Shad Posted March 8 Share Posted March 8 12 hours ago, Walt said: Speaking of Rick May's drives. I haven't yet got past race 1 with my homework. I found the betting on his drive Monaro Meg interesting. I had her as a 20-1 shot but she's at $4.50 fixed and dropping. Clearly, someone knows something. I thought the horse to beat was very much the mare Forgiveness. Paul Nairn as we know is the master with trotters. When he ventures to the Coast you know he has them ready to put their hand up. Ran a very nice second in a trial behind race winner One El who's been racing better fields than Forgiveness meets today. I note that she has blown to bits in previous races a year ago so Paul has had time to sort her out. Her trial run says he's winning that task. If she win's today I'd be backing up at Reefton on Sunday. I always enjoy Coast harness racing. To be fair, I'd take the meeting tonight Hands Down over the Auckland meeting tonight that has little appeal from a punting perspective. No doubt the Ribbon of Light will get a work over along with being all dressed up and nowhere to go. The Magic Man will be there with The Chief, The Wizard and The Ice Man of course but no sign yet of The Bogeyman and The Strawman Yep few short divs on that first race, I backed the winner moa mojito, thought it was bloody short on tote, was waiting the whole trip for it to blow to bits, but stuck well, did go a very good race at blenheim looked likely but broke on the turn, great days racing an nice weather, although the south west wind got cold later in the day, didn't think sods law would pay 5s in that field, great money on his number wins he's had, tossed up between elbury Street and hope for love, eventually settling on him, good place div only beaten by a horse with the gun run, some nice roughies today usually my forte but had to settle for the two, keep me ahead for the day, duty calls on Sunday so won't make reefton, unfortunately, be another good day out there, I must been the only poster oncourse, gazza beat put up a big run today until he broke after sitting parked the trip. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowornever Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 77 noms Auckland and 203 motukarara. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 3 hours ago, Nowornever said: 77 noms Auckland and 203 motukarara. 9 races programmed, but they are just awful to be betting into. The Garrards heat for colts and geldings 3 hear olds, has 7 starters. Only 3 trainers 2 from The Allstars, 2 from Barry Purdon, 2 from Telfers barn and Nathan Williamson has his good 3 year, Dreams Are Free lining up! Just not enough owners, trainers and horses around in Auckland to make racing financially viable! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nowornever Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 Only betting I will be doing this weekend is on the grass track at Banks Peninsular. At least there is a chance of getting a nice return on those bigger fields. As a side note I heard they are doing away from letting you put on pick six and place at TAB outlets from this week. Online only. Only a matter of time before it all goes online Brodie. Then they can really keep tabs on your bets. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 4 hours ago, Brodie said: The Garrards heat for colts and geldings 3 hear olds, has 7 starters. Only 3 trainers 2 from The Allstars, 2 from Barry Purdon, 2 from Telfers barn and Nathan Williamson has his good 3 year, Dreams Are Free lining up! Glad you noticed some of the Best three year olds in the country lining up there Brodster. Getting ready for the Great Northern Derby soon. And you should see the Fillies in the $100,000 race !!!. Must be a Million dollars worth of horses easy. what fantastic field and the Oaks will be greeaat. ! Can't wait for the racing action. Auckland very lucky to have such amazing trainers.🏆 here's the fabulous fillies field. I might go for Kiss for the QLD owner . his Nz Derby winning horse MERLIN did fantastic win in Aus last Saturday too. 1 43X621 Akatea 3 f R54 1 Ft Steve & Amanda Telfer 2 6X5161 Seaside Rose 3 f R51 2 Ft Steve & Amanda Telfer 3 11211 All You Need Is Me 3 f R65 3 Ft Carter Dalgety(J) Cran & Chrissie Dalgety 4 940142 Kiss 3 f R57 4 Ft Scott Phelan Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 5 111421 Coastal Babe 3 f R65 5 Ft Matthew White Steven Reid 6 11611 Ruby Roe 3 f R63 6 Ft Nathan Williamson Nathan Williamson 7 228133 Ultimate Racy Girl 3 f R49 7 Ft Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 8 587636 Onyx Shard 3 f R41 8 Ft Andre Poutama Ray Green ------------------ Second Line ------------------ 9 132121 Duchess Megxit 3 f R59 9 Ft Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 10 12441 Minjee 3 f R54 10 Ft Tony Herlihy Logan Hollis & Shane Robertson 11 221534 Treacherous Baby 3 f R53 11 Ft Mark Purdon Mark & Nathan Purdon 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 (edited) 9 hours ago, Gammalite said: Glad you noticed some of the Best three year olds in the country lining up there Brodster. Getting ready for the Great Northern Derby soon. And you should see the Fillies in the $100,000 race !!!. Must be a Million dollars worth of horses easy. what fantastic field and the Oaks will be greeaat. ! Can't wait for the racing action. Auckland very lucky to have such amazing trainers.