Is this ridiculous, or not?

[curious]

I know you'll probably say it is just Wightman moaning again, but really, give me a break.

He also knows that I am part owner of Ears Back a very capable 6yo mare that is being aimed at a Group 3 race this coming Saturday except that she’s on the barrier list after not entering the gates at her last start at Wingatui when in season (first time in her life). The trainer has tried valiantly this past few days to have her cleared for the race. Jump-outs last week were declined at the last minute as suitable because the mare didn’t have a race day rider on board. Off to Ashburton today to take part in an exhibition gallop by agreement of the club, a senior stipe and the barrier team .. an expensive float trip .. but sadly John Oatham decided at the last minute (when the mare arrived) that he would not allow the barriers to be used for the gallop which included a top Dunedin Guineas chance. He over-ruled everyone else who had earlier supported the trainers efforts. So here we are after 2 failed attempts to clear her to race (jump-outs & exhibition gallop), the trainer has to now take her to the trials at Ashburton on Tuesday to then back up again on the Saturday. In an industry where we battle to recover our costs. In an industry where we all try to help and respect others around us (RIU staff, other trainers, riders .. and other owners) .. isn’t it sad when someone like John Oatham can’t be more helpful???? Be more sympathetic and show greater empathy for those in the game??!?

[Huey]

Typical of NZracing , depends who you are.

[Trojan]

Yes Wightmans rant IS ridiculous.  He'll be embellishing the story and what would he expect when he constantly publicly abuses the RIB in a slanderous and personal manner.

[Doomed]

6 minutes ago, Trojan said:

Yes Wightmans rant IS ridiculous.  He'll be embellishing the story and what would he expect when he constantly publicly abuses the RIB in a slanderous and personal manner.

Until we see some other side to the story, surely we have to accept his version.

[Doomed]

This is no mug horse. It is the Timaru Cup winner and a very handy horse. As the owner said, it is the first time it has played up at the barriers. It would be a tragedy if it didn't get to the Wingatui race.

I notice they add on trials for certain horses at the drop of a hat in the North. Taupo this week has two trials on raceday for selected horses.

[Trojan]

28 minutes ago, Doomed said:

Until we see some other side to the story, surely we have to accept his version.

That's a bit naive when you look at Wightmans track record.  No doubt he has been all bluster and arrogance and abused someone.

[Chief Stipe]

26 minutes ago, Doomed said:

I notice they add on trials for certain horses at the drop of a hat in the North. Taupo this week has two trials on raceday for selected horses.

My understanding is they follow a protocol and no doubt ask politely.

[Freda]

I'll put my 2 cents in here.

When I first read the comments from Colin I tended to be sympathetic. 

Mentioned to my staff member who also is a permanent barrier attendant. 

He said ' its a c##t of an animal, an absolute mutt and that's why its called Ears Back.  It has always been a pig at the gates but the new 90 sec rule has caught it out, there isn't time to spend on her anymore. 

It went to the jumpouts and couldn't even get a barrier certificate there.

There was no approval from the gate staff, if he thinks we were going to fuck around BETWEEN races and risk being over time for the next, he's even sillier than people think.

And as for after the last of ten races, is he for real?

The horse doesn't want to do it, its never been happy about doing it.'

So that is pretty much word for word in response.  

[Trojan]

Col should look on the bright side he got another 2 days to get it right.

[Chief Stipe]

47 minutes ago, Freda said:

I'll put my 2 cents in here.

When I first read the comments from Colin I tended to be sympathetic. 

Mentioned to my staff member who also is a permanent barrier attendant. 

He said ' its a c##t of an animal, an absolute mutt and that's why its called Ears Back.  It has always been a pig at the gates but the new 90 sec rule has caught it out, there isn't time to spend on her anymore. 

It went to the jumpouts and couldn't even get a barrier certificate there.

There was no approval from the gate staff, if he thinks we were going to fuck around BETWEEN races and risk being over time for the next, he's even sillier than people think.

And as for after the last of ten races, is he for real?

The horse doesn't want to do it, its never been happy about doing it.'

So that is pretty much word for word in response.  

Interesting though that there is no mention in the Stipes report for the offending races.  

[Freda]

13 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Interesting though that there is no mention in the Stipes report for the offending races.  

Er...what offending races?

[Chief Stipe]

2 minutes ago, Freda said:

Er...what offending races?

From what I can see it isn't mentioned in any Stewards reports that the horse has been an issue at the start.  Is there a separate list of warnings for barrier manners?  It doesn't surprise me that there is no mention because the reports really should be better than they are.

[Freda]

3 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

From what I can see it isn't mentioned in any Stewards reports that the horse has been an issue at the start.  Is there a separate list of warnings for barrier manners?  It doesn't surprise me that there is no mention because the reports really should be better than they are.

Oh.  No, I don't think there are comments as long as the animal loads, even if reluctantly or is difficult to handle.

But there is now a 90 sec time limit after which horses must not be persevered with.  Reportedly this directive was Entain-driven, as they are not pleased with the unprofessional look/ loss of turnover when races are running consistently late with poorly educated horses holding up the starts.

[Chief Stipe]

Just now, Freda said:

Oh.  No, I don't think there are comments as long as the animal loads, even if reluctantly or is difficult to handle.

But there is now a 90 sec time limit after which horses must not be persevered with.  Reportedly this directive was Entain-driven, as they are not pleased with the unprofessional look/ loss of turnover when races are running consistently late with poorly educated horses holding up the starts.

It shouldn't have been ENTAIN driven it should have been NZTR/RIB driven.  It isn't fair to other horses.  In the offending race which was Ears Back's last race at Wingatui no horses received a barrier warning.  Earlier 3 horses were warned.  

