The Centaur Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 One factor most will agree on is the more effort one puts in the more one can expect out of it in the long run. So we get to the most important factor that is TIME and lets face it most people have little to spare of it. So anything that makes time more productive with horses is valuable. Something to remember with form racing web sites. Its not the so called winners they may produce but the amount of time they save extracting the information one requires. That also applies to going to the races. Unless its for social or commercial reasons one might as well make the most of the "time" at the races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Diceman's Been Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 This photo is of Ortensia at Newmarket. The rider just happens to be a part owner of the filly racing today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 So Tongue Tie & Back Markers are now the go?. So leaders with Blinkers are now not good bets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 6 minutes ago, curious said: ROI? Any evidence of that from a punting perspective? I'm surprised that you now trust the trainer on this. I thought you relied on stats. I've always reiterated that I trust the trainer on gear changes...on a neddy I've sorted out... ..I may even reduce investments on a neddy who's now racing in ear covers or bandages... If you call superior form in a better class of race back to inferior neddys...stats Thats your problem...I call it superior obvious form analysis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Centaur said: One factor most will agree on is the more effort one puts in the more one can expect out of it in the long run. So we get to the most important factor that is TIME and lets face it most people have little to spare of it. So anything that makes time more productive with horses is valuable. Something to remember with form racing web sites. Its not the so called winners they may produce but the amount of time they save extracting the information one requires. That also applies to going to the races. Unless its for social or commercial reasons one might as well make the most of the "time" at the races. Not necessarily so, a punter like Thomass can spend exceptional time and get no better results as his time is misguided and wasted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 9 minutes ago, barryb said: So Tongue Tie & Back Markers are now the go?. So leaders with Blinkers are now not good bets? Lets not go down the fiddle sticks root bazza... This thread should be a genuine attempt to help other Punters through their greatest torment in life...other than keeping the princess happy...picking winners at value... Mind You the winner of the first at TA had side winkers on first time...and it appeared to help it turn its form around...immensely ..straight to the front and too scared to look behind to see the scary monster coming at it... oh and BO first up is pretty good too...added 30% to Tileys horse in the last a week back...goes well fresh, form in superior fields, BO first up... ...always an indicator they're serious first up...give you that 'niche' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 That post race niche works well. I've not worked out a way of actually backing them for a return using it. Perhaps thomass should be telling us more about how he's managed that. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Trouble is Thomass, you are terribly misguided and you are more of a hindrance than assistance. No doubt you think you are helping out in your mind, however you are steering anyone silly enough to follow what you are posting down a poor house track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, mardigras said: That post race niche works well. I've not worked out a way of actually backing them for a return using it. Perhaps thomass should be telling us more about how he's managed that. Hahaha Amazingly I find every winner post race, just shows how bad T is when he cant even do that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Paul Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 10 minutes ago, barryb said: Amazingly I find every winner post race, just shows how bad T is when he cant even do that. I can't find some of them even after the fact! It is not an exact science. Steve. Great thread by the way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 29 minutes ago, The Diceman's Been said: This photo is of Ortensia at Newmarket. The rider just happens to be a part owner of the filly racing today. Is that a Girl or a boy D? Messara still training fgs? He's got far too much time on his hands if he's still doing that to keep busy. Arrowfield Stud Guy is a pretty big job.... Its showing 3's...whoopee You're not chasing your money on 3 shots are you D? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Diceman's Been Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 You are putting yourself in a precarious position Mr Arse. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Diceman's Been Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 23 minutes ago, Thomass said: Is that a Girl or a boy D? Messara still training fgs? He's got far too much time on his hands if he's still doing that to keep busy. Arrowfield Stud Guy is a pretty big job.... Its showing 3's...whoopee You're not chasing your money on 3 shots are you D? That is Leah Gavranich, a young lady who was a track rider in Perth who joined Arrowfield twelve years ago and who has been on a magic journey ever since......with one exception. https://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/superracing/man-charged-after-attack-on-female-strapper-in-mounting-yard-at-flemington/news-story/b3f99f28226349abfec20152248cfcbf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Diceman's Been Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 The money told the tale. The filly might be worth trying at 2000 metres plus, or ……….. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 42 minutes ago, The Diceman's Been said: The money told the tale. The filly might be worth trying at 2000 metres plus, or ……….. Maybe take the blinkers off. Gold apparently. Or is that on, I can't remember. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomass Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 That filly needs a touch more ground alright D.. ...there's plenty out the back of Widden Valley... Have you whispered in her ear about her royal family? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally Posted June 19, 2018 Author Share Posted June 19, 2018 3 minutes ago, Thomass said: That filly needs a touch more ground alright D.. ...there's plenty out the back of Widden Valley... Have you whispered in her ear about her royal family? if only it had a tongue tie 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 Just now, wally said: if only it had a tongue tie It did. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wally Posted June 19, 2018 Author Share Posted June 19, 2018 48 minutes ago, The Diceman's Been said: The money told the tale. The filly might be worth trying at 2000 metres plus, or ……….. dont worry dice im happy i took a roving tri with it and won 300 well done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Centaur Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 I'll introduce another factor which is never listed on any race form manual or training manual. i.e. SLEEP Now horse trainers will go into the science of feeding, workouts etc yet ask any athlete what they consider the most important for a peak performance and chances are they will say getting a good night sleep even golfers.Why should horses be any different? But for horses getting a good night's sleep is dependent on workout and feed. Many trainers just assume its its in the feed or workouts but if athletes are to believed the answer is sleep. Winter time requires peak fitness not necessarily galloping ability. Horses racing on their home course usually can be relied on having a good nights sleep. And Barry I realize you will advise Thom would do better just sleeping. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 2 minutes ago, The Centaur said: I'll introduce another factor which is never listed on any race form manual or training manual. i.e. SLEEP Now horse trainers will go into the science of feeding, workouts etc yet ask any athlete what they consider the most important for a peak performance and chances are they will say getting a good night sleep even golfers.Why should horses be any different? But for horses getting a good night's sleep is dependent on workout and feed. Many trainers just assume its its in the feed or workouts but if athletes are to believed the answer is sleep. Winter time requires peak fitness not necessarily galloping ability. Horses racing on their home course usually can be relied on having a good nights sleep. And Barry I realize you will advise Thom would do better just sleeping. No doubt an important factor. But like so many, how do we actually get the info. Do we get the trainer to do a daily report? How will they actually know? A bit like feed regimes, beach training. Do we require all sorts of info to make decisions. For some, no matter how much info is given out, it won't make any difference. Yet there is a cost in providing a lot of it. And things like sleep is a measure that is likely going to be subjective as we can't really ask the horse. My view on getting an edge often relates more to determining what other punters think is important for a horse that you don't think is as important - or vice versa. If punters think the same thing about some aspect of form, it is hardly likely to lead to them having an edge. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barryb Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 4 minutes ago, mardigras said: My view on getting an edge often relates more to determining what other punters think is important for a horse that you don't think is as important - or vice versa. If punters think the same thing about some aspect of form, it is hardly likely to lead to them having an edge. Exactly right, I spend far far more time researching what might be the best price I can get and trying to predict which way it will move in the market, based on what the Thomass's will do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
curious Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 (edited) 33 minutes ago, mardigras said: No doubt an important factor. But like so many, how do we actually get the info. Do we get the trainer to do a daily report? How will they actually know? A bit like feed regimes, beach training. Do we require all sorts of info to make decisions. For some, no matter how much info is given out, it won't make any difference. Yet there is a cost in providing a lot of it. And things like sleep is a measure that is likely going to be subjective as we can't really ask the horse. My view on getting an edge often relates more to determining what other punters think is important for a horse that you don't think is as important - or vice versa. If punters think the same thing about some aspect of form, it is hardly likely to lead to them having an edge. I only back horses that are fitted with sleep monitors where I can get direct reports from trainers, provided of course that they meet other criteria such as tongue ties, blinkers and lasix and that I know where the fast lane is on the track, even if the horse doesn't. Edited June 19, 2018 by curious 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 30 minutes ago, barryb said: Exactly right, I spend far far more time researching what might be the best price I can get and trying to predict which way it will move in the market, based on what the Thomass's will do. Which just makes the desire for all these penetrometer reading across the track equally futile. Who will actually get there first and all the other punters will be coming up with their own guesses. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mardigras Posted June 19, 2018 Share Posted June 19, 2018 (edited) 9 minutes ago, curious said: I only back horses that are fitted with sleep monitors where I can get direct reports from trainers, provided of course that they meet other criteria such as tongue ties, blinkers and lasix and that I know where the fast lane is on the track, even if the horse doesn't. Sadly we don't all have your sources. thomass should pay good money for that. All you need now is some telepathy to get the information about the fast lane to your horse before some other horse gets there first. Edited June 19, 2018 by mardigras Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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