NZTR Announce their Venue "Plan"

[mardigras]

1 minute ago, MaltedMilkshake said:

As usual we are presented with more spin by our “totally out of their depth” administrators.  

What I find interesting is the fact that no one addresses the horse population - current and future?  With the diminishing number being bred, will there be enough horses available to fund the industry?

 

And will they start running the industry to the size it is rather then wanting to pretend it is something it isn't.

[Mark D]

51 minutes ago, Bloke said:

Is this guy Craig McNeill who was fomerly the President of Fielding for real? 

He waxes lyrical about how great it was to amalgamate to be part of  Race. He claims that becoming part of Race made them stronger, well that does not align with the facts.

Thanks to the Awapuni Conference Centre disaster Race has been financially stuffed for the last decade.  What a clown.

 

 

Yip just trying to justify a totally disastrous transactiion.  All the money from the sale of their land is gone.  Nothing to show for it.  A total clown

[Dark Beau]

3 hours ago, Freda said:

and while I am not against some rationalisation of courses this continued crap about 'how much they cost' to keep going is a crock.

The larger courses - mentioned above - are the ones that suck funding,  and have done so for years.  How much did the industry have to cough up for Karaka Millions night?   while the rest of us are chewing the paint off the walls...

The two main races got $500,000 added from NZTR!

[Dark Beau]

1 hour ago, Bloke said:

Is this guy Craig McNeill who was fomerly the President of Fielding for real? 

He waxes lyrical about how great it was to amalgamate to be part of  Race. He claims that becoming part of Race made them stronger, well that does not align with the facts.

Thanks to the Awapuni Conference Centre disaster Race has been financially stuffed for the last decade.  What a clown.

 

 

Bloke, you got it one. 

[Freda]

On ‎29‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 3:47 PM, Weasel said:

Overall the general strategy seems to be shut down the venues where people actually want to go to the races. 

I disagree. The general strategy seems to be to 'stop the bleeding' (which comes from propping up unprofitable/unviable clubs and tracks) and allow some Clubs to keep racing at better venues. Sadly, the low population base of the upper South Island and the nature of the terrain makes travelling and related costs very high relative to other parts of NZ.

I have yet to see any quantitative data for each and every track.

This should have been the first thing done.

In the absence of any such figures,  do we then assume that :

a] there aren't any?

b] there are,  but we aren't allowed to see them because they don't support the spin.?

A few years ago,  a well-respected and experienced racing administrator did a venue inspection,  giving each club/track a 'warrant of fitness'.

In the course of this tour, clubs were notified of any work needed to be undertaken to bring the facilities up to compliance standards,  if necessary.

That administrator told me this morning that he hadn't been asked for comment at any part of this latest drama.

He said ' I don't need the headache,  or the work...but wouldn't you think I might have been asked?  ..considering I probably know more about the venues than anyone..! '

[Mark D]

It seems to me that "the Weasel" is closely related to Dafthorse from the old site

[Rowley Mile]

2 minutes ago, Mark D said:

It seems to me that "the Weasel" is closely related to Dafthorse from the old site

Now there's a thought.

[Freda]

1 hour ago, Mark D said:

It seems to me that "the Weasel" is closely related to Dafthorse from the old site

Doubt it..his spelling is miles better.

[Freda]

The underlying reason for all this b/s...as well as the allweather stuff....is that NZ Racing is technically insolvent and the only SUSTAINABLE way to get income is to increase turnover.

All the begging and bludging in the world wont create a sustainable income stream. 

Neither will closing tracks as a knee-jerk reaction.

Edited February 1, 2019 by Freda

[Kopia]

1 minute ago, Freda said:

The underlying reason for all this b/s...as well as the allweather stuff....is that NZ Racing is technically insolvent and the only SUSTAINABLE way to get income is to increase turnover.

All the begging and bludging in the world wont create a sustainable income stream. 

Neither will closing tracks as a knee-jerk reaction.

