Murray Fish

how would you know? you appear so bitter, why you need to visit here?

what you see when you be looking in the mirror? I be happy to fall into the 'organic intellectual' camp!

I'm hoping for some sort of 'count back' prize!

as always... talking punting? care to share some of your betting logic? historically? has it change much? what is the win/lose Colum like

4 years ago this broke out... https://www.stuff.co.nz/taranaki-daily-news/news/122086115/stratford-horse-racing-club-breaks-away-from-national-body-to-try-save-land-from-sale?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTAAAR1_chVeuN3eq1lquaiRTjeBpwV-ogZY41OUA55vxhNYi0eCgLWrkB3TS2Q_aem_eO0Upon1dVBuoEgZ7QuS3wo this broke out...

who would you nominate? I actually thought of nominating a couple of young workers from down this way, not this season, but I plan to study who be eligible better for next year!

back to the drawing board then for me! umm, any advantage to be gained by seeing what @TAB For Ever puts in first?

sigh, from the slowlearnersclub, would Avondale and 69 get me a ticket in this race?

Always Summer was a kind re$ult for me! winning it twice!

He should have followed my council then! ps, I did take a couple of interesting photos of him!

So impressive! I once managed 10ks at four min pace, following a couple of talented woman runners and I just Had to keep with them! I knew that was a PB that was never to be beaten!

Damian Lane continued his stellar run of form across the weekend on Sunday, but arguably his greatest achievement didn't even come on horseback. The leading Melbourne-based jockey rode a double at Headquarters on Saturday, before completing the Gold Coast Marathon in under three hours on Sunday morning, recording a time of two hours and 50 minutes - averaging a tick over four minutes per kilometre. The effort was enough for Lane to finish just outside the top 300 of a run in which there were nearly 9000 entrants. Hot on Lane's heels was fellow rider Jake Duffy, who finished the 42.2km course in 2:51 to claim 342nd overall. Daniel Stackhouse has ridden more than 100 winners this season and completed the Gold Coast Marathon in 3:09, while Hannah Edgley finished 121st in her category running a time of 4:09. The Gold Coast Marathon was won by male Kenyan athlete Timothy Kipkorir Kattam, who ran a time of 2:08:52. https://www.racing.com/news/2024-07-08/news-jockeys-jockeys-star-in-gc-marathon

They were personally helpful to me when I was there 7 years ago... a feed in the presidents room and free roaming around the course! They being Vince M

needing the Trainers Assoc to gallop in and advise!

wow, gee, first off! are you a betting man? if so, I will wager you that both of those riders that you have mentioned! - who, I have know, going back 40 years - Would wipe the floor with ya re 'current fitness'. How close to your 'fighting weigh' are You? ps. I be happy to bet ya re my current fitne$s! (lol, hope CS was right about you be propping up the bar a lot!) They 100% should be able to chose weather to apply for their Licence each season. They know if they can no longer ride safely! TK keeps his for the horse that he trains, he has no need to chase. CWJ I'm sure will keep focused on recovering! One thing that is very much in his camp, is he doesn't have to go through any silly eating reality to actually just make weight! Race fitness can only be got when and if that happens! Either Or, He be in a good place to be dealing with it!

