Auckland Friday night- should they race??

[TAB For Ever]

Great to see Gamma fighting the good fight against the great protectors of NZ Harness......we are doing it for the Industry !!!!

And we don't like the place prices , we don't like the product , the quality of the horses , the drivers ,the tempo ,the sit/sprints  the commentators and definitely don't like Auckland particularly as they lose the Industry money !

Change the way you look at things and the things you look at will change.......

And who would go and watch this dross......well I do and I been doing very nicely thank you .....look beyond the odd $1.20 shot and go for your free drink then and there are some great prices in the small fields on the win pool and trifectas etc !

After years of the huge expense of keeping Harness afloat in NZ , the punters now have 100's of options to show their skill , the owners returns are higher. 

Trainers are better off than ever and Drivers and Juniors are getting more opportunities each week to progress and learn faster.

And the NORTH is flying , the have the top breeders/stallions , many of top owners , the Northern trainers are killing it it ...Telfers winning the numbers game . All Stars and BPurdon up there on stakes. Northerners HCullen and SReid in the south as big back ups for the Stockwell/ Telfer machine. Dunns keeping a leg in both camps.

The BIG ISSUE seems to be that each Northern meeting is losing money .........well look closer at the numbers you will see that many Clubs /regions are currently losing money in that the GBR is less than the stakes contribution...at a quick glance it appears , Nelson ,Rangiora , many Southern Cubs /meetings do like wise.

And how is each of you being affected by this 'perceived doom and gloom ' being pointed at Auckland.......I'm enjoying the racing , free parking ,free drink , free racebook , good racing with top trainers and drivers....Telfers won at least 5 x last Friday ,maybe 8 for week ! , my owners returns are up , my small betting is profitable ,\. And the participants are enjoying it.

Again ,how are you lot affected ????????

The new 'strategy and dawning' will be revealed at Special Meeting tomorrow night   !!

In the meantime , imagine if all the Harness Clubs  had to throw their net worth /equity into a big hat to divvy up between the top THREE clubs in NZ who would YOU PICK the TOP 3 as..........

[TAB For Ever]

Just now, TAB For Ever said:

Great to see Gamma fighting the good fight against the great protectors of NZ Harness......we are doing it for the Industry !!!!

And we don't like the place prices , we don't like the product , the quality of the horses , the drivers ,the tempo ,the sit/sprints  the commentators and definitely don't like Auckland particularly as they lose the Industry money !

Change the way you look at things and the things you look at will change.......

And who would go and watch this dross......well I do and I been doing very nicely thank you .....look beyond the odd $1.20 shot and go for your free drink then and there are some great prices in the small fields on the win pool and trifectas etc !

After years of the huge expense of keeping Harness afloat in NZ , the punters now have 100's of options to show their skill , the owners returns are higher. 

Trainers are better off than ever and Drivers and Juniors are getting more opportunities each week to progress and learn faster.

And the NORTH is flying , the have the top breeders/stallions , many of top owners , the Northern trainers are killing it it ...Telfers winning the numbers game . All Stars and BPurdon up there on stakes. Northerners HCullen and SReid in the south as big back ups for the Stockwell/ Telfer machine. Dunns keeping a leg in both camps.

The BIG ISSUE seems to be that each Northern meeting is losing money .........well look closer at the numbers you will see that many Clubs /regions are currently losing money in that the GBR is less than the stakes contribution...at a quick glance it appears , Nelson ,Rangiora , many Southern Cubs /meetings do like wise.

And how is each of you being affected by this 'perceived doom and gloom ' being pointed at Auckland.......I'm enjoying the racing , free parking ,free drink , free racebook , good racing with top trainers and drivers....Telfers won at least 5 x last Friday ,maybe 8 for week ! , my owners returns are up , my small betting is profitable ,\. And the participants are enjoying it.

Again ,how are you lot affected ????????

The new 'strategy and dawning' will be revealed at Special Meeting tomorrow night   !!

In the meantime , imagine if all the Harness Clubs  had to throw their net worth /equity into a big hat to divvy up between the top THREE clubs in NZ who would YOU PICK the TOP 3 as..........

My TOP 3 are NZ Met , AUCKLAND and  possibly Methven.

Great post TAB man !

[Nowornever]

2 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

My TOP 3 are NZ Met , AUCKLAND and  possibly Methven.

Great post TAB man !

Yes I think I will go with Methven, Banks Peninsular and Ashburton. 

[Brodie]

9 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

Great to see Gamma fighting the good fight against the great protectors of NZ Harness......we are doing it for the Industry !!!!

And we don't like the place prices , we don't like the product , the quality of the horses , the drivers ,the tempo ,the sit/sprints  the commentators and definitely don't like Auckland particularly as they lose the Industry money !

