Chief Stipe Posted May 1 Posted May 1 NZ Cup 2024 stake $400,000 Turnover for NZ Cup $1.4 mil KiwiB 2025 stake $3,500,000 Turnover for The Kiwi $1.37mil 1 Quote
mikeynz Posted May 2 Posted May 2 28 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: NZ Cup 2024 stake $400,000 Turnover for NZ Cup $1.4 mil KiwiB 2025 stake $3,500,000 Turnover for The Kiwi $1.37mil I think the Derby was the biggest turnover on March 8. Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 Well one thing is for sure the return to the industry was a zillion times greater with the KiwiB than either the NZ Cup or the NZ Derby. Quote
Special Agent Posted May 2 Posted May 2 I think the point is similar turnover but vastly different stakes. Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 4 minutes ago, Special Agent said: I think the point is similar turnover but vastly different stakes. Well we all know the Sharrock quote about the positive relationship between stakes and wagering is a nonsense. The point I'd like to make is that that KiwiB is a slot race and the stakes largely come from slot holders NOT the industry pot. So in terms of returns to the industry from wagering turnover it is greater from the KiwiB than it is from the NZ Cup even if the latter had a higher turnover. Quote
mikeynz Posted May 2 Posted May 2 (edited) If you use turnover as yardstick, it shows that for all the hype/promotion it created no more national interest than Riccartons cup day but as we've already known Auckland don't care about horse racing as a rule,cup week jn Canterbury wins hands down. Edited May 2 by mikeynz 4 Quote
SLB2.0 Posted May 2 Posted May 2 The stakes for the Kiwi don't really apply because it's a slot race, yeah? How much of the prize money was from slot holders and how much from industry funds? Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 1 hour ago, mikeynz said: If you use turnover as yardstick, it shows that for all the hype/promotion it created no more national interest than Riccartons cup day but as we've already known Auckland don't care about horse racing as a rule,cup week jn Canterbury wins hands down. Yes but Cup week has been a tradition for 100 years - well a very long time with annual marketing from Throughbred Racing, Harness, Dogs, the local Councils and businesses. It is one of the last bucket list racing carnivals in NZ. Decades of tradition and ingrained in NZ'rs throughout the country. Quote
TAB For Ever Posted May 2 Posted May 2 Yes the NZ Cup has been an iconic race for over 100 years and the sheepshaggers love to descend on Christchurch for the week. So for a new race to get anywhere near it in interest and turnover is simply staggering ! A totally new race and concept doing so well first up.......the highest number of bettors engaged on the day ! Sure it had a great supporting program so won't threaten Melbourne Cup day for bets but a grand start ! Plus Aussies got involved ...... With so much great sport in Auckland and so much to attend , its great that it got so much cut-through and so well supported by all of NZ ! I enjoyed the days's racing immensely.......And loved a lot of cup weeks too ! Quote
mikeynz Posted May 2 Posted May 2 35 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Decades of tradition and ingrained in NZ'rs throughout the country. Still plenty of tradional Country meetings going ok still as well, there is probably no other place like Auckland that have chopped and changed days and shifted races, never seem to settle. Quote
mikeynz Posted May 2 Posted May 2 5 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said: Yes the NZ Cup has been an iconic race for over 100 years and the sheepshaggers love to descend on Christchurch for the week. So for a new race to get anywhere near it in interest and turnover is simply staggering ! A totally new race and concept doing so well first up.......the highest number of bettors engaged on the day ! Sure it had a great supporting program so won't threaten Melbourne Cup day for bets but a grand start ! Plus Aussies got involved ...... With so much great sport in Auckland and so much to attend , its great that it got so much cut-through and so well supported by all of NZ ! I enjoyed the days's racing immensely.......And loved a lot of cup weeks too ! Your comment about sheepshaggers is one of the reasons most here more than likely see you for the wanker you are, another negative for Auckland , no wonder the traffic congestion is so bad, can't even catch a bus without being bashed up,roll on the South Pacific's fastest growing ghetto, it's happening faster than some halfwits realise. 1 1 Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said: Yes the NZ Cup has been an iconic race for over 100 years and the sheepshaggers love to descend on Christchurch for the week. So how do you describe yourself? Of have you stopped attending Cup week to watch your horses? Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said: With so much great sport in Auckland and so much to attend , its great that it got so much cut-through and so well supported by all of NZ ! So I gather with your time at Otago University you didn't embrace everything that the South Island has to offer? JAFA. Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 1 hour ago, mikeynz said: Still plenty of tradional Country meetings going ok still as well, there is probably no other place like Auckland that have chopped and changed days and shifted races, never seem to settle. Exactly. They butchered their summer carnival. Auckland Cup and the Derby. They are starting to get a bit of a following with the KM but hardly a carnival when no one else is involved. What do they call solo sex? Quote
