Trentham!

[nomates]

Just now, curious said:

Where is that?
 

Did you miss the first part of the paragraph ?

[curious]

So, somewhere north of Foxton?

[nomates]

8 minutes ago, curious said:

So, somewhere north of Foxton?

No , somewhere north of Taupo , keep up . You asked where i would spend my dosh , which was the same paragraph as the Ellerslie and Waikato subject , 2 and 2 . 

[curious]

1 hour ago, nomates said:

I've written small articles on this topic on here , sell and rebuild north of Foxton , sell Awapuni as well ,

Make up your mind then. I realise that Taupo is north of Foxton.

Edited December 5, 2021 by curious

[nomates]

19 minutes ago, curious said:

Make up your mind then. I realise that Taupo is north of Foxton.

2 paragraphs , 1st on building north of Foxton , 2nd talking about Ellerslie and Waikato ending with where would you spend your dosh , your the one that quoted me from the 2nd paragraph , nothing to do with Foxton .

[Huey]

5 hours ago, curious said:

30 years too late ... but ...

5 December 2021
INVESTIGATION LAUNCHED INTO TRENTHAM ABANDONMENT
NZTR has implemented an investigation into the circumstances which resulted in the abandonment of the Wellington Racing Club’s Group One meeting on Saturday.
“NZ Sports Turf Institute (NZSTI) will commence a track review tomorrow morning, inspecting both the track and the data and reports from the Racing and Track managers,’’ NZTR CEO Bernard Saundry said.
“We have also requested a full report from the Racing Integrity Board (RIB) regarding the procedures leading up to and following the first race on Saturday,” he said.
RACE and Wellington Racing Club are extremely disappointed in what transpired yesterday at Trentham with the meeting abandoned after the running of the first race.
“We understand the consequences and outcomes due to the abandonment which affect not only RACE but the entire industry - through to sponsors, patrons, owners, trainers, jockeys, stablehands, officials and punters - and of course the programming of horses and their races at this important time of year,” RACE Chairman Paul Humphries said.
“As an organisation we need to do better, work with our team, staff, NZTR and industry on process, infrastructure and investment to remove risk where possible to ensure this won’t happen in the future,” he said.
NZTR is mindful of the fact that the abandonment has impacted the programme of a number of horses and that owners have been impacted financially. Those horses in the abandoned races will be eligible for compensation in line with NZTR’s policy.
Once NZTR has reviewed feedback from NZSTI, a full report from RACE, and the Racing Integrity Board, a further statement will be made outlining the findings.
[ENDS]

Yet another investigation , nothing is learned from them, therefore nothing is gained ... isn't it about time this lot got themselves investigated?

[Huey]

3 hours ago, nomates said:

I don't know who the track manager is or what his experience , maybe he's an ex jock or trainer who needs a job , seems to be happening more and more , D Bradley at Foxton and H Mathews is now doing Otaki , both good blokes and both good at their respective careers but track maintenance isn't a sideline or fallback option . 

We used to have a national track manager who seemed to be at odds with a large portion of tracks around the country and never gave anybody confidence that he knew what he was doing . Why can't employ someone with career knowledge and experience on the topic who can guide the inexperienced or lesser competent track managers , being saying this for years but it seems the one position they have never given serious credence to .

The biggest problem I have with all of this is that NZTR through their ridiculous Venue Plan have eliminated who knows how many potential venues for racing when things like this happen, its not just the mismagement of the Trentham track that needs a rethink its the entire utilisation of all available assets. 

Just look at the utterly ridiculous situation we had a few weeks back with a meeting being abandoned before a race was run to a track where the meeting was abnd after half the card was run, the leadership of the industry have no understanding of the mechanics of it , particularly the present geezer in charge who will soon be on his way.

[curious]

10 hours ago, Freda said:

 Canter round carefully and take everyone's money.

Exactly what he did. Sensible.

[Reefton]

On 4/12/2021 at 7:17 PM, Chief Stipe said:

Really Reefton?!  The best you can come up with getting an old West Coast dairy farmer to put a plough thorough.

None of the renovations have been done properly nor have they addressed the underlying problem - the soil structure.

It goes rock hard when dry, had a small rain shower it turns into an ice rink and a decent period of rain and it turns to mud.

Really Chief?

An 'old West Coast dairy farmer' you call him?  Peter was never a dairy farmer(his son has taken the farm over and converted it) but he has achieved an effing sight more in racing than you ever will.  Hard to believe looking at him but I think he actually won a race as a jockey(amateur to be fair), has probably trained 150 winners from very limited starters and owned most of them, worked long term for Brian Anderton(and even cradled the head of the great Mellay as the horse passed away), run his own stud and stood up(as Freda has pointed out) to the frigging experts who tried to turn his track into a skating rink and corrected the issues that another bunch of 'experts' created at another track. 

