Who out there is off to the Telegraph today....

[Wingman]

Always easy after the race telling all and sundry how easy it was to pick the winner. Lance O'Sullivan pre race said he considered it to be a very strong field. That said I thought along similar lines that Grail Seeker would win. The potential fly in the ointment was Skew Wiff who Te Akau assistant trainer was telling us how well she was going into the race. When My lips are sealed won so well I thought the bad patch they had been going through might be over but perhaps not? 

[Chief Stipe]

26 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

If you add fact that field had dropped away with scratchings and the track seemed to improve during day and 4 of last 5 Telegraphs had been won by young Matamata mares there could be only one winner.

Yeah well you are still talking about the past when the Topic you started was about the future.

Obviously the main track was softer than the part of the track hidden now by houses and piles of rubble.

[Wingman]

Ran 1.07.7 which is quick. I thought they would have struggled to break 1.08 bearing in mind the shute is very quick ground. Some horses struggled, there is that word again, some tried but found the condition of the track difficult. Opportunity for form reversals if we get good ground on cup day.

[Murray Fish]

11 minutes ago, Wingman said:

Ran 1.07.7 which is quick. I thought they would have struggled to break 1.08

doh!  I didn't bet into the race! scared off by the weather! thought the track was going to play a lot slower than that time! I think class won through on the day!

[Wingman]

Very classy mare but probably fragile despite her muscular physique. Superb team training effort but you were right to just watch and enjoy because rain on the morning of race day at Trentham ?? ??

[TAB For Ever]

2 hours ago, curious said:

Move to Gore then. That might help your chances. 1965.

Even Central Otago which has some of the highest summer temperatures and best weather can get some snow at Christmas.

I experienced snow on Christmas Day in Queenstown about 2003 and 2018 and 2020 had snow settling at this time.

As a youngster I played Cricket on Boing Day in Alexandra and it was hailing with snow on hills !

 

[TAB For Ever]

57 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Yeah well you are still talking about the past when the Topic you started was about the future.

Obviously the main track was softer than the part of the track hidden now by houses and piles of rubble.

Well as a Cost Accountant etc I clearly don't know as much as you but often what happens in the past can assist with predicting the future.

Like I know when I post you will be looking for a slip up ,to point out my weakness and your strength....you are the boss afterall !

My friends, neighbours and family have long and interesting historical association with Trentham and my Father used to fly me to the races in Cup week there from the time I was a foetus. 

Looking into the future I don't see much future for the place. ....bulldoze it !

If NZ Racing could get a huge sum of money out of Avondale and other Northern tracks ,and I was in charge ,I would build a purpose built racetrack in the Waikato with a straight 1200-1600 flat course with all the bells and whistles .I'd employ various experts to design the tracks and training facilities so I'd offer you a job to help design it. !

Meanwhile , did anyone actually go Trentham today for an 'update'  ?

Very few on here go to Ellerslie ,a few to Te Rapa , none to Trentham .........a few to Riccarton ,two to Timaru and three to the Coast...and Doomed to Woodville and you to Motukarara trots and to Ellerslie to get a handful of sandy peat and young grass from the outside fence !

[Chief Stipe]

45 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

Looking into the future I don't see much future for the place. ....bulldoze it !

Well they are half way there!

[Special Agent]

58 minutes ago, TAB For Ever said:

Looking into the future I don't see much future for the place. ....bulldoze it !

If NZ Racing could get a huge sum of money out of Avondale

I hate to say it but, I too think the future for Trentham is grim.

Interesting comment as it appears a lot think any money from Avondale will go into a "racing fund", however I thought I read that the Avondale club are keen to reinvest into a new complex north of Auckland, thus relocate.

[Huey]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Well as a Cost Accountant etc I clearly don't know as much as you but often what happens in the past can assist with predicting the future.

Like I know when I post you will be looking for a slip up ,to point out my weakness and your strength....you are the boss afterall !

My friends, neighbours and family have long and interesting historical association with Trentham and my Father used to fly me to the races in Cup week there from the time I was a foetus. 

Looking into the future I don't see much future for the place. ....bulldoze it !

If NZ Racing could get a huge sum of money out of Avondale and other Northern tracks ,and I was in charge ,I would build a purpose built racetrack in the Waikato with a straight 1200-1600 flat course with all the bells and whistles .I'd employ various experts to design the tracks and training facilities so I'd offer you a job to help design it. !

