Loyalist the 4 win wonderhorse

[Gammalite]

I don't understand how a horse like Loyalist can win a Group race feature race against the best going round in Qld. Won the Redcliffe Cup tonight.

A winner of 4 races for the HOPE stable in Nz from 54 starts. Only 1 win from 17 starts as a 4 yearold .............sure they ran 2nd at Addington 3 times in a row a year ago just before he left Nz last July , so they had him going fairly well . But to go out favourite and blow away a field of horses that have one literally hundreds of races between them.

Well it was BETTERZIPPIT  running second I spose, who couldn't even win at Manawatu. some good ones left struggling tonight like Hot and Treacherous, Colt Thirty One and LL CoolJ all quite a ways behind.  

Loyalist ??? geeez it's hard to keep up with who is 'Top Gun' these days lol.  at least it's simple in Nz . with just Akuta, Self Assured and Copy That to win the big ones. 

[Chief Stipe]

11 hours ago, Gammalite said:

I don't understand how a horse like Loyalist can win a Group race feature race against the best going round in Qld. Won the Redcliffe Cup tonight.

A winner of 4 races for the HOPE stable in Nz from 54 starts. Only 1 win from 17 starts as a 4 yearold .............sure they ran 2nd at Addington 3 times in a row a year ago just before he left Nz last July , so they had him going fairly well . But to go out favourite and blow away a field of horses that have one literally hundreds of races between them.

Well it was BETTERZIPPIT  running second I spose, who couldn't even win at Manawatu. some good ones left struggling tonight like Hot and Treacherous, Colt Thirty One and LL CoolJ all quite a ways behind.  

Loyalist ??? geeez it's hard to keep up with who is 'Top Gun' these days lol.  at least it's simple in Nz . with just Akuta, Self Assured and Copy That to win the big ones. 

Are you writing for Peter Profit now?

[Chief Stipe]

12 hours ago, Gammalite said:

A winner of 4 races for the HOPE stable in Nz from 54 starts. Only 1 win from 17 starts as a 4 yearold .............sure they ran 2nd at Addington 3 times in a row a year ago just before he left Nz last July , so they had him going fairly well . But to go out favourite and blow away a field of horses that have one literally hundreds of races between them.

You forgot to mention the 6 races it has won in the last year.

Although Ben Hope has improved may I suggest Loyalist may have won more in NZ with a different driver.

Not the first Bettors Delight to get better with age either.

 

[Gammalite]

1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said:

You forgot to mention the 6 races it has won in the last year.

Although Ben Hope has improved may I suggest Loyalist may have won more in NZ with a different driver.

Not the first Bettors Delight to get better with age either.

 

Yeah good points. It's just frustrating when they seem so dominant when they weren't in Nz. Makes em hard to pick.

I love supporting the Nz horses that come over . Hot and Treacherous, Alta Orlando (even Taipo at Menangle last night) as well as Amazing Dream , American Dealer , CopyThat in recent years. and just love Spirit of St Louis.(who won yet again last night )

But trainer J Grimson running the Quinella last night with LOYALIST and BETTERZIPPIT is just a bit much really. But the Bloke has won the last 2 Interdominion Grand Finals so shouldn't be that 'Shocked'  I spose. 'Boncel Benjamin' and 'I Cast No Shadow' coming from realitive obscurity to win the title.  Against McCarthy and Emma Stewart powerhouse barns too , who do a mile of 'preparation groundwork' on all their star horses. 

Might as well give him (Grimson)  All the 'medium rare' horses to train , as well as the 'well done' ones. He just wins with them all anyway. Nzer Loyalist too ??. If it Wins the Blacks A Fake Group 1 next month ..I give Up.   

[Chief Stipe]

8 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Yeah good points. It's just frustrating when they seem so dominant when they weren't in Nz. Makes em hard to pick.

Well it's OZ form was enough to say it had a chance.

[paleface adios]

3 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

Are you writing for Peter Profit now?

you don't read that crap do you chief

[Chief Stipe]

36 minutes ago, paleface adios said:

you don't read that crap do you chief

Just the headlines - don't subscribe.  Occasionally there is some useful information.

