Woman basher Anderson makes headlines, again.

[Davis]

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/racing/125035147/banned-harness-racing-figure-caught-in-breach-of-disqualification

Both of these gentlemen need to be banned for life from harness racing. This is a disgrace. What the hell is Burrows thinking? We all know Burrows is a reasonable trainer but clearly not too bright. Burrows has a checked history and this is another black mark on his poor record. Idiots like him give the harness racing hating Von Beynon plenty of ammunition. Disgrace.

Edited May 5, 2021 by Davis

[Rangatira]

victoria on the money yet again

i need tipsters as good as his

its been a tough night on the punt at fontainbleau but i should get it back and some at wheeling island

[Chief Stipe]

9 hours ago, Davis said:

Both of these gentlemen need to be banned for life from harness racing.

For what reason?

Seems the RIU are hiding in hedges again.

Referring to the article 2 years seems excessive for an offence unrelated to Harness Racing.  In any other industry Anderson would be straight back to work and working through his sentence.

I see Woodham is missing in action again.

"Harness Racing chief executive Garry Woodham said he would need more information before he could comment."

[Chief Stipe]

53 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

I see Woodham is missing in action again.

"Harness Racing chief executive Garry Woodham said he would need more information before he could comment."

Actually in fairness to Woodham assuming he is telling the truth then it raises a serious issue.

Who is the leak at the RIU?

Who at the RIU is feeding the media?

What is their agenda?

[Rangatira]

3 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

What is their agenda?

what was the riu involvement in what became known as inca ?

[Chief Stipe]

34 minutes ago, Rangatira said:

what was the riu involvement in what became known as inca ?

Sorry I don't get the drift of your question.  However my understanding was that the RIU (well certain individuals) were at the heart of the INCA inquiry which has so far returned nothing.  Through their connections they involved the Police (seem to be still doing that) and so far have only delivered collateral damage.

It will be the same individuals feeding/leaking to the media.  I have no hesitation in naming who I think they are.

[Gammalite]

42 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Sorry I don't get the drift of your question.  However my understanding was that the RIU (well certain individuals) were at the heart of the INCA inquiry which has so far returned nothing.  Through their connections they involved the Police (seem to be still doing that) and so far have only delivered collateral damage.

It will be the same individuals feeding/leaking to the media.  I have no hesitation in naming who I think they are.

One comment on this matter from me Chief as have read enough , and now know enough , of every BAD thing going on in NZ harness these days. Other channel even worse.

RIU and INCA (with the police help) are CONSTANTLY seeking New evidence and asking Probing questions Where-ever possible , to UNCOVER any illegal activity going on in NZ harness racing.

Of course some people ARE going to answer the questions put to them . I would !!!! If you have nothing to hide under the bed (like Darren Weir lol....) then you should be fine. So it is called INVESTIGATING. You can call it LEAK gathering all you like , but they are trying to keep NZ harness clean . a good thing. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And like you say,  it is great they find bugger All !  a good thing !!!!!!! 

p.s Agree if Matt A has sentence of 2 years, then that IS the sentence. should be able to apply to resume harness after that term. because he now chose to 'get in early' and got caught at Burrows, The expelled term should be extended or restart as he has consciously broken the arrangement (punishment)

[Chief Stipe]

1 minute ago, Gammalite said:

RIU and INCA (with the police help) are CONSTANTLY seeking New evidence and asking Probing questions Where-ever possible , to UNCOVER any illegal activity going on in NZ harness racing.

Police involvement in INCA finished many many months ago if not years.

[Chief Stipe]

2 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

So it is called INVESTIGATING. You can call it LEAK gathering all you like , but they are trying to keep NZ harness clean . a good thing.

No matter which way you try to paint the leaks they are BAD.  Why?  Industry administrators are not being told first.  Are THEY not trusted above journalists?

Leaking to the press to promote an agenda, which contrary to what you infer ISN'T the improvement of Harness Racing, does nothing to encourage trust and respect amongst participants.  It is old school policing that in the past has resulted in numerous cases of injustice.  It leads to the type of behaviour where the RIU sit on positives (that were legitimate mistakes or environmental contamination) to try an "catch a bigger fish".  

In my opinion that ISN'T how the industry should be governed.

