NZ Breeders G1

[Walt]

I can't remember the last time I enjoyed watching a race as much as I did here. I'm not talking via my pocket either as I thought Belle of Montana was a great place bet from the pole. Something clearly amiss with Belle of Montana. 

I admire the All Stars machine and how they've taken harness racing to another level. Having said that, I don't see it as a positive when the same stable and often the same sets of owners dominate the major races regardless of how much they put into the game. One of my pet hates is stables having multiple contenders in the same race. I think most of us have all seen very friendly lead changes when under normal circumstances they'd rather hit their own thumb with a hammer than hand up. It's such a huge advantage to know the leader will hand up to you when you come calling. Others don't have that luxury. If they make a play for the front and the leader keeps them posted, it's invariably game over for them.

I thought the Breeders had the hallmarks of a very exciting race. It was a G1 worth nice money and the huge increase in broodmare value to win or place in it. 

The All Stars have had a mortgage on NZ G1's in recent years. I wouldn't blame other connections if they were feeling somewhat disillusioned when it all just becomes the same old same old.

On paper Better Twist looked the winner and the very short odds reflected that but this race looked like it may just be an actual race than a procession. Better Twist had no stablemate to give her a cart up or work the leader. She had no stablemate to softly hand up to her or at least give her cover. She'd have to do it all on her own against opposition that all wanted to be part of the race. She's probably good enough to do that on her day. The result was a very exciting race.

Congratulations especially to Regan Todd and Robbie Close. The first of many G1's I'm sure.

The race did more to remind me why I love this game than any other race I've watched in years....and my wager ran down the track. I can't wait for more of the same.

 

https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=290901&Arg=hrnzg-rSite&Arg=TRUE

 

[Gammalite]

12 minutes ago, Walt said:

The result was a very exciting race.

Congratulations especially to Regan Todd and Robbie Close. The first of many G1's I'm sure.

All your points/ observations full of merit Walt. I thought it was a very proactive race. Ironically the Allstars machine didn't win it last year either with Amazing Dream getting beaten as hot favourite, by a Southerner.

A few rivals are getting close now , with COPY THAT stopping the big run of Allstars NZ Cups wins , and South Coast Arden proving to be a handful lately too. (taking the NZ FFA) and probably a big chance in THE RACE (900k ) at Cambridge as he won the Jewels there in blistering time last Winter.

Perhaps the run of 6 Auckland Cups by Allstars might end as well this year.? They are a fine training team......

As also are the Dunn team smacking out Rowe Cups and Dominions with 'Sundees Son'.

What do you think of those races Not Being Handicaps anymore ? seems a gift to him off the front these days?

 

[the galah]

I thought the dividend of the winner,better talk art was amazing. It was well favored in the similar race a couple of weeks prior and i thought had put in the best run of anything,just being poorly rated. So never should have paid$37. Just a shame my internet wasn't working when i tried to get a bet on  a couple of minutes before the race.Not sure whether that was a nz TAB or a local area thing,as it does happen occasionally.

I thought belle of montana should have been retired some time ago as its clearly been running as if it had serious issues,and i had actually thought Better twist had been racing poorly by its high standards,and was actually surprised it went such a good race,albeit unplaced.

Gammalite you mention South Coast Arden. I thought in its only recent run from the Mangos stable it looked like it had lost a leg in comparison with its runs from the all stars. Time will tell as the north island doesn't have any depth.

I agree with gammalite about gifting races to the top horses by not putting them on a handicaps in races like the nz cup,rowe cup and dominion. Races like that are no longer as exciting,not as good betting wise as they would be if the dominant horses were on handicaps.

Also personally i think the connections of some who line up against sunndees son in races like the dominion off the same mark,well they are just mugs in my opinion.Just look at this years race run in record time.The hope pair and bolt for brillance have raced well since,but everything else has dissapointed,but what do you expect when horses get their heads kicked in,lining up in a race in which they were always likely to have a gutbuster for no possible return.  

Edited February 11, 2022 by the galah

[hunterthepunter]

I remember one night at alexander park king of swing being attacked the whole journey by 3 stable mates in team driving and running a long and lonely last but funny thing now is the 3 horses that attacked him are all retired now broken down . and king of swing just keeps winning $$$$$$

[Davis]

11 hours ago, Walt said:

I can't remember the last time I enjoyed watching a race as much as I did here. I'm not talking via my pocket either as I thought Belle of Montana was a great place bet from the pole. Something clearly amiss with Belle of Montana. 

I admire the All Stars machine and how they've taken harness racing to another level. Having said that, I don't see it as a positive when the same stable and often the same sets of owners dominate the major races regardless of how much they put into the game. One of my pet hates is stables having multiple contenders in the same race. I think most of us have all seen very friendly lead changes when under normal circumstances they'd rather hit their own thumb with a hammer than hand up. It's such a huge advantage to know the leader will hand up to you when you come calling. Others don't have that luxury. If they make a play for the front and the leader keeps them posted, it's invariably game over for them.

 

I think you make some fair points but are a bit harsh on Bettor Twist. I don't think she has ever been assisted by a stablemate to win, she has been the only All Stars runner in other races too. She hasn't been going as well this season or in the past few months anyway. She's still won but she hasn't looked as sharp to me. I don't know the reason and it isn't uncommon. Sometimes a horse will have a cracker season winning multiple G! races but it might flatten it and next season the horse is off. Majestic Man is an example of this.