Change the way you look at things and the things you look at will change.......

And who would go and watch this dross......well I do and I been doing very nicely thank you .....look beyond the odd $1.20 shot and go for your free drink then and there are some great prices in the small fields on the win pool and trifectas etc !

After years of the huge expense of keeping Harness afloat in NZ , the punters now have 100's of options to show their skill , the owners returns are higher. 

Trainers are better off than ever and Drivers and Juniors are getting more opportunities each week to progress and learn faster.

And the NORTH is flying , the have the top breeders/stallions , many of top owners , the Northern trainers are killing it it ...Telfers winning the numbers game . All Stars and BPurdon up there on stakes. Northerners HCullen and SReid in the south as big back ups for the Stockwell/ Telfer machine. Dunns keeping a leg in both camps.

The BIG ISSUE seems to be that each Northern meeting is losing money .........well look closer at the numbers you will see that many Clubs /regions are currently losing money in that the GBR is less than the stakes contribution...at a quick glance it appears , Nelson ,Rangiora , many Southern Cubs /meetings do like wise.

And how is each of you being affected by this 'perceived doom and gloom ' being pointed at Auckland.......I'm enjoying the racing , free parking ,free drink , free racebook , good racing with top trainers and drivers....Telfers won at least 5 x last Friday ,maybe 8 for week ! , my owners returns are up , my small betting is profitable ,\. And the participants are enjoying it.

Again ,how are you lot affected ????????

The new 'strategy and dawning' will be revealed at Special Meeting tomorrow night   !!

In the meantime , imagine if all the Harness Clubs  had to throw their net worth /equity into a big hat to divvy up between the top THREE clubs in NZ who would YOU PICK the TOP 3 as..........

TABFOREVER, this is the problem that exists with harness racing in NZ!!!!!

There is no accountability coming from those that should be showing it!!!

Several of us that consistently comment actually care about what is going to happen with harness racing in NZ, even though it doesnt affect us too much personally.

Those at the helm and making decisions are showing that they are only there to collect their salaries which they do not seem to deserve, and bugger what happens in the future as we will be gone!

They were handed a lifeline by having all this money thrown at it from Entain and yet from the outside many of us can see what is going to happen when the money dries up, and it isnt looking good.

Anyway, TABFOREVER, if you think they are doing everything right then so be it, but what I do  know in a couple of years or so time, people will be saying that what we are saying was right, and what are we going to do now?

Make hay while the sun shines as all this money keeps coming is HRNZ’s attitude from where Brodie sits!

More than happy to be proven wrong!

Edited Tuesday at 08:15 PM by Brodie

[Gammalite]

1 hour ago, Brodie said:

TABFOREVER, this is the problem that exists with harness racing in NZ!!!!!

There is no accountability coming from those that should be showing it!!!

Several of us that consistently comment actually care about what is going to happen with harness racing in NZ, even though it doesnt affect us too much personally.

Those at the helm and making decisions are showing that they are only there to collect their salaries which they do not seem to deserve, and bugger what happens in the future as we will be gone!

They were handed a lifeline by having all this money thrown at it from Entain and yet from the outside many of us can see what is going to happen when the money dries up, and it isnt looking good.

Anyway, TABFOREVER, if you think they are doing everything right then so be it, but what I do  know in a couple of years or so time, people will be saying that what we are saying was right, and what are we going to do now?

Make hay while the sun shines as all this money keeps coming is HRNZ’s attitude from where Brodie sits!

More than happy to be proven wrong!

Well fair enough Brodster . It is good you are looking at the forward picture. and current problems .

But are you looking for a solution ? 

Your thread here says 'Should they Race ??" as the headline.

If they don't race we have No harness racing. How does that help anyone ? I'll miss seeing those fine horses and people . I saw it happen QLD when they closed the Gold Coast trotting club. since 2010 nothing there. It's sad.

Doomed and Nowornever and yourself constantly bag the Waikato /Auckland trotting as a product because you think you can't bet on it in it's current form. Betting companies Still DO take take bets. But you blokes want the HRNZ to put up race fields that suit YOUR needs for a punt. (one bloke here said he wanted 18 horse standing starts ?😂 something from prehistoric times. he's a dinosaur mate 😉)  , They are running races to the Participants needs these days. 

But you totally forget about the needs of the participants. Which is for HRNZ to put races on for them . 

There's not just owners trainers and drivers depending on this , but heaps of stable hands, all the back up services where people make a living, hundreds of people making some money . 

and you say 'Should they Race?' . and then pick on HRNZ for poor performance?. surely if they didn't race like you are suggesting, that's When they (HRNZ and ATC) would  Have Failed ???? 

