STRATHAYR Questions and Answers

[hesi]

Bill Casimaty the chief of Stathayr has agreed to come on BOAY and answer questions about Strathayr race tracks

More detail to follow when I get home

Edited September 13, 2018 by hesi

[hesi]

Right then, a couple of weeks ago, with emphasis in the Messara Report on racetrack upgrades, I decided to email Strathayr and ask them if they would come on BOAY, to talk about Strathayr racetracks.

Wasn't really expecting a reply, then this afternoon, I get a phone call from Bill Casimaty, who I think is the chief and guru at Strathayr.  Anyway, if I haven't scared him off, he indicated he would come on BOAY, and I said I would set up a thread.

Probably best just to fire away on any questions, I'll start with a few

1.  Is there any reason to suggest Strathayr would not work in NZ

2.  What is the updated data on abandoned race meetings on Strathayr tracks

3.  What are the success stories with Strathayr around the world

4.  What are the problems that have occurred around the world and why

5.  Eagle Farm was a disaster, was it Strathayr, what happened and why

Please note people from the NZ Racing Board and NZ Thoroughbred Racing read BOAY

https://docplayer.net/65489652-The-strathayr-track-from-research-to-proven-performance-bill-g-casimaty-december-2005.html

 

 

Edited September 13, 2018 by hesi

[wally]

10 minutes ago, hesi said:

Right then, a couple of weeks ago, with emphasis in the Messara Report on racetrack upgrades, I decided to email Strathayr and ask them if they would come on BOAY, to talk about Strathayr racetracks.

Wasn't really expecting a reply, then this afternoon, I get a phone call from Bill Casimaty, who I think is the chief and guru at Strathayr.  Anyway, if I haven't scared him off, he indicated he would come on BOAY, and I said I would set up a thread.

Probably best just to fire away on any questions, I'll start with a few

1.  Is there any reason to suggest Strathayr would not work in NZ

2.  What is the updated data on abandoned race meetings on Strathayr tracks

3.  What are the success stories with Strathayr around the world

4.  What are the problems that have occurred around the world and why

5.  Eagle Farm was a disaster, was it Strathayr, what happened and why

Please note people from the NZ Racing Board and NZ Thoroughbred Racing read BOAY

 

 

well done hesi

Edited September 13, 2018 by hesi

[Justamugpunter]

13 hours ago, hesi said:

 

Please note people from the NZ Racing Board and NZ Thoroughbred Racing read BOAY

 

 

Any truth that other than the young colt jonnyA all the others are 'aged geldings'  ?

[Frank Casimaty]

This is Frank Casimaty Managing Director StrathAyr. Bill is retired.

I will try and answer your questions as asked.

1. Is there any reason to suggest Strathayr would not work in NZ

StrathAyr Tracks will definitely work in NZ. We have tracks working well in all climates from the tropical climates of Hong Kong and Singapore all the way down to Moonee Valley and Moe in Victoria and Launceston in Tasmania. The only difference is the grass species on top which is selected to best meet the local climate

2.  What is the updated data on abandoned race meetings on Strathayr tracks

There hasn't been any track related wet weather cancellations other than due to visibility in extreme weather. The allweather StrathAyr Track drains extremely well and gives an extremely consistent racing surface around the entire track whether it is wet or dry. Even though a StrathAyr track is a natural grass racing surface it is in fact more all weather than many of the so called all weather synthetic tracks as well as being a very safe and consistent racing surface

3.  What are the success stories with Strathayr around the world

All  StrathAyr Tracks are performing well from the oldest at Sha Tin and Happy Valley in Hong Kong(1988) , Moonee Valley 1995, Singapore 1999, to the more recent Australian Tracks in Launceston, Mackay, Toowoomba, Moe, and Newcastle. The newest StrathAyr Track build for the Hong Kong jockey Club in Guangzhou in China is also performing very well. All of these tracks have stories of racing well in extreme weather conditions and many with heavy racing schedules. No matter the age of the track they will keep racing well indefinitely into the future as the ReFlex mesh reinforced sand profile under the grass has a very long life. Moonee Valley track surface for example is now 23 years old which is many years older than any other Metropolitan track in Melbourne

4.  What are the problems that have occurred around the world and why

Any issues have all been related to track maintenance and in particular in regard to thatch control. Heavy thatch can create weakness at the surface and result in kickback. Toowoomba and Moe had issues that were soon solved with good renovation and maintenance. Since these issues that some tracks had, StrathAyr now provides much more support in the early years in working with the track managers to make sure these issues don't occur . StrathAyr Tracks are not difficult or expensive to maintain but are a little different due to its unique reinforced sand profile and so education on how to manage the track initially is the key to success from day one onward.

