Noverre

[Peanut]

Shame to see this very smart 3yo may have run its last race.  But at least its still entire and has a Group One win for its Stallion breeding syndicate so will be very valuable.    Just out of interest since this sort of thing has to be legally disclosed.  If/when it is sold to a stud does anyone know what commission is payable to the trainer or the manager or both? 

[Chief Stipe]

29 minutes ago, Peanut said:

Just out of interest since this sort of thing has to be legally disclosed.

Why does it have to be legally disclosed?

30 minutes ago, Peanut said:

If/when it is sold to a stud does anyone know what commission is payable to the trainer or the manager or both? 

Depends on the ownership contract.  The going rate is 10%.  Could be anywhere between 0% and 10%.

[Peanut]

41 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Why does it have to be legally disclosed?

Because it is an NZTR rule as i understand it. 

41 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Depends on the ownership contract.  The going rate is 10%.  Could be anywhere between 0% and 10%.

Ok  ive never seen an ownership contract. 

[nomates]

The going rate for a sale as a racehorse is 10% , once a horse is retired to stud generally the trainer is out of the loop . 

In this situation i would suspect because it was a syndicate put together dedicated to making stallions it would be written into the contract that Te Akau , the business not the training operation , get a percentage . Te Akau's business is run along of the complete management of the horse from start to finish .

When Our Maizcay was retired thru injury there was dispute when he was sold to stud , one party thought they should get a percentage and the other didn't . Never got resolved , but there was no legal recourse for the party that thought they should get a percentage .

As for Noverre , it's a shame as he looked to have a big future , not sure of his value , maybe somewhere between 1-2mil at a guess . As much as they like to hype the Guineas as a stallion making race it hasn't really produced to any great level , Darci Brahma probably the best in recent years .

[Huey]

2 hours ago, nomates said:

The going rate for a sale as a racehorse is 10% , once a horse is retired to stud generally the trainer is out of the loop . 

In this situation i would suspect because it was a syndicate put together dedicated to making stallions it would be written into the contract that Te Akau , the business not the training operation , get a percentage . Te Akau's business is run along of the complete management of the horse from start to finish .

When Our Maizcay was retired thru injury there was dispute when he was sold to stud , one party thought they should get a percentage and the other didn't . Never got resolved , but there was no legal recourse for the party that thought they should get a percentage .

As for Noverre , it's a shame as he looked to have a big future , not sure of his value , maybe somewhere between 1-2mil at a guess . As much as they like to hype the Guineas as a stallion making race it hasn't really produced to any great level , Darci Brahma probably the best in recent years .

Form is suspect for mine, but then I guess that's going to be the case no matter what in NZ.

Shouldn't stand for more than $2k in the NZ market, but they'll toss him around the Embellish level and find a home for him.

[nomates]

Yeah Embellish is the bar for pricing him , although the Lyndsey's had already bought into Embellish , but he stands at 4k , shares maybe 12k , valued him at under 1mil , so will be interesting .

[Doomed]

What exactly has happened to Noverre? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

[Huey]

4 minutes ago, Doomed said:

What exactly has happened to Noverre? I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere.

The comment I read was only that he sustained an injury so can't identify what, makes ya wonder if it had anything to do with him being a Stallion proposition as to why it wasn't mentioned or perhaps its a show of recovery?

[Peanut]

22 hours ago, Huey said:

Form is suspect for mine, but then I guess that's going to be the case no matter what in NZ.

Shouldn't stand for more than $2k in the NZ market, but they'll toss him around the Embellish level and find a home for him.

Not a great ROI.  But at least he potentially still has a breeding career unlike Lethal and No Limits. 

[Doomed]

I still haven't read anything about this anywhere else. Is this an actual story? Seems strange that a Group 1 winner would break down or whatever and not get a single mention anywhere other than this one conversation.

[Huey]

1 hour ago, Doomed said:

I still haven't read anything about this anywhere else. Is this an actual story? Seems strange that a Group 1 winner would break down or whatever and not get a single mention anywhere other than this one conversation.

Correct it might be a hint as to what the problem with the horse might be? Only guessing however.

[Chief Stipe]

5 minutes ago, Huey said:

Correct it might be a hint as to what the problem with the horse might be? Only guessing however.

Hint?  Can you be anymore obtuse?

[nod]

There was an article in the N Z Herald detailing the breakdown

[Chief Stipe]

Racing: Noverre career crisis after ligament damage

9 Dec, 2021 05:45 AM3 minutes to read

Star three-year-old Noverre, winning the 2000 Guineas at Riccarton last month, may have to be retired to stud after suffering ligament damage. Photo / Race Images

 

The career of superstar New Zealand three-year-old Noverre could be over, long before it reached anything like its potential.

But if an injury suffered last month does bring a sudden halt to his racetrack career at least it comes after the victory that will guarantee him a new life at stud.

Noverre has being diagnosed with ligament damage just below a sesamoid bone, close to the suspensory, and while he will undergo another veterinary examination next week the initial prognosis is not good.

"They are already suggesting to us he may have to be retired to stud," says Te Akau boss David Ellis, who bought Noverre to be trained by Jamie Richards.

"So we will know more soon but the studs are already ringing so we know he will have a good home to go to."

The news will shock racing fans who were still trying to work out just how good Noverre may be.

After winning as a two-year-old the big, bold son of Savabeel went to a whole new level this season and won two of his four starts, including his dazzling victory in the 2000 Guineas at Riccarton on November 6.