I know you blokes are a fair judge of racing. for example NowOrNever tipped 3 out of 3 to me in Brisbane ( which tallied 77-1  multi ) and even labelled the Trot Grand Final Quinella a month before the event was run. my tip only 4th.

So this tells me 2 things. Harness racing is consistantly GOOD , as in horses and trainers and even drivers Run Fairly 'True to Form'. an excellent thing. and are good to bet on if you're having a bet, because you get a Good run for your dollar consistently and seems way better than Gallops , (golf or tennis) in my opinion.

Should they race ? of course they should race.  Pop a $50 on (like I do ) to help em' out if you're worried about turnover so much then you guys . Try and help a bit. 

what do you want??  . horses eating grain at home in the stable or something?.   park the sulky' in the paddock to rust.

[Brodie]

4 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Well fair enough Brodster . It is good you are looking at the forward picture. and current problems .

But are you looking for a solution ? 

Your thread here says 'Should they Race ??" as the headline.

If they don't race we have No harness racing. How does that help anyone ? I'll miss seeing those fine horses and people . I saw it happen QLD when they closed the Gold Coast trotting club. since 2010 nothing there. It's sad.

Doomed and Nowornever and yourself constantly bag the Waikato /Auckland trotting as a product because you think you can't bet on it in it's current form. Betting companies Still DO take take bets. But you blokes want the HRNZ to put up race fields that suit YOUR needs for a punt. (one bloke here said he wanted 18 horse standing starts ?😂 something from prehistoric times. he's a dinosaur mate 😉)  , They are running races to the Participants needs these days. 

But you totally forget about the needs of the participants. Which is for HRNZ to put races on for them . 

There's not just owners trainers and drivers depending on this , but heaps of stable hands, all the back up services where people make a living, hundreds of people making some money . 

and you say 'Should they Race?' . and then pick on HRNZ for poor performance?. surely if they didn't race like you are suggesting, that's When they (HRNZ and ATC) would  Have Failed ???? 

I know you blokes are a fair judge of racing. for example NowOrNever tipped 3 out of 3 to me in Brisbane ( which tallied 77-1  multi ) and even labelled the Trot Grand Final Quinella a month before the event was run. my tip only 4th.

So this tells me 2 things. Harness racing is consistantly GOOD , as in horses and trainers and even drivers Run Fairly 'True to Form'. an excellent thing. and are good to bet on if you're having a bet, because you get a Good run for your dollar consistently and seems way better than Gallops , (golf or tennis) in my opinion.

Should they race ? of course they should race.  Pop a $50 on (like I do ) to help em' out if you're worried about turnover so much then you guys . Try and help a bit. 

what do you want??  . horses eating grain at home in the stable or something?.   park the sulky' in the paddock to rust.

Gamma, no I do not want Auckland racing to finish but you just can not keep running sny business the way they are doing it currently.

Unfortunately there is just not enough interest in the sport in the North Island nowadays and they need to change this up.

Throwing money into the stakes is great for the current owners and trainers at the moment from Entain monies, however what after it runs out?

They just do not seem to have any answers and the punting turnover on the North Island meetings just does not warrant the current level of stakes!!

It is a business model doomed to fail without doubt!

Stakes of $30k plus with only a handful of starters is just a recipe for disaster but hey HRNZ obviously are happy with this.

Wouldnt be wanting them running any business I was associated with but then time is going to tell.

They should be keeping money aside for future years and development of the industry rather than trying to be Father Xmas.

Let us see what the Committee comes up with when it meets?

[Gammalite]

Well it is the middle of Winter. you can't expect the Spring Stars to be racing this early.

so with the lousy weather there in Winter no wonder the fields are small and no one watching/betting ?

you are being impatient.

There was FIRST CLASS Auckland racing in the Autumn for several weeks , with many highlights.

It's somewhat ironic that you want them QUALITY horse people to race for Peanuts , while you want to invest thousands as a bet but can't . The irony is quite funny.

(If they go to Queensland like the Best NZ trainer ever did, Mark Purdon . The kiwis could of been winning Group 1's. 

Mark still winning some while near retired.  what a legend. A nice 3rd for his own horse he part owns in the Interdominion trot Final too. and Congrats to the Whites from Canterbury running 2nd with BET N WIN.

Fine horse people who 'Deservedly' earn a quid by being Great Horsepeople. 

Yeah get HRNZ to pay Auckland Trainer peanuts then if you want ?? they are useless . Tony Herlihy, Barry Purdon , Ray Green , Butchers . They only win Miracle Mile s, Interdominions New Zealand Cups Auckland Cups, Barry even winning the New Slot race at Addington (as well as the Cambridge one last year with Merlin)

PAY THEM PEANUTS . they're NOT WORTH shit. They have Only been preparing World Class Pacers for decades ???? give the stakemoney to owner trainer at Nelson or Westport that prepares a horse that can't break 2 minutes. 

