Auckland Off

[Rangatira]

Down to one meeting tonight.

[Westview]

28 minutes ago, Rangatira said:

Down to one meeting tonight.

 

[Rangatira]

Now Saturday Night

[Newmarket]

Seems strange, not much rain has fallen. 

[mikeynz]

12 minutes ago, Rangatira said:

Now Saturday Night

Brodies dreams come true, Saturday night racing.

[Chief Stipe]

14 minutes ago, Newmarket said:

Seems strange, not much rain has fallen. 

I thought the same.  Plus the weather is improving.

[Brodie]

Far better idea running in a Saturday night anyway!

Racing at Alexandra Park against Addington on a Friday night can not be advantageous?

Does anyone know if the Auckland turnover has increased since going head to head with Addington?

 

[mikeynz]

Probably run half the card during the Rugby, they love having meetings clash lol

[Gammalite]

8 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

I thought the same.  Plus the weather is improving.

you can get those deep ruts with heavy run-off sometimes. 

Think it is on the home bend at Auckland tonight where the camber is steepest they got some. 

Kilmore had the same problem after a downpour. 

[Chief Stipe]

10 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

you can get those deep ruts with heavy run-off sometimes. 

Think it is on the home bend at Auckland tonight where the camber is steepest they got some. 

Kilmore had the same problem after a downpour. 

How long does it take to fix it?

[Gammalite]

15 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

How long does it take to fix it?

Usually the heavy Mesh drag can deal with it quickly , and they can often get a smooth surface (to have it not like corrugated iron) even during a meeting after a downpour. 

but if the ruts go too deep after particularly heavy run off , you need the grader with a big blade that would take several hours.  with follow up spreading/ sealing/ compacting and that. 

Kilmore transferred to another nearby track for that days racing, after the damage in photo.  Like Alexandra Park should be ok tomorrow , they were good to go the next day again.   

[Nowornever]

Not much point having a bet there now. Bookies will open the odds up again on the closing prices for the horses they had priced wrong. They get a free throw at the stumps. There were some big movers as well.

[mikeynz]

1 hour ago, Gammalite said:

you can get those deep ruts with heavy run-off sometimes. 

Think it is on the home bend at Auckland tonight where the camber is steepest they got some. 

Kilmore had the same problem after a downpour. 

That stand would be appropriate at Alexandra Park or have they recently downsized 😀

[Gammalite]

40 minutes ago, mikeynz said:

That stand would be appropriate at Alexandra Park or have they recently downsized 😀

Yeah , just usually quiet mid-week racing with not many there. 😂

Next week though they have their BIG night of the year,  with the Kilmore Cup 🏆.

There will be a Big crowd to see possibly last years winner ,(the Auckland Cup winning)  BETTER ECLIPSE take his 2nd victory in the event.

3 years ago Anthony Butt won it for NZ and trainer Nathan Purdon with another Auckland Cup winner in the form of the great mare AMAZING DREAM.  

[Newmarket]

5 hours ago, Brodie said:

Far better idea running in a Saturday night anyway!

Racing at Alexandra Park against Addington on a Friday night can not be advantageous?

Does anyone know if the Auckland turnover has increased since going head to head with Addington?

 

Why??? All Blacks playing tomorrow night, NRL semis, AFL semis and quality Aus racing Saturday arvo…. bet figures don’t match Addington tonight

[Brodie]

1 hour ago, Newmarket said:

Why??? All Blacks playing tomorrow night, NRL semis, AFL semis and quality Aus racing Saturday arvo…. bet figures don’t match Addington tonight

 

 

1 hour ago, Newmarket said:

Why??? All Blacks playing tomorrow night, NRL semis, AFL semis and quality Aus racing Saturday arvo…. bet figures don’t match Addington tonight

There is a few things going on tomorrow night, but the betting figures for Auckland I would say are pretty poor nowadays on a Friday night!

 

Saturday night would be a far better night to race in Auckland father than competing against Addington any night!

