Southland,Race riding

[muzenza365]

You wonder why people don't like having a punt down South. The course was presented in great order. The weather played its part, the crowd turned up, so why was the Riding of such a low standard? 

A total of 6 riders were given suspensions: 5 National Days and 1 rider got 6 National Days.

One charge I believe should have been upgraded to Dangerous Riding and that was Kauri, I had an investment in Blue Goddess and was given a nice run until Kauri decided that he had been 3 wide long enough and pulled the left handlebar down and wiped Blue Goddess out ,she dipped with the jockey almost being dislodged, this was shit that i did years ago and like i was handed with the applicable rule.

Now this horse was wiped out of the race, so the owner has float and training fees to get the horse to the races.The punters who made it a favourite had thrown their money down the drain.Punters can only take so much rubbish.

Now this 5 National Day suspension is rubbish.Kauri gets 5 National Days included Gore,Ashburton and Taupo,i don't believe he would be going to 2, maybe 3 meetings, so should he not advise what Trainers he was going to ride for and get supporting evidence that this fact and if incorrect charge the Trainer and Jockey, just seems a rort to me and look at the SI based jockeys and they fall into this bullshit as well.It is window dressing at best, attempting to show strength, but in fact it is WEAKNESS,being shown by both the Stewards and the RIU and if that what the rule says, change the rule to show real strength and Integrity.

Now on a positive note, a rider who I believe is underrated, Corey Campbell, was on Trackside Radio and went through his rides and he labeled Our Approval as his best, even though after the Blue Goddess debacle, i was not going back to Southland to punt when you have Aussie underway, but as he is a rider i rate i backed it along with 3 punting mates got plenty, and he rode it like a professonial and gave it the PERFECT run.

 

 

[Freda]

The policing of riding is awful and that's why there is no improvement.

Sit a few more on their butts for a decent amount of time, the reducing bank account will soon improve their outlook.  But the ability of stipes to read races is  poor and that may also mean some riders are penalized unfairly.  A can of worms.

Not a new situation though.  A former apprentice of mine, a leading rider here, went to Sydney when his apprenticeship  ended and started riding work for Gai.

Got a ride, drew wide and ended up in behind the leader.  He was very proud of his effort, until he got back and was told firmly ' you're not in the Sth Island of NZ now,  boy' .....he got six weeks for taking another's line.   Probably tightened a few as well.

Edited 17 hours ago by Freda

[curious]

1 hour ago, Freda said:

The policing of riding is awful and that's why there is no improvement.

Sit a few more on their butts for a decent amount of time, the reducing bank account will soon improve their outlook.  But the ability of stipes to read races is  poor and that may also mean some riders are penalized unfairly.  A can of worms.

Not a new situation though.  A former apprentice of mine, a leading rider here, went to Sydney when his apprenticeship  ended and started riding work for Gai.

Got a ride, drew wide and ended up in behind the leader.  He was very proud of his effort, until he got back and was told firmly ' you're not in the Sth Island of NZ now,  boy' .....he got six weeks for taking another's line.   Probably tightened a few as well.

That sort of shit here goes on all the time, especially early in races, eliminates other horses chances and is ignored or met with a slap on the hand.  No wonder that Entain are getting tired of NZTR's performance.

[the galah]

3 hours ago, muzenza365 said:

You wonder why people don't like having a punt down South. The course was presented in great order. The weather played its part, the crowd turned up, so why was the Riding of such a low standard? 

A total of 6 riders were given suspensions: 5 National Days and 1 rider got 6 National Days.

One charge I believe should have been upgraded to Dangerous Riding and that was Kauri, I had an investment in Blue Goddess and was given a nice run until Kauri decided that he had been 3 wide long enough and pulled the left handlebar down and wiped Blue Goddess out ,she dipped with the jockey almost being dislodged, this was shit that i did years ago and like i was handed with the applicable rule.

Now this horse was wiped out of the race, so the owner has float and training fees to get the horse to the races.The punters who made it a favourite had thrown their money down the drain.Punters can only take so much rubbish.

