Brodie Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 What is going on with harness racing at the moment when it comes to 2 year old racing? $10k race at Addington over 1980m for 2 year old male pacers has 2 nominations, that is right 2, Not one hundred per cent sure of the reason but most enthusiasts will have a pretty good idea as to why! Will be interesting to see if there are many more noms and the race takes place! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Brodie said: What is going on with harness racing at the moment when it comes to 2 year old racing? $10k race at Addington over 1980m for 2 year old male pacers has 2 nominations, that is right 2, Not one hundred per cent sure of the reason but most enthusiasts will have a pretty good idea as to why! Will be interesting to see if there are many more noms and the race takes place! Cant be Purdon's fault as he hasn't nominated anything . Auckland Fields look super for the juveniles as well.Tell us all as an enthusiast why there are only 2 noms.??? Greg Edited February 25, 2019 by JJ Flash 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 4 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: Cant be Purdon's fault as he hasn't nominated anything . Auckland Fields look super for the juveniles as well.Tell us all as an enthusiast why there are only 2 noms.??? Greg Why did you mention Purdon JJ? Did you have some thoughts as to why there are not 2 year olds ready to line up? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 30 minutes ago, Brodie said: Why did you mention Purdon JJ? Did you have some thoughts as to why there are not 2 year olds ready to line up? You blame his stable for everything else. You were the one saying not sure why but enthusiasts would know. Go on answer a question just for once I.n your life or are you just making up stuff as per Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Purdon not only trainer that can train a good 2yo 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 Bettors Delight? They take time don't they? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 they run like rabbits at 2yo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted February 25, 2019 Author Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 hour ago, JJ Flash said: You blame his stable for everything else. You were the one saying not sure why but enthusiasts would know. Go on answer a question just for once I.n your life or are you just making up stuff as per Greg Not sure what you are saying JJ? Didnt blame Stable for 2 nominations at all! Did you have a reason? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flagship uberalles Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 10 hours ago, Brodie said: Not sure what you are saying JJ? Didnt blame Stable for 2 nominations at all! Did you have a reason? No he won't have a reason, he's just trolling you as per..... even if you don't bring all stars into a conversation he will pretend you did.... fake news 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Kidd Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 I wouldn't be remotely interested in racing a 2 year old in NZ at this time...unless it was with the All Stars. Even if you were extremely fortunate enough to snare a beauty and race it from elsewhere, the numerical advantage the All Stars have alone and the way it's used is enough to obliterate anything that looks remotely like a level playing field. Add to that all the other factors at play and you would need to be more than optimistic to believe you had a show of sharing some of the cream with them. They have the market fully covered with virtually all the elite juvenile races are already in their bag. Not only will they win them all baring accidents, they will likely have the trifecta in every elite 2 year old event also. If you think you can change that from outside the All Stars, you will need a new wall and some medical intervention for the bruises on your forehead. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 1 hour ago, Joe Kidd said: I wouldn't be remotely interested in racing a 2 year old in NZ at this time...unless it was with the All Stars. Even if you were extremely fortunate enough to snare a beauty and race it from elsewhere, the numerical advantage the All Stars have alone and the way it's used is enough to obliterate anything that looks remotely like a level playing field. Add to that all the other factors at play and you would need to be more than optimistic to believe you had a show of sharing some of the cream with them. They have the market fully covered with virtually all the elite juvenile races are already in their bag. Not only will they win them all baring accidents, they will likely have the trifecta in every elite 2 year old event also. If you think you can change that from outside the All Stars, you will need a new wall and some medical intervention for the bruises on your forehead. With that sort of attitude Purdon and co will be laughing big time. Very defeatist but fortunately not shared by other professional trainers. On that note didn't Nigel,s 2yr old Westview horse win well last week. Trained by prolific yearling buyer last sales time. R Dunn Greg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Kidd Posted February 25, 2019 Share Posted February 25, 2019 39 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: With that sort of attitude Purdon and co will be laughing