I take the Liberty of reposting this here, from a site that has passed, like a lot of NZ Racing history... it popped up today on my FB memory's. HOOFBEATS AT TRENTHAM Written by : Angi Bunn 23/06/2011 from KOBE For an old nostalgia buff, who shared in the ownership of a horse trained at Trentham in the 1950's, I yearn for a return to the days when Trentham trackwork was covered twice a week in the Evening Post by a respected doyen known as St.Simon. However most of the recent discussions refer to the closure of the training facilities there. Trainers I recall in that era were: W J (Joe) Bromby, who trained for a Mr.R J Murphy and others. His team included Poetical, a Guineas winner, Renowned (Wellington Handicap), Beau Cheval etc.etc. W D Wylie, later a trainer on his own accord and recently retired (makes me feel really old), was one of his apprentices, also T S Carbin who had a brief but impressive career. J K ( Jack) Searle- father of Grant. Trained for Mr & Mrs H W Lyda, American Consul. The team included Idaho ( NZ Derby - at Riccarton then), among others. T G Stokes- trained Glenkay and Glenlee, classic winner. W G (Bill) Hawthorne- trained a top mile named Pierre. R S Wallis- trained Recluse a good open handicapper. W (Bill) Bryce- Rev (Auckland Cup). Ridden by sometime local jockey, Joe McFarlane, who spent much of his time riding in Asia (in those days!). That horse was set for the race months ahead, according to prior reports, and those in the know cleaned up nicely. The trainers of the J H Marshall horses, Fo'c'sle (Wellington Guineas) and Sleipner- good 2 year old, and Foxcatcher It may have been Keith Couper. And the tote and bookies nightmare and punter extraordinaire Peter Louis, owner/ trainer of Donna Bella and Princess Donna with whom he made some spectacular raids to Riccarton, taking home suitcases of bank notes on various occasions .I remember counting it out for him in the bank one day, eyes bulging. Also Sam Bryce and plenty since of course. But it was the 50's which captured my attention and absorbed much of my interest in racing at that time. FROM KOBE More recollections. I remember my father complaining that the entry fee to the Lawn Enclosure was 10 shiillings,(but you pay only 1s and 6d and go"outside" enclosure.) This would have been in the late 40's when the average wage was probably about 5- 6 pounds a week. So the entry fee would have been equivalent to about 70 to 80 dollars in current values- and the course was packed on any of their race days! Barrier draws were done at the track on the day,only a few jockey's names would have been published prior, and you would stand for up to 25 minutes in the betting queue- much shorter at the payout window of course. You waited with excitement to watch the jockeys' names inserted on the Semaphore Board in the middle of the course and The Red Ballon signalled the "All Clear" to the starter. Dave Clarkson provided exciting commentaries. There was no TAB in those early days so you had to be there to bet (bookies "services" excepted). All the best horses came from the north to the far south- D P Wilson of Mosgiel was a regular attender and winner, also the Riccarton trainers, J C Tomkinson and CC McCarthy (Dalray) and fields of 24 were not uncommon. The Awapuni and Taranaki horses were always competitive of course. FROM KOBE That's good to know that Bill has not completely retired. What I did not say, but remember it well, was seeing a very young and small W D W having a very early ride on one of Joe's horses and looking quite breathless in the birdcage. Perhaps it was excitement of the occasion as the race had not started at that stage! Another story re Peter Louis. There was a headline in the paper one day to say that a certain person, who I will not name, had been appointed as private trainer to the said Peter. I remember mentioning to him that it was interesting to see that he had appointed a new man ( I think he had a few private trainers along the way). This was only a week or so later and his response was:- "..... don't know nuthin!" ( his pronunciation) and a few days later I read that he was no longer his private trainer. FROM KOBE While the 1950's was quite a strong period in Trentham track activity by local trainers I understand that it did not compare with the real boom time, probably late 30's and 40's when T R George was stationed there and regularly won the trainers' premiership. From papers I read some time back I am pretty sure that Joe Bromby was head lad to Mr.George and