What a great thing that would be to happen .

Useless bloody HRNZ getting it ALL wrong.   Wrong people getting the prizemoney 😂😎 what a cock up NZ is lol. 😋

 

[Westview]

11 hours ago, Nowornever said:

Yes I think I will go with Methven, Banks Peninsular and Ashburton. 

Banks Peninsula don't own their track and Ashburton are in conjunction with the gallops but both run good meetings 

[the galah]

4 hours ago, Gammalite said:

 

Yeah get HRNZ to pay Auckland Trainer peanuts then if you want ?? they are useless . Tony Herlihy, Barry Purdon , Ray Green , Butchers . They only win Miracle Mile s, Interdominions New Zealand Cups Auckland Cups, Barry even winning the New Slot race at Addington (as well as the Cambridge one last year with Merlin)

PAY THEM PEANUTS . they're NOT WORTH shit. They have Only been preparing World Class Pacers for decades ???? give the stakemoney to owner trainer at Nelson or Westport that prepares a horse that can't break 2 minutes. 

What a great thing that would be to happen .

Useless bloody HRNZ getting it ALL wrong.   Wrong people getting the prizemoney 😂😎 what a cock up NZ is lol. 😋

 

Gammalite,Its like your thinking with your heart and not your head.

And i read what tabman posts,i get the feeling he understands,but is happy ignoring financial realities. He would go well on the hrnz board.

You talk about paying peanuts ..

well we're saying HRNZ will end up paying the auckland participants peanuts in the fututre ,if they carry on living beyond their means, as they currently are.

We are saying we don't want that to happen.I don't know why you ignore that,no matter how many times its said. 

We're saying its the current overspending that you and tabman forever support ,that will make it happen.

So who is actually promoting whats best for auckland harness racing? 

And all the people you keep mentioning,i understand why you support them,but don't you think they want to have a legacy in a sport that is still relevant in years to come.

The sport in auckland will die and with it their legacy. why would anyone support policies that would lead to that?

And all the people you mention are rich compared with most in the harness racing industry,yet its the rich who you say should race for the bigger stakes. The generation will be far poorer,yet it is the poorer people who you seem to want to leave to race for peanuts.

i understand why you think as you do,but we're saying at least  consider the big picture.

 

[Nowornever]

6 hours ago, Gammalite said:

Doomed and Nowornever and yourself constantly bag the Waikato /Auckland trotting as a product because you think you can't bet on it in it's current form

Well the thing is how long do you keep funding a business that is continuously losing money. Do you just run it into the ground until all the assets are gone? That seems to be the route they are taking at the moment.
 

[Brodie]

Auckland is haemorrhaging millions of dollars in losses each year snd it just is not going to improve in the future going by the current HRNZ policies!

What would give us some confidence that HRNZ knows what it is doing and we are talking BS, is if Brad Steele would come on to BOAY and explain to us mere mortals that everything is under control!

He won’t because he knows that things are dire and he can not back up with fact that things are rosey as he stated on Trackside a few weeks ago!

Doesnt have to be Brad, can be anyone that can advise us all of how great things are!

[the galah]

1 hour ago, Brodie said:

Auckland is haemorrhaging millions of dollars in losses each year snd it just is not going to improve in the future going by the current HRNZ policies!

What would give us some confidence that HRNZ knows what it is doing and we are talking BS, is if Brad Steele would come on to BOAY and explain to us mere mortals that everything is under control!

He won’t because he knows that things are dire and he can not back up with fact that things are rosey as he stated on Trackside a few weeks ago!

Doesnt have to be Brad, can be anyone that can advise us all of how great things are!

isn't mr steele in auckland tonight trying to sell to aucklanders the best way to spend ten's of millions of hrnz funds on auckland.

i mean,he would be loving it up there.

the saviour has arrived. this could be his finest hour.

he would ride in on his white horse called moneybags,have money bags stomp his feet a few times to get everyones attention.

