the galah

i see peter profit has a written a story today that the inside mail he's been given is the chinese property developer won't be paying the $90 million expected on time,in november. Sometimes his inside mail turns out to be wrong and i'm not a subscriber and only read his headlines,but the headline was" is the auckland trotting club stepping closer to the abyss." mick guerin wrote an article last month saying the ATC was paying $115,000 a week just in interest,so every month they wait they have about a half a million $ less to spend on their new training establishment. It already seems obvious the only way they will get a new training establishment is if HRNZ provide the extra funds. So,while who knows if peter profits information will turn put to be correct,but if he is.. Well,given HRNZ is currently throwing money at upper north island racing,is it not a given that if there is a delay in payment to the aucklnad club, it will be a given that even more funds will have to be diverted from south island clubs,owners,breeders,trainers,drivers. why is it they always say its a chinese property developer. Do they not file returns. The company that proceses the money,mount hope limited seems to be nz run with nz shareholders. The whole thing from the lack of media interest as to exactly who and how well funded the purchasers are,HRNZ's plans or lack thereof as relates to the ATC,the lack of transparency and leadership around how auckland issues will impact drag on the whole sports future,or morte precisely lack thereof. Lets hope peter profits inside mail is wrong as for anyone in the south island ,HRNZ has already seemingly attached itself,and every stakeholder in nz with them, to a sinking ship which may be going down a lot quicker than everyone thinks.

he wrote a nice story on a regular redcliffe patron a month ago. "Rest in peace thelma copeland". The redcliffe club named a race after her this month. That story just an illustration of how ranger is able to put into words and paint a picture of harness racing intertwining with every day peoples lives. People who provide the industry with content like that are few and far between.And their importance seeminngly undervalued in some quarters. Rangers connection to grass roots harness enthusiasts is a natural and instinctive thing ,sort of similar to nigel armstrong but in a different form.So few of those media type left anywhere so the industry should be promoting as much exposure as they can from them,while they can.

i like your stories like the redcliffe one. Redcliffe has their very own harness reporter ,duane ranger,father of leading auckland junior monika. duane ranger has developed into perhaps the best media harness story teller in australasia in my opinion. I know we have barrry lichter who is very good,but ranger seems to have free range of what and how long his articles are and by the end of reading them, you feel like you know the person they are talking about and some of their lifes journey. his latest couple of articles are about a trainer who had a recent redcliffe winner and who's first brush with harness racing was when his father used to work the door at harold park. Every time hondo gratten won tony turnbull would tip his father and it helped his family. The other m,ost recent article was about 2 mates who are redcliffe regulars who are going through on going cancer treatment and how they appreciate harness racing. I knew duane ranger earlier in life and used to play a little sport with him occasionally and he was always a great guy and has turned into a great story teller.Just keeps getting better. duane ranger harness racing is what you google to read his stories. He often has stories on ex new zealanders. phill keats was a recent one from memory.He was a junior driver who worked for dick prendegast back in the days along with roy purdon,john lischner and paul hadfield.

interesting concept.Good to see new ideas. Looking at it,it seems to be another form of the sires stakes type model.Just have to be queensland bred to be eligable. in nz, HRNZ are funding the selective group that race in the sires stakes series with a reported $600,000 this coming season. I had thought the increased funding was because the sires stakes weren't getting enough enrolments to put on the higher stakes,but who knows because hrnz like throwing money at the top end horses anyway. looking at how it works fro queensland,you have owners paying a registration fee of $700 for 2yo,$950 for 3yo,$1200 for 4 year old. But they do that a year or two before. has a few conditions and you don't get anything if your horse wins at aged 6 or over. so it seems the point of the scheme is encourage people to support horses bred in queensland only. hopefully it works for them,but nz doesn't have several states like australia. wouldn't it just be easier for hrnz to pay a higher winning stake to the owners of a horse at its first win each season. For nz i think it makes more sense to just redirect the extra funding they have recently handed out,which only a few benefit from,and instead spread the funding so many will benefit from. Even if its just for every horses first win,whatever the age.Just common sense i think to get the most positive impact.But we all know thats not how HRNZ thinks.

