Joe Kidd Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 hour ago, Harewood said: Last race at Nelson yesterday? Fair enough question and not the first time questions have been asked about this stable and at this same venue. Huey Lewis always had the opportunity with Blair Orange driving from the pole to hold up but the stablemate Feel The Money was the very short priced fav. John Dunn knew the way that race was unfolding, he had 0% hope of beating Huey Lewis. Despite that fact, he didn't move a muscle on Feel The Money until victory was assured for the stablemate. Having said that, he seemed determined to nail second. Had Huey Lewis not been in the same race, would Feel The Money have been driven differently? Below is a link to Feel The Money's previous victory in late October at Kaikoura. Did some work to lead, then dominated the race for an easy victory. That evidence highlights the fact hot fav Feel The Money can work in a race and still dominate. If that is accepted fact, why was Feel The Money driven conservatively until the home straight yesterday? Should be pointed out that the stable only had one representative in the Kaikoura race. Would stables being restricted to one runner per race increase the likelihood of a more authentic result and also a more level playing field? https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=255576 Feel The Money is in the last race again tomorrow so will be interesting to see if she is driven the same as she was on the first day or similar to Kaikoura. I'm picking the later but they do have Spot On in tomorrows race also. Which stable runner would they prefer winning? If they have no preference, Feel The Money wins. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boobybec Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Joe Kidd said: Fair enough question and not the first time questions have been asked about this stable and at this same venue. Huey Lewis always had the opportunity with Blair Orange driving from the pole to hold up but the stablemate Feel The Money was the very short priced fav. John Dunn knew the way that race was unfolding, he had 0% hope of beating Huey Lewis. Despite that fact, he didn't move a muscle on Feel The Money until victory was assured for the stablemate. Having said that, he seemed determined to nail second. Had Huey Lewis not been in the same race, would Feel The Money have been driven differently? Below is a link to Feel The Money's previous victory in late October at Kaikoura. Did some work to lead, then dominated the race for an easy victory. That evidence highlights the fact hot fav Feel The Money can work in a race and still dominate. If that is accepted fact, why was Feel The Money driven conservatively until the home straight yesterday? Should be pointed out that the stable only had one representative in the Kaikoura race. Would stables being restricted to one runner per race increase the likelihood of a more authentic result and also a more level playing field? https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=255576 Feel The Money is in the last race again tomorrow so will be interesting to see if she is driven the same as she was on the first day or similar to Kaikoura. I'm picking the later but they do have Spot On in tomorrows race also. Which stable runner would they prefer winning? If they have no preference, Feel The Money wins. Many good points made there. Orange stacked them up and sprinted them, Feel the Money had no chance to beat it the way the race panned out. This result cost me a several pantie and bra sets (Bendon i may add) Cant grizzle cos Johnny drove a super race on the trotter to win. Feel the money will get to the top and win tomorrow 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, Joe Kidd said: Fair enough question and not the first time questions have been asked about this stable and at this same venue. Huey Lewis always had the opportunity with Blair Orange driving from the pole to hold up but the stablemate Feel The Money was the very short priced fav. John Dunn knew the way that race was unfolding, he had 0% hope of beating Huey Lewis. Despite that fact, he didn't move a muscle on Feel The Money until victory was assured for the stablemate. Having said that, he seemed determined to nail second. Had Huey Lewis not been in the same race, would Feel The Money have been driven differently? Below is a link to Feel The Money's previous victory in late October at Kaikoura. Did some work to lead, then dominated the race for an easy victory. That evidence highlights the fact hot fav Feel The Money can work in a race and still dominate. If that is accepted fact, why was Feel The Money driven conservatively until the home straight yesterday? Should be pointed out that the stable only had one representative in the Kaikoura race. Would stables being restricted to one runner per race increase the likelihood of a more authentic result and also a more level playing field? https://harness.hrnz.co.nz/gws/ws/r/infohorsews/wsd06x?Arg=hrnzg-Ptype&Arg=RaceVideo&Arg=hrnzg-RacehdrID&Arg=255576 Feel The Money is in the last race again tomorrow so will be interesting to see if she is driven the same as she was on the first day or similar to Kaikoura. I'm picking the later but they do have Spot On in tomorrows race also. Which stable runner would they prefer winning? If they have no preference, Feel The Money wins. Jesus another conspiracy theory on why a horse ran second and was favourite . Feel the Money favourite as she has 200 plus owners x $5 ew v’s Heuy with one owner. Huey is the better horse and drew one and should of been favourite . Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . Draw 1 v’s 6 makes your conspiracy very shallow . The Fixer drive was - I am not going to try drive - so punters had their money stolen . Edited January 12, 2019 by LongOwner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 20 minutes ago, LongOwner said: Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . nope Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 (edited) 19 minutes ago, Rangatira said: nope Nope you did not hear the race or nope you are deaf? It was in the post race review Edited January 12, 2019 by LongOwner Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 10 minutes ago, LongOwner said: Nope you did not hear the race or nope you are deaf? It was in the post race review nope my imagination is not as good as yours 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 hour ago, LongOwner said: Jesus another conspiracy theory on why a horse ran second and was favourite . Feel the Money favourite as she has 200 plus owners x $5 ew v’s Heuy with one owner. Huey is the better horse and drew one and should of been favourite . Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . Draw 1 v’s 6 makes your conspiracy very shallow . The Fixer drive was - I am not going to try drive - so punters had their money stolen . That's what you get when there are race fixing allegations before the courts involving those concerned.. Punters,rightly or wrongly,lose trust. Totally understandable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 8 minutes ago, the galah said: That's what you get when there are race fixing allegations before the courts involving those concerned.. Punters,rightly or wrongly,lose trust. Totally understandable. and online posters substituting horses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, Rangatira said: and online posters substituting horses And you changed the thread from the Franklin Cup to race 9 Nelson with choreography unfounded insinuation - one could state slanderous comment as no facts ! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 hour ago, LongOwner said: Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . i don't suppose that stuff your dealer is providing you is remotely legal it does seem to be the good shizzle 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Kidd Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 1 hour ago, LongOwner said: Jesus another conspiracy theory on why a horse ran second and was favourite . Feel the Money favourite as she has 200 plus owners x $5 ew v’s Heuy with one owner. Huey is the better horse and drew one and should of been favourite . Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . Draw 1 v’s 6 makes your conspiracy very shallow . The Fixer drive was - I am not going to try drive - so punters had their money stolen . Huey Lewis is a better horse than Feel The Money and should have started favourite? I disagree on both counts. I respect your understanding as a long owner. Having said that, I've been in the game for 40+ years and didn't come down in the last shower. Not a big fan of conspiracy theories but I do know as a fact the way we usually get to the truth is by asking questions. I'm also fully aware that in almost all gambling where large sums of money are involved, there will often be aspects hidden from view. The reality is, some of those aspects can at times be of a dubious nature. I remember as a younger fella seeing a certain Northern gallops trainer start three or four horses in the same race. His son was leading jockey umpteen times. I would lose count at the number of times the roughest of the stable runners would win. As a very keen student of form and one time professional punter I would look into all aspects of those results and see if there was anything untoward. I always came up empty. The reason I ask the question about Feel The Money is almost entirely related to the way it was driven. At no point did John Dunn take the raging hot favourite around to put pressure on the leader despite that being John's usual style of driving and how Feel The Money won it's previous race at Kaikoura very easily. I did put up a link to that race in my previous input on the subject. Could the horse not being put into the race be related to the fact it was the stablemate who was leading the race at the time and being gifted comfortable sectionals? No conspiracy in asking that prudent question in fact it would be comparable to an ostrich finding some sand to bury it's head in to ignore the possibility. It also needs to be asked why did John Dunn not move in the race until victory for the stablemate was virtually guaranteed? Surely, it would be reasonable to expect a decent horse who started very short and had enjoyed a soft run to be driven in a manner that at least gave him a chance of winning said race and feeling the money? I'm prepared to accept the possibility everything was transparent and the result was authentic but if we are all going to dismiss the possibility of anything else and not ask questions, we may as well give up the game and take up that offer from Nigeria to buy the Brooklyn Bridge. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted January 12, 2019 Author Share Posted January 12, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, LongOwner said: Jesus another conspiracy theory on why a horse ran second and was favourite . Feel the Money favourite as she has 200 plus owners x $5 ew v’s Heuy with one owner. Huey is the better horse and drew one and should of been favourite . Listen to the race and the commentators gave huge rap of Johns drive from going from 3-4 wide on the bend to fence to run solid second . Draw 1 v’s 6 makes your conspiracy very shallow . The Fixer drive was - I am not going to try drive - so punters had their money stolen . Longowner, sorry but don’t agree with you that Huey is a better horse than Feel The Money!!! Feel The Money would’ve won for fun and won by several lengths if she had lead up!! She has gone some tremendous races in her short career. Show day 3 wide without cover from the 800m and only beaten by Mossdale Rose who had cover and home in 55 last half. Kaikoura win was just outside the track record and she won with a leg in the air! Auckland didn’t suit her. She ran 3rd behind Elle MAC and Bettor Joy I 3 year old fillies after doing more work than those two! She is as good as any of the horses in Nelson this weekend including the ones in the Cup! Edited January 12, 2019 by Brodie 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hunterthepunter Posted January 12, 2019 Share Posted January 12, 2019 6 hours ago, boobybec said: Many good points made there. Orange stacked them up and sprinted them, Feel the Money had no chance to beat it the way the race panned out. This result cost me a several pantie and bra sets (Bendon i may add) Cant grizzle cos Johnny drove a super race on the trotter to win. Feel the money will get to the top and win tomorrow lol this is ripper of a post Bec 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 One thing john dunn does do is normally put them in the race.Same as blair orange . They move at the right time 98% of the time,and if they aren't good enough they don't knock them about. So few drivers do that on a consistent basis,even when on the better horses. Take the race just run at nelson. You had the favourite ,anamajor,,sitting at the back,over racing on an average speed, following a horse who was never going to move,then pulls out 200m out 10 lengths off the leaders. All the punter wants is for the driver to drive to the horses ability,not wait for another day. Having watched a lot of races in the last 12 months,i now believe you get a far better run for your money from southland drivers than anywhere else in nz. That's apart from mr mcclennan of course. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newmarket Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 17 minutes ago, the galah said: One thing john dunn does do is normally put them in the race.Same as blair orange . They move at the right time 98% of the time,and if they aren't good enough they don't knock them about. So few drivers do that on a consistent basis,even when on the better horses. Take the race just run at nelson. You had the favourite ,anamajor,,sitting at the back,over racing on an average speed, following a horse who was never going to move,then pulls out 200m out 10 lengths off the leaders. All the punter wants is for the driver to drive to the horses ability,not wait for another day. Having watched a lot of races in the last 12 months,i now believe you get a far better run for your money from southland drivers than anywhere else in nz. That's apart from mr mcclennan of course. Yep, think it was Tuapeka Tricks turn to win today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLDWHITEMAN Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 16 minutes ago, the galah said: One thing john dunn does do is normally put them in the race.Same as blair orange . They move at the right time 98% of the time,and if they aren't good enough they don't knock them about. So few drivers do that on a consistent basis,even when on the better horses. Take the race just run at nelson. You had the favourite ,anamajor,,sitting at the back,over racing on an average speed, following a horse who was never going to move,then pulls out 200m out 10 lengths off the leaders. All the punter wants is for the driver to drive to the horses ability,not wait for another day. Having watched a lot of races in the last 12 months,i now believe you get a far better run for your money from southland drivers than anywhere else in nz. That's apart from mr mcclennan of course. Agree. Excellent racing down south and Southland is about the only area that Canterbury horses don't dominate with the locals winning most races. But please don't bag B. McLellan he is an excellent horseman, perhaps his driving is not as good as it was, but we are all getting on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the galah Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 2 minutes ago, OLDWHITEMAN said: Agree. Excellent racing down south and Southland is about the only area that Canterbury horses don't dominate with the locals winning most races. But please don't bag B. McLellan he is an excellent horseman, perhaps his driving is not as good as it was, but we are all getting on. Mr mclellan is an excellent horseman,its just his intent that is the worry. He does have a long history of not trying to win.He has spent time on the sideline a couple of times for that I think. So from a punters perspective,he always deserves a bagging,in my opinion.