Brodie Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) Michael House has bailed out the Manawatu Club over many seasons with providing heaps of horses for racing! Now who wouldve thought that he would be providing half of the field at Addington On Friday night. An eight horse 55-64 race over 1950m has four Michael House trained horses running! There has been a fair bit of racing recently but is it a major worry for harness racing at Addington when Mr House has to provide half of the field or the race would not be run and the other 4 horses included in another race? Bear in mind that it was suggested I believe that Michael House is looking at going over to the gallopers Darkside! Edited August 10, 2022 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) Maybe Housie can turn into the 'Ben Yole of Tassie trotting' and pick up all the rejects around the place and dominate Nz trotting through weight of numbers ? Yole sometimes as 8-10 runners in a race in Tassie and 40-50 race starters per meeting lol. Edited August 10, 2022 by Gammalite 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 1 hour ago, Gammalite said: Maybe Housie can turn into the 'Ben Yole of Tassie don't think Mikey owns a chainsaw 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paleface adios Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 1 hour ago, Gammalite said: Maybe Housie can turn into the 'Ben Yole of Tassie trotting' and pick up all the rejects around the place and dominate Nz trotting through weight of numbers ? Yole sometimes as 8-10 runners in a race in Tassie and 40-50 race starters per meeting lol. geez gammalite BEN YOLE is our leading trainer in the country . your hard to please 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 1 hour ago, paleface adios said: geez gammalite BEN YOLE is our leading trainer in the country . your hard to please That's what i'm saying. What a model to follow . Mr House could win a lot of races if fills the fields ?? not great from a punting angle though. Give it a miss altogeather? and starting 50 horses at one meeting takes a few trucks ! lol. a few junior drivers could 'get a Go' on the up-side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted August 10, 2022 Author Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) Michael House continues to train what seems to be a helluva lot lf horses. Most of them seem to have come from other trainers and I am wondering if there is some type of training for a percentage of the stake money arrangement going on?? If there is, I can not see how it is profitable for him with the cost of everything nowadays! If a horse was in work for a full year without much of a break, it would cost approx. $30,000 I would estimate. Therefore a horse would need to be winning possibly 5 races in that year to break even! You can see why syndication is becoming more popular and going to be very difficult to attract new owners, with the increased cost of living! Michael House deserves credit for keeping fields up in size not only at Palmy but Addington as well now! Edited August 10, 2022 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) 10 hours ago, Brodie said: Michael House continues to train what seems to be a helluva lot lf horses. Most of them seem to have come from other trainers and I am wondering if there is some type of training for a percentage of the stake money arrangement going on?? If there is, I can not see how it is profitable for him with the cost of everything nowadays! If a horse was in work for a full year without much of a break, it would cost approx. $30,000 I would estimate. Therefore a horse would need to be winning possibly 5 races in that year to break even! You can see why syndication is becoming more popular and going to be very difficult to attract new owners, with the increased cost of living! Michael House deserves credit for keeping fields up in size not only at Palmy but Addington as well now! The figure your talking about may be the cost of what the higher end trainers charge,but those type of trainers would have costs for all sorts of extra things like vets,but the average run of the mill trainer wouldn't be charging that. If you were an owner tainer and doing it yourself and had all the gear,then the costs you would be paying out would be around $130 a week. per horse. That doesn't include time,but would include the best of feed,shoeing if you were doing it yourself,transport and track fees.If you were paying a farrier it would be $120 every 4 weeks or so.So while significant,when suggesting the cost to house ,then the only extras i could see would be the cost of employees and vets. And isn't his wife a vet so that would help that cost ? Every trainer has their own circumstances,and for the likes of trainers not charging at the high end,then their hourly rates would be poor,but in houses case your figures would significantly over estimate his actual costs. Edited August 10, 2022 by the galah 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted August 10, 2022 Share Posted August 10, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, the galah said: The figure your talking about may be the cost of what the higher end trainers charge,but those type of trainers would have costs for all sorts of extra things like vets,but the average run of the mill trainer wouldn't be charging that. I think the Brodsters 7 points are near on the money Mr Galah. Nearly all trainers have 'arrangements ' with their owners to gain the most profit and make it affordable for all parties. All stables need vets , and is one of the major costs. usually itemised out separate to the monthly account. Training in the 90's was around your figure of $130 per week per horse. Everything is double that now , and having priced the cost of racing a horse in Queensland with local trainers . (I imagine would be similar Nz) I could itemise a few things but generally it cost you $1000 a month in the 90's, and is near $2000 a month now. 4 of us did 28 horses at a time training in the 90's. I would suspect that would be 8 