accompanied Beau Vite to Australia where he won several weight for age races and started as favourite in the Melbourne Cup. However I think he did start under an Australian trainer's name and was involved in a notorious shooting incident when hit men shot and wounded a horse they took to be Beau Vite in his stables but the trainer had switched stalls (forewarned perhaps?) and Beau Vite was unharmed, but did not win anyway. The bookies and punters took no prisoners in those days and I guess that incident would have been a strong deterrent to the former being legalised again in New Zealand. By the late 50's and 60's the Trentham trainers with the big teams were starting to move away, Joe Bromby went to Cambridge and Jack Searle to Levin. The rezoning of land, leading to subdivision of the larger land holdings would have occasioned some substantial increases in rates as Joe Bromby for example had a large property in Merton Road and I think all the trainers were located off track. A push towards upgrading facilities on the track makes sense to encourage trainers to operate there and reduce travel costs, as they do in many overseas locations. FROM KOBE I should have mentioned it sooner, but on re reading Angi's fine article I was prompted to recall some of jockeys who rode trackwork there in the 50's. These included R E Page, T.P.Biggs, J Toki, J McFarlane (occasionally), T S Carbin & W D Wylie (referred to earlier) and T.J. Perawiti who I think was apprentiiced to Tui Stokes, or Bill Hawthorne. Carbin and Wylie were often used when the allowances were permitted, particularly by their mentor, and Carbin enjoyed a lot of success for horses trained outside of the district. However apart from McFarlane, who was a top rider of international class, it was rare for the locals to be employed on race days. More that often the task would be handed to the Awapuni riders of whom there were any number. Bill Broughton, Vic Sellars, Lennie Hodren ( he might have been Woodville) , Bill Aitken, plus others like Keith Nuttall who moved around etc. FROM NEEN On the few occasions I have been to Trentham I found it to be one of the best kept and most picturesque tracks - but to be fair the memories of an impressional teenager are often not that reliable - and teenage years are long past Just a a thought would Trentham consider renting some of these facilities to equestrian pursuits outside of the racing environment - such as eventer preparation? I'm not sure what sort of riding/hacking is available off course - (busy roads) - but would be a way of bringing in some sort of revenue - would need to downsize costs to a degree - eventers tend not to have the 'owners' or income that trainers have - but at least there would be something happening - Is there a pony club associated with the course and if not why not? Seems a shame that the facilities are there and are not being used. FROM GLOAMING The current stands at Trentham were built 1922-1925 and the architect was E S Luttrell from Christchurch. He also had a hand in building the stands at Hastings and Riccarton. Work started early 1922 on the three stands ie the ledger, the public and the member's/stewards stand. They weren't built in line but were slightly angled so that from any position it was possible to view the course. They were finished at that stage early 1925.It was not until 1957 that the roof went onto the Members stand. I'd like a dollar for every time I've walked up and down the ramp at the back of the stand. The main tote building was erected in 1935/6. The yearling sales at Trentham first started in 1927 and the first four years they were held in the birdcage before moving to the complex at the top of the straight with the first sales there in 1931 . It was at the 1928 sale that Phar Lap was purchased for 168 pounds. The period when training was at it's best would have been in the 1930s and started to really take off when Tommy George moved from Richmond to Trentham. Beau Vite as Kobe has mentioned was probably his top horse but others were Pay Roll, Piastre who won an Auckland Cup and of course the top mare Cuddle. He also had Julius Ceasar and Synagogue. Round that era was also Joe Ayres, Charlie and Tommy Pritchard and Jack Lowe who trained the top miler Autoplay. Also Ebb Simpson and Percy Blundell and Bill Woods. Albert Goodman trained a big team including the very good gallopers Al-Sirat, Bridge Ace and Lady Christine along with Printemps. Hughie Telford who had large numbers too trained for Peter Louis they had the very