Noticeably in the offending race a number of horses had problems in the barriers - no doubt because they had to wait for a problematic horse.

[Freda]

I'll add a bit more;  after asking a few questions of several [  just to be absolutely fair ] including ANOTHER barrier staff member...yes, there was provisional approval from the office, but as the barrier staff weren't consulted approval was not given from them.

As was said to me, if the request had been for help before the first, even though it meant extra time which isn't re-imbursed, the barrier boys might have been ok to help.

But to rock up at the races and expect it to happen halfway through the day, no.

[Freda]

3 hours ago, Doomed said:

This is no mug horse. It is the Timaru Cup winner and a very handy horse. As the owner said, it is the first time it has played up at the barriers. It would be a tragedy if it didn't get to the Wingatui race.

I notice they add on trials for certain horses at the drop of a hat in the North. Taupo this week has two trials on raceday for selected horses.

Usually before the first, I believe.

[Doomed]

Thank you for that Pam.  I often think it be a great idea if someone in authority was to keep an eye on comments on places like this and come on occasionally to clarify situations which might often have a simple explanation.

[Chief Stipe]

19 minutes ago, Doomed said:

Thank you for that Pam.  I often think it be a great idea if someone in authority was to keep an eye on comments on places like this and come on occasionally to clarify situations which might often have a simple explanation.

Would be an impossible task.  However perhaps a statement online on NZTR would have sufficed.  

From a BOAY perspective I do try to balance things out where I sense something isn't quite right and will play the devils advocate on occasion.

In my opinion it isn't individual Stewards necessarily to blame (with one INCA exception) but the lack of Standard Operating Procedures, protocols and systems in place to ensure consistency.  Some will call that bureacracy but I think we are well short of having appropriate controls in place.

For example raceday protocols don't seem to have an Quality Control systems in place especially when the handover occurs between the Club, NZTR and then to the RIB.

[TAB For Ever]

20 minutes ago, Doomed said:

Thank you for that Pam.  I often think it be a great idea if someone in authority was to keep an eye on comments on places like this and come on occasionally to clarify situations which might often have a simple explanation.

Seriously Doomed , people in authority should not spend their time on Social media...may learn the odd thing , very odd !

IMO Posters need to gather their facts and not just guess about things and repeat gossip and mother-in-law research !

I do wonder about you utter faith in the Timaru Cup and the fading club that hosts it....gotta say I enjoyed both codes there back in the day but like Grey Way , they didn;t last forever !

[Murray Fish]

17 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

Seriously Doomed , people in authority should not spend their time on Social media...may learn the odd thing , very odd !

Typical shallow shit from you! any smart leadership will have their  heads around platforms that allow organic feedback! What has been lacking has been the backbone and political nous and intellectual skill to use these social media forums!

Of course! anyone that has a understanding of racing history and how as a Industry! especially Head Office! has lagged years behind in the move into the digital area!  You reap what you sow! and no amount of snide wailing from the likes of 'shallow peti-bourgeois Pollyanna' like yourself can change that!

30 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

I do wonder about you utter faith in the Timaru Cup and the fading club that hosts it...

One does have to wonder what you have chose to continue to sneer and talk smack around SCRC and D?  

From the outside, they seem to have a active local population trying to make things work!

[TAB For Ever]

1 hour ago, Murray Fish said:

Typical shallow shit from you! any smart leadership will have their  heads around platforms that allow organic feedback! What has been lacking has been the backbone and political nous and intellectual skill to use these social media forums!

Of course! anyone that has a understanding of racing history and how as a Industry! especially Head Office! has lagged years behind in the move into the digital area!  You reap what you sow! and no amount of snide wailing from the likes of 'shallow peti-bourgeois Pollyanna' like yourself can change that!

One does have to wonder what you have chose to continue to sneer and talk smack around SCRC and D?  

From the outside, they seem to have a active local population trying to make things work!

Tosser !

[Chief Stipe]

I always said Monday's were professionals night...seems afternoons as well.

[TAB For Ever]

4 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

I always said Monday's were professionals night...seems afternoons as well.

The aftermath......such a great weekend for NZ Racing !

And Too Darn Hot here at present.

Reading story about Dunedin man who tore head off seagull....used to be nice people down that way !

[The Centaur]

1 hour ago, Murray Fish said:

Typical shallow shit from you! any smart leadership will have their  heads around platforms that allow organic feedback! What has been lacking has been the backbone and political nous and intellectual skill to use these social media forums!

Of course! anyone that has a understanding of racing history and how as a Industry! especially Head Office! has lagged years behind in the move into the digital area!  You reap what you sow! and no amount of snide wailing from the likes of 'shallow peti-bourgeois Pollyanna' like yourself can change that!

One does have to wonder what you have chose to continue to sneer and talk smack around SCRC and D?  

From the outside, they seem to have a active local population trying to make things work!

Agree you make a valid point Mr Fish.

Back in 1994 I was the first New Zealander to join a racing forum group (Australia's first) run from out of Western Australia. About that time I phoned NZ TAB and tried to get the message across "Hey you guys should look at this internet thing". Reply was  "never heard of it but will pass it on".

After a week or so managed to get hold of one of the top managers "Who  informed me "Our customers will never be interested in anything like that".

In early 2000's the racing honchos set up a web portal or racing hub and even endorsed the early Channel X site. However the management of these social media web sites left a lot to be desired. Even to this day some of the owners seem to think they have a right to engage in personal abuse. (Excluding our host here offcourse). 

 

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Reading story about Dunedin man who tore head off seagull....used to be nice people down that way !

Now that's an even worthy of an "Aftermath" discussion - not a competitive safely run horse race.