[Newmarket]

On 24/06/2023 at 10:27 PM, Gammalite said:

I don't understand how a horse like Loyalist can win a Group race feature race against the best going round in Qld. Won the Redcliffe Cup tonight.

A winner of 4 races for the HOPE stable in Nz from 54 starts. Only 1 win from 17 starts as a 4 yearold .............sure they ran 2nd at Addington 3 times in a row a year ago just before he left Nz last July , so they had him going fairly well . But to go out favourite and blow away a field of horses that have one literally hundreds of races between them.

Well it was BETTERZIPPIT  running second I spose, who couldn't even win at Manawatu. some good ones left struggling tonight like Hot and Treacherous, Colt Thirty One and LL CoolJ all quite a ways behind.  

Loyalist ??? geeez it's hard to keep up with who is 'Top Gun' these days lol.  at least it's simple in Nz . with just Akuta, Self Assured and Copy That to win the big ones. 

Yes, some horses do grow a leg in Aus, but this one is a surprise

[Gammalite]

53 minutes ago, Newmarket said:

Yes, some horses do grow a leg in Aus, but this one is a surprise

Loyalist sure to be tested by Open class horses like Expensive Ego this week (maybe) 

Grimson also picking up SWAYZEE dirt cheap off ex-pat kiwis Tim and Ants Butt, because it had lost all form this year racing in Queensland (8 unplaced runs)

Grimson picks it up and it goes Bang..bang..bang bang .... 4 in a row like a freak show. Now taking on Open Class ??? give me a break lol..... can't work out what this guy does to make them jump out of the ground like they do 🙄

here's the Open class race this week .... surely Loyalist and Swayzee are beaten in this lol.......

$53,040 No NR. RBD. PACERS. Mobile

2ND LEG QUADRELLA, FIRST 4, 1ST LEG TREBLE

	Form	Horse	Trainer		Driver		Class	Hcp
1	s1718	BIG WHEELS	Chantal Turpin		Pete McMullen		NR118 B1	FR1	$5
2	58323	MAKE MINE MEMPHIS	Gemma Hewitt		Brendan Barnes		NR120 B2	FR2	$51
3	54758	MACH SHARD NZ	Belinda McCarthy		Jack Callaghan (C)		NR116 B1	FR3	$61
4	17637	KINGMAKER NZ	Belinda McCarthy		Ricky Thurlow		NR101 B1	FR4	$41
5	6s125	EXPENSIVE EGO	Belinda McCarthy		Luke McCarthy		NR120 B1	FR5	$2.80
6	75206	COLT THIRTY ONE	Grant Dixon		Grant Dixon		NR118 B1	FR6	$101
7	2643s	TOMMY LINCOLN NZ (Em 1)	Mark Dux		Mathew Neilson		NR109 B1	FR-	$101
------------------------------ Second Row ------------------------------
8	11112	MAGNIFICENT STORM NZ	Ray Williams		Aiden De Campo		NR120	SR1	$4
9	91111	SWAYZEE	Jason Grimson		Cameron Hart		NR94 B2	SR2	$6
10	38s21	LOYALIST NZ	Jason Grimson		Seaton Grima (C)		NR102 B1	SR3	$9
11	5s202	MANILA PLAYBOY	Shane Fraser		Angus Garrard (C)		NR120 B1	SR4	$17
12	11n27	L L COOL J NZ	Shane Graham		Kelli Dawson		NR120 B1	SR5	$101
13	50051	PETES SAID SO NZ	Grant Dixon		Robert Morris		NR120 B1	SR6	$26

[Gammalite]

On 7/6/2023 at 4:41 PM, Gammalite said:

Grimson also picking up SWAYZEE dirt cheap off ex-pat kiwis Tim and Ants Butt, because it had lost all form this year racing in Queensland (8 unplaced runs)

Grimson picks it up and it goes Bang..bang..bang bang .... 4 in a row like a freak show.