good horse Master Dash. Kobe, Peter Louis when he trained also had the good horses John's Pal and Harry's Pal. Pat Spratt in the forties, Bill Bryce trained Tuis to win the Railway in 1945 and in Rev to win the 1952 Auckland Cup. Percy Burgess trained at Trentham before relocating to Woodville. Percy of course won the 1955 Weelington Cup with Golden Galleon and the 1957 Cup with Sombrero and also had the top galloper in Tara King. Yes Kobe, Joe Bromby was head lad for Tommy George and took Beau Vite over to Australia. Joe Bromby in his own right trained the smart gallopers Howe, Distinction, Renowned, Lady Scholar and Foxcatcher. His brother Arthur also trained at Trentham as well as his father Pop Bromby. Wally Hume trained that very good mare in Lady Tinkle who won the Winter Cup. Others also Jack Searle, father of Grant, he trained Idaho Chuala Vista and Purdue along with Red Star. Robin Page who trained Akatarawa, Tui Stokes who trained Glenlee, Glenkay, Kyntyre and Ruletta. Alf Scholes with Style, Just and Mangaroa. Bill Hawthorne who trained Pierre, Deprive, Alcyone and Shaun. Keith Couper once trained at Trentham before relocating to Hastings, Bert Nesbit, Ron Belcher, Noel McFarlane, Randall Southee. Bill Wylie trained at Trentham before moving to the Wairarapa and of course moved back again and trained for Steve's father Dr Bill Luey. I'll leave that for Steve to comment on as they combined for some nice winners. Cyril Pfefferle trained from Trentham late 70s early 80s before moving to Foxton. He trained the top galloper Fountaincourt. Whilst I remember Pukekohe trainer Patsy Riley is Trentham girl and started off helping trainers out before and after school. The training ranks really started depleting from about that period and wasn't helped with the shift north of the yearling sales which was a major disappointment as the southern hemisphere had this wonderful concept of a magical week every January. Three days racing including races such as the Wellington Cup, Wellington Derby, the George Adams/Tattersall mile, the NZ Oaks, the Trentham Stakes, the Telegraph Handicap, the Duoro Cup etc etc and three days of sales action. That has been lost and is a big blow to the Wellington Racing Club and to the industry overall. It was a massive week and the whole country was exposed to it by both the written media and televison. Angi - Trentham is the best designed track in NZ and the wide course with it's sweeping bends allows all horses a chance. It creates an opportunity for the best stayers and as you have mentioned they run fast times there. For me it will always be the Royal Ascot of New Zealand racing. In 1970 I was the youngest member of the WRC. In those days there was a waiting list to become a member and people had to wait years to become a member. One had to be nominated and two other members signatures had to be obtained as seconders. When my father decided to apply he advised me to do the same and we were both accepted at the same time. It was quite an honour back then. I have seen champion horses race there, champion jockeys ride there and met champion people throughout the years there and Trentham will always remain my favourite course. There are so many memories and so many stories I could regale you with thats for sure. FROM KOBE Fantastic stuff Gloaming. Many of the horses names you mentioned were racing when I was at school and come back to me now. I had forgotten that Joe Bromby had trained Howe, A Goodman must have been winding down when I followed the Trentham horses as he had only a handful in the team then. Yes,Peter Louis did mention Master Dash to me once, suggesting he had enjoyed many tote busters from punting on that successful sprinter before the "Donnas" came along. And, Owen O'Hanlon, who is often heard on Des Coppins' radio programme, has referred to the killing he made from Lady Christine when she won at Trentham, probably the Wellesley Stakes. Did Chula Vista win an Oaks? I think she did win a classic race. And did Pat Spratt train Kindergarten at Trentham for a short time? It was certainly a racecourse with prime viewing potential and I remember watching the Riddiford Steeples from the top of the public stand when Peepin Thru' won- in pouring rain. Only 2 or 3 of us up there and completely soaked. My mother was the casualty nurse there for a number of years and had a very good clinic facility there. She always spoke well of the club and its committee. FROM GLOAMING I cannot recall Chula Vista winning a stakes race Kobe let alone