big time. Very defeatist but fortunately not shared by other professional trainers. On that note didn't Nigel,s 2yr old Westview horse win well last week. Trained by prolific yearling buyer last sales time. R Dunn Greg Translated, "that sort of attitude" equates to a "realistic attitude". I appreciate your modus operandi is passive aggressive patronizing. You remind me of a little terrier humping away at your leg. You were also obviously a big fan of George W Bush with his "you're either with us, or against us". I've been in the game for 40 years so please save your condescending for children elsewhere. Yes, there are many trainers out there that haven't given up hope of winning elite Juvenile races and good on them. I wish them well. Lets face it, if they had given up hope, some would still keep their blinkers on. I am in regular contact with several trainers and numerous modest owners who routinely express to me disillusionment at numerous aspects of the game. More now than ever. At the sharp end of that disillusionment is one trainer and a small group of owners who are taking the vast majority of the cream season after season. Most are now finding it increasingly difficult to justify the "investment" in the game. The dream of taking the cream home has almost become a hopeless fantasy for many. Very few if any will make public statements on the matter for obvious reasons. You will also struggle to get a different perspective if you reside in an echo chamber. You can't utterly dominate the elite harness races season after season in a country the size of NZ and not expect there to be a flow on effect with at least a % of other owners and trainers. There are still plenty of opportunities to win run of the mill 2 and 3 year old races but that's mostly due to the fact a certain stable isn't terribly interested in those. The Sapling Stakes for example when it matters produces the same old same old business as usual. All Stars 1,2 and 3. If you're referring to Spellbound as the Westview 2 year old. Yes, looks a fair enough type but perspective is always helpful. Race was worth 10k. Not a single All Star runner in the field and even if there was, it would likely have done a "The Fixer" with bigger fish to fry. Good luck even grabbing some crumbs when it matters most. 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 3 hours ago, Joe Kidd said: Translated, "that sort of attitude" equates to a "realistic attitude". I appreciate your modus operandi is passive aggressive patronizing. You remind me of a little terrier humping away at your leg. You were also obviously a big fan of George W Bush with his "you're either with us, or against us". I've been in the game for 40 years so please save your condescending for children elsewhere. Yes, there are many trainers out there that haven't given up hope of winning elite Juvenile races and good on them. I wish them well. Lets face it, if they had given up hope, some would still keep their blinkers on. I am in regular contact with several trainers and numerous modest owners who routinely express to me disillusionment at numerous aspects of the game. More now than ever. At the sharp end of that disillusionment is one trainer and a small group of owners who are taking the vast majority of the cream season after season. Most are now finding it increasingly difficult to justify the "investment" in the game. The dream of taking the cream home has almost become a hopeless fantasy for many. Very few if any will make public statements on the matter for obvious reasons. You will also struggle to get a different perspective if you reside in an echo chamber. You can't utterly dominate the elite harness races season after season in a country the size of NZ and not expect there to be a flow on effect with at least a % of other owners and trainers. There are still plenty of opportunities to win run of the mill 2 and 3 year old races but that's mostly due to the fact a certain stable isn't terribly interested in those. The Sapling Stakes for example when it matters produces the same old same old business as usual. All Stars 1,2 and 3. If you're referring to Spellbound as the Westview 2 year old. Yes, looks a fair enough type but perspective is always helpful. Race was worth 10k. Not a single All Star runner in the field and even if there was, it would likely have done a "The Fixer" with bigger fish to fry. Good luck even grabbing some crumbs when it matters most. interesting interpretation of my short reply post. I didn't realise you have to have a negative view about a certain stable to enable all the love from other posters. What no one on here bar Brodie is give up a solution to end that stables dominance and how to beat them. His was from memory - "Export them to Ozzie permanently" or some such comment. Fact is R Dunn bought more yearlings than AS clients last yearling sale. Surely he must have purchased some talented juveniles to take them on this season when the big money is up as you put it.. Hes not a defeatist and nor is HTP's trainer for that matter. Greg 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 purdon 2yos may be winning at the moment but for how much longer?