Bettors Twist is by far the best mare that was in that field and she will prove it again. She is a bit of a one-trick pony because she hasn't got real sharp speed but she can grind out keeping going, like a Laver type horse. I think All Stars will probably change her training and make her into a strong grinding sort. Regardless, she will always be vulnerable because she is one-paced. If she gets to front easily, it's all over. If she doesn't, she can be beaten.

Just my thoughts..

[Walt]

10 hours ago, Gammalite said:

All your points/ observations full of merit Walt. I thought it was a very proactive race. Ironically the Allstars machine didn't win it last year either with Amazing Dream getting beaten as hot favourite, by a Southerner.

A few rivals are getting close now , with COPY THAT stopping the big run of Allstars NZ Cups wins , and South Coast Arden proving to be a handful lately too. (taking the NZ FFA) and probably a big chance in THE RACE (900k ) at Cambridge as he won the Jewels there in blistering time last Winter.

Perhaps the run of 6 Auckland Cups by Allstars might end as well this year.? They are a fine training team......

As also are the Dunn team smacking out Rowe Cups and Dominions with 'Sundees Son'.

What do you think of those races Not Being Handicaps anymore ? seems a gift to him off the front these days?

 

Hey Gammalite,

I think for many punters their first experience in the game was the Melbourne Cup. For me it was the NZ Trotting Cup. The first I can remember was Arapaho winning for Jack Smolenski in 1973 beating Globe Bay and Young Quinn. It's just a race you want to be part of and remember it more than any other race. Lord Module winning it in 1979 like Cecil Devine had just found the turbo boost switch. Hands Down narrowly beating Delightful Lady in 1980 after a stirring duel. Armalight doing the unthinkable in 1981. When most were expecting her to wave the white flag she left them standing and won by a cricket pitch. Similar situation the following year with Bonnies Chance. Aussie raider Steel Jaw winning in 83 had an epic wow head shaking about it. Borana winning at huge odds for Peter Jones after spending his earlier career with the Shands. The win of the ill fated Inky Lord in 1989 was incredible and should never have happened. Terror to Love's third cup in 2013 was staggering. Adore Me the following year was also very special. I've left out many epic winners. It will always be "The Race" for me but from a punters perspective it just doesn't have the same conquering Everest magic feel about it any more. I'd put that down to the handicapping, a dwindling audience and the domination one stable have had in recent years.

I've enjoyed the achievements of the Dunn's, Telfar's, Ray Green, several others and young trainers like Regan Todd etc. I'm sure the unintended consequence of the All Stars dominance has been some other trainers who are in a position to have lifting their level up a notch. 

When the result is not a fait accompli, the amount of excitement and anticipation in that event raises to a much higher level. I feel that has been mostly absent in recent years. I hope that doesn't sound like tall poppy bashing as that's not my intent. 

[Walt]

17 minutes ago, Davis said:

I think you make some fair points but are a bit harsh on Bettor Twist. I don't think she has ever been assisted by a stablemate to win, she has been the only All Stars runner in other races too. She hasn't been going as well this season or in the past few months anyway. She's still won but she hasn't looked as sharp to me. I don't know the reason and it isn't uncommon. Sometimes a horse will have a cracker season winning multiple G! races but it might flatten it and next season the horse is off. Majestic Man is an example of this.

Bettors Twist is by far the best mare that was in that field and she will prove it again. She is a bit of a one-trick pony because she hasn't got real sharp speed but she can grind out keeping going, like a Laver type horse. I think All Stars will probably change her training and make her into a strong grinding sort. Regardless, she will always be vulnerable because she is one-paced. If she gets to front easily, it's all over. If she doesn't, she can be beaten.

Just my thoughts..

Davis,

 

I take on board your perspective which I don't disagree with. My input was more about the dynamic we have all become familiar with. One stable having multiple runners in G1 races and invariably not only winning most of them especially in the 2 and 3 year old classics but also filling the placings. 

Not only is it rare for the All Stars not to win the races that matter most, it's very unusual for them to have no luck at all and be an also ran. 

I must declare my hand here and admit I'd rather see 10 people win 1 million dollars each in the lotto rather than 1 person win 10 million and the others getting squat. Maybe I'm a closet Socialist  

[Walt]

1 hour ago, hunterthepunter said:

I remember one night at alexander park king of swing being attacked the whole journey by 3 stable mates in team driving and running a long and lonely last but funny thing now is the 3 horses that attacked him are all retired now broken down . and king of swing just keeps winning $$$$$$

Very difficult to read your perspective hunterthepunter and not think of horses like The Bru Czar, Dillon Dean and Franco Ice. They were all great horses that usually came off second best going up against a machine. 

[Gammalite]

7 hours ago, the galah said:

Also personally i think the connections of some who line up against sunndees son in races like the dominion off the same mark,well they are just mugs in my opinion.Just look at this years race run in record time.

Mark Purdon had won the Group 1 NZ Trotting FFA,  with OSCAR B, and he didn't bother taking on Sundees Son in the Dominion at his next start shortly after. The 'only' time I remember a Group 1 winner , not bothering to take on a rival because it would be too good for him. (Oscar B started off 30m in an intermediate trot instead the same day , and won easily)

The Rowe Cup will be a joke this year. Sundees Son drew '1' last year ,(after winning year before as well) so race was all over as soon as he stepped.

Should of been off 20m or something ??  IMO. give rivals 'some' hope. 'No Response' and others won off 10m. 

'Sundee'  could potentially WIN the next 3 Dominions at Addington and Rowe Cups at Auckland (make it 5 on the trot)  being off the front mark..   being the best 2 mile trotter in the world.

Edited February 12, 2022 by Gammalite
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