🏆 here's the fabulous fillies field. I might go for Kiss for the QLD owner . his Nz Derby winning horse MERLIN did fantastic win in Aus last Saturday too. 1 43X621 Akatea 3 f R54 1 Ft Steve & Amanda Telfer 2 6X5161 Seaside Rose 3 f R51 2 Ft Steve & Amanda Telfer 3 11211 All You Need Is Me 3 f R65 3 Ft Carter Dalgety(J) Cran & Chrissie Dalgety 4 940142 Kiss 3 f R57 4 Ft Scott Phelan Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 5 111421 Coastal Babe 3 f R65 5 Ft Matthew White Steven Reid 6 11611 Ruby Roe 3 f R63 6 Ft Nathan Williamson Nathan Williamson 7 228133 Ultimate Racy Girl 3 f R49 7 Ft Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 8 587636 Onyx Shard 3 f R41 8 Ft Andre Poutama Ray Green ------------------ Second Line ------------------ 9 132121 Duchess Megxit 3 f R59 9 Ft Barry Purdon & Scott Phelan 10 12441 Minjee 3 f R54 10 Ft Tony Herlihy Logan Hollis & Shane Robertson 11 221534 Treacherous Baby 3 f R53 11 Ft Mark Purdon Mark & Nathan Purdon The sad thing for the industry though , is the fact that there is no minor trainer with a horse lining up! It is the trainers who will be charging the most and shows that the smaller guys just can not compete, and one of the reasons there is a lack of owners and horses in the North! Total turnoff for the punter, gamma. Edited March 11 by Brodie 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 11 Share Posted March 11 2 hours ago, Brodie said: The sad thing for the industry though , is the fact that there is no minor trainer with a horse lining up! It is the trainers who will be charging the most and shows that the smaller guys just can not compete, and one of the reasons there is a lack of owners and horses in the North! Total turnoff for the punter, gamma. Yes that seems fairly true these days mate. quite a sad turn of events. A lot of hobby/slow class horse trainers have found the game too fast and can't compete with the professional stables . North island has no slow tracks for them to race at regularly. so getting too hard to compete.😪 The Big Guns are just getting more dominant, (BarryP, RayGreen, Herlihy,Reid and a couple of others) and your post made me think that Queensland man Dean Shannon , the multi millionaire ENTAIN CEO (who I thought was helping originally) is actually doing the North a 'Dis-service' by buying so many yearlings himself and racing them with Barry Purdon and Scott Phelan. He has 15 horses on their books . like merlin, Cold Chisel , etc... Because this weight of numbers sort of thing and money to buy the Top Lots at the sales ( a bit Like ALL Stars millionaire Owners have done for years) he is thwarting the chances of the 'smaller' guy to win those races...... so they (smaller guys) give up in the end. So I guess that does put the Punter off as well. I usually Punt gallops racing, and as was pretty happy seeing 'Regular folk' winning at Adelaide Cup Big raceday yesterday .( small-time owners and trainers) Instead of the usual Saturday Multi Millionaire exclusives. the 2 normal guys winning the Cup itself was a breath of fresh air. good on em'. so am starting to get the ' feel ' myself, for your (Walt,Galah, Nowornever and others) support of the small harness meetings in the South Island where those Millionaires don't compete. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cyril Posted March 11 Author Share Posted March 11 17 hours ago, Brodie said: 9 races programmed, but they are just awful to be betting into. The Garrards heat for colts and geldings 3 hear olds, has 7 starters. Only 3 trainers 2 from The Allstars, 2 from Barry Purdon, 2 from Telfers barn and Nathan Williamson has his good 3 year, Dreams Are Free lining up! Just not enough owners, trainers and horses around in Auckland to make racing financially viable! Good to see Nathan Williamson lining up his runner in the fillies race. Good luck to him. It would be thoroughly deserved if he can get a winner on the big stage. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 (edited) 5 hours ago, Brodie said: The sad thing for the industry though , is the fact that there is no minor trainer with a horse lining up! It is the trainers who will be charging the most and shows that the smaller guys just can not compete, and one of the reasons there is a lack of owners and horses in the North! Total turnoff for the punter, gamma. If you look at the trainers still going in the north island i would think they fall into 2 main categories. 1)The big trainers who train form properties they own themselves. 