The fields and racing at Auckland now is pretty average so far better on a Saturday night when people csn make a night of it at the weekend.

[Gammalite]

11 hours ago, Brodie said:

Saturday night would be a far better night to race in Auckland father than competing against Addington any night!

The fields and racing at Auckland now is pretty average so far better on a Saturday night when people csn make a night of it at the weekend.

Absolutely . People like to sleep in on a Sunday so a night out on a Saturday night is a Much better idea. dime a dozen racing on Friday nights . 

Much better to have the good Metro Class horses standing out , like on a Saturday night as you suggest, and have the punters that Won at the gallops meetings during the day , ready to spend some of their winnings with some bets and a night out somewhere. brilliant for everyone 👍💰

Alexandra Park not far from Ellerslie for them to do it too. could capture new players/supporters.

Average Racing comment is rubbish though. You have Mark Purdon racing , possibly in the top 6 Sportspeople of all time in NZ, and Merlin , who won the biggest prize races ever in NZ and beat the Aussies in the GRINS race , Sooner the Better (2nd in Oz biggest race the $mill Miracle Mile) , Duchess Megzit last week, top Auckland filly (who won a Group 1 at Addington in Dec at her last appearance there ) NZ leading trainers send horses round each week in Akld both Dunns and Telfers . Herlihy and Barry Purdon race every week. The quality is Very High indeed.

just insults them to call them 'average Racing'.

Who can you get there that is better ?? ( above average in your opinion )

[TAB For Ever]

35 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Absolutely . People like to sleep in on a Sunday so a night out on a Saturday night is a Much better idea. dime a dozen racing on Friday nights . 

Much better to have the good Metro Class horses standing out , like on a Saturday night as you suggest, and have the punters that Won at the gallops meetings during the day , ready to spend some of their winnings with some bets and a night out somewhere. brilliant for everyone 👍💰

Alexandra Park not far from Ellerslie for them to do it too. could capture new players/supporters.

Average Racing comment is rubbish though. You have Mark Purdon racing , possibly in the top 6 Sportspeople of all time in NZ, and Merlin , who won the biggest prize races ever in NZ and beat the Aussies in the GRINS race , Sooner the Better (2nd in Oz biggest race the $mill Miracle Mile) , Duchess Megzit last week, top Auckland filly (who won a Group 1 at Addington in Dec at her last appearance there ) NZ leading trainers send horses round each week in Akld both Dunns and Telfers . Herlihy and Barry Purdon race every week. The quality is Very High indeed.

just insults them to call them 'average Racing'.

Who can you get there that is better ?? ( above average in your opinion )

Some good points Gamma re the high standard of horseflesh and horse people.

Overall we have just become a cynical and bitter bunch when it comes to NZ racing.

Interesting there were some Australian groups out following the Interdoms when they were held in Auckland a few years back and they were in awe of the setup at Alex Park and of the racing in general .I went to a social outing with a large group of Victorian enthusiasts including some trainers and it was interesting hearing their comments.

Re the best night for Harness in NZ it has been proven beyond ALL doubt in recent years that the existing programming is best for the Harness TAB wagering in NZ.

Friday nights is the big night for Harness , Sunday day racing is the second decent bite at the cherry.

The other days /nights are a long way behind and most have been tinkered with in some form or other.

Saturday is the BIG day for overall punting ......but it focussed on Gallops ,particularly the big Australian meeting s in all the main states .

Harness is a poor second to Gallops EXCEPT a couple of iconic days particularly the Tuesday of NZ Trot Cup day which until this year was clearly NZ's biggest race meeting. This clear dominance was smashed by the Saturday gallops  meet of Karaka Day [6 x races only] which had previously been held on a Sunday.

Other interesting facts....Kiwis bet over 50% on gallops [of the 3 main codes] domestically. 55% when I last looked 27 % Harness ,18% Dogs. Harness been in decline for years.

Overseas betting it is about 70% on gallops and quite close between Harness and dogs.

Kiwis bet more on Overseas races than they do on NZ races. Yes there are more races !