Your views expressed seem to be in line with the decision makers at HRNZ,especially the executive leadership. But no one,including him has ever claimed turnover to be a focus of the unhinged content,nor does he have the power to decide where industry funding goes. The fairest comparisons to focus on are the aspects of the industry he focuses on. no point over complicating things,simply ask yourself who does more to give exposure and promote recognition of canterbury owners,a cross section of trainers,breeders,race sponsors,volunteers,getting up close to the horses in the stables,etc,etc? strangley the answer for most would be unhinged,the man,with his wife,doing it with just their own resources and time. Not the multi million dollar funded entain or HRNZ Thats a real head scratcher if ever you had one ? To me hes like a social media influencer,but industry decision makers just ignore using him and limit his,and the industries exposure.. as to him being a syndicate manager or promoting a certain trainer.Why don't hrnz just sit down with him and work out how a formula relating to that, works for both.They do promote many different syndicators in the unhinged content.

have HRNZ put the unhinged content so its easily accessible on the HRNZ website an obvious start. I remember starting a similar thread a few years back with a few ideas of how to promote the sport. Others contributed with their ideas. But i think bit of a yarn is a place where people get to say what they think,but after a while those posting realise decision makers at the clubs and HRNZ aren't listening to what appears on websites like this. I've certainly noticed not anything i have ever said anyway. Thats what i think contributes to an underlying frustration of those posting,that you sense from reading peoples opinions that are posted on here. So you(westview) may well be interested in promoting the sport,but people who make the decisions for the clubs or hrnz just prefer to stay within the box. But anyway,you always seem genuine,so i think you deserve a genuine reply. So one idea is,ask yourself,what do clubs like ashburton or addington or others have. They have racecourses with road frontage that 10's of thousands of people drive past everyday. So why don't they use that road frontage to place 2 strategically placed big billboards with the photo of the finish of the main race for the month on one billboard,with the winners name , then the photo of the winning driver with a cup in his hand and the winning group of owners on the other billboard. Then change the photos everymonth with that months winners. So over the course of each month you would have hundreds of thousands of people driving past and looking at them.Its what people do,look at billboards with something different on. Just remove the pictures for a week at the end of each month so as to get the fresh attention when the next months winners appear or maybe have them outlined in a different clour each month . The business supplying the photos would have..their business name on the bottom and the race sponsor of the big race for each month on the top.Their must be a business that would jump at the chance of such highly viewed advertising. Its just a matter of getting approval from the local authority. Transport nz probably best advised as well.The speed limits where the racecourses are, seem ok for that type of placement.

I watched the friday night thing. Good viewing. The thing i found interesting was the interview with jamie mackinnon ,the head of the auckland club. now i will say i think hes a high achiever and has done a top job representing and pursuing whats best for auckland. Very single minded although the negative to that is its been reported some of his decisions have upset some who also have served the atc at times when it was well run. but its what he said in his interview that i found interesting. I'm assuming he was just saying what he thinks. He said amongst other things that, he had never felt the high level of comradery that exists at present,that so many positive things were happening in the indstry,that entain was doing a wonderful job,that people at the grass roots were thinking positive... i heard that and it reminded me of the conversation i had just this week with a small time trainer who has a broodmare. He was telling me how he had sold his broodmare overseas and he thought the horse he currently trains will be his last,that he had been talking to another trainer this week,a professional trainer who trains about 15,who was telling him 3 of his main owners who normally breed one each year had told him they won't be this year.i heard the same myself from someone else this week. i know what i heard is real. Mackinnon obviously believes the opposite. obviously people move in different circles. but it does prove the total disconnect that exists in this industry. Its mackinnons view of things that is the basis for decision making at the highest level. people will have to make up their own minds as to who lives in the real world.