2)trainers who train from rented facilities like racecourses. I'm guessing there may be a handful of other trainers who train from their own property who mostly have small numbers,but you could count them on your fingers. The cost of setting up private training facilities is unaffordable ,except if you are a very big trainer like say stonewall. So realistically you won't be getting any more of them. And the rented facilities like racecourses or training centres,are limited in the numbers they can cater for and people have to live close by to make it practical to use them. So therein i have identified why harness racing in the north island is doomed. Its as simple as that. If you had another 500 people with 1000 horses wanting to train,where would you put them. Nowhere,thats the reality. Mark my words,the same issue will gradually become more obvious in places like canterbury in years to come.Its already a reality,just not on the same scale. And an observation i have made in the likes of canterbury, there are unused facilities on private properites that could cater for more trainers,but nearly all of them the owners would rather not have someone other than themselves use them. Which is up to them,its theirs, if they don't want to. i'm just stating what i think is a blatantly obvious fact ,yet it gets very little attention. Why that is,i've never been sure. Maybe its because there aren't the funds to fix that.Maybe its because some of those people who complain about dwindling numbers,know it exists,but know that stakeholders and licenceholders have no inclination on a personal level to allow a trainer to rent unused facilities they may have. Probably a bit of both. Edited March 12 by the galah 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 Agreed guys , very hard to get more horses quickly and ready to run in North. A few of the regular starters eg Simply Sam and a couple of stablemates have been sold of late. Happening every week. The smaller guys who race regularly like Dr Luk Chin are worth weight in gold. Hard to win at Auckland so less are trying to, plus more Northen horses going to places like Manawatu to try and grab a win. Its not an easy problem to solve because cost of training higher in North. Realisation of that became apparent about 10 years ago thats why the cursed Building Development happened in order to have higher stakes and build a nest egg to sustain them. That dream gone. The smaller guy can't attract owners to invest in horses. As soon as a horse shows ability , the offers flood in ...too high to turn down eg $140k for maiden winner or $300-$400k if a 3 yr old wins a couple. But even poorer horses being sold...Nz owner can take a price to stop the bleeding ,knowing the horse will probably cost $30-$45k and earn $10-$15k annually. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 3 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: Agreed guys , very hard to get more horses quickly and ready to run in North. A few of the regular starters eg Simply Sam and a couple of stablemates have been sold of late. Happening every week. The smaller guys who race regularly like Dr Luk Chin are worth weight in gold. Hard to win at Auckland so less are trying to, plus more Northen horses going to places like Manawatu to try and grab a win. Its not an easy problem to solve because cost of training higher in North. Realisation of that became apparent about 10 years ago thats why the cursed Building Development happened in order to have higher stakes and build a nest egg to sustain them. That dream gone. The smaller guy can't attract owners to invest in horses. As soon as a horse shows ability , the offers flood in ...too high to turn down eg $140k for maiden winner or $300-$400k if a 3 yr old wins a couple. But even poorer horses being sold...Nz owner can take a price to stop the bleeding ,knowing the horse will probably cost $30-$45k and earn $10-$15k annually. Are they actually paying $140k for a maiden winner? $300k for a 3 year old winner of a couple? Sounds a bit high TAB? If thats the case no wonder owners selling 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 1 hour ago, Brodie said: Are they actually paying $140k for a maiden winner? $300k for a 3 year old winner of a couple? Sounds a bit high TAB? If thats the case no wonder owners selling Well Brodie you will just have to take my word for it ...of course 30 odd years ago a sharp Southland qualifier would be asking $100k and things moved on from then. Once Bitten was a one win Sir Lincoln 3 yr old filly who got good money after a maiden win and Street Hawk by Bettors had 2 from 6 when sold .The Williamson boys sold some pearlers , I'd say it really not uncommon . But not my slow horses .....not into selling battlers but had a few offers of 3 yr old maidens early in careers but in syndicates it had to get OK. Aussies love our horses . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 On 3/11/2024 at 2:56 PM, Nowornever said: 77 noms Auckland and 203 motukarara. Can't imagine Motukarara holding Group races or installing lights and going up against Addington on a Friday night. And Entain certainly keen on trying to engage more punters and young people and new owners so with the Northern region having the biggest population they will be trying to weave some magic into the place. It won't be for lack of trying , but they will try so at least a bit of hope for the North ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 8 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: Can't imagine Motukarara holding Group races or installing lights and going up against Addington on a Friday night. And Entain certainly keen on trying to engage more punters and young people and new owners so with the Northern region having the biggest population they will be trying to weave some magic into the place. It won't be for lack of trying , but they will try so at least a bit of hope for the North ! Why do they continue to hsve Auckland compete with Addington on the same night? There is only so many $ to be spent on the one night! most punters are going to be investing on Addington rather than the Auckland oroduct that isnt that inspiring! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeynz Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 (edited) 9 hours ago, TAB For Ever said: Can't imagine Motukarara holding Group races or installing lights and going up against Addington on a Friday night. And Entain certainly keen on trying to engage more punters and young people and new owners so with the Northern region having the biggest population they will be trying to weave some magic into the place. It won't be for lack of trying , but they will try so at least a bit of hope for the North ! Why have a go at Motukarara, it's more than likely generating income that's being flitted away keeping Auckland going, as for the biggest population being in the North, won't make a scrap of difference if those people simply ain't interested in harness racing, just like Rugby wanting to tap into the US market, they simply ain't interested and never really will be. Brodie I don't think it's so bad running 2 meets on friday nights, like Saturdays for gallops , Fridays for harness, Entain seem to be keen to make the night a bit better, it can be a borefest between races when only one meeting, maybe if Auckland was on its own on Thursdays no one would watch at all. On a slightly more positive note I just hear the Wiggles are touring again soon, they seem to be able to attract young followers , why can't racing ? Might help if they reduce the gambling age to four. Edited March 12 by mikeynz 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 1 hour ago, mikeynz said: Why have a go at Motukarara, it's more than likely generating income that's being flitted away keeping Auckland going, as for the biggest population being in the North, won't make a scrap of difference if those people simply ain't interested in harness racing, just like Rugby wanting to tap into the US market, they simply ain't interested and never really will be. Brodie I don't think it's so bad running 2 meets on friday nights, like Saturdays for gallops , Fridays for harness, Entain seem to be keen to make the night a bit better, it can be a borefest between races when only one meeting, maybe if Auckland was on its own on Thursdays no one would watch at all. On a slightly more positive note I just hear the Wiggles are touring again soon, they seem to be able to attract young followers , why can't racing ? Might help if they reduce the gambling age to four. How do you know all this stuff ? What area are you in , do you attend races and see situation up close. i not having a go at Moukarara ,it was mentioned in previous post with comparison made between the two. It could be Gore ,Cromwell or whereever. When you first learned of the Wiggles ,Harness in NZ slowed down in May and halted completely in early June for a few weeks before slow start again mid August , as most tracks were grass. No ability to bet on Aussie Harness. Horse population grew and racing became 12 months ,and Forbury had night racing etc etc Times have changed and sadly Forbury faded ,too much apathy and getting pushed into terrible and often cold mid week dates . The TAB did best when Night trots got Friday to themselves , Gallops have Saturday and Sunday became a 'sports /racing/family' day etc .That the best situation from betting anle. I see Gore folk pushing their recent success with 3 x day meetings on grass compared to ATC and Addington. Not really apples with apples. Those main tracks run the night racing and Gore ,Mot, Methven ,Westprt have Sundays with little NZ thoroughbred opposition. And grass tracks run 3 t0 6 meetings a year...Addington and ATC combine for about 70 I guess. Easy to get sponsors and local support for 3 meetings harder for 30 to 40 ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 12 Share Posted March 12 2 hours ago, Brodie said: Why do they continue to hsve Auckland compete with Addington on the same night? There is only so many $ to be spent on the one night! most punters are going to be investing on Addington rather than the