Then he would dismount,start unsaddling money bags by removing large sacks with writing on them like,forbury money,southland money,grass roots canterbury prizemoney.He would then pick them up,it would be a struggle as the bag with forbury money on it is rather heavy.

then he would throw them on the table where mr mckinnon sits and mr mckinnon would flash a cheeky grin and stand up and address the crowd and say,i told you this restructuring was going to be a piece of cake.

at that point brad,we know him well enough to call him by his first name,would spot tabman in the crowd. They would exchange a bit of banter,like your the man tabmanforever,no your the man brad,no your the man tabman,no your the man brad.

after about 5 minutes of that only jamie,yes we know mr mckinnon well enough to be on first name tems as well,will be the only one awake and he will be observed doing starfish motions on the money,(and n,o no sexual pun intended there). so brad will call out to money bags and have him stomp his feet and all the members will awake and mutter yes,just as they are asked to vote, as if they have been dreaming a nightmare that all of a sudden awoken to a happy ending.

then brad will whistle,money bags will come over,brad will jump on and let out a cry of,my work is done here, then a few hi ho money bags and away.

he will gallop back out the door,do a couple of laps of the field while the blues traini and yell out to them,this is crusaders country now you bunch of losers, then gallop off into the distance.

who was that masked man the blues players will say, wthwere will be whispers of ,was that  rob penny. but then jamie will come out of the meeting room say and yell,not ron penny boys ,that was brad steele. remember this day,you will tell your granchildren about it.

Edited Wednesday at 08:02 AM by the galah

[Nowornever]

From Barry Lichter

Auckland Trotting Club president Jamie McKinnon today assured trainers that they would not be left without a training track if members voted tonight to sell Franklin Park.

And while he would not reveal details ahead of the special annual general meeting, McKinnon told Pukekohe trainers the club was close to signing a deal on a new site which it planned to lease and develop at a cost of $20 million.

McKinnon revealed the buyer of Franklin Park as Oyster Capital, a New Zealand company whose director Cam Wilson was a specialist in developing large properties.

Oyster Capital still had four months to complete its due diligence on the property which would go unconditional at the end of October or early November so until then there was still a risk it might not go ahead, he said.

The club would not be “dead in the water” however if Oyster Capital decided not to proceed as it had another party who was interested in buying part of the property.

But if all went to plan, Oyster Capital would then pay a deposit and there would be two further payments after that, allowing trainers the use of the tracks until October 1, 2026.

“That’s not negotiable but depending on where they're at with their development and consent process - they need to go for a boundary realignment - we could negotiate to stay longer if need be. But we don't think we're going to need any longer.”

McKinnon did not confirm the purchase price - believed to be $70 million - but he said the club had managed to negotiate a better deal than originally offered by Oyster Capital.

“We got it up to something respectable that the club's happy with and, more importantly, the banks happy with it as the bank's calling a lot of shots over the club these days.”

McKinnon said the deal would leave the club short of being able to pay off its bank debt, given it was not getting the $100 million from its first deal, which fell over.

“The club is going to put some of its commercial properties on the market to help fund the shortfall with the bank and we're hoping there'll be a surplus from those.”

The club also hoped to get money from various grants bodies, with the help of Harness Racing New Zealand CEO Brad Steele.

Steele addressed the often fiery meeting himself, stating that while HRNZ itself was not giving the ATC any money, he knew of six funds the club could access.

He had already lodged an application with the Government’s $1.3 billion Regional Infrastructure Fund, but was still waiting to hear if it was eligible. Thoroughbred racing had previously accessed the fund for $100 million.

Steele said he was “pretty certain” the ATC would be able to tap into some of the $100 million Entain had paid to the TAB on the passing of legislation for ge-blocking.

“Some of that is already ring-fenced for sport, but there's still a large amount of money left. I'm encouraging the TAB to allow some of those funds to be applied to infrastructure needs for harness racing. They haven't said no and they haven't said yes.”

Steele said that as a Queenslander he had no bias and his job was to ensure harness racing flourished in both islands, but particuarly in the North Island with its population base.

“I'm all-in, in terms of supporting the North Island. Yes, we do cop a bit of stick from Canterbury in terms of the money that we're investing. But it's worth it and it's the right thing to do. We need to get the North Island pumping.”

Steele said he believed the country needed three training centres and priority number one was the North Island.

Despite repeated pleas from trainers on how far they would have to travel to the new training centre, McKinnon would not reveal its location, except to say it was within half an hour of the present track.

“We're signing a memorandum of understanding with them, probably next week, and then we’ll go through the finer details to nail down exactly what we're going to do and how it's going to work.”

The intention was to lease the land and invest $20 million to build a track and 20 barns, similar to Menangle outside Sydney.

McKinnon said the entire complex could be set up quite quickly with a track put down next summer. Stonewall Stud owner Steve Stockman had come up with the design with factory-built barns, each with a walking machine.

Asked about the wisdom of investing $20 million on land it did not own, McKinnon said there would be a renewable 35-year lease.

Lincoln Farms’ boss John Street said he was sworn to secrecy over the location of the new training centre but assured trainers they would be “thrilled with it”.