people needed to do this amount of horses these days. So the horse pretty much has to win One race each weather season or 4 races per year ( , just to break even as Brodie has suggested. So not really worth the effort unless you can get a group or listed race performer (which is hard to do! lol ) Edited August 10, 2022 by Gammalite add in 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 2 hours ago, Gammalite said: I think the Brodsters 7 points are near on the money Mr Galah. Nearly all trainers have 'arrangements ' with their owners to gain the most profit and make it affordable for all parties. All stables need vets , and is one of the major costs. usually itemised out separate to the monthly account. Training in the 90's was around your figure of $130 per week per horse. Everything is double that now , and having priced the cost of racing a horse in Queensland with local trainers . (I imagine would be similar Nz) I could itemise a few things but generally it cost you $1000 a month in the 90's, and is near $2000 a month now. 4 of us did 28 horses at a time training in the 90's. I would suspect that would be 8 people needed to do this amount of horses these days. So the horse pretty much has to win One race each weather season or 4 races per year ( , just to break even as Brodie has suggested. So not really worth the effort unless you can get a group or listed race performer (which is hard to do! lol ) As i have said ,the figure i have said is what it costs an owner /trainer to do his or her horses. I have said it doesn't factor in time.I know what i have said is accurate. All stables may need vets if they are to "get the best" out of the horse,but not all trainers use vets.In fact i don't know anyone in the area i keep my horses that would use a vet.The trainer with the biggest team has only the one worker. Just works hard to keep the costs down for his owners. Of note,young trainers have little chance of ever buying their own properties anymore due to the cost of land increasing so much,so if they were to do so,there is little chance their incomes from harness racing would service the costs of paying off the property as well as general everyday living costs,no matter how much they charge. Dairying was the major reason for that.And i believe the costs of setting up a training establishment is part of what sometimes drives some young trainers to operate outside the rules. I assume when you say its not worth the effort unless you get a group winner relates to the financial side. But i don't agree with that either.But of course your right if your suggesting most people race horses with the hope of financial reward,not the expectation. I think we would both agree anyone who races a horse needs to either be an optimist or have a love of what they do,or probably both.I know you love your horses and you seem an optimist. Edited August 11, 2022 by the galah 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honestjohn Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 I used to pay $700 cash per month to trainers around 2009 and cash for any vets bills as well. I have a share in a horse now that works out to $1600 a month. I hate to think what the brylcreem kid charges?? Hj Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 25 minutes ago, the galah said: As i have said ,the figure i have said is what it costs an owner /trainer to do his or her horses. I have said it doesn't factor in time.I know what i have said is accurate. All stables may need vets if they are to "get the best" out of the horse,but not all trainers use vets.In fact i don't know anyone in the area i keep my horses that would use a vet.The trainer with the biggest team has only the one worker. Just works hard to keep the costs down for his owners. Of note,young trainers have little chance of ever buying their own properties anymore due to the cost of land increasing so much,so if they were to do so,there is little chance their incomes from harness racing would service the costs of paying off the property as well as general everyday living costs,no matter how much they charge. Dairying was the major reason for that.And i believe the costs of setting up a training establishment is part of what sometimes drives some young trainers to operate outside the rules. I assume when you say its not worth the effort unless you get a group winner relates to the financial side. But i don't agree with that either.But of course your right if your suggesting most people race horses with the hope of financial reward,not the expectation. I think we would both agree anyone who races a horse needs to either be an optimist or have a love of what they do,or probably both.I know you love your horses and you seem an optimist. Some more great points you have made. yes not worth the effort does apply to the financial area. as Brodie has out-lined. The enjoyment factor too, is a priority in racing a horse. you have syndicates owners, breeders, leaseing owners, and purchasing owners. so 4 groups. The last one puts the Trainer under pressure as you need a result to recover the purchase price and things go awry just when you don't want them too. seen it happen a few times. Syndication as Brodie said is great for bringing groups in. The 24 hour horse racing station on TV has ad's for the thoroughbreds every hour and are LIGHT YEARS ahead in getting owners togeather than trotting . I am convinced and would even buy int that , ahead of trots. very professionally done. My friend just finished racing his first horse with a 20th share (sold off at the big Gold Coast broodmare sale recently) She won 4 races including Flemington. Fees were quite manageable for small shares like that and you still make the racebook as a listed owner. I liked the Breeding owners as they are really attached to their stock and love them dearly through thick and thin. I Leased them myself as could send them 'home' when finished racing with them. I think TURN IT UP is racing well on lease from Nz . would love to get one like him !! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 In the North Island it's $998.20 to spell a horse, with no additives at all, for July 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 3 hours ago, Honestjohn said: I hate to think what the brylcreem kid charges?? Can't be referring to dear old Elmer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) 3 hours ago, Michael said: In the North Island it's $998.20 to spell a horse, with no additives at all, for July 2022 Would that be for 9 months? Its $30 per week for good grass paddocks,shelters and feed and tack room included where i am.Costs $8 per bale of very good quality meadow hay if you have to supplement food. . Edited August 11, 2022 by the galah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paleface adios Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 23 hours ago, Brodie said: Michael House continues to train what seems to be a helluva lot lf horses. Most of them seem to have come from other trainers and I am wondering if there is some type of training for a percentage of the stake money arrangement going on?? If there is, I can not see how it is profitable for him with the cost of everything nowadays! If a horse was in work for a full year without much of a break, it would cost approx. $30,000 I would estimate. Therefore a horse would need to be winning possibly 5 races in that year to break even! You can see why syndication is becoming more popular and going to be very difficult to attract new owners, with the increased cost of living! Michael House deserves credit for keeping fields up in size not only at Palmy but Addington as well now! race your horse over here mate great stake money weak fields good for a punt . Perth good place to race or great mile racing managle plus smaller training fees 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gammalite Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 35 minutes ago, paleface adios said: race your horse over here mate great stake money weak fields good for a punt . Perth good place to race or great mile racing managle plus smaller training fees A few do already Paleface!!. The leading trainers Robert and John Dunn while busy winning all the big Trotters races in NZ , sent their Pacer to Australia to race. ALTA ORLANDO picked up another $20k the other day when 4th in the' Blacks A Fake' Group1 in Brissy. Has picked up $70k from 12 starts this year. Probably better than what could of earned in NZ. also $50k when 3rd in the Interdominion Final last December. I think he'll get 3rd again this year too in Vic Interdom. (or hope so for the Dunn's anyway)😊🏆 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted August 11, 2022 Author Share Posted August 11, 2022 (edited) Reality is that you only need to look thru the fields of the tighter class racing at Addington and see the stake money earned by the horses. Many earn say $100k for example Prince Teka has won a bit over $100k for 115 starts and nine wins. Yes it is owner trained but imagine if it was trained by a fulltime trainer all the stake money would be eaten up by the training costs and doubt there would be anything left. Yes a lot of enjoyment for the connections no doubt which is all it can be as you couldnt do it for the financial purpose. Not hard to make $100k legally without the effort and length of time involved racing horses nowadays. Edited August 11, 2022 by Brodie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Posted August 11, 2022 Share Posted August 11, 2022 15 hours ago, the galah said: Would that be for 9 months? Its $30 per week for good grass paddocks,shelters and feed and tack room included where i am.Costs $8 per bale of very good quality meadow hay if you have to supplement food. . No, it's for the month of July only 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Honestjohn Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 16 hours ago, the galah said: Would that be for 9 months? Its $30 per week for good grass paddocks,shelters and feed and tack room included where i am.Costs $8 per bale of very good quality meadow hay if you have to supplement food. . What's a bale of lucerne worth? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted August 12, 2022 Share Posted August 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Honestjohn said: What's a bale of lucerne worth? I believe its between $12 to $15 per bale,depending on who you buy from and the quality. I was going to get some earlier in the year for $10,but wasn't happy with the quality so got very nice meadow hay instead for the $8 price quoted earlier. I believe you can pay around $10 for good quality meadow hay sometimes.Thats the prices in the area i live anyway.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 On 12/08/2022 at 3:07 PM, the galah said: I believe its between $12 to $15 per bale,depending on who you buy from and the quality. I was going to get some earlier in the year for $10,but wasn't happy with the quality so got very nice meadow hay instead for the $8 price quoted earlier. I believe you can pay around $10 for good quality meadow hay sometimes.Thats the prices in the area i live anyway.. What's chaff and oats worth.We used to sell chaff and oats from Ashburton to Auckland for just over half price of what they could buy for up north.That was 30years ago so might have changed now but feed was very dear up there 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Richie said: What's chaff and oats worth.We used to sell chaff and oats from Ashburton to Auckland for just over half price of what they could buy for up north.That was 30years ago so might have changed now but feed was very dear up there $33 a bag for oaten chaff . Edited August 14, 2022 by the galah Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted August 14, 2022 Share Posted August 14, 2022 4 hours ago, the galah said: $33 a bag for oaten chaff . I think 30 years ago we used sell it for $8 locally and $17 in North Island. Cost about $2 bag transport costs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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