Pushing more NZ Harness on to Saturdays will not help Harness betting ,too much competition.

[Gammalite]

30 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

Some good points Gamma re the high standard of horseflesh and horse people.

Overall we have just become a cynical and bitter bunch when it comes to NZ racing.

Interesting there were some Australian groups out following the Interdoms when they were held in Auckland a few years back and they were in awe of the setup at Alex Park and of the racing in general .I went to a social outing with a large group of Victorian enthusiasts including some trainers and it was interesting hearing their comments.

Re the best night for Harness in NZ it has been proven beyond ALL doubt in recent years that the existing programming is best for the Harness TAB wagering in NZ.

Friday nights is the big night for Harness , Sunday day racing is the second decent bite at the cherry.

The other days /nights are a long way behind and most have been tinkered with in some form or other.

Saturday is the BIG day for overall punting ......but it focussed on Gallops ,particularly the big Australian meeting s in all the main states .

Harness is a poor second to Gallops EXCEPT a couple of iconic days particularly the Tuesday of NZ Trot Cup day which until this year was clearly NZ's biggest race meeting. This clear dominance was smashed by the Saturday gallops  meet of Karaka Day [6 x races only] which had previously been held on a Sunday.

Other interesting facts....Kiwis bet over 50% on gallops [of the 3 main codes] domestically. 55% when I last looked 27 % Harness ,18% Dogs. Harness been in decline for years.

Overseas betting it is about 70% on gallops and quite close between Harness and dogs.

Kiwis bet more on Overseas races than they do on NZ races. Yes there are more races !

Pushing more NZ Harness on to Saturdays will not help Harness betting ,too much competition.

some excellent points Tabman .

All the blokes at my local tabs hardly ever bet trots . they just are used to the chances of their dollar going closer to winning betting on them , than the reputation and just the fact you're more likely to have something go drastically wrong in a harness race. (gallop) held up a long the inside , etc) so doesn't tickle their fancy to lose money like that. my guess is 90% of them not betting harness.  is more of just an interest in racing than a money making pass-time.  (a bit like racing your average horse as an owner really) 

As far as getting to Alexandra Park , they should race Every time Ellerslie does , and the club supply a Luxury coach to ferry as many patrons as possible across to the trots that could start an hour after the gallops are completed.  two or 3 round trips if necessary. And have a nice mid-class bistro (affordable) for the patrons to enjoy dinner at the TROTS. would of lapped that up as a great Saturday out. 

[the galah]

2 hours ago, TAB For Ever said:

Some good points Gamma re the high standard of horseflesh and horse people.

Overall we have just become a cynical and bitter bunch when it comes to NZ racing.

Interesting there were some Australian groups out following the Interdoms when they were held in Auckland a few years back and they were in awe of the setup at Alex Park and of the racing in general .I went to a social outing with a large group of Victorian enthusiasts including some trainers and it was interesting hearing their comments.

Re the best night for Harness in NZ it has been proven beyond ALL doubt in recent years that the existing programming is best for the Harness TAB wagering in NZ.

Friday nights is the big night for Harness , Sunday day racing is the second decent bite at the cherry.

The other days /nights are a long way behind and most have been tinkered with in some form or other.

Saturday is the BIG day for overall punting ......but it focussed on Gallops ,particularly the big Australian meeting s in all the main states .

Harness is a poor second to Gallops EXCEPT a couple of iconic days particularly the Tuesday of NZ Trot Cup day which until this year was clearly NZ's biggest race meeting. This clear dominance was smashed by the Saturday gallops  meet of Karaka Day [6 x races only] which had previously been held on a Sunday.

Other interesting facts....Kiwis bet over 50% on gallops [of the 3 main codes] domestically. 55% when I last looked 27 % Harness ,18% Dogs. Harness been in decline for years.

Overseas betting it is about 70% on gallops and quite close between Harness and dogs.

Kiwis bet more on Overseas races than they do on NZ races. Yes there are more races !