Noverre was forced back to last in the group one classic but exploded home under Opie Bosson in a style that suggests he may be one of the more talented recent winners of the Guineas and one with the scope to reach a Derby distance or race at group level in Australia.

"The vets are suggesting to us this is an injury that most likely happened at speed so we are nearly certain he did it in the Guineas, which makes how he won even more incredible," says Ellis.

Bred by Chittick Investment, of Waikato Stud fame, it wouldn't surprise to see Noverre end up standing at the iconic farm himself next year should the initial sire veterinary reports show no improvement and force him to stud.

Even if Noverre enjoys a miracle recovery and races again it won't be this summer and that has seen him removed from the market for the $1million Karaka Classic Mile on January 23, for which he was favourite.

The depth of Te Akau's strength is best summed up by the fact stablemate and last season's Karaka Million hero On The Bubbles is the new favourite for what is quickly becoming one of Ellerslie's iconic races.

On The Bubbles resumes at Te Rapa's star-studded meeting on Saturday his first start since winning the group one Sires' Produce at Awapuni last April and will carry 60.5kgs in the three-year-old race to open the programme.

With the Captain Cook Stakes and Wakefield Challenge from last Saturday's abandoned Trentham meeting having been transferred to Te Rapa and joining the Skycity Hamilton Waikato Cup, Cal Isuzu Stakes and a super-strong J Swap Sprint the meeting will be the strongest held in New Zealand so far this season.

[curious]

Yes. Do. Good discussion but nothing to do with Noverre anymore.

[Chief Stipe]

https://loveracing.nz/Common/SystemTemplates/Modal/Video.aspx?v=http%3a%2f%2fwww.racingreplays.co.nz%2fmedia%2f202111%2fCBRY-R08-061121.mp4&i=%2fCommon%2fImage.ashx%3fw%3d565%26h%3d314%26a%3d1%26o%3d1%26z%3d1%26bg%3deeeeee%26p%3dhttp%3a%2f%2fwww.racingreplays.co.nz%2fmedia%2f202111%2fCBRY-R08-061121.jpg&r=Race 8 - AL BASTI EQUIWORLD DUBAI 49TH NEW ZEALAND 2000 GUINEAS®&rs=1&jwsource=cl

[nomates]

Perhaps you could xfer my last post over to the SI programming thread chief .

[Chief Stipe]

G1 NZ 2000 Guineas Winner Noverre Retired to Stud

Media Release - Monday December 27

Te Akau Racing principal David Ellis has announced the retirement of Gr.1 New Zealand 2000 Guineas (1600m) winner Noverre.

 

Noverre has been retired and will stand at Waikato Stud.

“Noverre has been retired and has been bought by Waikato Stud and he’ll stand next season at Waikato Stud,” Ellis said on Weigh In.

The classy son of champion sire Savabeel, was out of the money only once in his seven starts, with his three career wins including the Gr.3 War Decree Stakes (1600m) to go with his 2000 Guineas victory.

The handsome entire had his career cut short after sustaining ligament damage just below a sesamoid bone, close to the suspensory last month.

Bred by Chittick Investments Ltd, Noverre was an $800,000 purchase from Waikato Stud’s 2020 Book 1 yearling draft at Karaka.

Noverre is the first named foal out of the Group Three winning Rip Van Winkle mare Magic Dancer, who in turn is out of the multiple stakes winner Dazzling Belle.

Waikato Stud retained a share in the well-bred colt who was set to contest feature races in Australia through the autumn.

Ellis also announced plans for Sunday’s impressive Listed Uncle Remus Stakes (1400m) winner On The Bubbles, who will now head to the Karaka Million 3YO Classic (1600m) at Ellerslie on January 22.

“I have no doubt he’ll get a mile, he’ll probably get 2000m if that’s the sort of race we needed him to win,” Ellis said. 

“Any two-year-old that can get 1400m on a soft track at Awapuni will always get a mile as a three-year-old.”

Ellis was also positive about the decision to move the annual New Zealand Bloodstock Yearling Sale series from the traditional January date to now start on March 7.

“When I was looking at the horses for the Ready to Run sale I saw a few yearlings at that time and I thought this is a vintage year, a vintage crop of yearlings, absolutely top quality,” he said. 

“I can’t wait to start looking at them in early February. It is going to be very exciting to see how the sale works in that period in March, I think it’ll be very successful and certainly gives me the first January at the beach ever.”

[Huey]

How many times has he said this .... " I thought this is a vintage year, a vintage crop of yearlings, absolutely top quality,” he said. "

They have a marketing department get some new material.

[KickintheKods]

What a guy that David Ellis is. Life's a beach Davy boy and you know it. Have a great time. I know how much you love the surf.

Is there nothing he can't do ????

 

Good luck to Waikato with the new stallion. I'm picking the other Savaloy stallion will be the better and that's no embellishment at all.

[Huey]

49 minutes ago, KickintheKods said:

What a guy that David Ellis is. Life's a beach Davy boy and you know it. Have a great time. I know how much you love the surf.

Is there nothing he can't do ????

 

Good luck to Waikato with the new stallion. I'm picking the other Savaloy stallion will be the better and that's no embellishment at all.

I'll have a chocolate fish on this one being the better of the two.

[Dark Beau]

Mo'unga [if he goes to the right stud farm] will beat them both.

[Huey]

2 hours ago, Dark Beau said:

Mo'unga [if he goes to the right stud farm] will beat them both.

Given he will likely stand for 5 or 6 times the amount of these other two you'd expect the quality of mare and the leg up at the sales he will get to be of considerable advantage to him.