse's performance but, as a punter, how do you know the extent of the difference when assessing a horse's chance before a race?

The answer is that you don't.

[curious]

5 hours ago, Pete Lane said:

I think you missed my point. I'm not denying all those factors can and do make a difference to a horse's performance but, as a punter, how do you know the extent of the difference when assessing a horse's chance before a race?

The answer is that you don't.

I don't think you can assess what effect they might have had after the race either. If the horse improved 5 lengths, how do you know that was due to the blinkers?