Riccarton Feedback

[billy connolly]

Any comments regards the claptrap from CEO Mills in the link below?  If my memory is correct Mills was the previous CEO's understudy whilst the current useless (white elephant) members grandstand was constructed approx 30 years ago.

Although the condemned public grandstand is antiquated and dated, it was by far the best viewpoint on-course and the top level of this stand provided excellent race viewing.

Mills has lived the life of Riley (probably rent free) in a club residence on club property for the majority of his tenure at CJC/Riccarton Park, all the while accumulating investment property of his own !

https://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/129736430/fixing-100yearold-grandstand-will-financially-cripple-racecourse

 

 

[Freda]

I'll keep out of the Riccarton discussion, I don't have all the facts and therefore would be foolish to comment.

But a local club had a [ much smaller ] grandstand, also damaged in the earthquake and which spent quite some time roped-off from the public while insurance matters were discussed.

The options were to take a payout, or repair with appropriate earthquake standards to be upheld.

They considered and opted for repair.   

The cost of renovation to acceptable standard was exponentially more than what had been offered as a lump sum.

[Freda]

The standard of buildings on many provincial courses will, of course, not pass muster wrt modern earthquake/general safety requirements and this fact does escape many when considering the fate of smaller clubs.

The ongoing and ever-increasing costs of insurance to that end is also a real burden for some.

Edited September 5, 2022 by Freda

[Chief Stipe]

3 hours ago, Freda said:

The standard of buildings on many provincial courses will, of course, not pass muster wrt modern earthquake/general safety requirements and this fact does escape many when considering the fate of smaller clubs.

The ongoing and ever-increasing costs of insurance to that end is also a real burden for some.

GRAND-stands are not required for a course to survive.  It is a BS requirement from NZTR.  The key are tracks.

Remember NZTR and Harness used to have Marque's they shipped around?

Regardless a good track, good facilities for the stakeholders who put on the show (the horses, the owners, trainers, stable staff and jockies) and the revenue comes (flows) from a good betting product.

 

[curious]

29 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

GRAND-stands are not required for a course to survive.  It is a BS requirement from NZTR.  The key are tracks.

Remember NZTR and Harness used to have Marque's they shipped around?

Regardless a good track, good facilities for the stakeholders who put on the show (the horses, the owners, trainers, stable staff and jockies) and the revenue comes (flows) from a good betting product.

 

Maybe true but what grandstands you have should be at the best viewing points. As far as tracks are concerned, the CJC has not spent a cent on a track that was totally screwed by a now 30 year old renovation and probably should have been redone straight away. The directive for that and insurance matters should have come from the board. They surely can't just leave that stand there decaying if the demolition is not approved. Some provision should have been made for that possibility.

[Chief Stipe]

15 minutes ago, curious said:

Maybe true but what grandstands you have should be at the best viewing points.

The point I was making was about other racecourses being put under pressure to rebuild facilities or close.  They aren't needed to put on the show.

As for Riccarton the Board and CEO have been asleep for the last 40 years.  Aided and abetted by compliant stakeholders.

The countdown to the Guineas going North has begun.

[billy connolly]

6 hours ago, Freda said:

I'll keep out of the Riccarton discussion, I don't have all the facts and therefore would be foolish to comment.

Seems odd that this structure suffered irreparable damage yet others in the vicinity did not, the majority of earthquake damage occurred at the eastern corner of Christchurch City, few buildings north of Hagley Park were destroyed and even less so north west of Church Corner.

 

3 hours ago, Chief Stipe said:

GRAND-stands are not required for a course to survive.  It is a BS requirement from NZTR.  The key are tracks.

To a degree but Metropolitan tracks in Australia, Hong Kong, England and USA have substantial facilities available to cater for their patrons, Riccarton Racecourse is a cold godforsaken place at the best of times and without adequate shelter from Canterbury's howling easterly wind it is a prick of a place.

Edited September 6, 2022 by billy connolly

[Chief Stipe]

1 hour ago, billy connolly said:

To a degree but Metropolitan tracks in Australia, Hong Kong, England and USA have substantial facilities available to cater for their patrons,

We are well past that stage now.  Back to basics and get horses running on good tracks and increase revenue.  No point building flash limited purpose edifices to be used a few times a year when the core business is going West (in more ways than one).

