nomates Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Sleeping with their jockey doesn't make you a stable rep , maybe she has Te Akau accreditation in which case sweet , but the point is where does the line lie between stable rep or just some acquaintance . I'm talking about us being professional , something we are long from being , but at least let us try . 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, nomates said: but the point is where does the line lie between stable rep or just some acquaintance . The point is there is bigger issues to address not that I consider this to be an issue. She wasn't "some acquaintance" at the end of the day you have no idea who carries the saddle to the stable of every horse at every race meeting in the country. Shyte I used to do it and I didn't have a license - sure I was an Owner and had a stable pass. At the end of the day the Trainer allowed it and that is where the buck ends and stops if there is an issue. Are you now saying Jamie Richards is unprofessional? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 17 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said: Freda summed it up but to reiterate, it's against the rules here, I think it is there too, however, TA should have had processes in place for such an event! With a positive swab in the offing, you'd think everything would be done with complete compliance......wouldn't you? You can't have one rule for some and another for Ellis......or can you? But at the end of the day you have no idea if any rule was broken. I'd be interested to see what specific rule we are talking about as well. Joe I'm sure you have at your finger tips reference to the relevant rule in Australia. Are you able to post it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 I would be more worried about there being no pre race testing.What is that about? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 39 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: But at the end of the day you have no idea if any rule was broken. I'd be interested to see what specific rule we are talking about as well. Joe I'm sure you have at your finger tips reference to the relevant rule in Australia. Are you able to post it? Not at fingertips Chief, no, but as per my licence criteria I'm only allowed to saddle my horse with the assistance of my designated and regulated stable personal. The only way I see TA being able to do what they did is to have registered the 'reporter' as a stable employee....and that's feasible if not likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 48 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: The point is there is bigger issues to address not that I consider this to be an issue. She wasn't "some acquaintance" at the end of the day you have no idea who carries the saddle to the stable of every horse at every race meeting in the country. Shyte I used to do it and I didn't have a license - sure I was an Owner and had a stable pass. At the end of the day the Trainer allowed it and that is where the buck ends and stops if there is an issue. Are you now saying Jamie Richards is unprofessional? As Huey eluded to Chief, it's NZ and NZ is a very different animal to other racing jurisdictions......you may very well NOT have a rule in NZ Rules Of Racing........here the policies differ from State to State, however the security surrounding Raceday procedure is very very stringent, and rightly so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said: Not at fingertips Chief, no, but as per my licence criteria I'm only allowed to saddle my horse with the assistance of my designated and regulated stable personal. The only way I see TA being able to do what they did is to have registered the 'reporter' as a stable employee....and that's feasible if not likely. Joe you are nit picking. Ms Emily is allowed to ride a horse and interview Jockey's on the track I'm pretty sure that she would be allowed to carry the saddle back to the stables. I've checked the NZ rules and can't find anything preventing what happened. Plus she carried the saddle and I doubt actually saddled the horse given she didn't travel too far from the parade ring. Indeed there is nothing in the rules stopping you from asking another licensed person to carry the saddle or even lead your horse for you - they don't have to be employed in your stable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 6 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said: however the security surrounding Raceday procedure is very very stringent, and rightly so. Yep a lot more dodgy bread thieves over your way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 3 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Joe you are nit picking. Ms Emily is allowed to ride a horse and interview Jockey's on the track I'm pretty sure that she would be allowed to carry the saddle back to the stables. I've checked the NZ rules and can't find anything preventing what happened. Plus she carried the saddle and I doubt actually saddled the horse given she didn't travel too far from the parade ring. Indeed there is nothing in the rules stopping you from asking another licensed person to carry the saddle or even lead your horse for you - they don't have to be employed in your stable. Your rules are very different......here I have to apply to the stewards to have anyone else saddle my horse, and that person has to be a licensed trainer! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Here's a hypothetical and in no way am I insinuating Emily partakes, however....lets say for instance I'm really busy with 5 runners, I seek out the assistance of a trusted colleague, a person I see every day and trust, I ask them to assist with carrying the extra saddles for me. Unbeknowns to me, the night before, said person was at a pre Raceday party, lot's of party drugs at this soiree, said person had no part in the partaking of recreational drugs, but did come in contact with a known user.....so......a few weeks after the race in question with my 5 runners, the stipes ring me to say, ''old fella, you've blown positive....your A sample is positive to Cocaine, a class A drug.......my world collapses, the owners do their arse, and my reputation is rooted......that Chief is why we have stringent and transparent policing of Raceday........