5.  Eagle Farm was a disaster, was it Strathayr, what happened and why

No Eagle Farm was definitely not StrathAyr. Not really up to me to comment further.

 

One more point I would like to make is that there is a perception that StrathAyr Tracks are very expensive. This is not true with the extra cost compared to building a new conventional track being quite modest. The long life of the track, the increased usage and fact that wet weather cancellations become a thing of the past more than makes up for the cost difference.

I hope this answers the questions and look forward to answering any other questions 

 

[hesi]

Thanks, I have a few more

1.  How does the support work, is it part of a maintenance contract ?? People left to their own devices, can tend to stuff things up

2.  Does Strathayr license out in each country and just become a project manager. ie growing of the turf, installation work etc

3.  Had Eagle Farm been Strathayr, I presume there would have been no problems and they would have been racing there 2-3 years ago

[curious]

I applaud the initiative of this thread Hesi but I'm not clear why we are introducing and reintroducing discussion of an Evergreen Turf installation at Eagle Farm in a thread on Strathayr tracks. Frank has already appropriately declined to comment on behalf of Strathayr.

I'd like to see the conversation focus on the question of whether or not if 1-3 AWTs are installed in NZ, whether or not a Strathayr or a synthetic would be the best option for those. Pros and Cons?

[hesi]

Fair enough, was just trying to illustrate the folly of trying to re-invent the wheel, when there is a perfectly proven product available.

Let's see where your last paragraph goes

[curious]

Firstly Frank, thank you very much for coming on here. I do have a couple more questions for you please.

1. For say an existing 2000m turf track, what is the likely cost difference between fully re-laying it as a conventional turf track cf. Strathayr?

2. Do you have or can you point us to hard data supporting the claim that Strathayr is safer than conventional turf?

3. I realise this will vary due to location and weather patterns etc., but what are the approximate water use savings that are likely with a Strathayr cf. conventional turf?

Many thanks.

[Frank Casimaty]

In answer to your questions

Firstly to answer Hesi

1.In regards to maintenance the support we offer if regular visits and working with the track manager to work out the most appropriate program for all aspects of management including nutrition, irrigation , and thatch control. We don't try and take over the full management but monitor and offer advice including warning of any impending issues. We have a specialised agronomist who visits regularly for the critical first couple of years. 

2. We don't licence out but generally run the installation contract ourselves using local contractors for general earthworks etc and will source turf by working with a local turf grower

To answer Curious

1. In regard to cost comparison it depends on what we are comparing to as conventional can means lots of different things and the cost of local materials such as sands and gravels has a big bearing on cost. However, for example if a full reconstruction to a higher standard conventional track including all earthworks, irrigation, drainage turf etc compared to a full StrathAyr system the difference would generally be around $ 40/m2 or $2 million for a 50,000m2 track 

2. In terms of hard data on safety this is hard to come by as reliable figures are hard to get. However, lots of anecdotal evidence and examples of horses with leg issues being run at Moonee Valley for examples and avoiding some other tracks. There is more data I believe  that shows grass tracks in general are safer than synthetic.

3. The profile features a perched water table design which means it holds extra water in the bottom part of the profile. This reduces how frequently the track needs to be watered and helps encourage deeper roots which also help to maximize water use efficiency. Also the track is extremely consistent all the way around so all the track needs the same amount of water and so you don't need to over water some areas to make sure poorer areas get enough. While the grass itself uses the same amount of water on any track the fact that you can more accurately apply only what the grass needs without waste can result in very significant water savings. Savings of 20% or more would in many situations is very achievable. More importantly a consistent healthy track will take more use and be better to race on. Also management of irrigation is much easier as the manager does not have to worry about watering close to a race meeting because of the free draining profile.