I've said there is already a need right now with the current number of horses and that need will only grow.Its all about how unaffordable and scarce land and training facilities are currently. those 2 things are obviously related. its also about the flow on effect to owners and breeders of having an affordable complex available. The people they use to educate and train their horses could pass on the savings to them ,or the owners and breeders could tap into using the affordable facility themselves. thats why having an agistment part to any complex is important. For example they could charge a certain amount for agisting someones broodmare,with a % of that being a rebate that could be used for the cost of beeding. If not used,no rebate.Agistment costs should still be kept at affordable rates. The complex would be there to run at a small profit. the thing is. And isn't this obvious if you think about it. say you currently own a broodmare. Your thinking well i don't think i will breed my mare this year. Maybe you can't find anywhere affordable to graze her,(that is a real problem),maybe its other circumstances,maybe youv'e looked to give her away but can't find anyone who wants her(another real issue),whatever. so what do you think next...Well do i keep paying out or do i just put the broodmare down or try and sell her or maybe sell to china or whatever. The future of that mare is in real peril. chances of that mare not being around next year are not good. ive spoken to 3 people i know just in the last week whoare saying that and i've only spoken to 3 people in harness racing. This is a real problem. anyway,ask yourself this. would you get 1 more starter in this years nz if the race was worth $500,000 or a million$. pretty sure no you wouldn't. And I'm sure the aussie billionaire most likely to win the race needs it. the point there is HRNZ leadership seems so out of touch with their spending priorities that people are losing all hope. The grass roots sees the spending on the top end and inevitably asks themselves,why do they bother anymore.Then they drift away.Once they are gone,they are gone.

its easy enough to see the merit in what you say,but the thing is the albion park races yesterday ran for stakes of $6200 and $4800 and had 8 races with an average field size just over 10. cambridge ran 7 races for stakes averaging around $7300 with an average field size of 7.7. They chose to run 3 races with field sizes of 4,5 &6. Had they combined those races into 2 instead of 3,(they were for similar type graded horses)they could have had an average field size of just under 9. For some reason the head of HRNZ issued a statement saying running the extra races with starters of only 4 and 5 was a positive sign. so albion park ran 8 races worth total stakes of around $41,000 and new zealand ran 7 races for stakes of around $51,000. albion park would have generated higher turnover. so i agree with the sentiment of what your saying,the only thing is queensland seem to do it in a way that will be sustainable,whereas the worry and expectation in nz is,because the stakes currently paid are too high given the turnover of the cambridge races,the loss that they run at, will impact the stakes they have available to pay out in canterbury and as a result owners ,trainers and breeders in canterbury will drop out of the game because the returns are too low.And because less numbers will participate in canterbury as a result,turnovers will drop and the future stakes availabe to pay in the north island will need to be reduced in the future. so the answer is to reduce the stakes at cambridge meetings,provide a betting product with more starters per race(don't split fields to run 5 horse races),and adjust the ratings points penalties to reflect the level of stakes won. that seems reasonably obvious,but thats how things are currently being run.

all the frame already in place then. With employees already with the right knowledge thats a plus not a negative. i would imagine once set up it would only require oversight from those people and just a couple of employees for the likes of maintenance(including track)accounting. remember it would run to achieve a profit,not loss. This is nothing whatsoever like building an apartment complex like auckland. The only real similar things would be the auckland investment in their training complex-isn't it supposed to have been sold for $100 million,victorian harness racing who paid $3 million for land 20 years ago now valued at $100 million(isn't that the only asset they have which is saving them from insolvency),addington once had lots of land later sold off for good profits. Many racecing clubs the same. Tab for ever,keep coming up with the reasons to support the project.

Washdyke and motukarara tracks are on leased land. Also motukarara not a good choice anyway given how cold and wet it is during the colder months. ashburton and rangiora i thought are pretty much full up.Thats what they tell you if you ask. personally i think no current racecourse is suitable. It would need to be a new complex to promote harness racing and overseen by Hrnz. why would hrnz invest in it unless they had total control of it. also i don't know whether you are aware,but history has shown that there have been many disputes at dual coded racecourses,disputes also at country racecourses where people on committees look after their own best interests,etc,etc. Some have got rather ugly. I can think of at least half a dozen racecourses where that has happened in the last 20 years. current racecourses definitely a bad choice in my opinion.

