Chief Stipe Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 Only 5 starters today in the time honoured Wakefield Challenge Stakes 2024. Some very good two year olds have won this race in the past. One of them probably our best in Our Maizcay. 1978 Tang 1980 Glamour Bay 1981 Bound To Honour 1982 Romantic Bay 1993 Silver Chalice 1995 Our Maizcay 1998 Happyanunoit 2001 Vinaka 2002 Danroad 2003 Maroofity 2004 Kapsdan 2005 Wahid 2010 Jimmy Choux Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 Another Tasmania of racing, all 5 by Aus based Sires as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomed Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 Hasn't the race been moved around a lot in recent years? Never used to be a Manawatu race either. Surely can't stay as group 2. Terrible field for $175,000. 2yo racing is so badly organised in the CD. Meanwhile the poor bloody South Island gets no 2yo racing for two months mid summer. Still, I suppose we must be doing well, stakes look ok. I suppose if you judge how well we are going based on stakes rather than the quality and quantity of fields, then things have never been better. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 Arguably a better field at last Trentham meet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray Fish Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 and only ONE male horse in... wow! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 Mid Eighties to 2015 raced in March at Trentham over 1200m and was always a natural lead in to the Manawatu Sires Produce. Since 2015 moved to December and distance reduced to 1100m and as one can plainly see , is now no longer a quality race 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 On 21/12/2024 at 4:40 AM, Wingman said: Mid Eighties to 2015 raced in March at Trentham over 1200m and was always a natural lead in to the Manawatu Sires Produce. Since 2015 moved to December and distance reduced to 1100m and as one can plainly see , is now no longer a quality race Expand Last year's winner did go on to win the 1000 guineas. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wingman Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 That is a fine piece of rebuttal Curious. With that concession I do still think it is not the race it was. I have always liked the seasonal flow and consistency of time honoured races but to quote Mr Fish; 'SIGH' ,that is a thing of the past in the land of the long white cloud. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 On 21/12/2024 at 4:57 AM, curious said: Last year's winner did go on to win the 1000 guineas. Expand Which is debately also screwed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomed Posted December 21, 2024 Share Posted December 21, 2024 We effectively now seem to have split the 2yos and 3yos into two tiers each. Based on this year's results so far the better ones work through the traditional pattern and aim for Australian targets eventually, while those who are eligible for the sweepstakes and slot races take a different path and just aim to pick up a maiden race somewhere without having to travel far. Actually, they don't even need to pick up a maiden race really. Nothing to stop a slot holder starting a maiden in the kiwi thing. Certainly a whole new world. Some people think it's wonderful so who am I to disagree. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murray Fish Posted December 22, 2024 Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 21/12/2024 at 8:31 AM, Doomed said: Certainly a whole new world Expand (wearing a punters hat!) hence: the needed to recalibrate and see what possible betting options their might be! Personally, my fav race on the AU/NZ calendar would now be The Everest, reason being!! 'we' get to see so much of all the horses in the build up to the race! This year there was Massive coverage, if you wanted to find it! Sigh, now comparing how the nz 'marketers' of the nz race go about their business of propagating for the race? Down this way Etain and ODT have been working hard, not to sure how much any of the bigger media players have nowadays for things racing! as you have said, a whole new world! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 22, 2024 Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 22/12/2024 at 2:59 AM, Murray Fish said: (wearing a punters hat!) hence: the needed to recalibrate and see what possible betting options their might be! Personally, my fav race on the AU/NZ calendar would now be The Everest, reason being!! 'we' get to see so much of all the horses in the build up to the race! This year there was Massive coverage, if you wanted to find it! Sigh, now comparing how the nz 'marketers' of the nz race go about their business of propagating for the race? Down this way Etain and ODT have been working hard, not to sure how much any of the bigger media players have nowadays for things racing! as you have said, a whole new world! Expand The NZB Kiwi or Funny trophy race whatever it's called is appearing to be an absolute yawn fest, any race dependent on the prize money alone to focus most interest in it , is going to struggle to capture the imagination. The beauty of the Everest as you have so succinctly put it is you get to know the horses & can follow their path there, this NZB kiwi half of us don't have a clue who is going there. Not to mention the Everest are the Superstars of the sport. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomed Posted December 22, 2024 Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 22/12/2024 at 9:34 AM, Huey said: The NZB Kiwi or Funny trophy race whatever it's called is appearing to be an absolute yawn fest, any race dependent on the prize money alone to focus most interest in it , is going to struggle to capture the imagination. The beauty of the Everest as you have so succinctly put it is you get to know the horses & can follow their path there, this NZB kiwi half of us don't have a clue who is going there. Not to mention the Everest are the Superstars of the sport. Expand Surely a bit harsh Huey. We have a 3rd placegetter from the Guineas and a maiden winner locked in so far. I can't remember their actual names, but you can feel the excitement building by the minute. It wouldn't surprise me if there's a big announcement in a few days that a maiden winner from Taranaki is next to be confirmed. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted December 22, 2024 Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 22/12/2024 at 9:45 AM, Doomed said: We have a 3rd placegetter from the Guineas and a maiden winner locked in so far. I can't remember their actual names, but you can feel the excitement building by the minute. Expand You have to remember that there are some very good judges of equine potential involved here. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted December 22, 2024 Author Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 22/12/2024 at 9:34 AM, Huey said: The NZB Kiwi or Funny trophy race whatever it's called is appearing to be an absolute yawn fest, any race dependent on the prize money alone to focus most interest in it , is going to struggle to capture the imagination. The beauty of the Everest as you have so succinctly put it is you get to know the horses & can follow their path there, this NZB kiwi half of us don't have a clue who is going there. Not to mention the Everest are the Superstars of the sport. Expand The only positive of The Everest is every horse is eligible to race it even though the best are both selected due to Slot Holder bias. The Kiwi B eligibility rules and timing and the lack of black type eliminates the best horses from racing. Many of those have a big following. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted December 22, 2024 Share Posted December 22, 2024 (edited) On 22/12/2024 at 6:24 PM, Chief Stipe said: The Kiwi B eligibility rules and timing and the lack of black type eliminates the best horses from racing. Many of those have a big following. Expand It has black type. Listed (Restricted) Edited December 22, 2024 by curious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted December 22, 2024 Author Share Posted December 22, 2024 On 22/12/2024 at 6:39 PM, curious said: It has black type. Listed (Restricted) Expand Do you really consider that is the black type that anyone with a serious horse would choose to go after when there Grp race options elsewhere? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special Agent Posted December 23, 2024 Share Posted December 23, 2024 (edited) On 22/12/2024 at 9:34 AM, Huey said: The NZB Kiwi or Funny trophy race whatever it's called is appearing to be an absolute yawn fest, any race dependent on the prize money alone to focus most interest in it , is going to struggle to capture the imagination. Expand These novelty races really are messing with New Zealand racing, particularly with history and tradition. Has anyone tabled a contingency plan for if/when the Entain deal blows apart? I'm only seeing money thrown at some races. What clubs and individuals are coming up with innovations to maintain and bolster field numbers and quality across the board? Edited December 23, 2024 by Special Agent 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 23, 2024 Share Posted December 23, 2024 On 23/12/2024 at 9:22 AM, Special Agent said: These novelty races really are messing with New Zealand racing, particularly with history and tradition. Has anyone tabled a contingency plan for if/when the Entain deal blows apart? I'm only seeing money thrown at some races. What clubs and individuals are coming up with innovations to maintain and bolster field numbers and quality across the board? Expand That's a good point, one can see one helluva a mess should they pull out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted December 23, 2024 Share Posted December 23, 2024 On 23/12/2024 at 9:22 AM, Special Agent said: These novelty races really are messing with New Zealand racing, particularly with history and tradition. Has anyone tabled a contingency plan for if/when the Entain deal blows apart? I'm only seeing money thrown at some races. What clubs and individuals are coming up with innovations to maintain and bolster field numbers and quality across the board? Expand That's a thought I've had too. Nothing is forever, and if Entain keeps getting in the proverbial, they may well divest themselves of a non- performer. NZTR needs to seriously address the programming/ handicapping issues and take note of area-specific field sizes. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doomed Posted December 23, 2024 Share Posted December 23, 2024 I do wonder about the whole funding model. If it is uneconomical to add an extra 9th race with 14 starters for $18,500 at a SI meeting, but acceptable to continually run 5 and 6 horse fields in the NI for $40,000 then obviously turnover is only a minor component of the funding model. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted December 23, 2024 Author Share Posted December 23, 2024 On 23/12/2024 at 4:49 PM, Freda said: That's a thought I've had too. Nothing is forever, and if Entain keeps getting in the proverbial, they may well divest themselves of a non- performer. NZTR needs to seriously address the programming/ handicapping issues and take note of area-specific field sizes. Expand That should be the focus of every stakeholder. Rather than being distracted by the woke issues the focus should be on the industry being financially viable and strong. That is the biggest reason Greyhounds succumbed - they didn't have enough revenue to fix ANY issues nor fight the fight against an obsessed minority who want to end ALL RACING. Whether whips are used or strikes are counted correctly is not at the forefront in the minds of stakeholders that have significant skin in the game. The issues are getting a start for their horse, having a safe track to train and race on and generally protecting their investment. If the industry can maintain financial strength at an individual and national level then other issues can be fought for or against. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted December 23, 2024 Share Posted December 23, 2024 On 23/12/2024 at 11:04 PM, Chief Stipe said: That should be the focus of every stakeholder. Rather than being distracted by the woke issues the focus should be on the industry being financially viable and strong. That is the biggest reason Greyhounds succumbed - they didn't have enough revenue to fix ANY issues nor fight the fight against an obsessed minority who want to end ALL RACING. Whether whips are used or strikes are counted correctly is not at the forefront in the minds of stakeholders that have significant skin in the game. The issues are getting a start for their horse, having a safe track to train and race on and generally protecting their investment. If the industry can maintain financial strength at an individual and national level then other issues can be fought for or against. Expand Yes. The focus should definitely be financial viability and sustainability but I believe that social acceptability is the number one factor in achieving that. Winfried Engelbrecht-Bresges among others agrees with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Special Agent Posted December 24, 2024 Share Posted December 24, 2024 On 23/12/2024 at 4:49 PM, Freda said: NZTR needs to seriously address the programming/ handicapping issues and take note of area-specific field sizes. Expand Just on this, in and around times of Covid the programming committees met on Zoom. This was hardly ideal. I remember a trainer representative telling me how difficult it was working through the races and meetings whilst juggling spreadsheets, and then the focus moving onto the next meeting before everyone had fully digested and discussed the previous. Does anyone know if these meetings are now in person in all regions? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huey Posted December 24, 2024 Share Posted December 24, 2024 Like most things In nzracing, a significant few have a huge influence over matters of programming whether good for the industry or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.