
Doomed
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Everything posted by Doomed
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Tokyo Tycoon - 2 yr old of the year. Controversial?
Doomed replied to Huey's topic in Galloping Chat
As far back as I can remember the 2yo of the year has always won at least one group 1 race and sometimes two. Usually one of the two NZ group ones, but occasionally an Aussie group 1. This is a major and extreme departure from the normal process. Some people don't seem to understand the significance of this. It means that Karaka restricted entry race now has more relevance than the group race pattern. If it is generally accepted that this is now reality then why not get rid of the group pattern altogether? What relevance does it have going forward? As it stands, the best 3yo male and filly probably won't contest either of the Riccarton Guineas races, preferring to go for the bigger Karaka money. This is perfectly understandable as they are owned by syndicates and group status means nothing to big syndicates. But again, why have a group pattern? I genuinely expected with all the money Entain was throwing around that the two Riccarton races would probably go to $1m and $750,000. Interestingly they didn't go up much at all and an extra $500,000 went into the Karaka race instead. You cannot tell me that they aren't trying to destroy the Riccarton races altogether, or at least get them moved north. Interesting times. Certainly not the NZ racing industry that I remember, and I quickly find myself losing interest. Obviously us traditionalists aren't really valued or needed anymore, which is all good. They are entitled to that approach. I hope it works out well for them. -
Cambridge Trials Cancelled....wheels fallen off?
Doomed replied to Chief Stipe's topic in Galloping Chat
The Cambridge fields on Wednesday are hardly flash either. Only 7 races, only one with more than 8 accepters and a couple with only 6. -
You would be disappointed if a couple of trainers couldn't come up with a couple of horses to make up a 6 horse field and run for $22,000. I continue to be impressed by the Tylers who seem to have the attitude that the money is there so why not run for it.
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I thought I had every right to participate. Shocked I didn't win.
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At least they haven't moved them all to Waverly which used to be the go to track for transfers.
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Victorian Owners Association serves it up to Racing Victoria!
Doomed replied to Chief Stipe's topic in Galloping Chat
Just imagine if we had an organisation in NZ that came out and told the governing bodies when they had made a massive cock-up. We might have made a mistake asking Messara for advice rather than Munz. We got the wrong M. -
So it's all about being able to have feature 2yo races in Nov Dec rather than April May? I never realised that was the major reason for the change.
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So better for a horse born in January to race in Nov than a horse born in August to race in May? I am quite interested in this subject, but no one has ever responded before. Under the old timing a 2yo would have a few months to mature and gradually build up to racing through the spring and summer and peak for Autumn features and then have the winter off. Under the new dates they surely are too immature to race during the summer months, then have to have the winter off when there are no feature meetings so I presume the 2yo features are squeezed into Nov and Dec. I am interested in this subject from an academic perspective. I wouldn't bet on harness 2yo racing anyhow as there are usually red hot favs. But I would love to know how the change of season dates has worked.
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2yos always used to be able to race in Nov, if I can remember correctly. And galloping 2yos can start racing from Sept, and are already having group races in Nov.
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So do they announce a horse of the year for 2022 or for 2022/23?
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My god! The National and the Louisson used to be the two big early season races in the South. I recall Our Mana winning one and all the open pacers used to resume in those races. $16,000 these days. How sad is that.
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It's an appallingly written document. Obviously totally aimed at one predetermined outcome. Their priority seems to be to save a few travelling costs. Rather than having 4-5,000 people turning up at Orari on a Sunday they would rather have 40 or 50 people turn up at Addington. Saves some trainers a few dollars in petrol. Obviously the same trainers, drivers and owners are happier racing in front of 50 people at Addington rather than a full house at a country meeting. Atmosphere not really considered important. Sadly Michael, I doubt you will get more than 3 or 4 people commenting on this thread. Harness people never really get the big picture, they would rather debate whether the Whale has picked a $1.60 winner.
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I have asked much the same question several times myself and no one either seems to know or care. They still seem to work on the season going 1 August to 31 July, but horses ages seems to go 1 January to 31 December. Seems weird to me. I have asked before how people think the change of season dates has worked, but never had a single response. People don't seem to care, or possibly don't understand the question.
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I'm wondering if the ferry cancellations might affect numbers this weekend. Are the northern candidates already in place or are they waiting for a break in the weather?
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My analyst has suggested that I really need to be more positive, so I just thought I should mention that things are obviously looking up for the national carnival this year. I recall last year the club was racing around trying to find out if any jumps trainers were planning to attend, this year there has been none of that so it sounds like we can expect some full fields and good racing.
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I can certainly remember Flying View being placed at Riccarton in good company, he may even have won one. I recall he used to race in the Timaru Cup and then drop back in distance to the sprint on the second day. I even have a vague idea he may have placed in the big WFA sprint at Te Rapa. Sad that the likes of Westport, Nelson, Orari and Waimate are no longer with us, they used to suit a certain type of horse.
