JJ Flash Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 9 hours ago, Brodie said: Punting on harness racing is losing its appeal with many people due to the Bookmakers attitude. I disagree .Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs . Its decline as a leisure industry is due to it non appeal/ existence in many provinces and poor integrity reputation. Thus liquidity has dried up, Ozzies don't want to play into our product but yet they are more than happy to punt on our greyhounds and TB's. Come distribution time from new Racing NZ board im picking their share will continue to decline. . At current rates of decline it will be more of a hobby industry within the next 2 decades 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 28 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: Thus liquidity has dried up, Ozzies don't want to play into our product but yet they are more than happy to punt on our greyhounds and TB's. What facts did you use to back this statement up? Or is it just a "gut feel"? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karrots Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 35 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs . Hey JJ This is not specificially directed at you, If this bit is true Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs then it doesn’t match up with the amount of repeat headlines it currently gets. Repeat headlines is way of trying to get as many eyes to it as Gamms pointed out, incase some peeps missed it. So why would the writer do that - with it being just an amateur sport? Referring to your and Brods debate, not sure why declining industry, my guess would be one word *TIME*. Time has no mercy. (saw this in a Netflix movie and thought thats so true). Edited April 18, 2021 by Karrots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Basil Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 22 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: I disagree .Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs . Its decline as a leisure industry is due to it non appeal/ existence in many provinces and poor integrity reputation. Thus liquidity has dried up, Ozzies don't want to play into our product but yet they are more than happy to punt on our greyhounds and TB's. Come distribution time from new Racing NZ board im picking their share will continue to decline. . At current rates of decline it will be more of a hobby industry within the next 2 decades Yep, as usual Brodie is confusing cause and effect. Any specific TAB restrictions on harness betting are the result of a poor reputation for integrity and dodgy behaviour, not the other way round. The only thing I'd add is that if it's indeed the case that Aussies are betting more on NZ's dog and gallop races, that almost certainly reflects their own experience with a scandal-plagued harness industry — it just surfaced 20 years earlier in their case. And yes Hunter old halfwit, please go ahead and give this your obligatory down vote. But you know, in that little walnut that passes for a brain, that I'm right; you comprehend, albeit very dimly in your case, that defending the indefensible is just enabling behaviour; you understand, if only vaguely, that people like you are pushing harness on a road to self-destruction. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 4 minutes ago, Basil said: The only thing I'd add is that if it's indeed the case that Aussies are betting more on NZ's dog and gallop races, that almost certainly reflects their own experience with a scandal-plagued harness industry — it just surfaced 20 years earlier in their case. But where are the facts to support the statement that there has been a decline in betting on NZ Harness? We don't need to worry about causation at this stage just need to establish the facts regarding what you and JJ Flash are saying is a decline. The NZ Trotting Cup still only runs second to the Melbourne Cup in terms of race turnover. The nearest galloping race is $400k behind! Then we can look at causes. Don't forget the manipulation of the calendar and televised racing that favours Thoroughbreds either. The Dogs maintain the betting revenue only through the importation of thousands of races from OZ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 3 minutes ago, Basil said: Yep, as usual Brodie is confusing cause and effect. Any specific TAB restrictions on harness betting are the result of a poor reputation for integrity and dodgy behaviour, not the other way round. The only thing I'd add is that if it's indeed the case that Aussies are betting more on NZ's dog and gallop races, that almost certainly reflects their own experience with a scandal-plagued harness industry — it just surfaced 20 years earlier in their case. And yes Hunter old halfwit, please go ahead and give this your obligatory down vote. But you know, in that little walnut that passes for a brain, that I'm right; you comprehend, albeit very dimly in your case, that defending the indefensible is just enabling behaviour; you understand, if only vaguely, that people like you are pushing harness on a road to self-destruction. how is hunter pushing harness racing on a road to self destruction basil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 40 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: I disagree .Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs . woodham? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karrots Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Then we can look at causes. Already given the tip Chief 😉 TIME Edited April 18, 2021 by Karrots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted April 18, 2021 Author Share Posted April 18, 2021 36 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: I disagree .Harness is an amateur sport and is run by amateurs . Its decline as a leisure industry is due to it non appeal/ existence in many provinces and poor integrity reputation. Thus liquidity has dried up, Ozzies don't want to play into our product but yet they are more than happy to punt on our greyhounds and TB's. Come distribution time from new Racing NZ board im picking their share will continue to decline. . At current rates of decline it will be more of a hobby industry within the next 2 decades Jj, harness racing decline in turnover has nothing to do with integrity/reputation. The racing itself leaves greyhounds and gallops for dead! The TAB is losing tens of millions of dollars in lost revenue due to their ridiculous policies towards harness punters! I have got no idea how many punters on harness that they have on restrictions but I am sure it is plenty. Without restrictions I would turnover at least $1 million per annum and so you can see that if they restrict say 50 of us that is $50 mill that they are not getting in turnover. Then you have the ones who would turnover say $500k and the huge amount of turnover being lost!!!!! Yes harness racing is suffering bigtime and will continue to into the future with the policy that they current operate under! It is just blatant BS that they say that turnover is increasing, they are manipulating figures! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karrots Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Brodie said: Without restrictions I would turnover at least $1 million per annum Excuse me, sorry just have to but in here again, so you can def donate $10 to Jewels comp 😁 Will touchbase with Chief next week to check up on donations. Was thinking of having a comp to include instead of $1 game, that we have to pick a roughie on day. Roughie that pays over say $3 for place & anyone that does gets a point if horse places. Edited April 18, 2021 by Karrots 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 1 hour ago, JJ Flash said: Thus liquidity has dried up, Ozzies don't want to play into our product but yet they are more than happy to punt on our greyhounds and TB's. Come distribution time from new Racing NZ board im picking their share will continue to decline. . At current rates of decline it will be more of a hobby industry within the next 2 decades Still waiting for the facts JJ Flash. However just to speed things up. You are aware that between 2018-19 and 2019-20 the % of total revenue earned by Harness actually increased and Thoroughbred racing declined. That is on the back of a very skewed import distribution favouring the other codes particularly Thoroughbreds i.e. that % increase was based on Harness domestic racing entirely. The import distribution in 2018 was 63% Thoroughbred, 24% Greyhound and 13% Harness. So your base premise doesn't match the facts. Of course you may be privy to the current figures as the rest of us have to rely on a paucity of information from this current mob. Neither the TAB nor any of the codes have released detailed half-yearly reports. So much for transparency. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 35 minutes ago, Basil said: Yep, as usual Brodie is confusing cause and effect. Any specific TAB restrictions on harness betting are the result of a poor reputation for integrity and dodgy behaviour, not the other way round. The only thing I'd add is that if it's indeed the case that Aussies are betting more on NZ's dog and gallop races, that almost certainly reflects their own experience with a scandal-plagued harness industry — it just surfaced 20 years earlier in their case. And yes Hunter old halfwit, please go ahead and give this your obligatory down vote. But you know, in that little walnut that passes for a brain, that I'm right; you comprehend, albeit very dimly in your case, that defending the indefensible is just enabling behaviour; you understand, if only vaguely, that people like you are pushing harness on a road to self-destruction. Thanks Basil, The betting from Ozzie that i referred to came from the "Horses Mouth" so to speak so its factual but no doubt Chief will want to challenge and want written evidence blah blah. As for Hunter comment , i blocked him 3 years ago. Have never seen his comments nor do i care what he writes . others may see it differently 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJ Flash Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said: Of course you may be privy to the current figures Correct- and no i wont be saying anymore so dont waste your time with your familiar challenges 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 Just now, JJ Flash said: Correct- and no i wont be saying anymore so dont waste your time with your familiar challenges Oh right. JJ Flash has access to figures that no other general stakeholder has. JJ you are full of shyte. So this BIG DECLINE that you are talking about has only occurred this season? That is in the last 9 months? Oh I wonder why that has happened nothing to do with a pandemic or the even further skewed import/export situation? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chief Stipe Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 6 minutes ago, JJ Flash said: Thanks Basil, The betting from Ozzie that i referred to came from the "Horses Mouth" so to speak so its factual but no doubt Chief will want to challenge and want written evidence blah blah. You haven't given us any numbers just anecdotal wink wink nudge nudge bullshit. Surely you can post some numbers? Why the secrecy? BOAY readers take note - JJ Flash has a reputation for posting misinformation and fake news. I guess Harness can rest assured that they still have the largest revenue race held domestically across all codes - the NZ Trotting Cup. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted April 18, 2021 Share Posted April 18, 2021 12 hours ago, Brodie said: Didnt watch any of the races live but did look at so e tote pools a d they werent that flash! what were they ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, Rangatira said: what were they ? THE BRODSTER HAS GOT YOU COVERED HE IS SPOT ON Edited April 19, 2021 by hunterthepunter 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 6 hours ago, Rangatira said: what were they ? First race had bit over 6k in the tote win pool when I saw it when race started before abandonment!,, Ranga, have you got access to the tote pools and fixed odds amounts? I am still waiting for Methven figures! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Brodie said: Ranga, have you got access to the tote pools and fixed odds amounts? just pork bones, puha and doughboys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 1 minute ago, Rangatira said: just pork bones, puha and doughboys What on earth Ranga? You having a crisis?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 1 minute ago, Brodie said: What on earth Ranga? You having a crisis?? maori medicine 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karrots Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 8 hours ago, Karrots said: Excuse me, sorry just have to but in here again, so you can def donate $10 to Jewels comp 😁 Will touchbase with Chief next week to check up on donations. Was thinking of having a comp to include instead of $1 game, that we have to pick a roughie on day. Roughie that pays over say $3 for place & anyone that does gets a point if horse places. JJ not sure why you gave me a sad emoji reaction for this, when I propped Brods for $10. Dont ask don’t get. Brods has been a good sport with me 👍 How many others on this site have Brods info as to how he did what he did to become a restricted punter? I give you tip Karrots does. And how did Karrots come privy to that info? Oh thats right Karrots asked! Have read that you believe the journo is fine to just repeat, repeat, repeat same info. Know you are in that camp, which is tots fine. But you actually have contradicted yourself with stating in your opinion the industry is an amateur industry. I was trying to be nice to you, by not pointing this out. Besides this whole me repeat, repeating myself re donations, is more a dig, maybe you did not get that. Have already stated I will donate the money myself should we NOT get donations. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 9 hours ago, Brodie said: I have got no idea should have started and finished there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted April 19, 2021 Share Posted April 19, 2021 2 hours ago, Rangatira said: maori medicine you have to go see the doyleston doctor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted April 19, 2021 Author Share Posted April 19, 2021 3 hours ago, Rangatira said: maori medicine Why would “ The Brodster” ever need to take Maori Medicine?? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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