one thing that has struck me in recent years is that the decison makers at HRNZ have never promoted a vision that uplifts industry participants and injects a form of comradship and positivity into the industry. from my observations this lack of leadership flows right through to the grass roots. People at all levels,from leadership to trainers and administrators say the right things about doing this and that being needed to retain participants,but when it comes to the crunch they just do their own thing and do whats best for themselves,and so what about the fella next door who's drifting away. Maybe its just a human thing and they may feel they can't do much anyway,but i've formed the opinion that theres an attitude ,a mindset within the industry thats negative and a lack of thinking outside their own we bubble. My point is we need leadership to actually lead and their example needs to make each and everyone just think a little more about whats happening around them industry wise. A positive vision for the future and actual tangible ,sellable, positive plans from industry leadership is where it should start. We recently saw the appointment of the aussie as hrnz leader. then within a couple of weeks he came out and stated " how encouraging it was they were having 7 races at cambridge instead of 6 the week before',despite there much less actual starters. The first thing people would have thought when they saw that would be,well so much for that new guy talking much sense,he must think we are all stupid. Leadership needs to actually lead.

actually thats a very good point. John mooney an owner but probably known more for specialising in breeding as well. Richard bromley always comes across as being in touch with the grass roots owner/trainers whose views often overlooked. This group of people did produce some very good work though.

the question there is where does r todd go and what about the other 3 or 4 trainers with just a couple of horses? Its been on the market for a few months,but the sales pitch of "harness the potential" infers they may be pitching to someone interested in harness racing,which all seems a bit of an unrealistic pitch to me.Hopefully they do get someone like that but who in harness racing has that type of money. Its certainly a wonderful set up but realistically any new development needs to be much bigger land wise and suitable for development in a way that caters for trainers of differing sizes,those with a couple of horses to those with 20-30. Given the larger the portion of land you buy the bigger the value $ per hectare you get you would think it has to be at the very least 100 hectares. it also needs to cater for other aspects like agistment,breakers,people specialising in pre training and other industry related jobs as i mentioned earlier. Theres land agents like justin le lievre and stevie golding whose knowledge of suitable properties they could tap into. at the end of the day,this is a topic that people will think,well thats a good idea that wouild certainly help sustain harness racing into the future and give peace of mind to many struggling with this issue. But the problem is the decision makers at HRNZ seem to be all about plugging holes in a leaking boat. .

you were right. my original post was suggesting the best use of some of the forbury sale proceeds would be setting up a complex in canterbury. in my opinion canterbury harness is without doubt in decline. the issue i raised is significant reason for that in my opinion and needs to be addressed to stop the rot. as to canterbury being awash with horses. if you went to woodend or rangiora on some days you may think that. then you have addington,which is not normally available so you would see no one,then you have motukarara where i'm told you may see only 3 or 4 regulars with only one of those having more than 3 horses currently using that track. doesn't sound awash with horses or trainers to me. then theres this... apart from 5 trainers with starters at addington on friday night,every other trainer has been training for years,most several decades. the 5 recent news ones are john morrison who trains at the ashburton track,sam payne who i believe trains from his fathers propery,luke whittaker who trains in partnership with his father from the fathers propery,robie close who i assume trains at the rangiora track and angela washington who's husband has a property primarily for greyhounds. Then you have the auckland meeting. apart from 2 trainers ,the rest have been around for decades. Only ben butcher,who i magine does not have his own property and gareth hughes who trains in partnership with his father, i assume form his father property if he has one. So effectively i have just proved that not even one trainer who has been taken up training in the last decade, who has a runner competing at the addington or auckland meetings this friday night, has established a new training establishment in the last 10 years. The stonewall establishment is the only new player in the sport in canterbury to have not previously had a training establishment in the last decadealthough there trainers have been around for a while,but they have the luxury of having millions in the bank from other business ventures i rest my case.

forburyclub reportedly did get to retain a share of the $14 million. They just haven't said exactly how much they got.