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 5 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said: Your rules are very different......here I have to apply to the stewards to have anyone else saddle my horse, and that person has to be a licensed trainer! Emily DIDN'T saddle the horse she CARRIED the saddle probably not even to the stables! Hell how many times have you seen a top trainer have someone help them with saddling? Certainly I've helped from time to time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 2 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said: Here's a hypothetical and in no way am I insinuating Emily partakes, however....lets say for instance I'm really busy with 5 runners, I seek out the assistance of a trusted colleague, a person I see every day and trust, I ask them to assist with carrying the extra saddles for me. Unbeknowns to me, the night before, said person was at a pre Raceday party, lot's of party drugs at this soiree, said person had no part in the partaking of recreational drugs, but did come in contact with a known user.....so......a few weeks after the race in question with my 5 runners, the stipes ring me to say, ''old fella, you've blown positive....your A sample is positive to Cocaine, a class A drug.......my world collapses, the owners do their arse, and my reputation is rooted......that Chief is why we have stringent and transparent policing of Raceday........ FFS Joe you really are stretching things now. The scenario you paint could happen to any trainer with any staff member. However the scenario you paint is so far fetched to be laughable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 No, its not really. Look at the shambles at Reefton ( sorry to bring that in to this conversation) where a trainer had several runners and was assisted by two experienced and licensed personnel. However they weren't employees and we discussed the cock up at great length here. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Freda Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Freda said: No, its not really. Look at the shambles at Reefton ( sorry to bring that in to this conversation) where a trainer had several runners and was assisted by two experienced and licensed personnel. However they weren't employees and we discussed the cock up at great length here. It's not that anything illicit went on. ..but procedures must be not just beyond doubt, they must be seen to be as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 4 minutes ago, Freda said: It's not that anything illicit went on. ..but procedures must be not just beyond doubt, they must be seen to be as well. Absolutely! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 11 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: FFS Joe you really are stretching things now. The scenario you paint could happen to any trainer with any staff member. However the scenario you paint is so far fetched to be laughable. It didn't happen to just any trainer, it happened to Gai........the buck stops with the trainer.........a stablehand on cocaine chief, you think it doesn't't happen.......thats why the rules here changed, a dangerous precedent. Laughable you say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 20 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Emily DIDN'T saddle the horse she CARRIED the saddle probably not even to the stables! Hell how many times have you seen a top trainer have someone help them with saddling? Certainly I've helped from time to time. You carry the saddle and you've had contact with someone I mentioned earlier? You just don't get it.....have you ever watched border security, it happens all the time........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 8 minutes ago, Freda said: No, its not really. Look at the shambles at Reefton ( sorry to bring that in to this conversation) where a trainer had several runners and was assisted by two experienced and licensed personnel. However they weren't employees and we discussed the cock up at great length here. There were a number of systemic errors there. I bet Jamie Richards inspected and checked everyone of his charges before they went to the parade ring. FFS Emily probably met Jamie at Weigh Out scales - was handed the saddle by a Jockey and then walked with Jamie towards the stabling area and before she got there handed the saddle to a strapper. Wouldn't have saddled the horse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 You're laughing at the AUS rules of racing chief, I'd back those over the joke that is the RIU and JCA Chief, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Joe Bloggs said: You carry the saddle and you've had contact with someone I mentioned earlier? You just don't get it.....have you ever watched border security, it happens all the time........ Come Joe. How do you know what was on the hands of the last person you shaked? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Chief Stipe said: Come Joe. How do you know what was on the hands of the last person you shaked? I don't, and that's the whole point......you eliminate risk to the closest common denominator...........does Covid19 ring a bell? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Joe Bloggs said: You're laughing at the AUS rules of racing chief, I'd back those over the joke that is the RIU and JCA Chief, I'm not laughing at anyone except you Joe. To be blunt you saw something to have a bitch about and it just happened to involve one of your favourite targets. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Joe Bloggs said: I don't, and that's the whole point......you eliminate risk to the closest common denominator...........does Covid19 ring a bell? So Joe you can put your hand on your heart and say in all the years of your involvement in horse racing you have followed ALL the rules to the letter of the law? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Bloggs Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Just now, Chief Stipe said: So Joe you can put your hand on your heart and say in all the years of your involvement in horse racing you have followed ALL the rules to the letter of the law? Nope, definitely not. Bent a few broken none! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted January 24, 2021 Author Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 minute ago, Joe Bloggs said: Nope, definitely not. Bent a few broken none! Well we have to take your word for that but Ms Bosson didn't break any rules either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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