Thats correct Freda. Very succinct. The great big elephant in the room is the costs incurred by NZTR, including huge salaries etc and an ever increasing RIU. Further, the so called 'Dead Horse' Racing Board, which doesn't yet look too dead to me. What does look sick is the Minister. Big talker...Messara comes out with a report suggesting the impossible, peters appoints another ' inquiry' committee which to my mind is nothing more than a smoke-screen. Clearly the govt is under huge pressure from all areas..does anyone think they'll come to racings rescue? Sales look very average. It looks to me that most of the tracks headed for oblivion are run by voluntary labour, and owned by Clubs...try getting money out of private clubs...its all been said before but I'm not holding my breath for any good news. Might just wander down to the best little pub in Dunders and drown some sorrows?

[nomates]

13 minutes ago, Freda said:

The underlying reason for all this b/s...as well as the allweather stuff....is that NZ Racing is technically insolvent and the only SUSTAINABLE way to get income is to increase turnover.

All the begging and bludging in the world wont create a sustainable income stream. 

Neither will closing tracks as a knee-jerk reaction.

NZRB and NZTR are both running around in ever decreasing circles hoping to survive as long as possible and therefore hang on to their inflated salaries and perks . As the circles are getting smaller and smaller drawing them faster and faster into the abyss unfortunately the racing industry participants are being dragged down the hole as well . This is what happens when people with no experience ( hands on experience ) of a particular industry continually get control .  

[MaltedMilkshake]

46 minutes ago, Freda said:

The underlying reason for all this b/s...as well as the allweather stuff....is that NZ Racing is technically insolvent and the only SUSTAINABLE way to get income is to increase turnover.

All the begging and bludging in the world wont create a sustainable income stream. 

Neither will closing tracks as a knee-jerk reaction.

You know Freda, I came to NZ about 5 years ago and whilst we all knew it wasn’t too rosy, we still believed there would be enough nouce within racing admin to right the ship.

But we were wrong. The industry has let itself down - no one else but the industry.  By nature I am an optimist, but when it comes to NZ racing, I can’t get enthusiastic....because the people charged with administering the industry plus the politicians are derelict in their duties.

It could’ve been righted but there is not only a genuine lack of will to do so but a sense of not knowing how to,fix it. They won’t make the tough calls, they lack vision and most of of all, are placing the interests of a few before the those of the general industry.....all for the short term....as there will be no long term.

Having been closely associated with administrators at the Sydney Turf Club for many years, they always knew that upping the betting turnover was the key to a successful industry...these people were responsible for the introduction of the appearance fees for unplaced runners...and subsequently (pre Waller) field sizes in Sydney and provincials increased, turnover increased.

 

 

[Freda]

Sadly - yes,  you're right.

I still live in hope that something can be salvaged..the whole point of the Messara land-grab concept was to realise sufficient funding to re-vamp a few specific tracks,  and thus improve the racing/betting experience for the viewer and address the falling betting turnover.

He's no dummy...but, I do feel he has been poorly advised,  there won't be much - if any - capital coming from any potential closures and thence no funding for improvements ;   and to improve the racing experience,  integrity /jockeyship must be improved,  exponentially.

The RB and NZTR continue on their rampant way - if they were going to be replaced,  surely they could have been prevented from spending precious funds in the meantime..?  and MAC - with four members who could hardly be called 'impartial'  - even Dean,  who is very well respected,  was on the NZTR Board that was responsible for this effing 'Draft Venue' document.

Maybe, bringing a bit of colour and atmosphere to raceday, in the form of on-course bookies..?  might give some incentive to have a dollar or two on - that is, if the TAB platform hasn't turned everybody off NZ racing completely.

 

[Weasel]

2 hours ago, Freda said:

The underlying reason for all this b/s...as well as the allweather stuff....is that NZ Racing is technically insolvent and the only SUSTAINABLE way to get income is to increase turnover.

All the begging and bludging in the world wont create a sustainable income stream. 

Neither will closing tracks as a knee-jerk reaction.

perhaps not ...but another significant income stream is taking the land that belongs to Incorporated Societies (or similar entities) to part-fund the industry's future. Question is: will the Labour-led Gummit get their hands on it via Winnie (now there's a Dafthorse) Peters?

