Happy Sunrise Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Where there is smoke there is fire? Just read this part of an article in the Herald. Closing down access to the overseas betting agencies would be brutal but it would probably bring in more money to the industry. If you are a big punter you will still gamble I reckon. Its hard to stop ? The possibility, I think, seems in line with what is happening to New Zealanders when it comes to online shopping operating in NZ without restriction? There is even a job for Brodie mentioned in the article. A good article by Mick too I might add if you want to have a look in the Herald. $400m dilemma for industry It is the industry money maker nobody seems to be talking about and many punters won't want put in place. But banning New Zealanders from betting with overseas agencies could be one of the quickest money makers for the struggling racing industry. At present Kiwi punters enjoy some of the most liberal internet betting laws in the world and many, including those at the top of the three racing codes, bet not just with the TAB but with overseas bookmakers, most via the internet. Latest estimates suggest more than $400 million a year is lost to overseas betting agencies and while the new point of consumption tax and race fields legislation will claw some profits back from that, if that $400m was bet with the New Zealand TAB, the returns to the local industry would be enormously higher. Of course not all that $400m would bet here if the overseas options disappeared but put simply, if Kiwis could only bet with the TAB here, the racing and sports industries would make a lot more money. That would effectively give the TAB a monopoly on all racing and sports gambling conducted in New Zealand and has a second, hugely important benefit. Officials from overseas agencies set to bid for a New Zealand betting licence have confirmed they would pay significantly more for those rights if they were a monopoly, which would translate to a much bigger up-front payment to the racing industry. Of course, having only one bookmaker available to New Zealand punters could see them at the mercy of markets set to brutally high percentages but that could be tempered by rules around setting markets and even a punters' watchdog agency, who ensured markets and restrictions on winning punters were kept in line with overseas norms. Closing New Zealand punting borders would require a legislative change and wouldn't be popular with the punters who currently enjoy a myriad of options. But it poses the question for punters: are you willing to cop less choice about where you bet if the whole industry profits? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theshu Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Maybe it would help if you actually had a tab that worked.All i seem to read on here is that the tab keeps breaking down or is so slow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Sunrise Posted July 15, 2019 Author Share Posted July 15, 2019 1 hour ago, theshu said: Maybe it would help if you actually had a tab that worked.All i seem to read on here is that the tab keeps breaking down or is so slow. That would require some self reflection by the TAB but the only type they are interested in seems to start with ... mirror mirror on the wall..... I am still not a fan of the TAB site by the way. Bothersome. Maybe they could use the money they get from shutting out foreign betting agencies to restore the old TAB site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) The NZ TAB has progressively got worse as a gambling agency! They are currently being saved by sports betting as horse punters are getting screwed big time. They want turnover to increase on racing however they don’t want to payout to anyone that looks remotely like they know what they are doing. The watchdog is going to be increased even more by this punters card and has very little to do with money laundering! Racing is stuffed in NZ in many ways now and the NZ TAB is one of the major reasons it isn’t going to get any better, unless they change Their useless policies! Edited July 15, 2019 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 31 minutes ago, Brodie said: The NZ TAB has progressively got worse as a gambling agency! They are currently being saved by sports betting as horse punters are getting screwed big time. They want turnover to increase on racing however they don’t want to payout to anyone that looks remotely like they know what they are doing. The watchdog is going to be increased even more by this punters card and has very little to do with money laundering! Racing is stuffed in NZ in many ways now and the NZ TAB is one of the major reasons it isn’t going to get any better, unless they change Their useless policies! who is the mp for redwood 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newmarket Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 2 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said: Where there is smoke there is fire? Just read this part of an article in the Herald. Closing down access to the overseas betting agencies would be brutal but it would probably bring in more money to the industry. If you are a big punter you will still gamble I reckon. Its hard to stop ? The possibility, I think, seems in line with what is happening to New Zealanders when it comes to online shopping operating in NZ without restriction? There is even a job for Brodie mentioned in the article. A good article by Mick too I might add if you want to have a look in the Herald. $400m dilemma for industry It is the industry money maker nobody seems to be talking about and many punters won't want put in place. But banning New Zealanders from betting with overseas agencies could be one of the quickest money makers for the struggling racing industry. At present Kiwi punters enjoy some of the most liberal internet betting laws in the world and many, including those at the top of the three racing codes, bet not just with the TAB but with overseas bookmakers, most via the internet. Latest estimates suggest more than $400 million a year is lost to overseas betting agencies