And he is not particularly old either.

You really know nothing do you?

For someone who bags shiite out of achievers like O'Malley and Michael Pitman your own achievements in the game are fairly thin on the ground.

Edited December 5, 2021 by Reefton

[Reefton]

On 4/12/2021 at 7:21 PM, Chief Stipe said:

Short term mechanical fix that medium to long term makes the problem worse.

Of course you don't understand that.

You'd know

 

[curious]

4 hours ago, Reefton said:

You'd know

 

Works fine. Breaks up the compaction layer.

[Freda]

8 hours ago, curious said:

Exactly what he did. Sensible.

Very sensible.

However, that practice falls well outside the obligation of a jockey to 'give all possible chance' to their mount.

Refusing to ride would have been more honest.

My first partner [ jockey ] was occasionally maligned for 'calling the races off' ...actually, he didn't, and didn't have the power anyway.  But he, and fellow senior Paul Richards were often at the forefront of discussions re. safety, both in the room, as well as talking with other riders about their thoughts.   Frequently, after such chat, there would be an announcement to the effect that any rider with concerns could stand down without repercussions.  I know N.G.H would do so on occasion.

H & S practices were  nowhere near as developed as now, where, if there is a query about safety, races must be called off.  Sending riders round 'to find out' is appalling and I'm surprised there haven't been further repercussions from Workplace H&S.  Perhaps too soon.

[curious]

1 hour ago, Freda said:

Very sensible.

However, that practice falls well outside the obligation of a jockey to 'give all possible chance' to their mount.

You would think the stewards would have queried the ride on that basis wouldn't you and reported their findings?

[Freda]

47 minutes ago, curious said:

You would think the stewards would have queried the ride on that basis wouldn't you and reported their findings?

Did they notice?

[curious]

6 minutes ago, Freda said:

Did they notice?

Apparently not even though they'd been alerted by the rider concerned that he thought the track was unsafe and elected to do nothing about it except send them round on it.

[Reefton]

5 hours ago, curious said:

Works fine. Breaks up the compaction layer.

In my view what you do depends on the way the ground is laid down.  That course is built on a riverbed and obviously a few feet down is gravel where the water drains through.  Everybody(well most people) knows the Coast is a shocker for leeching fertilizer and stuff so no surprise it is hard to stop that(which compaction would)

I am sure you Curious would not manage Foxton in the same way you would manage Awapuni?  Different ground composition

Put it this way - we had a track that had been slaughtered by the trotters(and I mean slaughtered).  We either did something radical to provide a short term fix or we cancelled the racemeeting(given we raced ourselves less than seven days later).  Past history with uncooperative TAB staff ruled out transferring even with seven days notice.  So what did we do - rolled it.  Seven days later a perfectly satisfactory days racing with no incidents and no complaints.  At the time we had a senior rider of many decades experience on our committee(R McCann) and he thought it a totally appropriate solution(and there were no moans from the likes of T Moseley or C Johnson nor David Walsh).

We are not total red necks - the Club has a spiker machine and the verti drainer man comes at least once a year(was there three weeks ago and I then met him at Cromwell - didn't actually know who he was until he started talking - he commended our track as excellent).  Every few years the top six inches of the track gets diced up and resown after the trotter's March meeting.  Easy you might say when there are only three meetings a year on the track and that is true enough. 

The Coast is designed and equipped to handle immense amounts of rain - hence being able to have a twelve tonne vibrating roller on the track the day after three or four inches of rain.  Kumara (and Hoki in the past) are the exceptions because they were essentially built on swamp,  Omoto and Reefton on riverbed.  In Omoto's case the 'experts' relaid the track and, I bet, put a clay layer in it which stopped the water draining.  Once the mole plough broke that up the track returned to a very acceptable state.

Pam will confirm the story of the flood water being over the running rail at Omoto one raceday in the past.  They postponed until the next day(as they did in those times) and by the end of that second day the track was bloody near firm.

Cromwell I thought has a brilliant track and the racing was bloody good quality(even if my nags didn't salute).  That was South Island racing up to a very good standard in my view

 

[curious]

I have a mole plough and 6" groundhog (multi-position) aerator here that I'm about to sell if you want one. Had a couple of very internationally  experienced track work riders here for a few months earlier this year. Probably don't even know what a groundhog is but couldn't believe how well the little tracks in my back paddock stood up to daily work and recovered. And yes, had the roller treatment too. You can do that once you have the aeration and root structure.