[billy connolly]

You're missing the point somewhat, the half baked CEO, Mills (with the backing of the CJC board) wants to trash an iconic grandstand which has stood the test of time for 100 years and will stand for another 100 years (earthquake or no earthquake) and replace it with sweet fuck-all.

Instead of old Millsey sitting on his arse all day thinking of his next drink at the Racecourse Pub, why can't he and his assistant (Rowe I think his name is) go out cap in hand and raise funds in an attempt to salvage this amazing building.

I'm with the Civic Trust/Historic Places, retain and redevelop the stand to become a heritage centre, holiday apartments, museum, casino etc, etc, etc

[Joe Bloggs]

53 minutes ago, billy connolly said:

You're missing the point somewhat, the half baked CEO, Mills (with the backing of the CJC board) wants to trash an iconic grandstand which has stood the test of time for 100 years and will stand for another 100 years (earthquake or no earthquake) and replace it with sweet fuck-all.

Instead of old Millsey sitting on his arse all day thinking of his next drink at the Racecourse Pub, why can't he and his assistant (Rowe I think his name is) go out cap in hand and raise funds in an attempt to salvage this amazing building.

I'm with the Civic Trust/Historic Places, retain and redevelop the stand to become a heritage centre, holiday apartments, museum, casino etc, etc, etc

That'll work!......the worlds most picturesque racecourse Chantilly near Paris is surrounded by beautifully restored iconic buildings, some now house boutique 5* hotels and restaurants, you are only limited by your budget and your imagination, in which case the pale, stale ageing males of the CJC need a boot up the arse and a hosing down on a cold Canterbury morning, get out and raise the money needed, make Riccarton great again......opps sorry that's Trumpsters go to.....but you know what I mean.......I'm with you Billy.

[curious]

2 hours ago, billy connolly said:

You're missing the point somewhat, the half baked CEO, Mills (with the backing of the CJC board) wants to trash an iconic grandstand which has stood the test of time for 100 years and will stand for another 100 years (earthquake or no earthquake) and replace it with sweet fuck-all.

Instead of old Millsey sitting on his arse all day thinking of his next drink at the Racecourse Pub, why can't he and his assistant (Rowe I think his name is) go out cap in hand and raise funds in an attempt to salvage this amazing building.

I'm with the Civic Trust/Historic Places, retain and redevelop the stand to become a heritage centre, holiday apartments, museum, casino etc, etc, etc

Totally agree. They've had 10 years to do that. Now the only option they offer is to leave it to decay. . The only decent race viewing point remaining at Riccarton with the now tiring newer members stand set so far back from the course. Even better viewing now with the big screen there as well. A travesty.

[Peanut]

Has anyone else heard the absolutely appalling radio ad for Cup week?   It sounds like some jingle to sell nappies out of the 1950's which i guess is not surprising given Mills and Rowe both seem to have been in their jobs since then and wouldnt know how to spell the word marketing. 

[Doomed]

2 hours ago, Peanut said:

Has anyone else heard the absolutely appalling radio ad for Cup week?   It sounds like some jingle to sell nappies out of the 1950's which i guess is not surprising given Mills and Rowe both seem to have been in their jobs since then and wouldnt know how to spell the word marketing. 

I suspect you are not the target market Peanut. None of us on here really.

What's this new thing called to promote the favoured doz or so big meetings? I presume it starts this weekend at HB, be interesting to see how many extras it attracts. I was at this meeting a few years ago and there weren't many there for a big day.

[Peanut]

20 minutes ago, Doomed said:

I suspect you are not the target market Peanut. None of us on here really.

What's this new thing called to promote the favoured doz or so big meetings? I presume it starts this weekend at HB, be interesting to see how many extras it attracts. I was at this meeting a few years ago and there weren't many there for a big day.

Possibly not by my teenage daughter thought it was just awful as well.     The Grand Tour is this new thing which really doesnt seem to be anything new at all. 

[Doomed]

1 hour ago, Peanut said:

Possibly not by my teenage daughter thought it was just awful as well.     The Grand Tour is this new thing which really doesnt seem to be anything new at all. 

Yes, the grand tour. And as you say it doesn't seem to be anything at all. Hope it didn't cost too much.