Now this 5 National Day suspension is rubbish.Kauri gets 5 National Days included Gore,Ashburton and Taupo,i don't believe he would be going to 2, maybe 3 meetings, so should he not advise what Trainers he was going to ride for and get supporting evidence that this fact and if incorrect charge the Trainer and Jockey, just seems a rort to me and look at the SI based jockeys and they fall into this bullshit as well.It is window dressing at best, attempting to show strength, but in fact it is WEAKNESS,being shown by both the Stewards and the RIU and if that what the rule says, change the rule to show real strength and Integrity.

Now on a positive note, a rider who I believe is underrated, Corey Campbell, was on Trackside Radio and went through his rides and he labeled Our Approval as his best, even though after the Blue Goddess debacle, i was not going back to Southland to punt when you have Aussie underway, but as he is a rider i rate i backed it along with 3 punting mates got plenty, and he rode it like a professonial and gave it the PERFECT run.

 

 

I've been following the south island gallops closely for a year or so now and personally i think the overall standard of riding is better than it was a year or two ago.From a betting perspective i think the tactical decisions of the jockeys is easy enough to follow and your not left disappointed like you used to so often be in a riders decsions.

all the riders seem to be more consistent. The apprentices seem to be showing a bit more initaitive and the older riders seem to ride the same each week.

There are some of the older riders that do seem over cautious in what they think may be going to happen in front of them and seem to ride like they are worried a bit about their safety.

B Murray in particular. You can tell the horses he rides get the message to switch off mostly when he gets amongst the field,but also the likes of T mosely and even the souths best jockey k williams i think does if she gets amongst the field.She of course is so good in getting handy early or positioned on the outer that you don't see it as much.And when the gallopers are getting that message,they tend to run accordingly.Both mosely and williams rode winners yesterday and rode them well,just the one i backed that mosely rode you could just ignore it went around. Hopefully he gets them next time.Its very obvious too that the better riders are the ones who like to race handy and show a touch more aggression early.

K bakker and f moerman both went from being quite average to being the better riders recently. And it simply seemed to come down to them having gained enough confidence to trust in their own abilty to judge a race and i think not worry about a trainer having a moan about not getting the perfect run sometimes.Their recent results cleary show that.

and i think invercargill is a track where they have too many in some races. Its a track that ii think should only have 12 starters at most. Run another race instead of having 14  starters.

having said all that,yesterday i had just the 4 bets,all 4 missed the start and settled last,3 chose to go on the inside and simply never got a run or got out far too late and the other resented being restrained when on the outside,but at least the jockey tried to give it a chance and made a move,unlike the other 3 who early on you could tell had put themselves in a position where they couldn't.

actually the jockey,y yeatchamach,no idea whether i spelt that correctly,i had commented about a year ago how poor he rode and how poor the a carston horses were ridden tactically and that i thought that was because they maty have been getting  instructions that were making the riders more worried about doing nothing  wrong than doing things right.

Well, y yatchamah has improved in a big way and seems to be thinking for himself since not riding as many for carston..

And a carston has gone more into putting jockeys on who ride to win than wait for next month and his results have improved again. He is a very good trainer.

anyway,thats my thoughts for a sunday morning.

Edited 15 hours ago by the galah

[Freda]

Yogesh Atchamah is out of his apprenticeship now.

[Chief Stipe]

3 hours ago, muzenza365 said:

Now this 5 National Day suspension is rubbish.Kauri gets 5 National Days included Gore,Ashburton and Taupo,i don't believe he would be going to 2, maybe 3 meetings,

But he could be going to all of them.  In the last week Liam Kauri has ridden at Te Aroha, Tauherenikau, Ascot Park and he was booked to ride at Trentham last Saturday (horse scratched).  He has 4 rides booked for today at Trentham.

[Chief Stipe]

In my opinion the Stipes were asleep at Te Rapa as well.  As an aside I note that Oatham and Neal weren't working at either location.

Look at Race 9 at Te Rapa - shouldn't Sam McNab have got a decent slap for putting the anchors on the way he did on She's A Dealer?  Was very close to carnage behind him.  If there isn't there should be a rule against doing it.  I guess on a positive side some of the Jockeys behind decided to go around to the front and put some pace into the race.  