[Reefton]

18 minutes ago, curious said:

I have a mole plough and 6" groundhog (multi-position) aerator here that I'm about to sell if you want one. Had a couple of very internationally  experienced track work riders here for a few months earlier this year. Probably don't even know what a groundhog is but couldn't believe how well the little tracks in my back paddock stood up to daily work and recovered. And yes, had the roller treatment too. You can do that once you have the aeration and root structure.

I'm no expert on ground composition but there are one or two I know who know their stuff.  I reckon it is only logic to get air and drainage down there to improve and enhance the root structure.

I believe the GJC got the big tractor and contractors in to sort their joint but it bloody worked

 

[nod]

The problem is a simple one--the top of the track is wet and the ground below is drier and this causes a skid effect.It can be fixed by maintaining a 'heavy' track but no one wants that.

After all winter racing is a very poor relation compared to summer -not only stakes wise, we even have the filly of the year bizo but that year is a lie because its really run over 6 months . Why is this so ?

Anyway racing has survived for hundreds of years around the world with cancellations and abandonments   -it is a fact of life and we just have to accept such and do our best to mitigate the damage

Haivng a local galloper or two work around the course early in the morning would help but not in the case of later rain.

[Joe Bloggs]

1 hour ago, curious said:

I have a mole plough and 6" groundhog (multi-position) aerator here that I'm about to sell if you want one. Had a couple of very internationally  experienced track work riders here for a few months earlier this year. Probably don't even know what a groundhog is but couldn't believe how well the little tracks in my back paddock stood up to daily work and recovered. And yes, had the roller treatment too. You can do that once you have the aeration and root structure.

Why don't the airheads at the Taj get you in as a 'consultant'? All the experts have failed, those agri scientists, so what have they got to lose? Nothing like a hands on experience, get off their arses and head up to Foxton and they just might learn something, shame Tony Lee hasn't had a word in their ear, he should bloody well know!

[Doomed]

3 hours ago, Reefton said:

 

Cromwell I thought has a brilliant track and the racing was bloody good quality(even if my nags didn't salute).  That was South Island racing up to a very good standard in my view

 

I did mean to comment at the time that the racing looked great at Cromwell and the track played very well. 

There is something very strange about our industry when some of the best racing, with the best tracks and often biggest crowds is put on by the country clubs while the major metropolitan tracks continue to shoot themselves in the foot.

And the well paid industry leaders answer to this problem is to try and eliminate the country and provincial clubs. I suppose in this way there is less chance of the metro clubs being embarrassed, but really you do wonder whether we might be ignoring what should be our biggest advantage.

We can only hope that all this will be forgotten when we have three AWTs up and going and the industry zooms to a new level. Look out Sydney and Melbourne, NZ racing is about to experience a great resurgence.

[The Centaur]

On 5/12/2021 at 8:05 AM, Huey said:

Wow that is incredible and therein lies the problem the incompetence and experience from above just flows down the chain.

I've always believed racing biggest problem in NZ over the past 20 years has been it has never got personnel involved at an administrative level that are truly passionate or interested or experienced in the sport or at least in good numbers and at the admistrative level it just sends around the same small pool of administrators who merry go round those jobs, that has led to the downfall of it. Take your example of BS and horses galloping every day how on earth does an industry hire a leader who actually has no idea at all about the sport? Yet we continously do it across the board in NZ over and over again.

But nothing will change, nothing will come out of this latest incident either, no voices no cohesion from the trainers or jockeys just on to the next show!

I like your analysis.

Petone is just down the road from Trentham. Its where all the high salaried staff of TAB and NZTR work. What were they doing all week apart from socialising?  Whats the point of head offices in Petone? Quicker they can be transferred to Ellerslie racecourse the better.

You've mentioned the elitist European model. The problem begins with the proliferation of parasitic bookmakers. The bookie format of betting is expensive and inefficient. Something Hong Kong has known for a long time.

 

[Chief Stipe]

41 minutes ago, The Centaur said:

Quicker they can be transferred to Ellerslie racecourse the better.

Better to shift to the Waikato.  At least they still train horses there and the rent is cheaper.

Unsustainable maintaining a racecourse that has no fulltime training facilities.

[Joe Bloggs]

25 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Better to shift to the Waikato.  At least they still train horses there and the rent is cheaper.

Unsustainable maintaining a racecourse that has no fulltime training facilities.

Moonee Valley, Sandown and now Caulfield, no training facilities at all, its the New World Order.......

[Chief Stipe]

22 minutes ago, Joe Bloggs said:

Moonee Valley, Sandown and now Caulfield, no training facilities at all, its the New World Order.......

Sandown is targeted for closure.

Moonee Valley is set for a major suburban housing and facility development.

Caulfield is set to receive a $500m transformation into a major sports and entertainment zone 10x the size of the MCG.

Next point?