Victoria apparently in recent years borrowed from the government using the training complex,or part thereof, at melton as security. auckland of course did the same thing with their training complex. so both auckland and victoria showed that investing strategically located areas,have proven over time,they can be a very,very worthwhile thing. just another reason to support my suggestion they should do the same in canterbury..

i type in do ug gale and the computer spits out chief stipe gale. I've tried to edit it but it just keeps coming up as chief stipe gale. maybe the chief has programmed it that way,for chief stipe to replace the name do ug whenever that names used. whats going on there? Seems rather spooky to me. p.s. it spelt the name do ug with a space in it as it did it again.

the group comprised john mooney,chairman together with clark barron,karen blanchard,david branch,jason broad,richard bromley,john denton,arna donnelly,Chief Stipe gale,peter larkin,bill mcdonald,andrew morris,scott phelan,regan todd and matthew white. i'm surprised no one has commented on the repoert released just over a week ago. its lengthy and covers many issues,some rather thorny things like handicapping,scratching penalties,etc. Ive read it and theres so much common sense recommended policy wise,to come out of that report, that it makes you wonder where have they been. my question would be ,just this week hrnz announced some minor changes to the handicapping system in that report,but not everything recommended,including no mention of recommendations around the morse substative handicapping issues.Why not? hopefully some of the common sense to come out of that report rubs off on hrnz decision makers.

people who own their own properties or are wealthy dont have this problem. but most are not in that position. so ask yourself this.. if your a trainer in canterbury with 30 horses in work,renting someone elses training facilites and the owner of the propery decides to sell,where do you go? if your a trainer wanting to train 1 horse in canterbury,where do you go? if you own a broodmare in canterbury with a foal at foot and don't have your own property,where are you going to keep them so you can afford to breed again next year.Simply put,is there a choice locally of paying $30 each for your broodmare and foal each week and check on them yourselves,or do you have to pay the going rate of mostly around $80 a week for each on an agistment farmi. In other words do you spend the extra $5200 a year just to graze them,knowing that would be your breeding money gone. many other scenarios for which lots of people in canterbury would have encountered. well i know the answer to the above. maybe the fella with the 30 horses will be accomodated somewhere.who knows where,but people do tend to help someone like that but that would be a one off. But all other scenerios,don't waste your time looking because if you do you will be disappointed. take the 5 tracks closest to christchurch. Addington,motukarara,rangiora,ashburton,methven.You ring them tomorrow and ask them do they have facilities to rent. The answer will be no. You drive around your district and stop and ask property owners,put ads in you local newspaper for grazing for your broodmare. even if you were able to pay more.will you find somewhere.No you won't. Reality is this issue is real,its major and no one is addressing it. The issue has been there for a couple of decades now,but its getting worse. canterbury is the heart of harness racing in new zealand but it needs an affordable complex where people can keep their harness horses to retain the numbers participating.And the only way to get that is for HRNZ to allocate funds for that. As i have said,such a complex properly run should still be able to generate a small profit. Hrnz got $14 million from forbury.

Interesting you can form that opinion when i think your 3 key points are actually the strongest arguments for my suggestion and against what you say. Just look at whats going on in the auckland/waikato region. auckland ,quite rightly from their point of view,are currently very vocal about the importance of having a training complex for their district. They recognise that having sold the one they did have to get out of debt,that its imperative for them to provide industry participants in the area a new complex from which they can base themselves.They know,without such a complex,they won't have the numbers to have race meetings. And you would be aware that the Auckland club has been vocal about the need for HRNZ to contribute funds to a new training complex. ask yourself this. what makes more sense. Putting industry funds into a training complex for a district(auckland) that provides a product that will always be heavily subsidised to keep it going. Or put industry funds into a similar complex with as great,if not greater need in canterbury ,where the product supplied generates income and is not subsidised. your second point is owners/breeders/punters would not be satisfied. Clearly the punters don't agree with that. They invest their $ far more on the canterbury product than the auckland product. Owners and breeders,well obviously if they're from the upper north island,they will be parochial and wants whats best for them,but numbers wise there are far more owners in the south island. Same applies to the breeders. So if we applied your perspective,you would be prioritising the minority over the majority. now i'm not saying auckland should or shouldn't get industry support,i'm just pointing out the obvious that canterbury has a far stronger case. also,don't you think it would be hypocrisy for those suggesting auckland be assisted to provide a training cimplex and not canterbury,when the problem is the same. when i started the topic i was not comparing auckland to canterbury,but have addressed the comparisons as you brought it up.