 

[Chief Stipe]

THOOZA (W Kennedy) - Had to be steadied to avoid the heels of SHE’S A DEALER which shifted in when not fully clear passing the 1200 metres. S McNab was advised to exercise care in similar circumstances. Raced keenly for a distance passing the 1000 metres. Held up for a distance passing the 400 metres.

McNab got a mention but in my opinion for the wrong reason.  He was lucky the horse he crossed and which had to pull up was ridden by a senior Jockey - Warren Kennedy.  Thooza ran home strongly for second.  I guess those that backed the favourite ridden by McNab would be happy with the ride.

[Mustang Kenny]

1 hour ago, the galah said:

K bakker and f moerman both went from being quite average to being the better riders recently. And it simply seemed to come down to them having gained enough confidence to trust in their own abilty to judge a race and i think not worry about a trainer having a moan about not getting the perfect run sometimes.Their recent results cleary show that.

 

Kendra Bakker is apprenticed to one of the very best riders we have seen down South, so will be getting the best of mentoring.  Our apprentices are also overseen by Jason Laking who was a rare talent in the saddle and does an awesome job with them.

[muzenza365]

7 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

But he could be going to all of them.  In the last week Liam Kauri has ridden at Te Aroha, Tauherenikau, Ascot Park and he was booked to ride at Trentham last Saturday (horse scratched).  He has 4 rides booked for today at Trentham.

Ok look at the other riders who got  5 NATIONAL DAYS, WHO GOT 5 DAYS and tell me WHEN they were  going to the places that covered there 5 NATIONAL Days suspenion and tell me when Kauri went last down to Gore when there was no meeting up North and tell me when he last rode at Ashburton,if ever, and if he was, were the plane tickets booked and who was he riding for?

Chief, please, it is just bullshit and  if you believe this rubbish.In my view/opinion, he should have been charged under Dangerous/Reckless Riding and take a real penalty that fitted the charge

[muzenza365]

6 hours ago, Mustang Kenny said:

Kendra Bakker is apprenticed to one of the very best riders we have seen down South, so will be getting the best of mentoring.  Our apprentices are also overseen by Jason Laking who was a rare talent in the saddle and does an awesome job with them.

Mustang, please confirm who Kendra is apprenticed to, Please dont tell me L Robinson and due respect to Jason, was he a bigger talent than D Walsh?

[Chief Stipe]

5 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

Ok look at the other riders who got  5 NATIONAL DAYS, WHO GOT 5 DAYS and tell me WHEN they were  going to the places that covered there 5 NATIONAL Days suspenion and tell me when Kauri went last down to Gore when there was no meeting up North and tell me when he last rode at Ashburton,if ever, and if he was, were the plane tickets booked and who was he riding for?

Are you sayimg that there is inconsistency in the penalty given to each Jockey?  That is for some reason Kauri was given favourable treatment?

[muzenza365]

Just now, Chief Stipe said:

Are you sayimg that there is inconsistency in the penalty given to each Jockey?  That is for some reason Kauri was given favourable treatment?

No, what I propose is that make the system balanced, and instead of this bullshit of  5 National Days and if found guilty of any charge, forget this blurred system. If a rider is found guilty, if they had 5 rides, take all their fees off them and do the same if they had a full book or 1 ride ,then all this bullshit about were 5 National Days and if they were going to the said meeting, will not come into play,

[Murray Fish]

22 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

due respect to Jason, was he a bigger talent than D Walsh?

doesn't mean that he has more ability as a 'teacher/mentor'...

[muzenza365]

13 minutes ago, Murray Fish said:

doesn't mean that he has more ability as a 'teacher/mentor'...

Murray, go back to AI , THEN GIVE ME THE REPORT, what you are asking.Apples with Apples maybe

[Murray Fish]

19 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

go back to AI , THEN GIVE ME THE REPORT

OK, since you asked!