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I would be fascinated to hear what those people who criticise Reefton think of Moonee Valley. Every race I saw from the Valley on Saturday the horse leading for home ran away and won easily. Give me Reefton any day. I think if Reefton was to put on a $2m slot race it could be a great success. The TAB might even sponsor it.
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Are you suggesting these "prime holiday race dates" should be coducted on the Riccarton AWT? That is afterall the SI's flashest track, and in the largest population area: albeit a mere provincial area in terms of the PGF. The only worry being that this is a club that has given away all its prime holiday dates, such as Waitangi day and Easter Monday, over the years.
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Well constructed letter I thought, I look forward to the response.
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I note it isn't explicitly stated that NZTR is stumping up the whole half million to boost the stake. NZTR just says the stake is going to $1.5m. NZ Bloodstock though seem to indicate the extra is all coming from NZTR, so effectively subsidised by the rest of the industry. Along with the new $350,000 restricted race in the SI and others like it, it does make me wonder whether the Group race system has any more relevance in NZ. We now have group races like the NZ Cup and Coupland Stakes dwarfed in stakes by the various novelty races. I'm not sure how the handicapper compares form out of the novelty races with form out of group races. How much longer before there is a push to see the novelty races granted group status? Interesting that the breeders are big exponents of these novelty races at the expense of group races. Perhaps someone could explain to me the relevance of listed races? Do we need them anymore? Perhaps get rid of them first and then work on dropping Group races?
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I would be interested in seeing the process Brian. I have largely given up bothering about how the industry is run any more, but it does no harm to confirm my suspicion that they moved on from being largely incompetent to now being closer to corrupt.
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Off until Wednesday I see. All the more reason why they should have raced at Timaru last Sunday. There should be a grass track meeting each week in the south in case this sort of thing happens. The AWTs should be for a largely separate set of horses and follow their own pattern. I notice there was no suggestion to move this meeting to the AWT. Perhaps that approach has been discontinued after one attempt.
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Does anyone know who the RIB actaully answers to?
Doomed replied to Reefton's topic in Galloping Chat
As Pam said, the approach is just to wear down anyone who criticises their actions and wait until they disappear. And no way can you afford to take them to court as they have limitless funds and can pour as much money at it as they like, as we have seen in the past. Sadly, most of the club administrators who have stood up to oppressive policies over the years have disappeared, along with their clubs. By my calculation Reefton is probably the only one left. So NZTR, and whatever the other ruling bodies are called these days, have achieved what they desired and they now have the industry they dreamed of. I suspect I will look on with some amusement in 4 or 5 years time when 2 or 3 clubs who assumed they were big beneficiaries of the new regime get told that they are no longer required either. I do wonder what will happen if some of the track reconstructions don't go well and there are no alternative tracks to move meetings to. Where would the north have been in recent times without Te Rapa, which fronts up week after week with all the other tracks either out of action or out of favour. -
This Oamaru meeting brings up a lot of questions. For one, why on earth was there not a SI meeting last Sunday? 54 horses balloted and eliminated at Oamaru. They are all just told tough nothing for you this week, try again in a few weeks, meanwhile keep paying those trainers bills. Contrast that with Ruakaka who ran a meeting with massive stakes last weekend with a grand total of 67 starters. The treatment of the 65 1,200m race is also interesting. 41 noms. So they split it into a $30,000 race and a $20,000 race. The other 13 horses just stay at home. The minimum rating in the $30,000 is 62, in the $20,000 there is one rating 59, the rest all 60 and higher. Contrast that with the two northern meetings this weekend where there are virtually no ballots and any rating horse has no trouble getting a start. Why should the second rating 65 1,200m field have to race for $20,000? Last weekend 7 2yos went around for $60,000 at Ruakaka, this weekend 6 2yos have accepted at Tauranga, probably 4 will start. The open race at Tauranga, 5 horses currently, again probably 4 will start. Why does NZTR not say to Tauranga "look you only have 6 and 5 starters so we will run those races for $20,000". Surely that is the same logic? But really, at the end of the day this all just shows how badly the industry is run, and increasing a few stakes won't fix any of the structural problems. I should mention too, that there are 2 or 3 people on here who think this is exactly how things should work. They think there should be a lot less racing and then when a meeting does eventually pop up there will be big fields and massive betting, and that is the way of the world. They argue that the 54 who miss out at Oamaru aren't really needed and it would be best if they are all retired. Obviously I don't subscribe to that theory.
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Does anyone know who the RIB actaully answers to?
Doomed replied to Reefton's topic in Galloping Chat
The RIB provides a service to the three codes, so surely it is answerable to the codes. In this instance it is surely up to NZTR to reprimand them if it can be shown RIB has acted without integrity.