recently HRNZ issued a press staement about the $14 million they had received from the forbury park sale. heres what i think they should do with a large portion of the funds. canterbury is the backbone of the industry,but i believe Canterbury harness racing has a problem, that is going to start significantly impacting on harness racings horse numbers and publics perception in the next 10 years if they don't start planning for it now. the serious problem being,if you want to train,graze,breed,agist,etc... where can you do it in canterbury and if you do happen to find somewhere, will it be affordable. you either have to be wealthy or have your own property these days or both. if your in canterbury,just look at the internet .Prices for a 10 hectare bare blocks anywhere near christchurch.Most are around a million dollars.In areas away from christchurch small blocks of land are still very expensive. so realistically you would think no one is going to be able to afford to set up there own training establishment unless they go some way out. the other option is renting off current owners of training establishments. Now theres 2 reasons thats unlikely.1)trainers like to do there own thing and very few have any interest whatsoever in accomodating other trainers on their properties whether they be someone wanting to train 1 horse or 10 horses.2) if you owned a bit of ground worth over a million,are you going to subdivide and sell it for that or are you going to lease it out for minimal returns if you no longer train.obviously your going to sell. its not just training properties where the squeeze is coming,its grazing your broodmare,grazing your spelling horse or retired racehorses. anyone who has looked for grazing can attest to that. Either you pay rates that most cant afford or you give away or dispose of your horses. The sad reality is no one really wants them if you try and find a home for them. The life after racing horses programmes dont cater for horses over 12. There are several people out there doing there best ,to find homes for horses over that age,but there simply isn't anywhere to put them. How does the fate of those horses reflect on the industry in this day and age.many of those horses could be broodmares. so the solution. hrnz should buy 100 hectares and set up a training establishment in an area within 30 minutes drive of christchurch. where. Well for example you can get 100 hectares for 4 million near leeston.maybe somewhere drier to the west of that is more realistic. stables should be built,fencing,tracks,etc it would be a self funding establishment where the likes of up and coming trainers who have done their time in stables can use to try and establish themselves,also trainers who want to train only very small numbers but have no where else to go,breakers who are trying to establish themselves,part of the land could be dedicated to an agistment farm at affordable rates for harness horses. Breeders could place their horses with trainers willing to train for a racing half share and could have their broodmares agisted on the property at affordable rates. .Theres all sorts of possibilities.Stables made available at minimal rates for travelling trainers. You could have a farrier renting and operating out of a stabing block,a vet in another area emplyed by hrnz as a way of providing veterinarian care at affordable prices. a feed store operated by a local harness feed merchant who discounts for bulk orders for harness horse owners. Everything done in a way that hrnz helps keeps cost affordable for those with harness horses yet hrnz still getting a cut to make minimal profits.when you think about it,why do farriers and vets seem so expensive. its because your paying a lot for the travel and time they travel to you.Take that out and its more affordable. paddocks set aside for Hay to be grown and sold at discounted prices to horse trainers and owners on the propery. all sorts of other possibilites but you get my drift. i think it could easily soon become home for over 250 horses. Also there are many retired trainers with so much knowledge willing and able to pass that on if given the chance. such trainers could be mentors rostered on to oversee and chat and offer advice.Owners wouldn't have far to come from christchurch.its also about being located in an area not too far from affordable housing. call me a dreamer,but ask yourself this. Is HRNZ better spending money on short term stakes funding for things like slot races or increasing age group races or series races they are helping fund that they were never supposed to....or are they better in laying down the framework and providing solutions for the long term viability of harness racing for the next few decades. also remember that ,but in the right location and the land alone could become a ever appreciating valued asset. currently we have a pro racing minister in government. That should be used to harness racings benefit while they can,if borrowings were required initially,,with of course the property the security. always remember ,just how important a strong canterbury harness racing scene is to the industry.