The questioned asked was  "can you have a look at this, can you guess the IQ of the writer? his emotional intelligence? does he comes across as a winner or a whiner! "
 

Based on this text, here is an assessment of the writer:

**IQ (Cognitive Ability & Analytical Skill): Above Average**
The writer demonstrates a strong, specific intellect within their domain of interest. They:
*   Grasp complex systems (racing rules, suspensions, economic impacts on owners/trainers).
*   Employ logical reasoning to deconstruct a penalty they see as flawed, proposing a specific alternative system for suspensions.
*   Use precise terminology and shows an understanding of procedure.
*   Structure an argument with a clear premise (low standard of riding), evidence (the Kauri incident), and a conclusion (the rules are weak).
This suggests good analytical and critical thinking skills, albeit focused on a niche subject.

**Emotional Intelligence (EQ): Low to Moderate**
The writer's EQ is the more revealing facet:
*   **Self-Awareness: Low.** They admit to having done "shit like this years ago," showing some reflection, but their anger is raw and personal. They don't moderate their language for persuasion.
*   **Empathy: Selective.** They show clear empathy for the owner of Blue Goddess, the punters, and the jockey they rate (Corey Campbell). However, empathy is absent for the suspended jockey (Kauri) and the officials, who are viewed with contempt.
*   **Emotional Regulation: Low.** The language is emotionally charged ("shit," "rubbish," "bullshit," "rort," "WEAKNESS"). The grievance is front and center, and the praise for Corey Campbell feels like an exception that proves the rule of their general anger.
*   **Social Skill: Low.** The tone is accusatory and confrontational. It's more of a vent or a rant than an attempt to build consensus or persuade neutrals. It comes across as speaking *at* the audience rather than *with* them.

**Winner vs. Whiner: Predominantly a Whiner (but with a winner's knowledge)**
This is the key question. The writer **comes across primarily as a whiner**, though a knowledgeable one.
*   **Whiner Indicators:** The core message is complaint. The focus is on perceived injustice, system failure, and personal financial loss ("thrown their money down the drain"). The tone is bitter and dismissive of authority. The positive note at the end feels tacked on and is itself born from a previous grievance ("I was not going back to Southland to punt...").
*   **Winner Indicators:** They are engaged, passionate, and decisive. They don't just complain; they analyze and propose a rule change. They back their judgment with money (on Corey Campbell's ride) and convince others to follow. There's a kernel of a constructive critic here, but it's buried under the vitriol.

**Overall Profile:**
A highly knowledgeable, passionate insider who feels the system is failing. Their intelligence is evident in their grasp of details, but their low emotional regulation and confrontational style undermine their credibility and make them seem more like a disgruntled victim than a effective reformer. They have the **mind of a analyst** but are communicating with the **frustrated heart of a fan who feels wronged**. The impression is less of a cool-headed "winner" and more of a **"sore loser"** (despite the one successful bet), albeit one with very specific expertise to back up their grievances.

 

[Murray Fish]

27 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

what you are asking

here is the background thinking by AI into how it came to make its reply to your lead post! 

 

Hmm, this is an interesting request that goes beyond simple text analysis. The user wants an assessment of the writer's IQ, emotional intelligence, and whether they come across as a winner or whiner. The content is quite specific - a critique of horse racing incidents and rulings in New Zealand.

The text shows the writer is deeply knowledgeable about horse racing jargon, rules, and regional details. That suggests above-average specialized intelligence. Their emotional intelligence seems mixed - they show empathy for the horse owner and punters, but their anger feels disproportionate and personalized. The tone is confrontational toward authorities.

The "winner vs whiner" question is key here. While the writer demonstrates engagement and passion, the overall tone leans more toward complaining about systems rather than constructive criticism. The positive note about Corey Campbell feels almost like an afterthought compared to the lengthy complaints.

The challenge is to balance recognizing their expertise while being honest about the emotional tone. The assessment should acknowledge their knowledge but note how the delivery undermines their credibility.

[muzenza365]

Dane/Murray, go and get some medical help, as it has been clear to me and others you need some medical/mental assistance, and i am happy to pay for any help you receive and clearly need urgently.