Of course 'Swayzee' wins ... how? is Tim Butt a completely useless trainer or something?  who couldn't get this horse                                                  to run a place in 8 mid class runs in average Qld company this year . 🙄

Grimson wins easily with it , backed in to $4 second fav in an Open Class G3  feature against Interdominion Championship runners and placegetters.  Cam Hart is an outstanding driver but come oooonnn . .... how? 

[Gammalite]

On 7/6/2023 at 4:41 PM, Gammalite said:

Grimson also picking up SWAYZEE dirt cheap off ex-pat kiwis Tim and Ants Butt, because it had lost all form this year racing in Queensland (8 unplaced runs)

Grimson picks it up and it goes Bang..bang..bang bang .... 4 in a row like a freak show. Now taking on Open Class ??? give me a break lol..... can't work out what this guy does to make them jump out of the ground like they do 🙄

here's the Open class race this week .... surely Loyalist and Swayzee are beaten in this lol.......

At least Loyalist didn't Win the Group 1 'Blacks A Fake' grand Circuit event  tonight in Brisbane .

( Loyalist A tidy 3rd in the consolation to Katrina Purdon's horse AKLD horse 'Mach Shard' ) 

BUT BUT but ... Swayzee Does Win It ???  Holy shit....Beating the best horse in the country ? (Leap To Fame)  although Leap To fame was sporting a flat tyre running 2nd.

SWAYZEE  !! 😰🙄🤢 .... no..no ..no.. It can't be true ... 'Grimson' is a Miracle Man . Cam Hart is a great driver , but that horse winning is just plain  B#%&$*@#*&&$&#@)#&$^%##$%^&*S

Is Tim Butt really that bad a trainer?? he had this horse racing midweek getting nothing  .. 

 

[Blackie]

Could of gone another round.

[the galah]

On 23/07/2023 at 8:28 AM, Blackie said:

Could of gone another round.

Was that the horse or the trainer in the punch up after the race.

I see he got 12 months disqualification for punching someone who as being held by a security guard. j Trainor out for 3 months.

Does make you wonder though .

It seems everyone everywhere thinks the stable is giving them something,hence the punch up,Yet they have never been caught doing so.From which you can draw the conclusion that people have no faith in authorities to detect the performance enhancers they may be using,assuming everyone is right.

Edited August 24, 2023 by the galah

[Gammalite]

24 minutes ago, the galah said:

On 7/23/2023 at 6:28 AM, Blackie said:

 

Was that the horse or the trainer in the punch up after the race

hahaha thats clever. 😂.

I am surprised at the punch up stuff. Must of been quite serious to get 12 months though.

People react badly to criticism sometimes , but to jeopardise his license , after winning the last 2 Interdominions and that , is crazy. 

35 minutes ago, the galah said:

It seems everyone everywhere thinks the stable is giving them something,hence the punch up,Yet they have never been caught doing so.From which you can draw the conclusion that people have no faith in authorities to detect the performance enhancers they may be using,assuming everyone is right.

Well sometimes things aren't that easy (like simple bi-carb level testing and stuff like that) Lance Armstrong and his cronnies got away with it for years and years in the cycling world , even with strict daily testing. It took a confession from a rider to bring them down ultimately.

In USA currently at this time , 12 harness racing Trainers are training under 'Stays' still , after positives for this and that . Charging and proving is difficult for even simple things. 'Cobalt' cases cause plenty of issues even , in both thoroughbred and Standardbred.

I think there is too many lawyers making black and white turn grey if you know what I mean... 

 

[the galah]

I see he had a horse called mynameisjeff run 1.48.9 first up for the stable last night. Apparently operating under a stay of penalty while they hear his appeal.

Mynameisjeff bred by glenys chimel maybe.

Ran like it could have won by double the winning margin if the driver had wanted.

Funny thing was i was watching some  Aussie gallops yesterday and was thinking how well the waterhouse/bott stable was going in victoria and nsw.