the NZ Oaks, which of course was run at Riccarton in those days. Incidentally, Hughie Telford trained Caithness to win the 1943 NZ Oaks for Peter Louis. Yes, you are correct in that Pat Spratt trained Kindergarten for a short time at Trentham although I believe Stan Bagby won all those races with him. Lady Christine did win the Wellesley Stakes in 1946. You are older than me Kobe and my Trentham days are from the late sixties, seventies, eighties, through to the early ninties. certainly the seventies and eighties were magic times with some terrific horses having raced on the course. I was fortunate enough to know most of the racing people personally, trainers jockeys etc with a number of jockeys staying at home at Trentham meetings ie Bruce Marsh, John Harris, Noel Harris, Garry Phillips, Nigel Landers, Peter Johnson, Maurice Campbell, Greg Childs, Brian York, Chris McNab, Mark Burridge, Rodney Heaslip to name some. My first time to Trentham was to the 1966 Wellington Cup won by Red Crest who went on and ran second in the Melbourne Cup the following year beaten a neck by Red Handed. I saw the top class horse Mayo Gold win on all three days of the Cup carnival in 1969 winning the first Wellington Oaks, later to become the NZ Oaks in 1974 which was won by Sweet Offer with Garry Phillip's in the saddle. I was there in 1970 when the Queen attended and Herb Rauhihi won the Captain James Cook Handicap on outsider Every Post beating the horse I backed the Wally McEwan trained Red Loki. I could go through the years but it would be a marathon task to write it all down. A couple of notable points, I was there when they had the first figure eight steeplechase at the May meeting in 1973. There when Glen trained by Dave Enright and ridden by Maurice Campbell got up to beat runner Rod Dixon in the last stride over 2000m. There when Show Gate broke down and still winning the Trentham Stakes. There when the first licenced woman rode Vivienne Kaye. And there when one of my favourite's Copper Belt beat Grey Way (again) in the 1978 George Adams. There when Castletown won his third Wellington Cup and that day I got to have a drink and a chat with Rod Stewart who was attending with Rachael Hunter. Tipped him into backing Castletown and I still have the days racebook with Rod and Rachael's autographs on the same page. And I'll never forget seeing Lynda Jones ride Braless there one day. I barely missed a day's racing at Trentham and saw thirty Wellington Cups in row. Great times and great memories. FROM TRENTHAM (ME) I would like to thank all of you that have commented on my article. I am so humbled by all the memories that you have written on here, and to know that there are others out there that hold Trentham as a very special place in their memories. Some of the information you have supplied is very invaluable and extremely interesting. I have thoroughly enjoyed reading them all. I would like to ask permission from those of you that have supplied such interesting information - if I could copy and paste this info onto my original post on Facebook. I'm sure alot of others would be interested in your comments and the extra information supplied. If you would rather I didn't do that then please let me know on here and I will respect your wishes. Thank you once again. FROM THE WIZARD – STABLETALK Go ahead Angi........ put a link to StableTalk with any references and you can copy whatever you like. FROM KOBE No problem Angi- pleased to be able to write in support of Trentham, which holds a special place in my memories, although I have not visited there since about 1965. Best horses I saw in my period would have been Beaumaris, Golden Souvenir, Yahabeebe. I never saw Kindergarten race but do remember listening to a commentary on radio when he won the Harcourt Stakes from Rakanui, Gladynev and Representative (a 4 horse field). His name was frequently mentioned in the newspapers as to whether he would race or not as he did have ongoing injury problems. When I was transferred to Gisborne a friend told me that Kindy was still alive on his owner's ( Mr E N Fitzgerald) property in the Kaiti area and he did arrange for a few of us to call out there, but unfortunately the horse was said to be up in the hills somewhere and diificult to find. This would have been in about 1959. Please keep us informed regarding your publication. *************************** Thank you to all the above people who posted their memories of Trentham on my article HOOFBEATS AT TRENTHAM on the STABLETALK SITE. Angi Bunn