[Chief Stipe]

8 minutes ago, Gammalite said:

Agree if Matt A has sentence of 2 years, then that IS the sentence. should be able to apply to resume harness after that term. because he now chose to 'get in early' and got caught at Burrows, The expelled term should be extended or restart as he has consciously broken the arrangement (punishment)

It isn't clear yet what he was actually doing at Burrows establishment.  I guess it is a bit like David Walker.  If he is banned from training in his own right and driving then what is actually wrong with him working a horse for someone?  Yes the rules say he can't but are the rules wrong?  I think the punishment far outweighs the crime especially when considering the sentence he got in the Justice system.  The Harness sentence is far more severe than the court one.  

If he had been a professional rugby player he wouldn't have been effectively stood down for two years.  

[Gammalite]

6 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

It isn't clear yet what he was actually doing at Burrows establishment.  I guess it is a bit like David Walker.  If he is banned from training in his own right and driving then what is actually wrong with him working a horse for someone?  Yes the rules say he can't but are the rules wrong?  I think the punishment far outweighs the crime especially when considering the sentence he got in the Justice system.  The Harness sentence is far more severe than the court one.  

If he had been a professional rugby player he wouldn't have been effectively stood down for two years.  

Yeah Chief, for sure. People really don't know how tough it is with the DQ's for trainers. I know some that had to literally MOVE out off the property, (and pretty much be separated from the family for a year) as most trainers live on the property with their horses, and NO WAY could you just turn a blind eye to them everyday and be involved , If you stayed there, on the property.  (RIU in trees to ping you if you pat one?)

They transfer the horses to training name of daughter, wife, son-in-law or whoever and go and drive a truck for a year or the like ? very tough. 

For a harness driver like Anderson, much easier to 'stay away' and NO EXCUSE is valid to be working horses while under a ban.

[Rangatira]

1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said:

Sorry I don't get the drift of your question.  However my understanding was that the RIU (well certain individuals) were at the heart of the INCA inquiry which has so far returned nothing.  Through their connections they involved the Police (seem to be still doing that) and so far have only delivered collateral damage.

It will be the same individuals feeding/leaking to the media.  I have no hesitation in naming who I think they are.

i have a gut feeling inca comes to nought conviction wise

will the riu then use the recent decisions as a way to justify their involvement in inca ?

crazy i know

 

[the galah]

49 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

No matter which way you try to paint the leaks they are BAD.  Why?  Industry administrators are not being told first.  Are THEY not trusted above journalists?

 

So you have had someone like ken spicer on the board of hrnz openly supporting and advocating for nigel mcgrath,matt anderson and who knows who else.

Are you seriously suggesting he,or those that work with him should be kept informed on all details of ongoing investigations?

Isn't the reason for the constant referral in the press coverage to ken spicers ongoing support of those being investigated, there to highlight that hrnz position on integrity would be compromised if full disclosure was given to them. Seems an obvious conclusion to draw.

Surely you remember the blue magic scandal where a racing official warned all the licence holders involved of the investigation. 

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by the galah

[JJ Flash]

5 minutes ago, the galah said:

So you have had someone like ken spicer on the board of hrnz openly supporting and advocating for nigel mcgrath,matt anderson and who knows who else.

Are you seriously suggesting he,or those that work with him should be kept informed on all details of ongoing investigations?

Isn't the reason for the constant referral in the press coverage to ken spicers ongoing support of those being investigated, there to highlight that hrnz position on integrity would be compromised if full disclosure was given to them. Seems an obvious conclusion to draw.

Surely you remember the blue magic scandal where a racing official warned all the licence holders involved of the investigation. 

 

Great post. Very logical and factual insofar as Spicer part.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Gammalite said:

For a harness driver like Anderson, much easier to 'stay away' and NO EXCUSE is valid to be working horses while under a ban.

Yet any unlicensed person with a criminal conviction can pitch up and work a horse and dung out the stables.

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, Rangatira said:

i have a gut feeling inca comes to nought conviction wise

will the riu then use the recent decisions as a way to justify their involvement in inca ?

crazy i know

 

Probably.  Most likely.  There is a major shake up coming at the RIU.  Not before time.

[Chief Stipe]

42 minutes ago, the galah said:

Are you seriously suggesting he,or those that work with him should be kept informed on all details of ongoing investigations?