and while the new point of consumption tax and race fields legislation will claw some profits back from that, if that $400m was bet with the New Zealand TAB, the returns to the local industry would be enormously higher. Of course not all that $400m would bet here if the overseas options disappeared but put simply, if Kiwis could only bet with the TAB here, the racing and sports industries would make a lot more money. That would effectively give the TAB a monopoly on all racing and sports gambling conducted in New Zealand and has a second, hugely important benefit. Officials from overseas agencies set to bid for a New Zealand betting licence have confirmed they would pay significantly more for those rights if they were a monopoly, which would translate to a much bigger up-front payment to the racing industry. Of course, having only one bookmaker available to New Zealand punters could see them at the mercy of markets set to brutally high percentages but that could be tempered by rules around setting markets and even a punters' watchdog agency, who ensured markets and restrictions on winning punters were kept in line with overseas norms. Closing New Zealand punting borders would require a legislative change and wouldn't be popular with the punters who currently enjoy a myriad of options. But it poses the question for punters: are you willing to cop less choice about where you bet if the whole industry profits? So no overseas punters, anywhere, will be allowed to bet with the nz tab? Must work both ways. Bizarre really, because we know overseas punters bet more money at the nz tab, than nz punters betting with overseas agencies??? Surely they can see this?? FFS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Sunrise Posted July 15, 2019 Author Share Posted July 15, 2019 5 minutes ago, Newmarket said: So no overseas punters, anywhere, will be allowed to bet with the nz tab? Must work both ways. Like going to OZ and not being able to access your NZ TAB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 this would be wrong whilst the tab remains a monopoly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newmarket Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 35 minutes ago, Happy Sunrise said: Like going to OZ and not being able to access your NZ TAB. Yes, i know oz you cant use nz tab account. But other countries allow punters to bet on nz tab, which they allow. So will this stop? How can they stop me betting on aussie races with an aussie operator? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Sunrise Posted July 15, 2019 Author Share Posted July 15, 2019 1 minute ago, Newmarket said: How can they stop me betting on aussie races with an aussie operator? Easy. Block the domain names. Just the same way the Chinese government do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Happy Sunrise said: Easy. Block the domain names. Just the same way the Chinese government do it. The way around it would be just to get a VPN for Aussie. "A friend" has told me it is easily done and they change their VPN from country to country depending on the content that they wish to view. I would never do that though. Wouldn't dare. Government knows best. Don't hate the player, hate the game. Edited July 15, 2019 by Rusty 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Rangatira said: who is the mp for redwood It certainly isn’t Winnie, Minister for Racing. What has he actually done for racing that has been beneficial? Edited July 15, 2019 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 10 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said: Like going to OZ and not being able to access your NZ TAB. You probably already know this, but for those that don't; If going to Aussie on holiday, you can continue to use the NZ TAB website via your cell phone, on the global roaming option. Check with your mobile provider on how to set this up. For some companies, it is automatic, but there will be a small daily charge. For Vodafone it is/was $5 per day (about to be $7 per day if not already) and one could continue to use their phone as per their NZ terms and conditions (eg. Free minutes, texts and mobile data usage). If using wifi on your cell phone in Aussie, the NZ TAB will be blocked. The key to it is using your mobile data and electing for the global roaming option. God bless gambling. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
globederby12 Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 This subject about access to NZ TAB has come up before on here.My son in Melbourne showed me how to trick the site into thinking you were somewhere else and access was simple. That was from a computer or laptop/ tablet.. Not sure about a cellphone though. But here is great story. "A leading Australian bookmaker is refunding punters who backed NZ to win the cricket World Cup final. Sportsbet says it has refunded over 11000 people nearly $450,000 describing the method used to determine England as winners , the countback on boundaries an "absolute disgrace. Touched to that. Someone get in touch with our guys here at the TAB and see if they can reciprocate for the embattled NZ punter. Ppphhhhh. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 20 minutes ago, globederby12 said: This subject about access to NZ TAB has come up before on here.My son in Melbourne showed me how to trick the site into thinking you were somewhere else and access was simple. That was from a computer or laptop/ tablet.. Not sure about a cellphone though. But here is great story. "A leading Australian bookmaker is refunding punters who backed NZ to win the cricket World Cup final. Sportsbet says it has refunded over 11000 people nearly $450,000 describing the method used to determine England as winners , the countback on boundaries an "absolute disgrace. Touched to that. Someone get in touch with our guys here at the TAB and see if they can reciprocate for the embattled NZ punter. Ppphhhhh. Ridiculous that Kiwis can not have a bet on their TAB account just because you are on holiday! Great that Sportsbet is going to pay out to punters on NZ winning the cricket World Cup, however it does seem rather weird that the average bet in NZ to win is only $40??