Really hard to know how to promote racing these days.  30 odd years ago Cup Week needed no promotion at all. The same punters from all around the country kept coming back year after year. These days virtually none of them bother as the place is full of non racing types there for the piss up.

Back in the 80s you hardly saw any non racing types at Cup Week at Riccarton and yet they were still able to fill the place and all that big grandstand.

[Chief Stipe]

Doesn't matter how many turn up at the racecourse.  Stuff all revenue and margin from oncourse hospitality.

If the track is stuffed, the fields poor and a umcompetively priced punting product then the revenue that counts will continue to decline.

[Doomed]

38 minutes ago, Chief Stipe said:

Doesn't matter how many turn up at the racecourse.  Stuff all revenue and margin from oncourse hospitality.

 

You should have told that to the VRC before they build all those new stands just for their Cup Week.

[Chief Stipe]

21 minutes ago, Doomed said:

You should have told that to the VRC before they build all those new stands just for their Cup Week.

Assuming you are talking about Flemington?  Victoria Racing has invested in the fundamentals of their core business ans are reaping the rewards.  Can you honestly compare the Flemington track and facilities for horses with ANY track in New Zealand?

The Flemington track is on a constant cycle of yearly maintenance longer cycles of renovation.  The horses come first. 

[Huey]

1 hour ago, Doomed said:

You should have told that to the VRC before they build all those new stands just for their Cup Week.

Unfortunately this is the prevailing attitude amongst many in  the NZ industry, many believe we are in a position to replicate the success of other jurisdictions without developing the fundamentals or the base and grass roots of the industry, it doesn't work like that.

[curious]

2 minutes ago, Huey said:

Unfortunately this is the prevailing attitude amongst many in  the NZ industry, many believe we are in a position to replicate the success of other jurisdictions without developing the fundamentals or the base and grass roots of the industry, it doesn't work like that.

Grass roots would be a good start. Not many of those left on most NZ courses.

[Turny]

1 hour ago, Chief Stipe said:

Assuming you are talking about Flemington?  Victoria Racing has invested in the fundamentals of their core business ans are reaping the rewards.  Can you honestly compare the Flemington track and facilities for horses with ANY track in New Zealand?

The Flemington track is on a constant cycle of yearly maintenance longer cycles of renovation.  The horses come first. 

Flemington is the best track in the Southern Hemisphere, complete with 9 full time gardeners tending the roses which in itself tells you the gulf between *them and us* is wider than the Tasman Sea, somehow we are stuck in the roughness of Cook Straight minus a Captain of Industry

 

[billy connolly]

On 6/09/2022 at 5:01 PM, curious said:

The only decent race viewing point remaining at Riccarton with the now tiring newer members stand set so far back from the course.

It was tired before they built it, Mill's predecessor (whom Mills worked under at the time) was largely responsible for that members stand... an aberration.

Yet a place like Ashburton (who no doubt were on a tight budget) can revamp their entire track satisfactorily as well as build a very nice 'covered' grandstand overlooking the track, whereas the goons at CJC/Riccarton Park with bigger tickets and a bigger budgets can decimate their track and erect a second-rate, inferior grandstand.

[curious]

4 hours ago, billy connolly said:

It was tired before they built it, Mill's predecessor (whom Mills worked under at the time) was largely responsible for that members stand... an aberration.

Yet a place like Ashburton (who no doubt were on a tight budget) can revamp their entire track satisfactorily as well as build a very nice 'covered' grandstand overlooking the track, whereas the goons at CJC/Riccarton Park with bigger tickets and a bigger budgets can decimate their track and erect a second-rate, inferior grandstand.

They'd be better to demolish that building and fix the public stand from a racing perspective. That and the embankment in front are now way the best viewing point for the new AWT as well and great sight of the birdcage too.

[Freda]

On 6/09/2022 at 12:01 PM, billy connolly said:

Seems odd that this structure suffered irreparable damage yet others in the vicinity did not, the majority of earthquake damage occurred at the eastern corner of Christchurch City, few buildings north of Hagley Park were destroyed and even less so north west of Church Corner.

 

My recollection  [ may be a bit hazy though...! ]    was that the venerable old lady had escaped pretty lightly, according to the reports made at the time.   And the stand was used subsequently;  but, then, a more in-depth builders' assessment found significant damage to the foundations and use was then ceased.