McKinnon rebuffed suggestions the club should be selling Alexandra Park instead of Franklin Park, revealing that, while land around the course could be sold and developed, the track itself was a nationally protected venue. Under the Auckland Unitary Plan it was a special zone.

McKinnon said while Auckland Thoroughbred Racing had recently voted to sell the galloping track opposite Franklin Park, the ATC did not have the money to buy it.

But he was aware of the need to cause as little disruption as possible to the Pukekohe locals, knowing families had invested in housing and schooling.

 

[Brodie]

Investing in the North is worth it Brad??

Interesting times indeed, just incredible that it couldve got this bad for a once profitable Club.

The interest cost is going to add probably at least another $7 million of debt if only a deposit is paid and full payment isnt made for another 16 months or so, allowing for the other  payment reducing the loan! 
We can rest easy, we are in great hands.

[the galah]

so mr rubber has  ridden off on his white horse into the sunset.

but not before he told his supporters(which exist primarily in auckland and nowhere else),that Hrnz  can arrange for $20 million to go to the ATC from 6 funds,but hrnz are not providing any funding.

oh,and we hope its 20 million,as we still are doing the paperwork for the funding applications.

 

That of course is code for,instead of hrnz applying for the money and passing it on to the atc,lets just have it go directly to the atc,that way  the idiots in the rest of nz will be fooled into thinking they're not propping up auckland.

that man should run the country,hes that clever.Was he in sri lanka at one stage. nah,just kidding.

oh and hes still saying aucklands population is a significant factor in how he views the importance of auckland.

as i keep saying,name one positive thing to have happened for auckland ahrness racing from aucklands increasing population over the years. Just one positive trend which has impacted auckland racing in a good way. I keep asking that and no one ever answers it.

obviously mr lichter ran out of ink to finish his story.

you see,he didn't come to the part where neither the ATC or HRNZ have a plan to run meetings that generate break even results. You see,i would have thought they may have thought about that as any halfwit would realise its very important going forward.

anyway,good luck to auckland and harness racing throughout nz .

you'll need it.

anyway,mr steele has ridden off into the sunset,hi ho moneybags and away.

Edited Wednesday at 10:15 AM by the galah

[Nowornever]

A couple of key takeaways I can see here.

The club’s financial health is shaky enough that the bank has substantial control over decisions which is worrying in that bank driven sales often lead to accepting less than ideal terms. 

Another worrying sign for stakeholders is club priorities are now probably secondary to satisfying bank requirements.

[Nowornever]

Lots of red flags

Sale would not cover debt

What happens if sales do not go ahead? Still no guarantee of that happening.

Seems to be a reliance on third party funding - Steele said “The club also hoped to get money from various grants bodies... HRNZ itself was not giving the ATC any money, he knew of six funds the club could access.”

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, Nowornever said:

Lots of red flags

Sale would not cover debt

What happens if sales do not go ahead? Still no guarantee of that happening.

Seems to be a reliance on third party funding - Steele said “The club also hoped to get money from various grants bodies... HRNZ itself was not giving the ATC any money, he knew of six funds the club could access.”

We all hope it works out well for the ATC and Auckland harness racing.

They arent actually anyway better than when the Chinese pulled out, in fact with the continuing accrual of monthly interest they are decidedly worse off!

They still only have a conditional offer and they could well crash or they come back and renegotiate it down as they know the situation.

It is really a cot case and is going to be very very hard to see how the Auckand harness racing scene can thrive.

They are losing money on every meeting being run at Alexandra Park, they have no new trainers coming through and many will be retired in a few years at best!

Brad Steele thinks that investing into Auckland harness racing is a good thing, well I am sure he would not be investing any of his own money into it, as-he will lose it all!

just saying it as it is and more than happy to be proven wrong.

[Taku Umanga]

So, they're "close to signing a deal" and planning to commit funds to setting up a training centre prior to the unconditional date of the Franklin sale (November)?

Risky methinks.

[mikeynz]

At this time be nice to know where the funds from Forbury Park have ended up, strangely Forbury closed but was nothing like the mess Aucklands created, I say created, but im sure if one cent of Forbury funds went to Auckland  there would be some very angry people in some places, Forbury money stays in the South, and the money from Entain for geo blocking shouldn't go there either, that's for the betterment of Racing/ Harness racing, , Aucklands mess Aucklands problem, sad as it is.

[TAB For Ever]

On 7/23/2025 at 7:57 PM, the galah said:

isn't mr steele in auckland tonight trying to sell to aucklanders the best way to spend ten's of millions of hrnz funds on auckland.

i mean,he would be loving it up there.

the saviour has arrived. this could be his finest hour.

he would ride in on his white horse called moneybags,have money bags stomp his feet a few times to get everyones attention.