Pushing more NZ Harness on to Saturdays will not help Harness betting ,too much competition.

I went to alexandra park once about 20 years ago.

3 men talking to each other were the only people in the main stand . I sat there for one race but thought the viewing was poor so wandered down to next to the outside fence,for the next race, but found that an even worse viewing area.It was like you were below where the horses were.

so i wandered up to the stand near the winning post,where the people were. I just chose to watch the race on the tv inside and watched the people all around. Next to no one bothered to watch the races and they seemed just there for the social side or something to eat. 

i left after that race.Thought if that was harness racing in auckland ,well they were lucky they had all those revenue streams because so few of the public seemed interested in it. 

I had been there as a kid and remembered the lines of punters 20 deep to get a bet on the tote, people always getting shut out and 2 stands full of people which from memory seemed segregated but the one further up the straight had good viewing.I remember as a kid thinking auckland was exciting,but how things had changed. 

The people who say auckland is so strategically important because thats where all the people live,to me are out of touch with reality.

Auckland and cambridge racing need to be consolidated into 2 areas close to each other which feed off each other and provide faclilties that provide a far better harness racing product for the public on a far smaller scale.

How about the concept of auckland focusing on their core business,i.e.harness racing.

Aucklands past leadership blew it,the major cash flows are  gone,it doesn't matter how clever mr mackinnon may be,he can't save the titanic which is aleaxndra park,no matter how much he tries.

Also,i can't help think,why is it people in canterbury manage to drive to places like methven or rangiora or geraldine in good numbers,yet administrators seemingly think aucklanders shouldn't be expected to do so.

do they not realise that apart from cup day,you get more people at the aforementioned tracks than addington.

To me the whole auckland debate is another harness topic thats clear cut,black and white as to what decisions need to be made to make it sustainable,but for reasons which i can't figure out,decision makers just ignore reality.

Edited September 21 by the galah

[Brodie]

4 hours ago, Gammalite said:

Absolutely . People like to sleep in on a Sunday so a night out on a Saturday night is a Much better idea. dime a dozen racing on Friday nights . 

Much better to have the good Metro Class horses standing out , like on a Saturday night as you suggest, and have the punters that Won at the gallops meetings during the day , ready to spend some of their winnings with some bets and a night out somewhere. brilliant for everyone 👍💰

Alexandra Park not far from Ellerslie for them to do it too. could capture new players/supporters.

Average Racing comment is rubbish though. You have Mark Purdon racing , possibly in the top 6 Sportspeople of all time in NZ, and Merlin , who won the biggest prize races ever in NZ and beat the Aussies in the GRINS race , Sooner the Better (2nd in Oz biggest race the $mill Miracle Mile) , Duchess Megzit last week, top Auckland filly (who won a Group 1 at Addington in Dec at her last appearance there ) NZ leading trainers send horses round each week in Akld both Dunns and Telfers . Herlihy and Barry Purdon race every week. The quality is Very High indeed.

just insults them to call them 'average Racing'.

Who can you get there that is better ?? ( above average in your opinion )

The racing at Auckland is very average compared to Addington!!
Think it is because it is only 1000m2 track and the design.

As a punter, I find that it is just not worth the effort!

[Rangatira]

2 minutes ago, Brodie said:

As a punter, I find that it is just not worth the effort!

0900 shrunkenaquaticfriend

[Gammalite]

31 minutes ago, Brodie said:

The racing at Auckland is very average compared to Addington!!
Think it is because it is only 1000m2 track and the design.

As a punter, I find that it is just not worth the effort!

The driving standard is very good these days , and they certainly have a crack more than they used too.

I quite enjoyed Oamaru Hannon Memorial day last Sunday . some great racing . 