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 4 minutes ago, the galah said: Mr mclellan is an excellent horseman,its just his intent that is the worry. he seems to be a man with a plan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 2 hours ago, OLDWHITEMAN said: Agree. Excellent racing down south and Southland is about the only area that Canterbury horses don't dominate with the locals winning most races. But please don't bag B. McLellan he is an excellent horseman, perhaps his driving is not as good as it was, but we are all getting on. Old Whiteman, he deserves serious bagging! His willingness to win or put his horses into a race has to be questioned! How do you class him as being an excellent horseman? If it is his ability to want to win as many races as he can, then you are seriously deluded! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rangatira Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, Brodie said: How do you class him as being an excellent horseman? If it is his ability to want to win as many races as he can, then you are seriously deluded! got some wins out of happy patron, glencoe vc, its ella, shania patron and many more Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 On 12/01/2019 at 5:50 PM, Rangatira said: nope my imagination is not as good as yours 16 minutes ago, Rangatira said: got some wins out of happy patron, glencoe vc, its ella, shania patron and many more How did Feel the Money go today - I say again not as good as Hewy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 23 hours ago, Brodie said: Longowner, sorry but don’t agree with you that Huey is a better horse than Feel The Money!!! Feel The Money would’ve won for fun and won by several lengths if she had lead up!! She has gone some tremendous races in her short career. Show day 3 wide without cover from the 800m and only beaten by Mossdale Rose who had cover and home in 55 last half. Kaikoura win was just outside the track record and she won with a leg in the air! Auckland didn’t suit her. She ran 3rd behind Elle MAC and Bettor Joy I 3 year old fillies after doing more work than those two! She is as good as any of the horses in Nelson this weekend including the ones in the Cup! How we looking today -Huey just confirmed my view he is a better horse than FTM . LongOwner always right 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 23 hours ago, Joe Kidd said: Huey Lewis is a better horse than Feel The Money and should have started favourite? I disagree on both counts. I respect your understanding as a long owner. Having said that, I've been in the game for 40+ years and didn't come down in the last shower. Not a big fan of conspiracy theories but I do know as a fact the way we usually get to the truth is by asking questions. I'm also fully aware that in almost all gambling where large sums of money are involved, there will often be aspects hidden from view. The reality is, some of those aspects can at times be of a dubious nature. I remember as a younger fella seeing a certain Northern gallops trainer start three or four horses in the same race. His son was leading jockey umpteen times. I would lose count at the number of times the roughest of the stable runners would win. As a very keen student of form and one time professional punter I would look into all aspects of those results and see if there was anything untoward. I always came up empty. The reason I ask the question about Feel The Money is almost entirely related to the way it was driven. At no point did John Dunn take the raging hot favourite around to put pressure on the leader despite that being John's usual style of driving and how Feel The Money won it's previous race at Kaikoura very easily. I did put up a link to that race in my previous input on the subject. Could the horse not being put into the race be related to the fact it was the stablemate who was leading the race at the time and being gifted comfortable sectionals? No conspiracy in asking that prudent question in fact it would be comparable to an ostrich finding some sand to bury it's head in to ignore the possibility. It also needs to be asked why did John Dunn not move in the race until victory for the stablemate was virtually guaranteed? Surely, it would be reasonable to expect a decent horse who started very short and had enjoyed a soft run to be driven in a manner that at least gave him a chance of winning said race and feeling the money? I'm prepared to accept the possibility everything was transparent and the result was authentic but if we are all going to dismiss the possibility of anything else and not ask questions, we may as well give up the game and take up that offer from Nigeria to buy the Brooklyn Bridge. Heuy a better horse - confirmed today . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brodie Posted January 13, 2019 Author Share Posted January 13, 2019 1 minute ago, LongOwner said: How we looking today -Huey just confirmed my view he is a better horse than FTM . LongOwner always right Fair enough on today’s run Long Owner! Dont think Feel The Money backed up after tough run the first day! Put it this way I still maintain that Feel The Money is a better horse than Huey Lewis!!! Huey went better today than the first day and Feel The Money went better the first day than Huey! To be fair she probably should’ve finished stronger today but she was 3 wide without any cover? Proof will be in the next few starts won’t it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongOwner Posted January 13, 2019 Share Posted January 13, 2019 23 minutes ago, Rangatira said: got some wins out of happy patron, glencoe vc, its ella, shania patron and many more Those drugs you say I am on - to say Mcleland is a good / top driver - you must on them as well . 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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