Then he would dismount,start unsaddling money bags by removing large sacks with writing on them like,forbury money,southland money,grass roots canterbury prizemoney.He would then pick them up,it would be a struggle as the bag with forbury money on it is rather heavy.

then he would throw them on the table where mr mckinnon sits and mr mckinnon would flash a cheeky grin and stand up and address the crowd and say,i told you this restructuring was going to be a piece of cake.

at that point brad,we know him well enough to call him by his first name,would spot tabman in the crowd. They would exchange a bit of banter,like your the man tabmanforever,no your the man brad,no your the man tabman,no your the man brad.

after about 5 minutes of that only jamie,yes we know mr mckinnon well enough to be on first name tems as well,will be the only one awake and he will be observed doing starfish motions on the money,(and n,o no sexual pun intended there). so brad will call out to money bags and have him stomp his feet and all the members will awake and mutter yes,just as they are asked to vote, as if they have been dreaming a nightmare that all of a sudden awoken to a happy ending.

then brad will whistle,money bags will come over,brad will jump on and let out a cry of,my work is done here, then a few hi ho money bags and away.

he will gallop back out the door,do a couple of laps of the field while the blues traini and yell out to them,this is crusaders country now you bunch of losers, then gallop off into the distance.

who was that masked man the blues players will say, wthwere will be whispers of ,was that  rob penny. but then jamie will come out of the meeting room say and yell,not ron penny boys ,that was brad steele. remember this day,you will tell your granchildren about it.

Quite an imagination here and its great to see Canterbury coming to the rescue as its been decades of support the other way ......when the Earthquakes hit Chch ,Auckland sent tens of $million's no fanfare , no issue no problem.

And mention of Rugby....who will ever forget the shocking start of Canterbury in the Super Rugby competition.....stone cold last , so the North ,especially Auckland starting sending the talent to boost the ailing Cantabs .

Caleb Ralph [120 games on end] Ron Cribb , Norm Maxwell , Norm Berryman , Keiran Read  plus a raft  of Fijians Auckland had recruited plus Taranaki lads and Scott Robertson from Mt Maunganui. Recent Captain Scott Barrett Taranaki etc. They became Invincible !

And as for Southland ,a region of struggling Trot Clubs they should chip in for Auckland too. One of them Tim Shadbolt saved Invercargill , that was losing population of 1000 per year . This Aucklander saved Southland ,much of their sport and economy.

Now the struggling rugby team down there the Highlanders hopes to be saved by a group of investing Aucklanders who make up the Board..PKeane,MEllis, CGallaher etc.

Auckland Harness needs some of their past 'love and money' in return . At least send them some money first ,then some horses[ Brad says 30 - 40 ] then bet on them !

                                                  

[Blackie]

Been hearing that for a little time now, only need 10 more horses, 20 more horses, now only need 40 more horses. On a declining foal population… yeah right. ATC should be looking further down the road and getting into bed with Cambridge, centralising there, and make whatever they have better, just not enough to go round to support the two there. This sunset industry we are in just needs to cut its cloth to the conditions it’s facing then it may stand a chance of a little bit longer. Golden days are gone, strong leadership needed.

[TAB For Ever]

1 hour ago, Blackie said:

Been hearing that for a little time now, only need 10 more horses, 20 more horses, now only need 40 more horses. On a declining foal population… yeah right. ATC should be looking further down the road and getting into bed with Cambridge, centralising there, and make whatever they have better, just not enough to go round to support the two there. This sunset industry we are in just needs to cut its cloth to the conditions it’s facing then it may stand a chance of a little bit longer. Golden days are gone, strong leadership needed.

Fair comment..........but realistically anything less than 40 horses extra ready to race each week isn't going to make much difference. And Northern horses have been drifting South in recent years and the Sale of horses from the North hasn't really stalled even with the extra stakes and Golden Gait carrots.

It still bloody expensive to own a horse and very hard in North for them to earn their keep.

And the active Auckland membership ,who surely must average close to 70 can't see any future for them moving to cambridge . It would limit their outings to races, a few hundred still attend and ownership would decrease. All the way through this Group have had plenty to say about the future of the Club but few if any have spoken up on matters nor voted the current out and new folk in.

Most realise there aint a lot of 'ideal' solutions. And the big players /trainers/ breeders do OK as things are .They don't want to move everything to Cambridge.

It only a glimmer of hope ,but the easiest current option and the best chance of a revival is a to battle on as at present and hope the Government and Funding/Grants organisations just GIFT the money to allow a reset and a 'new birth' for Harness in the North. Protects jobs etc etc

ps....The current leadership was not the same that created this mess , but the ones who supported the mistakes are the same . Go figure ! We now suggesting solutions !