you got me typing again gammalite. What you also have to consider is, what province has had the highest number of participants drop out of the game in the last 5 years? my guess,and its a pretty safe and obvious guess,and easily enough observed if you lived there, is canterbury is the region. especially small time trainers and breeders are walking away from harness racing . if you lose 2 or 3 from an area like auckland where numbers are already small,those that leave are easily noticed. on the other hand lose 20 or 30 trainers and breeders a year from a district that had 10 times the size of auckland to start off with,people dont notice as much or place the appropriate degree of long term importance. Long term, industry leaders need to have the forsight to see that the providers of the mainstay area of harness racings core business income, is eroding at a snowballing rate.. So why do industry leaders implement policies that show they care more about auckland participants than those in canterbury? none of the industry decision makers seem to have a logical,justifiable answer to that question? I think your suggestion of using the queensland model for racing in the north island is a more realistic possible model.Queensland obviously have far more horses,but they run many $4000 races at redcliffe and $10,000 races at albion park. The way they increase drivers,trainers,owners incomes and make breeding more viable is they start their horses more.So while the betting may be limited,stakes paid come closeto matching income received from betting. Industry leadership should give the auckland stakeholers the choice,either come up with a sustainable model themselves or try the queensland model. as to tuesday racing. i have always said its a good idea. But mini canterbury meetings for canterbury participants are just as important as those in auckland. its just a matter of the racing getting appropriate lead in sky racing coverage in australia on tuesdays and running at the appropriate timeslots for that. That point,in my opinion, is such an important factor,and entain no doubt realise that. i don't understand why people don't place the importance lead in sky racing coverage deserves when discussing what impacts turnovers,whatever the meeting.Why don't our industry leaders or entain ever explain that and explain what they are doing to mensure that happens.

I didn't realise i had left the site either. i still read both bit of a yarn and Channel X and think posters on both sites are passionate about harness racing and like to see it thrive. contributors each have their own perspective on the industry and if the industry is to prosper forums like this provide a barometer as to what people are actually thinking. Of course such forums should have a welcoming environment to expressions of differing points of view,without those that run it getting too annoyed about someones elses differing opinion.. i decided that after reading the chiefs multiple put down replies to a topic i commented on a bit, that he wasn't at that point meeting the degree of fairness that should be applied,so i moderated him in reverse and decided to stop posting and instead just read the forums. i thought he just sounded like there may be other stuff going on in his mind as he seemed in a bit of a negative space in his head. I'm not saying he wouldn't have good reason to come across as in that frame of mind sometimes. we all can get a bit like that . He may not agree with that,i don't value whether he does anyway. the chiefs words were... it was people with views like mine that were killing the industry. I just read that and thought,well thats ok for you to think that,and dumbo i already had worked out you thought that anyway,but thats just too unneccsarily hostile. As you realise jj,when chief gets a bee in his bonnet about someone he acts more like theres a hive of wasps there. anyway.nice to hear from you. i'm actually finding not posting and just reading these forums just as interesting. this reply is defintely a one off and i will stick to that. Anyway,You've only got to read peoples replies,especially regular contribtors to see the passion and knowledge the contributors have for harness racing. So whether it be the chief or scooby,i'm grateful to them that i have somewhere where i can read what other people are thinking.i still fill in my day by reading everyones replies each day.

Just another reason to say something negative is my take on your reaction to my post. your site,do as you wish. I made a living for many years.did you? i don't bother trying to do that now due to the tab changing things and returns no longer match the time and effort i put in. but you questioning my analysis of races just because you have different opinions to mine is all a bit silly. if my opinions were similar you wouldn't. so your justification for your comment is flawed. As to the j cox drive on majestic man. so what happened to majestic man after he ran that,tactically poor,strength sapping but courageous race.??? retired,no more racing. did you not read what phil williamson said about where his strengths lay. I have since pointed out that i think j ocx is currently in career best form,but his drive on majestic man was not his brightest tactically. anyway,i think even the thick skinned like myself get tired of your name calling. so i won't give you any more opportunities ,as you seem to have become consistently rather negative in the words you use these days. Bit of a shame,but i can tell thats how you feel,so better out than in i always say. so my final words about your replies to my posts is....Whatever chief. I used a capital W just to emphasis that,as even small things like that can irritate you.