Meanwhile , did anyone actually go Trentham today for an 'update'  ?

Very few on here go to Ellerslie ,a few to Te Rapa , none to Trentham .........a few to Riccarton ,two to Timaru and three to the Coast...and Doomed to Woodville and you to Motukarara trots and to Ellerslie to get a handful of sandy peat and young grass from the outside fence !

Trouble is they'd screw it up!

[Wingman]

1 hour ago, TAB For Ever said:

Meanwhile , did anyone actually go Trentham today for an 'update'  ?

 

28 minutes ago, Special Agent said:

Looking into the future I don't see much future for the place. ....bulldoze it !

Poignant! When I was a young man a colleague said to me "You nearly missed the first race" "How on earth did you know that?" I replied. "They started the race a few minutes late. I figured the starter was waiting for you to get your bets on!" As I type this I have an oil painting of the former grandstand in my study which was painted in 1969. In 1970 my Dad took me to Trentham, my first visit to Trentham and I was hooked. Il Tempo. My first horse won her first race at Trentham, I used to host parties at Trentham. I could but will not drop names and many stories. Poignantly I am unlikely to go back. I had the time to have gone today but it would have hurt. I was there last summer but it already felt like a relic. Time marches on and to be realistic I do not think that track will be part of the march.  

[Doomed]

10 hours ago, Wingman said:

 

Poignant! When I was a young man a colleague said to me "You nearly missed the first race" "How on earth did you know that?" I replied. "They started the race a few minutes late. I figured the starter was waiting for you to get your bets on!" As I type this I have an oil painting of the former grandstand in my study which was painted in 1969. In 1970 my Dad took me to Trentham, my first visit to Trentham and I was hooked. Il Tempo. My first horse won her first race at Trentham, I used to host parties at Trentham. I could but will not drop names and many stories. Poignantly I am unlikely to go back. I had the time to have gone today but it would have hurt. I was there last summer but it already felt like a relic. Time marches on and to be realistic I do not think that track will be part of the march.  

I know exactly how you feel. I still remember my first visit to Trentham in March in the late 70s when The Twinkle won. After that i used to go to nearly every meeting until the early 90s. Then I was away for many years. I have been back to a couple of Cup meetings in recent years and it has been very depressing. Run down facilities and no atmosphere, despite a reasonable crowd on Cup Day.

I doubt I will go again. I don't know if anything could have saved it, but I suspect it is too late now.

[Dark Beau]

After 20mm plus of rain overnight, finishing mid to late morning I thought that the Trentham track played super well, unbelievable in fact, especially after the amount of racing, it’s had to carry this year because of the closure of Awapuni and HB.

I saw an interview with their Racing Manager, Brad Taylor who said that the Rail was out 6 metres and he thought that they would scout out even further, which they did, so with the rail in the true position for the next two days it would leave virgin ground and should make for more fantastic racing.

Oh Chief Stipe in case you didn’t know it’s been confirmed by Lance O’Sullivan via the Sunday morning show (name escape's me) that the Telegraph being WFA, has to now be the No 1 Sprint race in the country.

I concur as ever horse gets a chance on the big roomy expanses of the track.

Just another thought. The time was unbelievable. Maybe it’s to do with wind protection from all the housing and mounds of dirt creating a protected environment.

God only knows what time they would have run without the rain.

I guess the next complaint about the Shute will be that it’s downhill. It has to be because the river that runs though the valley runs in the same direction so it has to be!

The next question is; how much time should one knock off because of it?

God it’s now confusing with you saying half the 1200 (Shute) is faster than the other, me saying that its protected by the houses and mounds of dirt from the wind and now I am throwing in the downhill aspect, then Lance cones on and says that it has to now be rated the best Sprint in the country. Amazing.

Dream over, time to go back to sleep 😴 at 3:00am in the morning.
 

 

 

[Chief Stipe]

Interesting the track was rated a Soft 7.

Grailseeker runs 1:07.71.  Which is very quick for a soft 7.

Was the chute harder than the rest of the track?

Or was the race mistimed?

Or was the race short?

Had it improved during the day?

On Trackside the commentator had said the Jockeys had approached the Stewards to say the rating was wrong.  The Stewards didn't change it.  There is no mention in the Stewards Report.