PS: the Weasel may be Daft but he ain't no horse. So there.

[Freda]

8 minutes ago, Weasel said:

 

PS: the Weasel may be Daft but he ain't no horse. So there.

 

I am aware of that!

...and 'taking land' or whatever,  is not an ongoing and sustainable means.

It is just providing more money to piss up against that wall along with what has gone before.

Until the business model changes there is NO POINT in stealing money.

Edited February 1, 2019 by Freda

[Weasel]

Reefton asks:

I wonder how many voluntary years Houseboy or Weasel have put into Clubs?

Racing Clubs..NONE. You don't have to have been a Racing Club volunteer or paid employee to express a point of view or ask questions.

I fully support the notion that real consultation should be occurring over which Clubs keep race dates/courses and I have no particular confidence in Winnie to get the overall restructuring job done. That's why I have previously posted that the answers on sustainable future for our industry here will come in this year's Budget, cos it will reveal how much influence he has over Taxinda ...and time has run out for promising and not delivering. (This is the Year of Delivering, remember. There's an election in 2020!)

Edited February 1, 2019 by Weasel

[Weasel]

2 hours ago, Kopia said:

Thats correct Freda. Very succinct. The great big elephant in the room is the costs incurred by NZTR, including huge salaries etc and an ever increasing RIU. Further, the so called 'Dead Horse' Racing Board, which doesn't yet look too dead to me. What does look sick is the Minister. Big talker...Messara comes out with a report suggesting the impossible, peters appoints another ' inquiry' committee which to my mind is nothing more than a smoke-screen. Clearly the govt is under huge pressure from all areas..does anyone think they'll come to racings rescue? Sales look very average. It looks to me that most of the tracks headed for oblivion are run by voluntary labour, and owned by Clubs...try getting money out of private clubs...its all been said before but I'm not holding my breath for any good news. Might just wander down to the best little pub in Dunders and drown some sorrows?

and then transfer your TAB account  to Betfair? Or have you already done that? LOL. Have one for me

Edited February 1, 2019 by Weasel

[nomates]

17 minutes ago, Freda said:

Sadly - yes,  you're right.

I still live in hope that something can be salvaged..the whole point of the Messara land-grab concept was to realise sufficient funding to re-vamp a few specific tracks,  and thus improve the racing/betting experience for the viewer and address the falling betting turnover.

He's no dummy...but, I do feel he has been poorly advised,  there won't be much - if any - capital coming from any potential closures and thence no funding for improvements ;   and to improve the racing experience,  integrity /jockeyship must be improved,  exponentially.

The RB and NZTR continue on their rampant way - if they were going to be replaced,  surely they could have been prevented from spending precious funds in the meantime..?  and MAC - with four members who could hardly be called 'impartial'  - even Dean,  who is very well respected,  was on the NZTR Board that was responsible for this effing 'Draft Venue' document.

Maybe, bringing a bit of colour and atmosphere to raceday, in the form of on-course bookies..?  might give some incentive to have a dollar or two on - that is, if the TAB platform hasn't turned everybody off NZ racing completely.

 

Agree with everything said but what the whole industry has to understand is that "the good old days " are gone and racing as well as many other pursuits have to work with those changes . The whole social landscape has changed and unfortunately for us when this change began many years ago those charged with guiding this industry were too busy patting themselves on their backs and lost sight of the future and what would be required to navigate those changes . I've had first hand experience of the industry just sitting on it's hands or just plain not interested . Best (worst ) quote i ever got given when suggesting something was being done wrong " just the way it's always been " .  That quote came from a multiple group 1 winning trainer , i walked out of his office saying " pigs at a trough " . We now need people who can understand the product , both the racing administration and the betting sides , not postmen , not lawyers or any other suited persons , people who may well be those types but first and foremost they are racing people . It's not just racing that the suits are fecking up .

[Weasel]

7 minutes ago, Freda said:

I am aware of that!