Auckland oroduct that isnt that inspiring! Yep but as partly answered above the best betting outcome for us at TAB is for Friday night to be in the main exclusive for Trots. Expect a slicker smother and more informative presentation. You may get a gig if apply ! Saturday is Gallops ,overall Trots does not do well against good gallops ! Then Sunday ,grass trots gets a good possie with low key Aussie racing in oppostion. There will be midweek NZ harness as well but Kiwis generally lack appetite for that. Things are and will be happening....things will be tweaked and tried ! Get amongst it ,get out and present your thoughts to the Entain bosses ,they want to progress and get the show back on the road. They very approachable ...leave the padded cell and keyboard . Develop the attitude of expecting positive results ,avoid being skeptical ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeynz Posted March 13 Share Posted March 13 Wiggles tickets are going fast it seems. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 On 3/12/2024 at 8:56 AM, Cyril said: Good to see Nathan Williamson lining up his runner in the fillies race. Good luck to him. It would be thoroughly deserved if he can get a winner on the big stage. The filly went well Cyril. a great 3rd to fellow Southerner All youNeedIsMe of Carter's. But wow .. he's de-railed the triple Purdon Threat in the boys division. Not many can do that...😳 vvv 1st 4 DREAMS ARE FREE NATHAN WILLIAMSON FT 6.00 2.00 5.40 3.00 2nd 6 COLD CHISEL ZACHARY BUTCHER FT 1.65 1.60 3rd 5 MAJOR HOT TONY HERLIHY FT 4th 1 CHASE A DREAM MARK PURDON FT 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TAB For Ever Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 10 hours ago, Gammalite said: The filly went well Cyril. a great 3rd to fellow Southerner All youNeedIsMe of Carter's. But wow .. he's de-railed the triple Purdon Threat in the boys division. Not many can do that...😳 vvv 1st 4 DREAMS ARE FREE NATHAN WILLIAMSON FT 6.00 2.00 5.40 3.00 2nd 6 COLD CHISEL ZACHARY BUTCHER FT 1.65 1.60 3rd 5 MAJOR HOT TONY HERLIHY FT 4th 1 CHASE A DREAM MARK PURDON FT Very nice win by Dreams Are Free ,first up at Park righthanded. A few new young owners involved too. Main owner Mr Fahy breeds horses with Raka in their name , but bought this one at sale , not expensive either. Especially as half to Don't Stop Dreaming...the mother Start Dreaming was Group 1 placed in GN Oaks and Jewels. Great purchase , well trained ! Possibly at auction ,was one of horses mixed up when wrong horse put thru ring and horses re auction. But that would be another Yarn ! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeynz Posted March 15 Share Posted March 15 1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said: Very nice win by Dreams Are Free ,first up at Park righthanded. A few new young owners involved too. Main owner Mr Fahy breeds horses with Raka in their name , but bought this one at sale , not expensive either. Especially as half to Don't Stop Dreaming...the mother Start Dreaming was Group 1 placed in GN Oaks and Jewels. Great purchase , well trained ! Possibly at auction ,was one of horses mixed up when wrong horse put thru ring and horses re auction. But that would be another Yarn ! A southland horse at Alexandra Park, that's been a long since the last one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 23 hours ago, mikeynz said: A southland horse at Alexandra Park, that's been a long since the last one. maybe this one lol ? to win the GN Derby a while back . (if you mean potential Derby Winners ) Ranga probably too young to remember this bloke 😎. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 16 Share Posted March 16 These guys picked Up 'Dreams Are Free' for $60,000 ? . wow ! what a great buy 💰 . being by Captain Treacherous and all . ......older half brother 'Don't Stop Dreaming' may have been unraced at the time of those sales which might have helped with bargain price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted March 17 Share Posted March 17 59 minutes ago, Gammalite said: maybe this one lol ? to win the GN Derby a while back . (if you mean potential Derby Winners ) Ranga probably too young to remember this bloke 😎. Matai Dreamer for Alex Milne snr and RM ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted March 17 Share Posted March 17 4 hours ago, Rangatira said: Matai Dreamer for Alex Milne snr and RM ? yeah part of a great run for the Southerners in the supposed Great 'Northern' Derby. Saw a few live ones while in Auckland. and always won by the Southerners !! All 6 of them. 'Amrbro Wings ' at big odds I think, won it the year after Matai Dreamer for a BIG SOUTHland Double for the Milne clan of the deep south , way up in the North ..lol 🏆. followed by Melton Monarch, Mighty Me , Mel's Boy, Royden Glen and finally Nardinski over the following years . southern invaders everywhere like white ants 😆 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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