A really good twist on what I said Galah.  What I was questioning was why wasnt the CEO of HRNZ told about the charges in detail BEFORE the media?  Surely you are not suggesting that the media were also pre-warned before the RIU investigated?

Why shouldn't anyone on the HRNZ Board be told BEFORE the media?

How can HRNZ be expected to respond coherently and accurately if the first thing they hear about a charge is from a journalist and not the RIU?

[Chief Stipe]

49 minutes ago, the galah said:

Isn't the reason for the constant referral in the press coverage to ken spicers ongoing support of those being investigated, there to highlight that hrnz position on integrity would be compromised if full disclosure was given to them. Seems an obvious conclusion to draw.

Surely you remember the blue magic scandal where a racing official warned all the licence holders involved of the investigation. 

You completely miss the point.  At the very least Woodham should have been told BEFORE a muck raking journalist.

[the galah]

42 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

You completely miss the point.  At the very least Woodham should have been told BEFORE a muck raking journalist.

Woodham saying he would need more information before he could comment, is not the same as saying he was unaware of what the journalist was asking about,as appears to be your take on it.

[Chief Stipe]

21 minutes ago, the galah said:

Woodham saying he would need more information before he could comment, is not the same as saying he was unaware of what the journalist was asking about,as appears to be your take on it.

It isn't the first time Woodham has indicated he hasn't been briefed.

If you take your slant on it then it leads one to conclude he is incompetent.  From what I've heard my slant is closer to the truth than yours.

[LongOwner]

3 hours ago, Gammalite said:

One comment on this matter from me Chief as have read enough , and now know enough , of every BAD thing going on in NZ harness these days. Other channel even worse.

RIU and INCA (with the police help) are CONSTANTLY seeking New evidence and asking Probing questions Where-ever possible , to UNCOVER any illegal activity going on in NZ harness racing.

Of course some people ARE going to answer the questions put to them . I would !!!! If you have nothing to hide under the bed (like Darren Weir lol....) then you should be fine. So it is called INVESTIGATING. You can call it LEAK gathering all you like , but they are trying to keep NZ harness clean . a good thing. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And like you say,  it is great they find bugger All !  a good thing !!!!!!! 

p.s Agree if Matt A has sentence of 2 years, then that IS the sentence. should be able to apply to resume harness after that term. because he now chose to 'get in early' and got caught at Burrows, The expelled term should be extended or restart as he has consciously broken the arrangement (punishment)

I am sure when you have an employment contract you cannot “leak” confidential informations or investigations or clients details etc . 
If RIU is the mole to The Press they should be fired and charged.

It is disgraceful  if a member of the RIU in paid employment is leaking confidential investigation details to the press. 
The Inca judge basically told the RIU staff they had behaved poorly re releasing information before suppression orders had been finished and exaggerated details. MVB was shown the court room door and censured by the Court due to his over the top reporting and poor court behaviour- he has never got over it.

[Rangatira]

13 minutes ago, LongOwner said:

 MVB was shown the court room door and censured by the Court due to his over the top reporting and poor court behaviour- he has never got over it.

victoria a very bitter and twisted man re that

[the galah]

1 hour ago, Rangatira said:

victoria a very bitter and twisted man re that

 

So what long owner is saying is a judge excluded a certain member of the press from some of the inca court proceedings,and now we have this saturation coverage from that member of the press on related to topics to what the judge didn't want any reporting on.

Whether thats accurate or not i don't know.

If it is, whats the bet at the time some not too clever people actually thought excluding that reporter was a victory of sorts,and wouldn't have consequences..

Edited May 6, 2021 by the galah

[Rangatira]

11 minutes ago, the galah said:

If it is, whats the bet at the time some not too clever people actually thought excluding that reporter was a victory of sorts,and wouldn't have consequences..

i am pretty sure it was the judges decision alone

prior to a break he had warned the press gallery, yes there were a few, clarkson and victoria amongst them

during the break members of the press ignored the judges warnings

on his return the good kind judge made it known that he was well aware and took action

 

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by Rangatira

[JJ Flash]

5 minutes ago, Rangatira said:

during the break members of the press ignored the judges warnings

$15 K fine and Community Service at least