a sad tale continues to drag on...

from the pen of the winning Trainer: " Not a day I’ll forget in a hurry it’s been one hell of a learning curve and levelling experience entering the racing game but it makes days like this one so much more rewarding getting my first winner as a trainer! Since the first time I sat on Captain I knew we were going to be pals, he’s a horse that I have so much respect for and he gives me everything I met him while he was under Paul and I’d like to think he was with us all today with this win! To all of Captain’s owners thank you so much for trusting me with your boy it means the world to me. Thank you Kendra Bakker for a great ride! To the team at home I can’t thank you enough for all your help and support, it takes a village and I’m so lucky with the one I have. My sponsors and supporters are also a huge help to the running of the team and have certainly stuck by me through plenty of lows! @witchesbrew_hoofoil @crawfordhilljewellery @seahorsesupplements @mcmillan_equine_feeds @equus_elite_nz @qualityequestriannz @michelleclarkephotography Also stoked with Fakeittillumakeit running well for 3rd the boys are positively flying to kick off their winter prep!"

Especially so with the better stakes up! there seemed to be some larger fields for some races?

Great to see Jess final get that W on the board! A noted horse person away from the Track! Not scared to Jump Over Fences!

cancelled at wingatui the other day.. bugger, and was going to go to timaru as well... i live in hope

Hi, I will work my way down you post. 1: We share commonalities re that! Though, as I mature, life has taught me to be wary of 'comparing and goats etc' , But to really appreciate Talent if we get the chance to get close to it! Life has privileged me in many way, one being the access that I have had to so many Pro Athletics! Across multiple Sports and Jobs. Gee, I could sit here now and type up a long list of strengths that I have seen Jockeys bring to Excellence while doing their Job! I know it quickly gets vulgar if one tries to compare and contrasted say a James Mac with say a CWJ. Totally different back stories to start with! 1000% different journeys taken via their Rides etc! We do know that CWJ #1 Wins on NZ Tracks. And that will be celebrated for ever in History! #2: I happened to work that Oaks day! Got some strong Action shots of that win! (I could add a amusing back story, to that race day, but will not...) by chance, I have chosen a photo from that win, for me my 'project/book', weaving it into a story of how many top fillies that Chris has ridden, Facing The Music gets in as well... more on that later. #3 Beer and Chris have played out so far in his career. If not a beer! I could attempt to arrange a photo! and a cuppa, one day! Do you get on course much theses days? Sigh, I've gone from a once! 100+ year to a few times a Nil. This season I've been going Big! 2 meetings and a Got on course, but abended flag went up! from the amusing so dept, the first run back took a lot out of me! 1000+ cool photos taken though! 10 races was a challenge. 7 races, I only walked 5.5ks v 8.10 at previous! 800+ photos, Ms helped out taking a few 100 more. I'm thankful for having the needed fitness to photo the way I do! I not be like the some, who don't actually understand how a days races should be captured, be if for that day, or for marketing or future history.... If you like stats, from the June 2nd meeting I posted up X (30?)shots, gaining multi 10000+ views! I'm sure I could have put x photos up and from that one meeting that would more that match months of postings from 'official sites', sigh, I feel the bitterness coming on!! time to walk away from the computer! So, I don't bite, am always up for a in person chat, on any track, should you be up for it/one! As shown to be true by my actions at Wingatui on Sunday.

Chris is the rather humble when it comes to anything along that line, not a naturel raconteur as such..

Noted... Still working of the Theme.. two parts, shots from film camera, early 90's, a few horses, a few races, a few jockeys, a few trainers, 3/4 of each of those, there is a bit of cross overs... then some from the digital area. 'Logic' suggests a book, and I would like to be able to add some 'oral history', and off course, part of the process is flushing out who is will to be helpful. Some other concepts I will be keeping undercover! for now. They be around the tragic digital historical reality of NZ Racing History! What I will do is to soon start a thread on it, I'm aware of knowing that it has to be cost sensible, meaning in the end, I actually want most of what is going to be printed and framed etc needs to be sold! Then, there is decisions around whose Name goes on the Exhibition, MF or DOK.. sigh, no rest for the wicked!

That use to happen back in the later 1950's for Govt Depts, Feb was the biggest spending month of the year, driven by G Depts having to spend all their income or it dropped the next year! No Govt debt back then!