Then i heard ron dufficy coment near the end of the day that some horse they train looked like it would have run through a wall,after it won. Then he said,well they added the tounge tie today but no one can have predicted that much improvement on its last run. Then he said ,mind you, everything from that stable is going like that lately. i've never heard him comment like that before,but it was obvious he was meaning something with those comments.

Edited August 27, 2023 by the galah

[Brodie]

8 minutes ago, the galah said:

I see he had a horse called mynameisjeff run 1.48.9 first up for the stable last night. Apparently operating under a stay of penalty while they hear his appeal.

Mynameisjeff bred by glenys chimel maybe.

Ran like it could have won by double the winning margin if the driver had wanted.

Funny thing was i was watching some  Aussie gallops yesterday and was thinking how well the waterhouse/bott stable was going in victoria and nsw.

Then i heard ron dufficy coment near the end of the day that some horse they train looked like it would have run through a wall,after it won. Then he said,well they added the tounge tie today but no one can have predicted that much improvement on its last run. Then he said ,mind you, everything from that stable is going like that lately. i've never heard him comment like that before,but it was obvious he was meaning something with those comments.

Galah, what are you doing watching gallops??

Where do you think the saying “its a mugs game” came  from?

You can not follow thoroughbred form to any great degree!

They can win one day and run awful the next!

As long as you dont wager on them you will be fine lol

[Chief Stipe]

39 minutes ago, the galah said:

Then he said ,mind you, everything from that stable is going like that lately. i've never heard him comment like that before,but it was obvious he was meaning something with those comments.

A number of trainers have better or similar strike rates currently this season.

Waterhouse and Bott were only 5th on the NSW Premiership last year and running about the same this year.

[Gammalite]

42 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

A number of trainers have better or similar strike rates currently this season.

Waterhouse and Bott were only 5th on the NSW Premiership last year and running about the same this year.

Gai and Adrian are still pretty good Chief.

Over 1000 winners from 5670 starts and closing in on $100,000,000  prize in 7 years. 

2023/24	15	24.2%	18	53.2%	62	$1,076,650	0	1	0	0	$1.47
2022/23	160	20.6%	201	46.5%	777	$19,961,245	4	3	13	12	$1.07
2021/22	158	18.7%	200	42.3%	846	$14,996,242	5	4	4	4	$1.02
2020/21	137	19.1%	179	44.1%	717	$10,004,215	2	2	2	8	$0.96
2019/20	141	16.5%	217	42.0%	853	$10,729,641	4	2	6	4	$0.80
2018/19	127	16.0%	179	38.4%	796	$8,438,700	0	3	10	7	$0.85
2017/18	165	19.0%	227	45.1%	869	$11,913,027	3	7	8	8	$0.90
2016/17	151	20.1%	193	45.9%	750	$9,537,305	2	4	4	13	$0.89
Overall	1054	18.6%	1414	24.9%	5670	$86,657,025	20	26	47	56	$0.90

[the galah]

11 hours ago, Brodie said:

Galah, what are you doing watching gallops??

Where do you think the saying “its a mugs game” came  from?

You can not follow thoroughbred form to any great degree!

They can win one day and run awful the next!

As long as you dont wager on them you will be fine lol

I'm a harness racing supporter through and through,but i did used to bet on the gallops as well. I don't bet on the gallops much at all now. If i do have a bet on the nz gallops it is when the tracks get firmer.

I agree the gallops form is more inconsistent ,although think thats in part due to in the south island the jockeys not being as good as they used to be. A handful are tops,but many seem to lack experience and consistency in how they ride.

I still enjoy watching them though,as i do the dogs sometimes. 

saturday nights theres never anything worth watching on tv either.

[the galah]

11 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

A number of trainers have better or similar strike rates currently this season.

Waterhouse and Bott were only 5th on the NSW Premiership last year and running about the same this year.

Are you saying ron dufficy doesn't know what he is talking about?

I have always thought he is the best judge in the australian racing media.

I quoted his words earlier.

Clearly he thinks the waterhouse/bott team have grown a leg in the last couple of weeks.

He's talking about the present,not last month or earlier in the year.