...and 'taking land' or whatever,  is not an ongoing and sustainable means.

It is just providing more money to piss up against that wall along with what has gone before.

Until the business model changes there is NO POINT in stealing money.'

agreed...but doesn't changing the business model mean necessarily closing course/Clubs? I can understand the 'investment' of $48M if it will yield squillions of new revenue mostly via sports betting and international punters as John Allen seems to think will occur (his budget forecasts are based on it, aren't they?). Most people I talk to see the rationale behind reducing the number of tracks ..as long as its not the course/Club they belong to or support.

[Freda]

5 minutes ago, Weasel said:

,  and comlpyagreed...but doesn't changing the business model mean necessarily closing course/Clubs? I can understand the 'investment' of $48M if it will yield squillions of new revenue mostly via sports betting and international punters as John Allen seems to think will occur (his budget forecasts are based on it, aren't they?). Most people I talk to see the rationale behind reducing the number of tracks ..as long as its not the course/Club they belong to or support.

The 'nimby' syndrome  - sure...I agree with that premise,  if the club concerned is costing industry funds to keep going.

Absolutely.  But if a club can sustain itself for a community raceday, and comply with modern H & S requirements,  without dragging funding,  how is closing it going to help?

Edited February 1, 2019 by Freda

[Freda]

6 minutes ago, Weasel said:

 I can understand the 'investment' of $48M if it will yield squillions of new revenue mostly via sports betting and international punters as John Allen seems to think will occur (his budget forecasts are based on it, aren't they?).

It hasn't started out too flash,  has it?  How much is turnover down in the first weeks of the platform?

People I talk to are,  many of them,  so pissed off they have gone elsewhere and likely won't be back.

[nomates]

14 minutes ago, Weasel said:

agreed...but doesn't changing the business model mean necessarily closing course/Clubs? I can understand the 'investment' of $48M if it will yield squillions of new revenue mostly via sports betting and international punters as John Allen seems to think will occur (his budget forecasts are based on it, aren't they?). Most people I talk to see the rationale behind reducing the number of tracks ..as long as its not the course/Club they belong to or support.

I'm not against closures on the whole but track closures wont make a jot of difference financially to the bottom line at NZTR . The ones listed for closure are for the most self funded by training fees and volunteers so closing them won't save NZTR any dosh , my 2 local tracks survive along these lines . It will cost us horses , trainers , owners and future racing staff and punters . Close down racing in smaller communities and it will shrink the whole product .

Edited February 1, 2019 by nomates
spelling mistake

[MaltedMilkshake]

The absolute premium issue is lack of horses being bred.  There is not enough to supply domestic racing (forget the latest press release from NZTR about the sales).

So we can second and cash in all the old racetracks that we like but it’s not the silver bullet....the grass root issue is horse supply....

[nomates]

15 minutes ago, MaltedMilkshake said:

The absolute premium issue is lack of horses being bred.  There is not enough to supply domestic racing (forget the latest press release from NZTR about the sales).

So we can second and cash in all the old racetracks that we like but it’s not the silver bullet....the grass root issue is horse supply....

The grass root problem is owners or lack of , there are plenty of horses to be had if you haven't got the largest budget . Watch Sunday's sale , even the k2 sale plenty of horses passed , you can argue vendors not meeting market but biggest issue is lack of people buying . K2 and K3 have historically been the NZer's sale but people not getting into horses because of current climate going forward . I've been in the game 40 years never seen it anywhere close to this bad , last 5 years has been a complete nose dive . I'm on my last horse unless i see significant progress by end of this year then will look to Aussie , not holding my breath . I'm sick and tired of being treated like shite by policies of NZTR and TAB and can't see anything changing .

[MaltedMilkshake]

I’m lucky enough to have bred and owned one of best 3yos in NZ this year and he is with a fabulous young trainer on the way.

So far we have resisted the temptation to bring him to Oz and he will never, ever go to Asia despite the several offers from the bloodsuckers. 

If I do decide to bring him over it will be due to policies of the Petone Proletariat.