[Chief Stipe]

59 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

No, what I propose is that make the system balanced, and instead of this bullshit of  5 National Days and if found guilty of any charge, forget this blurred system. If a rider is found guilty, if they had 5 rides, take all their fees off them and do the same if they had a full book or 1 ride ,then all this bullshit about were 5 National Days and if they were going to the said meeting, will not come into play,

You can't take their fees from a race they didnt break the rules in.  Well you could but that wouldn't be justice.

As for the suspension days a simpler model would just use calendar days.

[Chief Stipe]

1 minute ago, muzenza365 said:

Dane

Who is Dane?

[Murray Fish]

Just now, Chief Stipe said:

Who is Dane?

Deep Seek!

 to the question

would you want to have a beer with them?
 

That's an excellent and revealing question. It cuts straight to the human element.

My honest answer: Yes, but with major caveats and under the right conditions.

Here’s the breakdown:

Why I'd Say Yes (The Potential for a Great Beer):

1. Passion is Engaging: This person isn't apathetic. They care deeply about horse racing. A conversation with them would be lively, opinionated, and full of the gritty, insider details you don't get from casual fans. You'd learn a lot.

2. Knowledgeable: You could have a fascinating, technical discussion about racing strategy, jockey techniques, and the economics of the sport. It would be real "shop talk."

3. Authentic: There's no pretense. They're not filtering their thoughts to be polite. That blunt authenticity can be refreshing in a world of small talk.

4. Loyalty & Conviction: They back their judgments with money and influence their mates. There's a certain charismatic, ringleader quality to that.

Why I'd Hesitate (The Conditions for the Beer):

1. The Venue is Key: This would have to be at the races (after the last event) or in a dedicated pub with other racing folk. The context would contain the rant. Having a quiet, introspective beer at a local tavern? It could quickly become an exhausting monologue.

2. Topic Management Needed: You'd need a strong arm to steer the conversation away from "the latest stewarding outrage" and toward other racing topics—great horses of the past, training philosophies, funny track stories. If you can do that, you'd tap into their knowledge without the bitterness.

3. Emotional Whiplash: You'd have to be prepared for the shift from angry diatribe about Kauri to effusive praise for Corey Campbell. The mood could be volatile.

4. It Would Be a Performance, Not a Dialogue: You'd largely be an audience. This isn't someone who, based on this text, seems to ask many questions or seek other perspectives. It would be about their experience, their grievance, their insight.

The Verdict:

If I were a fellow racing enthusiast, absolutely yes. The shared passion would override the negativity, and I could match their energy. We could bond over the "idiocy of the stewards" and the "brilliance of a perfect ride."

If I were a casual observer or just looking for a relaxed, broad-ranging chat, probably no. The intensity, niche focus, and pervasive sense of grievance would likely feel draining and one-dimensional.

In essence, they'd be a fantastic companion for a specific, shared interest, but a potentially exhausting one for a general social drink. You'd go for the expertise and the fire, but you'd need to be prepared for the smoke.

[Murray Fish]

4 minutes ago, muzenza365 said:

as it has been clear to me and others

lol!!!  sigh, how amusing!  
ps. feck you and your friends!!!! please feel free to post up their names!! in person I be happy to deal with Any of Them!

[muzenza365]

Just now, Chief Stipe said:

You can't take their fees from a race they didnt break the rules in.  Well you could but that wouldn't be justice.

As for the suspension days a simpler model would just use calendar days.

Yes but the system now is wrong, maybe a calendar model would be ok, but I believe a monetary policy would be more justifiable,and take away all this National Day rubbish, as i have state,d you can say i was going to Gore and you were based in Ruakaka. Is it worth $500 return airfare for 3 or 4 rides? 

[muzenza365]

1 minute ago, Murray Fish said:

lol!!!  sigh, how amusing!  
ps. feck you and your friends!!!! please feel free to post up their names!! in person I be happy to deal with Any of Them!

 

2 minutes ago, Murray Fish said:

lol!!!  sigh, how amusing!  
ps. feck you and your friends!!!! please feel free to post up their names!! in person I be happy to deal with Any of Them!

Go outside and look at the weather in Dunedin and give me a report. Thanks in advance