 

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, the galah said:

Are you saying ron dufficy doesn't know what he is talking about?

I have always thought he is the best judge in the australian racing media.

I quoted his words earlier.

Clearly he thinks the waterhouse/bott team have grown a leg in the last couple of weeks

He's talking about the present,not last month or earlier in the year.

 

No I disagree with what you are inferring.

The Duff is a cheeky little commentator who often throws out glib comments.

Waterhouse and Bott's performance isn't anything out of the ordinary nor signficantly different to a number of other trainers.

Anyone who follows the gallops knows that Gai Waterhouse is a meaner version of her father TJ Smith.  No prisoners in her stable going by the attrition rate.  Her horses don't start in a race to "have a run" or to warm up for bigger things.  So early in the season her horses do shine.  Compared to someone like Chris Waller who takes a more traditional Kiwi approach where he winds his horses up slowly with bigger targets later in the season.

[the galah]

9 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

No I disagree with what you are inferring.

The Duff is a cheeky little commentator who often throws out glib comments.

Waterhouse and Bott's performance isn't anything out of the ordinary nor signficantly different to a number of other trainers.

Anyone who follows the gallops knows that Gai Waterhouse is a meaner version of her father TJ Smith.  No prisoners in her stable going by the attrition rate.  Her horses don't start in a race to "have a run" or to warm up for bigger things.  So early in the season her horses do shine.  Compared to someone like Chris Waller who takes a more traditional Kiwi approach where he winds his horses up slowly with bigger targets later in the season.

I haven't heard him say a horse looked like it would run through a wall before, like he did on saturday.Obviously his opinion for what its worth.

 

[Chief Stipe]

7 minutes ago, the galah said:

I haven't heard him say a horse looked like it would run through a wall before, like he did on saturday.Obviously his opinion for what its worth.

 

You obviously haven't listend to Duff very much have you!

What do you think of this quote from little Ron:

 

 

[the galah]

I see mynameisjeff was bred by glenis chimel. She must have liked the film 22jump street or maybe channing tatum is her favorite actor.

The horse looks to be the next big thing going by its performance the other night. Maybe the big track helped it as it struggled on the bends for its previous trainer in victoria.

Will be interesting to see how it performs once grimson is out. Maybe he will get his wife or someone else from the family or maybe the farrier to do the training.Isn't that what they do normally..

I see the write up by adam hamilton on the hrnz website says grimson assaulted someone after provocation.

Why did adam hamilton think it necssary to put the provocation comment in his story. Not sure if hes suggesting being called a drug cheat is provocation to punch someone while that name caller is being held by a security guard. I read somewhere that is what supposedly happened but the actual detail of the assault seems to have been given very little coverage,which seems rather strange. Isn't grimsons dominance a bad thing for harness racing in australia. Cleary most think hes cheating and that is what punters will think as well.

Edited August 27, 2023 by the galah

[Gammalite]

1 hour ago, the galah said:

I quoted his words earlier.

Clearly he thinks the waterhouse/bott team have grown a leg in the last couple of weeks.

He's talking about the present,not last month or earlier in the year.

Chief thinks only average... but who isn't compared to Waller with 700 horses listed lol..

I would say Gai Waterhouse/Adrian Bott would have a 'fair few' as well. they syndicate now with All these micro shares of things like buy into 8 horses for 2k no more to pay and you have a so many 100ths of a share etc. quite funny what they can con people with lol.

Just wanted to add Gai and Adrian have the most expensive horse in Australia at the moment.

A yulong investments (chinese) purchase for $10,000,000 earlier in year from UK. where she won 4 Group 1's. Second highest price ever paid at auction for a racehorse.  named ALCOHOL FREE . a mare no less 😲. It won a Randwick trial on Friday and nearly ready to go this time In....  

Fancy paying $10,000,000 for a mare?. Could of just paid $1,000,000 each for 8 race winning colts, and had $2,000,000 left for the training fees for a year or 2 ..... and had 8 times the fun and 8 times the chance of winning a Big race.