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rusty Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Great marketing move by Sportsbet. They can't advertise in NZ, not allowed to. However by doing this (refunding punters) they are getting great media exposure to not only NZ punters but also the general public, whereas normally they couldn't achieve this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 12 hours ago, Brodie said: It certainly isn’t Winnie, Minister for Racing. What has he actually done for racing that has been beneficial? in a previous coalition he did manage to get a decent amount of money that was mainly squandered on top end stakes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 15, 2019 Share Posted July 15, 2019 Yes it was very Sporting that Sportsbet refunded the $450k as a token of good will, and they will get it back from those punters anyway. $450k doesn’t seem very much for 11000 punters who backed NZ to win as it is only $40 per punter? There must’ve some big bets but most of them had to have been pretty small! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newmarket Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 But why on earth would they stop nzers punting overseas??? If they took that stand, surely they must stop taking punters money from overseas punters??? They would lose in that deal, as most of their elite punters are from overseas? What am i missing? Do they expect all the punters that they lost, closed accounts, no free trackside, closed tabs, site and app issues, you name it, do they expect all of these punters to come back?? FFS. Just looking at my punting last week, 40% beteasy, 40% betfair, 20% nz tab, only because i have been betting on some of their promotions and nz quads. Just take my 20% tab, if you try to stop me punting overseas, i think my support of nz racing will dwindle more, less than 20% i would say 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 13 minutes ago, Newmarket said: But why on earth would they stop nzers punting overseas??? If they took that stand, surely they must stop taking punters money from overseas punters??? They would lose in that deal, as most of their elite punters are from overseas? What am i missing? Do they expect all the punters that they lost, closed accounts, no free trackside, closed tabs, site and app issues, you name it, do they expect all of these punters to come back?? FFS. Just looking at my punting last week, 40% beteasy, 40% betfair, 20% nz tab, only because i have been betting on some of their promotions and nz quads. Just take my 20% tab, if you try to stop me punting overseas, i think my support of nz racing will dwindle more, less than 20% i would say Newmarket, because they aren’t overly intelligent the hierarchy of the NZ TAB. They don’t tend to be too worried that punters in NZ are pissed off with them, they live in dreamland and as long as their exorbitant salaries come thru, they don’t care about the Punters. The Elite punters you say are mostly from overseas? They must surely be heavily restricted or if they are losing punters why are they bothering to bet in little of NZ? Is Winston correct, and are there all these punters from NZ and around the world money laundering money into NZ through NZ Bookies and tote??????? Seems like a weird way of doing things, although they say it is only being done to protect us all! Can anyone please advise us of what we need to be protected from, apart from the control of the NZ TAB and the NZ government, Big Brother? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sandpiper Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 18 hours ago, Happy Sunrise said: Easy. Block the domain names. Just the same way the Chinese government do it. That would be pretty funny to see them try. The betting agencies just won't accept NZ customers any more is my guess. They already have plenty of banned territories and anti money laundering processes etc. If you don't have a valid overseas debit/credit card and address, good luck. And even then you know they will most likely run their double-checks when it's time to make a withdrawal... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Sandpiper said: And even then you know they will most likely run their double-checks when it's time to make a withdrawal... the brodster would be apoplectic 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Counter Punch Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 4 hours ago, Brodie said: Yes it was very Sporting that Sportsbet refunded the $450k as a token of good will, and they will get it back from those punters anyway. $450k doesn’t seem very much for 11000 punters who backed NZ to win as it is only $40 per punter? There must’ve some big bets but most of them had to have been pretty small! Refund was paid out in bonus bets. So, yes - they are getting it back. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 1 hour ago, Rangatira said: the brodster would be apoplectic Ranga, did you swallow a dictionary? Never heard of that word before, so had to google it. Will just give it away, as I am not going to play by Big Brothers rules of having to identify myself just because I have collected over $1k, it is absolute BS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted July 16, 2019 Share Posted July 16, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Counter Punch said: Refund was paid out in bonus bets. So, yes - they are getting it back. Fair enough I suppose CP, at the end of the day they didn’t have to! The Thing is the betting agencies are trying to attract new punters by offering the money back on various options even if they don’t win, but the money back is only being pathetic amounts! Obviously it is to gain punters to the habit and to keep them gambling. However if that punter that they have attracted wins, they say bugger that, we will restrict or shut them down! They certainly don’t want to take the good with the bad and certainly don’t play fair!!!!!! Edited July 16, 2019 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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