Assange Posted May 2 Posted May 2 35 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Exactly. They butchered their summer carnival. Auckland Cup and the Derby. They are starting to get a bit of a following with the KM but hardly a carnival when no one else is involved. What do they call solo sex? Owner operators 3 Quote
Murray Fish Posted May 2 Posted May 2 5 hours ago, Chief Stipe said: So in terms of returns to the industry from wagering turnover it is greater from the KiwiB than it is from the NZ Cup even if the latter had a higher turnover. what was the propaganda/publicity spend on both events? 1 Quote
Murray Fish Posted May 2 Posted May 2 3 hours ago, curious said: Yes. What was the NZTR contribution? as in their overall. gross? spend on both events? I presume extra was spent with the KIWI being a first time event v CUP Week being as old as I can recall.. Quote
Murray Fish Posted May 2 Posted May 2 2 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: I enjoyed the days's racing immensely..... I still be dealing with 4 bets for 4 nose 2nds,,, phew Quote
Doomed Posted May 2 Posted May 2 8 hours ago, Chief Stipe said: Well we all know the Sharrock quote about the positive relationship between stakes and wagering is a nonsense. The point I'd like to make is that that KiwiB is a slot race and the stakes largely come from slot holders NOT the industry pot. So in terms of returns to the industry from wagering turnover it is greater from the KiwiB than it is from the NZ Cup even if the latter had a higher turnover. I don't necessarily agree with that. I haven't seen a breakdown about how much came from the slot holders. It would be easy enough to figure out if someone could be bothered. Certainly not $3.5m though. $90,000 came as a listed race subsidy. I doubt the rest of the stake all came from slot holders. Plus there were $1m in bonuses, hence the often quoted stake of $4.5m. And four slots funded by other racing clubs. I don't know how they could afford that. I guess it will come out in their annual reports. And it made a laughing stock of the CJC. That $1m of bonuses would have gone a long way during Cup Week. And god knows how many hundreds of thousands were spent on promotion by Entain and NZTR. 2 Quote
TAB For Ever Posted May 2 Posted May 2 A totally NEW race on the calendar ...... Placed on the same day as some iconic NZ races ,not only did it attract phenomenal interest from Australia and abroad ,but in a soft and very competitive wagering environment it increased betting on those iconic races as well. And the total active betters in NZ on that meeting was a record ! And the good news is next year it is going to be bigger and better again ! Year one and all NZ betting records were either beaten or nearly beaten. Not that one day or one race proves anything ,they gotta keep repeating it ! But the alternative was obvious...keep doing the same ole , same ole and NZ racing would be back where we were.....unable to pay our bills and technically insolvent. A great time NOW to be involved ! Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 11 hours ago, Doomed said: I don't necessarily agree with that. I haven't seen a breakdown about how much came from the slot holders. It would be easy enough to figure out if someone could be bothered. Certainly not $3.5m though. $90,000 came as a listed race subsidy. I doubt the rest of the stake all came from slot holders. Plus there were $1m in bonuses, hence the often quoted stake of $4.5m. And four slots funded by other racing clubs. I don't know how they could afford that. I guess it will come out in their annual reports. And it made a laughing stock of the CJC. That $1m of bonuses would have gone a long way during Cup Week. And god knows how many hundreds of thousands were spent on promotion by Entain and NZTR. But you are not doing an equal comparison. You are loading up the KiwiB while discounting the NZ Cup. You are also loading the Champions Day total marketing on one race. As for CJC having a slot - they wasted their "gift" by choosing a runner that had no show. 11 hours ago, Doomed said: That $1m of bonuses would have gone a long way during Cup Week. Doing what? Arguably the Stakes races had been loaded enough and the supporting races are all well funded. Quote
Chief Stipe Posted May 2 Author Posted May 2 8 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: But the alternative was obvious...keep doing the same ole , same ole and NZ racing would be back where we were.....unable to pay our bills and technically insolvent. Nothing has changed in that regard except the black line has got further away. I guess you were more of a "creative" accountant than a cost one. 1 Quote
Special Agent Posted May 2 Posted May 2 8 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: And the good news is next year it is going to be bigger and better again ! Year one and all NZ betting records were either beaten or nearly beaten. Not that one day or one race proves anything ,they gotta keep repeating it ! Yes. Only time will tell if interest can be retained. Quote
mikeynz Posted May 2 Posted May 2 (edited) 59 minutes ago, Special Agent said: Yes. Only time will tell if interest can be retained. Not too many at Eden Park last night, seems interest wanes at Auckland quickly in many things but it was only the Force, actually it was only the Blues lol. Edited May 2 by mikeynz Quote
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