[Gammalite]

32 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Grailseeker runs 1:07.71.  Which is very quick for a soft 7.

Was the chute harder than the rest of the track?

Or was the race mistimed?

Or was the race short?

Had it improved during the day?

Looking at the race , you had bright sunshine, a near straight run with a 'Fast lane' like Flemington. Some very fast handy horses , winner GRAILSEEKER balanced nicely and sliced through the field without losing momentum coming from the back, There was some 'Keen' jockeys who went hard early like you might expect in a Group 1 sprint.  ( compare Bella Nipotina 1.08.7 in the Everest at Randwick (that has a rise) on a soft 5.?)  

and possible Wind assistance too for GrailSeeker?.  It seems they head slightly downhill All the way Trentham too?

It's a wonder they didn't break the 1.07 really ? 😂 🤣🏇  loved the winner. very nice horse. 

Levante did when she won 2022 . 1.06 .6 speaking of which , where did that jockey go that won on that one ? Ryan Elliot. ? only followed NZ racing past 2 years and can't remember seeing him anywhere?

[Chief Stipe]

17 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

and possible Wind assistance too for GrailSeeker?.

No wind assist @Gammalite it was blowing a stiff SWester.

[Chief Stipe]

18 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Levante did when she won 2022 . 1.06 .6

On a Good 4.  The Benchmark R65's broke 1:08 that day.

[Trojan]

9 hours ago, Dark Beau said:

Oh Chief Stipe in case you didn’t know it’s been confirmed by Lance O’Sullivan via the Sunday morning show (name escape's me) that the Telegraph being WFA, has to now be the No 1 Sprint race in the country.

Of course he is going to say it is the best in the country after he just won the bloody race!!  What did you expect him to say that it was a second rate Grp 1 run on a shyte track?!

9 hours ago, Dark Beau said:

Just another thought. The time was unbelievable. Maybe it’s to do with wind protection from all the housing and mounds of dirt creating a protected environment.

Oh year?  So the houses and mounds of rubble that look an absolute mess for the "Champagne Turf" of NZ racing is deliberate?  By the way no stipes side on view available down the chute because of it!!  Oh and the ambulance and stipe services can't keep up unless they are in 4 wheel drive over the mounds of dirt or follow on the course proper!

Did anyone tell Crocetti's trainer that the Track wasn't really a Soft 7 but a Good 4 or better especially in the chute?!

[TAB For Ever]

IMO the Telegraph has always been the best sprint in the country........must have contributed to Trentham being known as the Champagne Turf !

It's meetings brought together the very best horses together from all across NZ . A true NZ Championship on left hand dog-leg track.

And Wellington Cup day has always remained one of the top interest /betting days.

Sadly the Cup race seemed to go into decline re quality of horses , even the distance was tampered with , their Monday Anniversary race faded badly , the facilities never left the 1940's, and the track became bad too often. Back in the day the bog track presented for the Winter features incl the Whyte ,Parliamentary and Winter Oats never worried most but expectations changed and Trentham got left behind.

Even the road in seemed to present transport problems .

I suspect now that many Northern connections find the trip South too much , and prefer to race closer to home !

And those who moved the big Yearling sales north to Karaka in 1988 certainly showed forward thinking !

[billy connolly]

12 hours ago, Dark Beau said:

The time was unbelievable. Maybe it’s to do with wind protection from all the housing and mounds of dirt creating a protected environment.

God only knows what time they would have run without the rain.

Herock's exhibition on Idyllic was mostly responsible for the time posted in Telegraph.

Hercock is a piss-poor rider in my view.

 

Edited 9 hours ago by billy connolly

[Shad]

On 5/01/2025 at 9:41 AM, Doomed said:

I know exactly how you feel. I still remember my first visit to Trentham in March in the late 70s when The Twinkle won. After that i used to go to nearly every meeting until the early 90s. Then I was away for many years. I have been back to a couple of Cup meetings in recent years and it has been very depressing. Run down facilities and no atmosphere, despite a reasonable crowd on Cup Day.

I doubt I will go again. I don't know if anything could have saved it, but I suspect it is too late now.

Oh the memories, remember Jonny alone won the jarden mile back in the eighties, at a big price, southlander knight invader finished 3rd from memory, Jonny was sired by the unfashionable blue vermillion, been some good horses grace the turf over the years, most of them some years ago.