And you don't need Big fields either . they all get a chance when just 8 runners start.

examples >>

Blair Orange drove well to win the Juvenile Stakes with Rubira  in a 8 horse field. Had to come from last because drew the outside gate. (John Dunn pushed 6 wide turning in lol in the small field, so shows even the good drivers have to stay sharp to win) 

And in the last race of the day Race 10 at Oamaru Blair Orange must of felt young again 😅 driving against 6 or 7 Junior drivers , and got outdriven in the end too. Was very entertaining for just moderate class horses , as the Juniors ALL had a great crack at winning it in a 8 horse field. 

KORBYN NEWMAN (who I have criticised at times so need to give credit where credit is due) , drove a 10/10 race to take Victory with Miki Bennett . They (all those juniors)  all gave Blair quite a run for the money anyway .  he ended up 3rd in that one. 

 

 

[the galah]

as expected the pools are very small for the auckland races so far.

the first 5 races being

win pools entain               3534, 2967, 1976. 3245 ,2788

tabcorp(australia)              856,   478,   435   ,889 ,1160

i keep going back to the point i regularly make.

that is.

The  pool sizes are dictated by pre race sky australian racing coverage.

so no, or next to no pre race australian coverage ,next to no betting. Thats for both nz entain and tabcorp  pools.

i believe people over estimate the number of new zealanders who bet on nz harness racing at tracks like auckland and to a degree addington.

Like i say,when entain has a good pool size,most of the time so does tabcorp.Just look at the figures for tonight to see the same pattern.

I would guess that 3/4 of the tabcorp pools would be about the amount entain gets from parts of australia tabcorp doesn't service..

Like on friday nights you sometimes see a $9,000 tabcorp win pool and they are always the races nz entain has the bigger pools.75% of $9000 is an additional $6750 australian commingled  money that goes into the entain nz pool.Last night tabcorp had a win pool of $12,000 on an addington race.

before anyone talks about nz betting turnovers,they first need to factor in the point i make

you start with understanding australian tabcorp pools are different from the australian money which entain gets for commingling in the nz pools and then progress to the point i make.

Now there is an exception to what i say in my opinion.That is sunday racing,especially canterbury grass tracks, attracts more nz punters and the % of the nz pool coming from commingled australian money is not as great .

anyway,there you go,people can talk about the reasons for the size of pools,but if they aren't factoring in the point i make,they are missing an important part of the puzzle.

Edited September 21 by the galah

[the galah]

49 minutes ago, the galah said:

as expected the pools are very small for the auckland races so far.

the first 5 races being

win pools entain               3534, 2967, 1976. 3245 ,2788

tabcorp(australia)              856,   478,   435   ,889 ,1160

i keep going back to the point i regularly make.

that is.

The  pool sizes are dictated by pre race sky australian racing coverage.

so no, or next to no pre race australian coverage ,next to no betting. Thats for both nz entain and tabcorp  pools.

i believe people over estimate the number of new zealanders who bet on nz harness racing at tracks like auckland and to a degree addington.

Like i say,when entain has a good pool size,most of the time so does tabcorp.Just look at the figures for tonight to see the same pattern.

I would guess that 3/4 of the tabcorp pools would be about the amount entain gets from parts of australia tabcorp doesn't service..

Like on friday nights you sometimes see a $9,000 tabcorp win pool and they are always the races nz entain has the bigger pools.75% of $9000 is an additional $6750 australian commingled  money that goes into the entain nz pool.Last night tabcorp had a win pool of $12,000 on an addington race.

before anyone talks about nz betting turnovers,they first need to factor in the point i make

you start with understanding australian tabcorp pools are different from the australian money which entain gets for commingling in the nz pools and then progress to the point i make.

Now there is an exception to what i say in my opinion.That is sunday racing,especially canterbury grass tracks, attracts more nz punters and the % of the nz pool coming from commingled australian money is not as great .

anyway,there you go,people can talk about the reasons for the size of pools,but if they aren't factoring in the point i make,they are missing an important part of the puzzle.

there you go. That group 1 fillies 2yo race obviously got some sky racing coverage in australia.

By far the biggest win pool,race so far.

nz win pool $9929.

tabcorp      $6303.

same pattern as normal that i point out.

Edited September 21 by the galah