I apologise that answers aren't clearer but really to talk about costs and savings really need to look at the track in question.

In terms of pros and cons compared to synthetic I am obviously biased but synthetics do seem to have a place for training where very heavy use is required day in and day out. However, grass tracks are generally better for the horses and are preferred for racing and betting is higher on grass tracks. A StrathAyr Track is cheaper than most synthetic tracks and will last indefinitely which is not the case with synthetics. Many synthetics require a lot of time and money to maintain properly. StrathAyr Tracks will take more use than conventional grass tracks and so in many instances will take all the use required without having to resort to a synthetic. Also as stated before a StrathAyr track will drain better than a synthetic track and so be more all weather

I hope this answers your questions

[Delta Bro]

What went wrong with the StrathAyr redevelopment at Moe in 2015? From what I read, the redevelopment resulted in no racing for 19 months, cost $4.5 million and when racing recommenced there was kickback of large clods. Moe's racing was then transferred to Bairnsdale. 

[curious]

Didn't they sow it down in kikuyu to begin with which struggled in the cooler temps and it had to be resown in ryegrass?

[Frank Casimaty]

There were issues at Moe about a year after construction and a few months racing were lost but certainly not 19 months. Issues as I have stated earlier were all about thatch build up resulting in surface kickback and part of this was related to the grass type used initially. Moe was a little different to manage due to the cool climate there but with renovation and some other management changes the track is now performing well and no doubt will perform well for a very long time into the future. 

[Kopia]

Frank, thanks for coming on here and clarifying some points.  You probably won't want/or be able to answer this question, however a great many people in New Zealand, particuarly in the upper North Island, are extremely disappointed that the Auckland Racing Club haven't considered a Strathayr and seem intent on patching up a track which has caused problems for many years. Ellerslie has been closed over winter months recently-the weather pattern in NZ especially the North Island, has been wetter and wetter each winter. In your opinion, and I'm sure you'll be aware of what I'm saying-would Ellerslie be better suited to a Strathayr than what they've got and seem intent on keeping..i.e. a track which is basically 'stuffed' ?

Secondly....have you been invited to look at Ellerslie by the auckland Racing Club, i.e. have they ever considered an alternative to what they curently have?.. ( I don't expect you to answer this part..think we all know the answer!)

[hesi]

A few more questions

1.  The majority of race day abandonments in NZ have been down to 2 things

     - waterlogged tracks, through excessive rain either in the days leading up to or on race day

     - rain on the day on say a G3/D4 tracks, a horse slips, the meeting is called off due to safety concerns

Please note we run a scale in NZ from Fast1 up to Heavy 11(Fast, Good, Dead, Soft, Heavy)

What impact would Strathayr tracks have on this

2.  For the Winter months(June, July, Aug), other than Ruakaka and Te Rapa, NZ races on heavy tracks, more often than not very heavy tracks.  We get a situation where margins are double digit lengths, fields finish spread over 200m, and 800m out you know whether your horse will be in the finish.  Not very inspiring for punters.

What would be the situation on a Strathayr track

Please note that in the 3 months June/July/Aug we get cumulative rainfall totals in the high 300mm for places like Tauranga, New Plymouth, Auckland, 3 notable bog tracks in heavy rainfall conditions

Thanks again

 

 

Edited September 18, 2018 by hesi

[holy ravioli]

' however a great many people in New Zealand, particuarly in the upper North Island, are extremely disappointed that the Auckland Racing Club haven't considered a Strathayr and seem intent on patching up a track which has caused problems for many years. '

Prayers been answered!

[Chief Stipe]

56 minutes ago, holy ravioli said:

' however a great many people in New Zealand, particuarly in the upper North Island, are extremely disappointed that the Auckland Racing Club haven't considered a Strathayr and seem intent on patching up a track which has caused problems for many years. '

Prayers been answered!

What song goes with that?

 

[nod]

4 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

What song goes with that?

 

Goodnight Irene