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Kidd Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 18 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: interesting interpretation of my short reply post. I didn't realise you have to have a negative view about a certain stable to enable all the love from other posters. What no one on here bar Brodie is give up a solution to end that stables dominance and how to beat them. His was from memory - "Export them to Ozzie permanently" or some such comment. Fact is R Dunn bought more yearlings than AS clients last yearling sale. Surely he must have purchased some talented juveniles to take them on this season when the big money is up as you put it.. Hes not a defeatist and nor is HTP's trainer for that matter. Greg There is a solid earn in it for Robert Dunn long term. All Stars take the cream and RD mops up the scraps with his significant mop. Nothing defeatist about acknowledging reality. If you were serious about taking on the All Stars month in month out, you'd need a state of the art operation, a top line trainer, the backing of someone like Bin Rashid Al Maktoum and drivers like Blair Orange and David Butcher etc. Anything less will result in a huge amount of luck being required just to beat them very occasionally. Hypothetical questions. Kim Jong-Un decides he likes harness racing. He buys up the All Stars operation. He then goes to every yearling sale on both sides of the ditch and buys any horse that looks like it may be half way decent. Within a few years his operation are running the trifecta in every group and listed harness race in NZ. He's a very happy man. Would this be good for NZ harness racing and if so, why? Would this be bad for NZ harness racing and if not, why? I have no realistic suggestions as to how the stranglehold the All Stars enjoy could be broken. If I owned a half way decent animal, I'd be very happy with a placing in a Derby or Oaks etc. Just the dream would keep me in the game as long as the dream is not an unrealistic fantasy. It's the routine shut outs that I think do the damage. When a stable has the best three or four runners in a group race and they all race in a manner that is helpful to each other, the result is a virtual fait accompli. I would suggest that any and all stables are limited to a maximum of two runners in a group or listed race but I know that wouldn't work for multiple reasons. First reason being that if the AS started four runners in a race, they would likely have four different sets of owners and secondly, I'm 100% certain that should M P for example be limited to starting only two horses in a group race, it would be musical chairs with his other stable runners being transferred to family members so the result would still be exactly the same. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boobybec Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 you talk alot of sense joe 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 42 minutes ago, boobybec said: you talk alot of sense joe we all love Bec sweet talk lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newmarket Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 Me thinks hunter and boobs get a room? 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boobybec Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 hour ago, hunterthepunter said: we all love Bec sweet talk lol You guys couldn't handle my dirty talk ........ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Kidd Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 2 hours ago, boobybec said: you talk alot of sense joe Merci beaucoup mademoiselle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 4 hours ago, hunterthepunter said: purdon 2yos may be winning at the moment but for how much longer?? Until they turn 3 and become 3yos winning? 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chestnut Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 hour ago, boobybec said: You guys couldn't handle my dirty talk ........ Yeah they could.. never under estimate a male 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLDWHITEMAN Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 (edited) On 25/02/2019 at 5:26 PM, Brodie said: What is going on with harness racing at the moment when it comes to 2 year old racing? $10k race at Addington over 1980m for 2 year old male pacers has 2 nominations, that is right 2, Not one hundred per cent sure of the reason but most enthusiasts will have a pretty good idea as to why! Will be interesting to see if there are many more noms and the race takes place! I am enthusiast but I don't have a "pretty good idea as to why." I think one reason is that All Stars and R. Dunn are targeting Auckland with their most forward two-year-olds as there are some good races up there in the next few weeks. It is still baffling though. I cannot understand why the likes of the Jamiesons and K. Barron - his two year olds have not measured up so far so surely this would be a great opportunity for them to start paying their way? I would go for Virgil as my top pick at Auckland but I am not sure about the driver T. Cameron. Is he any good? Edited February 26, 2019 by OLDWHITEMAN 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 still early for 2yos too race as jewels in June and breeders crown in August long time to have them up and running so why race for 10k when can race for 150k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted February 26, 2019 Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Chestnut said: Yeah they could.. never under estimate a male happy birthday tomorrow chestnut Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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