[Blackie]

TAB, if you keep looking backwards you’ll get a sore neck. Canterbury not exactly flying either, need to remodel the whole god damn thing to survive.
Addington will get pushed out in years to come, just the way things go. So what if the 70 yr olds don’t want to travel, they aren’t the future. Lack of numbers every metric so need a reset.

 

[the galah]

i get why the auckland people continue to fight for whats best for auckland.

thats the way it should be.

But as to mr steele. This is what barry lichter reports he said at that meeting.

On 23/07/2025 at 9:35 PM, Nowornever said:

From Barry Lichter

 

Steele said that as a Queenslander he had no bias and his job was to ensure harness racing flourished in both islands, but particuarly in the North Island with its population base.

“I'm all-in, in terms of supporting the North Island. Yes, we do cop a bit of stick from Canterbury in terms of the money that we're investing. But it's worth it and it's the right thing to do. We need to get the North Island pumping.”

Steele said he believed the country needed three training centres and priority number one was the North Island.

 

what you have to do with mr steele is realise what he says and what he does are often 2 different things.

so he said, he has no bias but his job was to ensure harness racing flourishes,particularly in the north island. he says nz needs 3 training centres,but his number 1 priority is the north island.

so he recognises nz needs 3 training centres.(i believe they need 2,the other in canterbury.I have no idea where he thinks the other training centre should be).

But effectively what mr steele has done, is support the direction of funds HRNZ could tap into,to auckland,thus undermining any plans for HRNZ to use funds to purchase land and put  training centres in the other 2 parts of nz that he said needs it.

so mr steeles actions show he does have a bias and his words are a contradiction.

he says population base is why he thinks the north island can flourish.

Auckland people have used that as a talking point to rally support to their cause,i have no problem with that. But i really believe only dumb people believe that,as its so blatantly obvious that auckland harness racing has in the last 3 decades shrunk big time while the population has expanded. like, if population was a favourable factor,then wheres the proof. If you use logical thinking,population growth in auckland is part of the problem.I could refer to several negative issues impacting auckland harness racing caused by population growth. Can anyone name one positive?

i mean,mr steele should realise just because someone repeats something over and over doesn't it make it true. It may make more people think its true,but it still ain't true.

why are they spending 20 million on a piece of ground they don't own. No doubt they will spend millions more in the future maintaining it.

if they really do have access to 10's of millions of $ then they should be buying land,especially just out of christchurch .

They need to have a plan where they set up 2 training centres which can be transformed into future racetracks in 10-15 years times,so that they cash up aleaxandra park and addington and move ,thus ensuring a future of the sport. What HRNZ have done is support a plan that virtually takes that off the table. I mean,its not only mr steele that has no vision,its the whole board at hrnz. 

the training centres should be  set up in a way where parcels of land,of varying shapes and sizes, within that training centre are available  for both leasing and leasing with a right of purchase on the understanding that if someone does purchase land within that area that the land purpose must be for harness racing and that, in the event of any future sale by a purchaser ,hrnz has the right to either buy back or can approve any future buyer. Thus maintaining the control of the purpose of the  training centre.In effect using harness racing participants funds to make a training centre more affordable.

this investing over 20 million on somethg you don't own is typical hrnz think. again it illustrates they only think 5 years ahead and really don't have the intelligence to ensure the sport of harness racing continues in a viable way.

as to mr steele saying "we need to get the north island pumping". i wonder if he really believes tha can happen..Hey ,maybe he really does belive that. nah,i think he knows that won't happen.

finally,I think of a trainer in auckland . they are now going to get all those new facilities,get to run in small fields with good stakes,the warmer weather and all the things tabman referred to.

It got me thinking.If your a trainer in canterbury or southland ,who's currently getting up on these cold winter mornings and walks out into the paddocks gumboot high of mud,who trains their horses on frosty tracks,who has to maintain their own track and stables,who can see their owners no longer breeding so they will most likely have to send the wife out to work soon,and to be even handed,also send the mother in law out to work for that matter if shes living on the property.

Then i think auckland might need to spend an extra 10 million on those new auckland facilities for the influx of trainers As why struggle when life could be so much easier in auckland.

Heres a suggestion,that new auckland facilty seems to be an ideal place to put in an olympic size swimming pool where the trainers can lounge around in their swim wear ,watching one of the big screen tv's that the atc have bought for them.Given harness people seemingly are quite a randy lot from all the stories i've heard over the years,with the wife and mother in law away earning,they could have a young female(i had better not say stablehand as thats stereotyping),  rub a bit of sunblock on their backs (and tummies for the randy ones).The only issue i can see is,they may doze off on the lazy friday afternoons and there may be a few late sctaching at the ribbon of light.

Edited 11 hours ago by the galah